OMG, my new Panasonic S10K already got burn in I can see Astro logo, the picture setting menu and some subtitles on the screen. Any idea how to remove it not sure is IR or burn in. Luckily this image is not noticeable when watching movies, it can only be seen on a non-signal AV source in a dark environment.

During the first 100 hours, I mostly use Normal/Cinema mode with contrast set to 50% and brightness to 0.



Not visible on white background:


This post has been edited by echoesian: Jan 15 2010, 11:00 PM

Is it blurrish or blackish?

It's blurrish, do you know how to go into service menu to "white wash" it ??

Wah so easy to burn one ah. I thought mostly new plasma has been factoru burn in

Thats why..


Why not try and contact the place u bought, maybe they have the same model and can guide you 1 by 1..

Unplug your aerial cable, and let it run with static (white noise) for an hour...but remember to off the power saver mode temporary.

I usually do a 2~3 minutes of static before I 'off' the TV everyday..so far so good.

This post has been edited by azbro: Dec 30 2009, 12:12 AM

I dont think they will exchange for 1 to 1. After I wash it using the "snow", the other grayish images are gone but the Astro logo is still there and it is blackish!!

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Added on December 30, 2009, 12:16 amI did the same thing just now for about 3 minutes, it seems the IR is gone but the Astro logo is still there

This post has been edited by echoesian: Dec 30 2009, 12:16 AM

the reason why i choose L42 over P42...

very skeptical in getting IR ler..

I really do not expect a new TV is so easily get burn in with contrast set to low, my family is mostly using it to watch Astro for 4-5 hours a day but in between there is a lot of advertisement and I don't think the logo is showing on screen so frequently until get burn in. This is ridiculous

mine also got burn in...not just u...

Is this particular panel is defective or what?

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Added on December 30, 2009, 1:04 amIt is confirmed burn-in with blackish blur Astro logo on the top right corner even after washed with white noise for 45 minutes. This is really ridiculous for a new Plasma TV.

This post has been edited by echoesian: Dec 30 2009, 01:04 AM

mine after break in also can get burn in...dunno wut to say

hmm i better stick to lcd then. i tot plasma now no longer has this issue

Plasma cannot watch Astro one.

"IR is a thing of the past" - not really true.

Bro, sorry to hear that. Have u contacted Pana service centre for advise?

Actually I am looking for Plasma TV due to natural color. Perhaps I should hold it for the moment...

im lucky coz im closed to get P42S10K...but for power efficient and IR prob...i managed to get L42S10K

can you capture a photo n show to us?
i think u better get advise frm Pana service center.
my one switch on 8 hrs daily n no problem.

This post has been edited by Pjee: Dec 30 2009, 04:56 AM

just curious, whats the difference (other then the playback feature) between the L42S10K and L42S18K...both LCD from Panny.
Which one better?

if i watch astro for long periods, i use zoom 2 to avoid the logo's.

also, my contrast setting is only 30, 50 is quite bright.

Can you see it on normal content? Try googling "Evangelo Break in DVD", increase the contrast and colour and playing it for a few hours. This is a full screen colour slides that shd at least improve the IR/BurnIn.

I have calibrated a few S10s and in those houses there are cases where Astro is switched on almost 5-8 hrs (sometimes same channel) but I have not seen any major cases of Burn In.

In most cases, post calibration contrast is set to almost 80...Anyway, I would also suggest you call the dealer where u bought the plasma and have a chat with them.

I have 2 units of 42s10. I don't have such problem. Could it be that you use the wrong setting and didn't follow the proper guide?

not sure bout it...but according to brochure...S18 Full HD IPS Panel....S10 Full HD Alpha IPS Panel

I can't see the blurry logo when watching movies, but when i switch to another source, say DVD with no signal, with the room is total dark, I can see the thing after I step closer to about 2 feet. It is not visible on normal viewing but I'm just worried it might be getting worse in the near future

I can't see it this morning because the environment is not dark enough. I will take a photo tonight.



This post has been edited by echoesian: Dec 30 2009, 10:19 AM

Scary experience...I just found out this good article about Plasma burn-in & the fanstastic tips on how to remove it..Yes it can be remove by playing the snowy/bright static for 24hrs non stop!:

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6449_7-6844370-1.html

echoesian,

Do try what I told you. What you can do is download the Break In DVD, increase contrast and colour (and select dynamic mode) and run it or get a full screen animation movie and play it for a couple of house with hig contrast and colour and in dynamic mode.

