Hi guys,

Thought I'd drop by and say hello in this thread. I used to LYN quite a lot a couple years back but I've slowed down a lot since then.

Anyway, I love flashlights =) Only started on them early this past year.

I'm normally in the USA but currently in Malaysia for a couple months. Getting parts here has been more challenging than when I was in the states, but it's good to see that there are a fair amount of dealers over here.

My humble collection:
(EDC) Liteflux LF2XT Q4-4C Black w/ 10440 Li-Ion - Great for "Need a light in 5 seconds" situations, variable brightness

(EDC) 4Sevens Quark AA Tactical WC w/ ICR14500 - Great for general purpose/longer runtime usage

(Keychain) Fenix E01 w/ L91 Lithium - Awesome backup - I just forget about it but it's there when I need it!

(Backpack) Seraph SP-6/IMR-9 w/ 2x IMR16340 - Great flood - a bit too orange for my taste but good for the night walks outdoors - 100 CRI!
(Backpack) Fenix PD30 w/ 2xICR16340 - Haven't used this much since I got my Quark, but it's still a solid performer.

At home: Romisen RC-N3 Q5, Minimag 2AA w/ Terralux Drop-In ... plus a bunch of other cheapo lights not worth mentioning!

Coming soon: FM D-26 bi-pin adapter & WA1111 bulbs. And hopefully CL1794 bulbs if/when they become available!

Does anyone know where to find Surefire P91 drop-ins cheap in M'sia? I saw them retailing for ~RM165 - pricey!

Thanks for the welcome! I'll see whether I can make the gathering. Work has been pretty busy - but I'll try to make it!


Oh well, guess I'll have to pass on the P91 for now. Anyway, I have the Fivemega D26 to bi-pin adapter on its way, along with TL-3 (LOLA), WA1111s and WA1185s!! Although who knows when they'll arrive..

My IMR-9 will probably be no where near the P91.. haha.. especially - even if it runs at its advertised 500lumens, <400 would get out the front. And it was only measured at 270 =\ But it is nice to know that it's more likely to turn on without instaflashing even on 18650s!

You run your P91 off 2x18500s?

This post has been edited by hoongern: Dec 15 2009, 11:37 PM

Who's hoogern? Hoongern
But anyway, you can put me on the list - but I honestly don't know yet, I'll say 50% chance - I have some stuff going on around that time so gotta see if scheduling and all works out.

But if I go - HOPEFULLY my WA1111/85s will have arrived by then and we can see how they perform against the venerable P91! (Hides my IMR-9....)

Haha, I just realized I got the wrong bi-pin adapter. Oops. So this tiny monster won't come to live after all, not for a while at least!

FiveMega D26-G4 Sunlight bi-pin adapter + WA1185 on 3x18500s =) More flexible - many lamps to choose from.

Really depends if you want to carry around a D36. I like to be able to fit mine in my pocket, so I'm opting to stay with the D26 and 2x18500s (WA1111, ~ 800 bulb lumens)/3x16340s. I also prefer huge flood. And 1185s are only USD5 a piece. But the IMR-13's probably safer, plus more 'heatsinking'.

If you are interested in this, make sure you do your research! I just bought the FM-G4-D26 and FM-T15-D26 adapters and WA1111, WA1185, TL3 bulbs, made some expensive and silly mistakes along the way =S

HOT stuff indeed!! It's those beamshots which is making me impatient to receive my D26-bipin modules with TL3, WA1111 and WA1185! I just love the 'wall of light' with 1185.

However, I was just glancing at the mag623 There's always something brighter, huh?

Yup, that's one of them. I got 2 different ones for 2 different bi-pin types (T1.5 for CL1794 and TL-3, and T.2.25/G4 for WA1111/WA1185). I decided that bi-pin bulbs are a lot cheaper to replace than Lamp Assemblies. I'll still be on the look out for cheap P91 modules, though. The LF modules are great, but I think I'd only use it with larger batteries. My IMR-9 with IMR16340s is, I'm sure, underdriving the bulb by quite a margin, since it's really made to shine on 2x18650s.

I'm guessing it'll take a while for them to arrive, though. Well, better to keep expectations low and have them exceeded!

Anyway, for prolonged (continuous) use, I still stick to my Quark AA =) It's easier to pocket as well.

