It's class D amp so it shouldn't be hot. 150w x 7 = 1050w total. But I look at the transformer it's quite small. 1kw transformer is not small. I open up the XPA-5 and take a peek. The transformer is damn huge. In fact there is 2 transformer, the small one for the control circuit and big one for each of the amp plate. But maybe because XPA-5 is class A/B which require bigger transformer to push 1000w out.

This post has been edited by pierreye: Apr 27 2010, 10:55 AM

You sell cheap cheap to me. I need another sub for my living hall and I just want loud and deep bass. Don't care about music.

Sorry, I need PC-13 or PC-12 cause footprint can't be too big. Must be less than 20" x 20".

This post has been edited by pierreye: May 10 2010, 09:27 AM

PM me your best price for PC12-Plus. Might consider for living hall.

Submersive is the sub to beat at USD 2k. It's a sealed sub which has more gradual roll off after 15hz. My understanding is Mark purposely start to roll off submersive at 30hz and in room, the boundary gain will give you a flat response. So submersive would perform best in sealed room. If you had open space or very large room, you might consider either a sub eq or dual submersive. Mark always pitch to go dual submersive due to smoother response.

PB-13 Ultra is a brutal beast. It'll give you lot of punch above the tuning freq (high SPL). The only issue is below tuning freq, it will roll off steeper and higher distortion. For HT, PB-13 Ultra pricing is hard to beat.

This post has been edited by pierreye: Jun 28 2010, 08:42 AM

The translation makes me headache.

This post has been edited by pierreye: Jul 2 2010, 04:28 PM

Here's my translation. Need to omit some of the joke as it doesn't sound right after translation.

The reason to do a shootout with PB13 is due to some feedback from forummers that eD A3 subwoofer is better.
After setting up the Av.13a (DIY eD A7s-650), I want to bully SVS PB-13.

As human perception is different and always influence by current emotion (eg. if Chi Lin is sitting next to me, anything would be sound goood to me)

To be fair, we need to set some rules using test equipment. Using REW software to test the equipment would be the easiest solution.

Integration between sub and main/surround speakers are important. So we need to test both sub delay to ensure that there is no phase problem with the main speakers.

Both subwoofer SPL should be set as close as to main speaker SPL.

Using REW, it's very easy to set both subwoofer at the same level.

Below is the graph for both subwoofer place at slightly different position.




With different distance from the back wall will show different peak/null. This is considered normal. Both sub peak/null are quite near, although 13AV.2 is sealed design, using twin driver in half open room (door is fully open) without EQ, the low freq extension is extended near PB13 level can be considered very good.




Let's try out 13AV.2 first,

The skidoosh scene!



A lot of bass fanatics will applause when watching this scene.

The explosion scene will show multiple low freq. The low freq will extend until it pass through your wall.

In this scene, PB13 using ported advantage show a low freq rumbling that continuously spread out. When you thought the rumbling is ending, the coach is still shaking.

If I want to put good words for 13AV.2, I can only say that the performance on 13AV.2 show cleaner sound, the ending of the rumbling is control and end faster (doesn't sound like a compliment!)

Frankly speaking, although PB13 show a bit exaggerated bass output, but it's consider at the boundary of very good performance. From a strict point of view, I can only give 80 points. The difficulty of low freq is control. The truth is 13AV.2 using sealed air advantage (air spring), the control is very good. Different preference, different point of view. Those who prefer 13AV.2 will say this is advantage. Those who prefer PB13 will say this is disadvantage.
The truth is PB13 show its advantage in this type of low freq scene.

The PB13 owner console me by saying maybe the sub haven't warm up. We'll try other scene before coming to conclusion (F**k, This is common terms use by forummer to console other people).


Die Hard 4 test scene.

I remember during the tunnel crash scene, one of the Taipei forummer mention that during the car overturn to the front tunnel, it give a full body impact sensation. There's multiple wave of rumbling during this scene.

At this part, 13AV.2 performance started to open up. The body feel of car overturn, the impact falling to the ground shows 13AV.2 true performance. But PB13 give a slightly better sense of space.


As for the fighter jet bombing the bridge scene, this scene at last I can feel the explosive advantage of 13Av.2

In continuous bombing scene, 13AV.2 maintain the high SPL output performance.
13AV.2 performance completely pawn the PB13 without competition.

At this moment, the PB13 owner speak again.

He feel that although in this scene 13Av.2 performance is better, but mostly is chest thumping feeling. The pressure almost make him deaf, very uncomfortable. (F**k, when attend shootout, should say some good word, please help me)

Most of the important scene had been tested.

Conclusion.

PB13 in low freq high SPL output or one explosive energy performance is the best. Such as skidoosh scene, iron man accelerating in the air, hulk sonic gun scene.

13Av.2 advantages in early stage of impact and continuous output response. The integration with other channel is also smoother especially in upper octave performance.

In actual fact, 13Av.2 had it's problem too. Because twin driver movement are too strong and both drivers are installed in the same cabinet, the interference will impact the control.

I'm very satisfy with this shootout as it can perform close to PB13 which is out of my expectation.

As for ported and sealed design, both sub can considered top performance sub in each category.

The rest of the selection would depends on your preferences.

This post has been edited by pierreye: Jul 4 2010, 06:57 AM

I suggest you go for second submersive. Mixing ported and sealed sub might not be a good idea as you will loose out on lower extension at high SPL. Most recommendation from expert for dual sub are same model.

You really want to bring your SVS-PC13 over for shootout? I don't think I can shift the eD sub once it is install in the false wall.

Bro, don't throw the shit at us.

I'll bring my SPL meter to measure how loud is your fart

HSU ULS-15 is a sealed sub and can go down near 10hz. It's a good buy but not sure how much is the shipping for 2 units + tax. Estimate shipping for 2 should be around USD 560 based on weight. So USD 2560 x 3.3 = MYR 8448. Plus another 25% tax = MYR 10560. My opinion is SB-13 should sell less than USD 1k in US.

This post has been edited by pierreye: Jul 21 2010, 02:43 PM

USD 550 for 93lbs expensive leh. My eD kit shipping for 215lbs only USD 560.

USD 279 for 2 ULS-15 subs is dirt cheap for shipping charges. Only thing is Ketam will bite your ass in taxes.

I doubt it can be compare to 15" HSU ULS-15.

Anyway, I had found out why my sub is bottoming. Turning out I run the sub 10db too hot. It seems that audyssey and AVR test tone using SPL meter show correct level but when using REW graph, it's running too hot. Maybe the test tone emit the tone somewhere near the dip which cause this problem.

This post has been edited by pierreye: Jul 21 2010, 08:47 PM

Here's the chart after using REW to tune in the sub with main speaker. Audyssey is off and no EQ. Definitely need an EQ for the sub to dial in the response.

JChong, can you redo the graph at standard 75db? This is the normal listening level and will reflect the actual scenario. Also note that the higher db you go, the waterfall chart will show RT60 increase due to more energy reflected in the room.




This post has been edited by pierreye: Jul 22 2010, 04:33 PM

Yes. Note that this is without EQ on the sub.

Next year you should upgrade your Submersive to 2400w version.

It's call Submersive HP. Same driver just amp upgraded to 2400w. You can ask Mark to sell you the upgraded amp plate and trade in your old 1000w amp. Currently no 240v version but coming next year. Should net you another 3-4db for more punch.

I think it's around USD 300. Not sure if this is the trade in price.

Want to buy my RS Analog SPL meter? I'm getting Galaxy CM-140 for my speaker full range measurement.