What is the current life of your set? Also call a dealer and get them to see. PM me if u need more info.

wah..plasma tv also can act like this ?thought the latest the tv is ,the better the performance will be

In dynamic mode, how high the contrast and color should I set? My TV running time is only 140+ hours

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Added on December 30, 2009, 10:38 amCan I just use my POHD to watch movies (not animation) with high contrast for longer hours to eliminate it?

This post has been edited by echoesian: Dec 30 2009, 10:38 AM

From the same article I hv given earlier..

I use cinema mode with contrast 50% I feel it is already very dim

I'm currently using the default contrast which I'm not sure how high & hopefully nothing happen bcos most channels do hv the static logos on top.

Seriously, I'm never bothered about IR or Logos by implementing White noise wash when I off the Plasma before going to bed..takes only 2~3 minutes.

Sorry to hear that, especially I noticed you did some homework here before your purchase. Honestly, I still believe the current batches of plasmas are more resilient to burn-ins. The 2 I have have not such problems even though I didnt do the 'professional' burn-ins with specialised software. Just zooming in or run animax as much as i can initially. no over-night stuff.

yslysl has also such problems and i am not sure whether this is an exception rather than the rule. referring back to the dealer/Panasonic is one way to find out especially yr units are new.

good luck!

I will say one thing about all this though. The LCD camp has very succesfully put fear into a lot of people minds about IR and burn in, yet the same people fail to notice this same issue in the CRT era.... This is the key selling point of the LCD, but the other disadvantages of LCD are never mentioned.

All technologies have their drawbacks. There are viewing angles, IR, ghosting, clouding, screen uniformity issues, inaccurate colour gamut, bad black levels, SDE and many more. There is no perfect display technology yet.

Trust me, if u go look at ur CRT carefully, in its infancy of the tube life has the same problem. Just check out the older bank teller machines.

This is not a case of burn in. The phophors have uneven wear. If its permanent burn in, u will see it on all content. This is only viewable on dark environment as such, because the channel logos are bright, that area has worn more. As content is varied, it will diminish. As long as you vary your content, burn in is very unlikely. Again, this is in the infancy of the panel. Phopshors take time to mature.

The panels becomes more resilient with time. Different panels are different.

BTW, has anyone ever seen burn in on a LCD panel before....I have. So it can happen. Do a google search and u will see.

Correct statement from Anfieldude
I use my plasma for PS3 and watch Bd movies include astro and IR can be wash off.

Cheers

I connect it using my laptop and display a plain white background maximized window, the black patch is very very light only noticeable when getting very close. Hopefully as what you said is just the uneven wear of the phosphor. I'll try to run animated movies with high contrast to break it evenly tonight

Ok, hope it works for u. Either the animation or the break in dvd. It shd diminish, but it could take time, if u see some improvement, then just vary your content for a while.

I see someone in avsforum says that lower down the contrast and brightness when using the break in DVD but others say it should be run with maximized contrast level?

In my opinion, what the BreakIn DVD does is to age the phosphors evenly. If u lower down the contrast than the purpose seems defeated. There does seem to be 2 schools of thought on this break in.

In your case, we are trying to clear what we believe is the uneven wear, so running it on high contrast and colour shd help.

However, if u are not comfortable, I would recommend that u get in touch Panny dealers.

If for me I would rather follow the earlier posted tips by cnet:

http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6449_7-6844370-1.html

Anyway just curious to know only, at first I'll try to break it evenly with high contrast for the first few minutes see anything goes wrong, if not I'll let it run for hours see if it helps if not I'll check with the dealers/Panasonic tomorrow. Really appreciates your help.

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Added on December 30, 2009, 5:07 pmNot sure what kind of bright static image that the fellow recorded

This post has been edited by echoesian: Dec 30 2009, 05:07 PM

What exactly is "implemanting White noise wash"? Is it in the 50S10 itself?

Why don't other manufacturers have something like Pioneer Kuro's "orbiter" technology to avoid burn in?

just video noise.. like when you don't have reception for TV signal..

Yup. just unplug your aerial and let it run on white noise for a few minutes.
No need to do it everyday, maybe 3 times a week would be sufficient.
Just let the TV run, you can go to sleep. and eventually, it will off by itself...depending on your settings.

Like this:

Its not the fanciest technology stuff, but at least it works on IR before it becomes screen burn.

Caution: Do not look at the static image for too long...later become like the movie 'White Noise' than you know..haha...see ghost image in there
But if you see number..share with me..