This post has been edited by hoongern: Dec 19 2009, 12:55 PM

Hahah, it would probably be best if someone more knowledgeable here replies or you ask on CPF, but T1.5 and T2.25 are different socket types for bi-pin bulbs. The numbers either refer to their pin base separation, or bulb diameter. Afaik, the Gx (I.e. G4 G5 G6.35) refers to the pin separation in mm, while the Tx (I.e. T1, T1.5, T2, etc refers to the bulb diameter in multiples of 1/8" inches, i.e. T1 is 1/8", T1.5 is 1.5*1/8", etc). Whatever it is, bulbs like the TL-3, CL1794, CL1499 are T1.5 bulbs and would require this adapter. Bulbs like the WA1111, WA1185 are T2.25 bulbs, requiring this adapter.

Hope that helps!

This post has been edited by hoongern: Dec 22 2009, 04:31 PM

Hi guys, not sure if I can make it. I've been really tired and also not so well. Got tons of stuff to do tomorrow as well I think a hike ending at 11.30pm may be a bit too much for me. If I can't make it, I'll try and make the next one though, whenever that is! Anyway, my WA1111 and WA1185 bulbs aren't here yet

This is my understanding of Li-Ions:

To clarify, the LiFePO4 are Li-Ions. All the rechargeable lithium-based batteries are lithium ions, just that they use different chemistries. The "normal" ones which most use (with the protection circuits) are Lithium Cobalt 3.7V chemistry, potentially explosive. The LiFePO4s are a 3V chemistry, but will not explode. I don't believe that they are less prone to overcharging/discharging - in fact, as they don't have a protection circuit, one could accidentally over-discharge or overcharge them. The only difference is that they are generally more "rugged" and can take more abuse without catastrophic failure. (As can be seen in AW's thread - submerging it in water)

Similarly, I've started to grow fond of my IMR Li-ons, which are also Li-Ions, but use Lithium Manganese. They are 3.7V, and are a safe (non-explosive) chemistry. They are very similar to the LiFePO4s but they hold a bit more charge (550mAh) and can withstand EXTREME discharge currents while still maintaining a good voltage level. But I have to watch them - to make sure I don't accidentally discharge them.

At a 1amp discharge rate, you have the following capacities:
[CR123 Non-rechargeable] Li-MnO2: 1473mAh @ 2.15V_average: 3.170Wh Edit: Sorry, used the wrong values just now
[RCR/ICR] Li-Co 16340: 419mAh @ 3.25V_average: 1.363Wh
[IMR] Li-Mn 16340: 515mAh @ (ESTIMATE!) 3.5V_average: 1.777Wh (ESTIMATE!)
LiFePO4 16340: 500mAh @ (ESTIMATE!) 2.95V_average: 1.475Wh (ESTIMATE!)

Sources:
SilverFox's 123 battery shootout
SilverFox's Li-Ion battery shootout
AW's IMR16340 test
AW's LiFePO4 test

This post has been edited by hoongern: Jan 13 2010, 03:45 PM

I already have my IMR-9, plus D26/TL-3 (Pretty good throw!), but am STILL waiting for the D26 WA1111 [on 2xIMR18500] / WA1185 [on 3x IMR16340] to arrive (there was a mix up back in December and Fivemega only just mailed it off a couple days ago - hopefully will arrive within 2 weeks) - but I have been really wanting to see the P91 in action.

Plus I think the IMR-9 not being as bright as the P91 is probably when it's on 16340s. The IMR-9 performs much better on higher capacity IMRs - it was designed for 18650 usage, according to LumensFactory. Whereas, I think the P91 is at higher risk flashing on 18650s?

Oh NO! Unfortunately, my setup may not be ready :'(

I just experienced a short circuit, and my IMR18500 cells died, along with my twisty tailcap and D26 T1.5 module springs

http://www.candlepowerforums.com/vb/showthread.php?t=257976

Lesson: Do NOT underestimate how powerful IMR cells can be - exercise caution! And remove your batteries before changing P60 drop-ins, and check that the spring is straight before putting them back in!

Yeah, I didn't think anything would happen - in fact I hadn't read anywhere that you're supposed to remove the cells first. After this experience, I will always be removing the cells first and checking the springs!