Cannot, totally cannot!!...later become like Kuro..become extinct species...haha..cause the set never give problem or breaks down...
Never heard of a person change his Kuro to another brand yet.

This post has been edited by azbro: Dec 31 2009, 12:18 AM

I have uploaded the photos... hopefully it is just a heavy IR that can be removed.

should can kua..

my samsung 1 month watch astro in 4:3 also can remove the IR after a few days...

What kind of ghost images did you get? Is it the Astro logo too? My logo looks alike Astro Ceria must be those kids ... but strange they are only watching for 2-3 hours a day

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Added on December 31, 2009, 2:05 amAfter run the Bolt 1080p movie with 75% contrast and colors for 1 hour, the thing is still there

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Added on December 31, 2009, 2:15 amVery strange, when I test with the Break-in DVD, the whole screen is white but I can't see the image.

This post has been edited by echoesian: Dec 31 2009, 02:15 AM

I think the side grey background is another way, a plasma manufacture built in to avoid burn-in according to the cnet article
http://reviews.cnet.com/4520-6449_7-6844370-1.html

"Most TV broadcasters and cable and satellite service providers are quite aware that there are a lot of plasma owners out there, and they've taken steps to help you avoid burn-in. Some hardware providers, such as DVR makers TiVo, DirecTV, Dish Network, and even Scientific Atlanta, give you the option of changing those pillarbox bars from black to gray, which keeps the pixels "

echosien,

Seen the pictures, I believe is uneven wear of phosphors for now. Also if it is not clear on a white screen, it is very light. I would just ignore it, stay away from that channel, if u can run the break in DVD for longer or the bolt movie longer, this will clear. This uneven wear will not clear after 1 hr of Bolt, it will go away with time.

Cheers.

I believe Panny has something similar to orbiter. So does Samsung.

Some panels are more susceptible to IR. This is related to the panel and the panel firing and voltage mechanism and phosphor discharge.

Kuro panels are resilient but nothing is 100% bullet proof. This is part of the technology.

I'll run the Break-in DVD longer this time, which one is more effective? Animation movie or the Break-in DVD?

I think u can use both, interchange. Looking at ur case, both will work. I tend to prefer the animation in ur case as it has more movements. However, typically, in the top right part of the movie, there is not usually much fast action.

So do you have any movie/clip that you can recommended to remove it?

saw ur posted photo but couldn't make anything out of it so i guess the burn in is not serious at all.... y bother?

Any Pixar animation that is in 16:9 ratio shd be fine, Meet the Robinsons, Up etc....

Just worry if watch more Astro next time, the same place will get even worse... dun tell me have to zoom3 each time watch Astro

Hmnn where's the uploaded photo

BTW, got this burn-in images from google:



However I think it's older Plasma bcos greyish background..new plasma mostly deep black hor

photo is on page 1 of this thread

It will become more resilient with time. As the phosphors mature.

Plasma screen is always black, but if you check it out when it is on without input signal..it will slightly be grey especially at night when there are no ceiling lights on.

Exactly the same thing, but mine is lighter in color

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Added on December 31, 2009, 1:55 pmDoes anyone know how to activate the pixel orbiter on this TV?

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Added on January 9, 2010, 3:00 pmhttp://www.avforums.com/forums/plasma-televisions/385173-pioneer-dvd-retention-washer-available-here.html

I'm going to try with this, see if it works

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Added on January 9, 2010, 3:00 pmhttp://www.avforums.com/forums/plasma-tele...lable-here.html

I'm going to try with this, see if it works

This post has been edited by echoesian: Jan 9 2010, 03:00 PM

50S10K seems not to have any user accessible features to fix or to prevent IR

I've tried several ways to remove the IR but there is no improvement so far. After a while I found out a scrolling washer image from Pioneer - http://www.avforums.com/forums/plasma-tele...lable-here.html, I have tried to use this for several times and I feel it is quite effective, I've noticed a very very little improvement. So on one day, I try to switch to Just mode to watch Astro, after switch off and try observe the IR, you know what? The IR seems like getting back to its initial shape. What this tells me is that it is damn worrisome to watch Astro with station logo even though most of the station logo doesn't stay there for very long because it is gone when the programme switch to Advertisement.

My TV mileage is 300 hours now, I'm not sure when I can enjoy Astro without worrying too much about the burn in issue. Although there is no visible burn in now, imagine if keep watching Astro for another 1-2 years, there is a high probability the IR becomes a permanent burn in ?

Sorry to hear about your plasma tv problem, bro. I will go crazy if I were in your situation . All the worries on your tv might get burn in and maintenance work needed to avoid burn in on the tv screen before off your tv or go to bed has made the tv more of a hassle rather than an entertainment set .

My LG plasma TV also got astro logo burn in since 2 months ago...

Is your burn in situation similar to mine?

hey echoesian, i'm very sorry to hear that...me too just scared this thing happen, and i'll always make sure the contrast and brightness were not that high by setting it at 45 and below...according to mys salesman, he did told me that this will happened if you let this tv static for straight 2 hours and more...btw, what setting do you used and are you satisfied with the picture produced? as for me, my 10 hours run-in plasma still not give me the 'WOW' impression as I don't expect it for the first 200 hours and i'm still using rca cable for astro connection.

This post has been edited by kayly: Jan 17 2010, 04:53 PM

Which TV model are you using?

hi echosian....i'm using p42s10 series...

why not try to zoom out the aspect ratio while watch astro ?

When zooming out to Zoom2, the PQ is very horrible

sure boh,i did try out but ok 4 me leh.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder

I feel the pixels are kind of distorted or exploded?? but of course that's also depends on the viewing distance. I still prefer to watch Astro in 4:3 but when watching on Plasma must be very careful and not to watch for longer hours....

I am loving my plasma screen, but i think my next purchase will not be a plasma anymore. In fact I feel plasma tv will be dead too in the future. But before any plasma fans start to attack me, here are my reasons why I feel plasma will be extinct in the future..

1. LED LCD tvs are getting more common and cheaper by the days and the boast picture quality and black levels as good as the plasma. So why buy plasma and risk getting burn-in on your screens.

2. With Astro Beyond here now, HD tv will be getting more popular than ever and the truth is most HD channels will have permanent logo that is famous for causing burn-in on plasma screen.

3. Plasma suck power so much more than LCD tv adn even the latest plasma from pana with neo-pdp have no match for the LED tv now.

4. Plasma tv have not really improve much over the years as compare to LCD tv. A few years back, plasma rule in terms of picture quality and black and contrast level, but these differences is almost gone with the LCD tv improvements over the last few years.

5. I thought burn-in are a thing of the past for current plasma tv but they are not.

Well, The story of plasma willbe dead already there for the past few years but yet still survivi till now..& LED TV is just a normal TV but instead of using florescent backlight, it uses LED thus less electricity & black.

Certain school of though will disagree on your statement that Plasma consume more than LCD...however LED diff games bcos using cost saving LED.


Anyway, agreeing that Plasma & LCD not much diff interm of PQ nowadays. LED will be a super good buy if the price

I suspect this burn-in only on few selected model of plasam & one of them Panasonic S10K series. So far no one facing this on the C, X & G series....Furthermore the S series have been withdrawn from the market without any valid reason esp they still selling the outdated C series & the HD ready X series....Does this ring any bell?

So can we list down the model that easily gets the burn-in issue?

1) Panasonic P42S10K
2) LG Plasma...?

Let see what will happen when Panasonic 2010 V and G models arrive to Malaysia. Let wait and see the performance of some called native contract of 5,000,000 : 1 and did you guy notice that the US model for S2 power consumption for 42" already decrease from 485 W in S1 to 298 W in S2. Just wondering what is the power comsuption for Malaysia model.

I don't think Plasma will loss cause simple, price issue. Most of our Malaysian less concern about the specification, their are more concern on price. This is still the weak point for LCD based TV for now.

I read from some megazine, their test the power consumption for Plasma for 54" Panasonic, 50" Pioneer and 50" Samsung, I noted actually when Plasma in all black, their only comsumed less than 200w power but when all white, thier comsumed 300 to 400+ W. Did that mean, power consumption for Plasma is vary according to what their display?

This post has been edited by low98944: Jan 21 2010, 10:09 AM

I predict that the future trend of TV will lean more towards "Go Green" direction like energy saving and using non-hazardours material for tv parts for easier disposal. So judging it in this direction, especially when OLED tv generation arrives, plasma might be struggling to compete with it unless they have come out new or breakthrough technology to keep them alive in this direction.

Don't talk about whose PQ and black level is better or so but towards the awareness of eveyone living on this planet, more ppl will tend to go for those tv set with the "Go Green" elements as part of their responsibility to fight with Global Warming.