Agreed. Storage is not so bad - as you can see them and put them in battery cases. However, when they're INSIDE the host.. that's when you can't see them and they can start causing trouble!

ooh ouch, looks almost exactly like what happened to mine. My cells seem to be fine as well - still holding > 4 volts right now. But I will carefully test them outdoors and outside of hosts first, and at low currents. I wonder how many watts were going through that thing when it shorted.....

The FM D26 has a longer-than-usual (at least, longer than my IMR9 spring) inner positive spring, which I think bent. It doesn't have the outer (larger) negative spring, but when I use it, I transfer the outer spring from my IMR-9 over to the D26 module.

Anyway, I actually managed to grab 3 beamshots before it all burned up!

Here's the Quark AA on a fully charged 14500 Li-Co, on maximum


Here's the FM D26 T1.5 module with a Streamlight TL-3 bulb on 18500s


Finally, here's the LumensFactory IMR-9 module on 18500s


all settings on 0.4sec F2.8 ISO80 EV-1 Daylight balance

After that is the *poof*

This post has been edited by hoongern: Jan 20 2010, 10:39 AM

I don't think I'd let a kid near even LiFePO4s, as shown by jwyj above they can also short! I think the only flashlights I'd lend to kids would be alkalines, or *maybe* ni-mhs (even ni-mhs are capable of very high currents!). No lithiums!

I may try to trim the spring in the future. The FM module spring is pretty long. We'll see =) He's going to send me a spare spring.

And it must have been REALLY RED HOT, seeing how it actually melted.. I'm not sure what the spring is made out, but steel melts at > 1000 degrees celcius! Now that's scary..

LiFePO4 cells can be thought of as a better substitute for CR123 primaries, as their average voltage is 3.2V (NOTE: Still slightly higher than CR123s, so don't just assume that CR123 setups can be replaced with LiFePO4s!), rather than the regular Li-Co cells which are 3.7V.

They are a safe chemistry, meaning that they will never explode (they can leak electrolyte, though, if abused beyond specifications), and they can take a lot of abuse, and are capable of higher discharge currents. They mostly do not have a protection circuit, so over-discharge protection has to be built into the light or watched by the user manually.

Their drawback is that they have relatively low capacity (500mAh) at low current applications - although at high current draws they far exceed the capacity of the regular Li-Co cells. (Li-Cos tend to sag a lot and lose capacity at high currents)

This post has been edited by hoongern: Jan 22 2010, 11:47 AM

If the drive current is very high, I would say it's unlikely. If it's low, probably yes. OTOH the maximum discharge rate from CR123s would be around 2A @ 2.4V - only 4.8W of power each. Whereas, the LiFePO4s can be driven to 2A with a decent capacity @ 2.8V - 5.6W each. They can actually tolerate 5Amp discharges, but with very low capacity. Look here.

Honestly I'm a bit puzzled by LiFePO4s - I would have thought IMR16340s would be a better choice for high current applications as they can provide 5Amps @ 3.1V = 15.3W of power each. Look here.

I'm not sure what drive current is needed for 1200 lumens from the SST50/90

---

Added on January 22, 2010, 12:15 pmAccording to the SST90 data sheet, 1000 lumens @ 3.2Amps (highest flux bin, not sure what 4Sevens is using). So to get 1200 lumens would be around 3.9Amps (a 120% flux increase) @ 3.25V = 12.6W of total power.

Now, guessing time.

If you have 3 cells, each cell would have to provide around 4.2W of power. For a LiFePO4, that would be around a 1.5A discharge (1.5A*2.9V_avg = 4.35W). For a CR123, that would be around 2A discharge (2A*2.2V_avg = 4.4W). For an IMR, that would probably be just over 1A current.

So actually with 3xCR123s, it could be *just slightly under* the limits.... although 2A is pushing it, afaik. And this is just at the beginning of the discharge when cells are full.

I dunno... ? I'm just making calculations which I think are correct, but I'm not sure. Go calculate it yourselves...

It also depends on how the circuit is designed and whether it will accept the higher voltages of Li-Co/IMRs

This post has been edited by hoongern: Jan 22 2010, 12:28 PM

Hey guys, I finally got my D26-G4 module and managed to get a couple beamshots of the TL3, LF IMR-9, WA1111 and WA1185!

Here they are:





This post has been edited by hoongern: Feb 1 2010, 09:33 PM

Yup! Gotta love IMRs for high currents - once you go > 1amp discharge, they far surpass the normal black label Li-Co cells. Much safer too!