"Go Green" is good thing, but who's care? At least in Malaysia, how many ppls really care about Green? Give us a choice, want green with more expensive products or less green with cheaper products? Don't you think which product will survive? Unless their can got green at the sametime lower the price la.

When OLED is ready, it is time for all Plasma, LCD, LED LCD, etc to retire.

This post has been edited by low98944: Jan 21 2010, 01:32 PM

My boss tell me in Japan, there is a point system for 'Going Green Lifestyle'...benefits will be given by the company based on that point system...but in Malaysia..err..just follow ISO14001 requirement should be proud oledi.

In our house no need to follow ISO14001 and there is no "real" benefit to normal ppl like us, then why go green? You don't expect ppl will go green since there is not immediate danger for not going green and there is no immediate benefit too. Then, most of the ppl will ask green for what?

Of course we could not see the instant benefit on this but for your next generations to come. Many companies have started to incorporate this policy as part of their social responsibility. We are not talking about us as normal consumer to lead the trend especially in Malaysia yet but this will be gradually driven by the government's effort going down to all the levels. It won't be surprised that we are start seeing more and more consumer products with environmental friendly element in it as their marketing strategy.

You may disagree to this or think this is too futuristic to be bothered as it is more on a prediction based on the current situation which will drive people's reaction for a cure

I am actually not support or against on green. It is funny that some of our products are greener than before but that is not mainly due to our government's effort but is due to those are manufactured by foreign invested companies where their have to compliance to their our countries policies.

This post has been edited by low98944: Jan 21 2010, 07:57 PM

No lah I didn't say it is Malaysia goverment but I meant a country's government. You got the absolute power to choose your own stand on this

why panasonic stop p42s10 production?

Yes. That is correct. Actually I try to explain what I think common ppl with react to green (example, more energy saving, etc). For common ppl, I think, price still most important factor, in Malaysia, affect them to choice products, the other factors are follow trend, etc.

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Added on January 21, 2010, 8:33 pmAsk Mr. Tony Endoh, he should know.

This post has been edited by low98944: Jan 21 2010, 08:33 PM

managing director! unreachable by common people

i think plasma eventually will lose out because no matter how, plasma will consume more power than the LED because of the nature of the plasma tech vs LED tech.

But the main concern for consumers is the Burn-in thing. Imagine if you are going to spend 5K on a TV and you heard people like your friends who bought plasma tv before and have screen burn-in, would you take the risk and still choose plasma even if it have slightly better blacks?

Most of the consumers who buy HD Tv now will likely wanna watch Astro Beyond had most HD programs will have big bright logo just to remind you're watching their channel. Are you gonna buy a tv that says "please don't watch the same channel for too long or risk getting burn-in?" Why bother with a tech that give so much hassle.

Now i'm in a difficult situation whether to subscribe to Astro HD because of the risk of getting burn-in on my 50"plasma. And I don't think I want to buy another tv where I feel so restricted as to how long can I watch a channel. To me ...I just forget about plasma Tv as LED tv can provide just as pretty picture as the plasma.

Who dunwan new tech..The problem is will the price competitive enough compare to Plasma (probably another year of two but not now) & furthermore LED TV is just another LCD TV wth LED backlight instead of Fluorescent...So watching in big screen >42' might not be as good as plasma.

pixel kind of distorted ? so whch distance of yr viewing ? mine approx 7feet away which are max liao.

Both are the same. Read somewhere the 18K sounds better, you know what I mean! You know lah the Chinese is obsessed with the number 8. So some big Chinese owned outlet use it to attract customers. Whether it makes a difference or not, I think it's an OCD thing.

BTW, even Michael Schumacher is obsessed with odd number. He was allocated with the number 4 but he asked to switch to 3 which was allocated to his teammate & it was approved.

Plasma & LCD have their advantages & disadvantages respectively.

One of the reasons I prefer Plasma is its natural colour. Also Plasma price now for a 42" is less than RM3,000.00. A few years ago it was unthinkable. My friend bought one 42" for about RM18,000.00 a few years ago.

Malaysian tends to be obsessed with price too. The lower the better for a quality product.

Thanks

I sit about 9-10 feet

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Added on January 22, 2010, 12:33 pmYeah I agree, we buy a TV is to enjoy as much as we can and not to worry about those IR and the restricted of usage of longer hours..

This post has been edited by echoesian: Jan 22 2010, 12:33 PM

Did you use the Just mode for converting 4:3 to fill the screen or 16:9?

The correct mode in the Panny to scale a 4:3 image is Just. The scaling is pretty decent. There are displays with better scalers.