Im talking about TV series or dramas,not documentaries.There are heaps of documentaries on engineering.

I enjoy watching documentaries,as they usually show the difficulties that they faced during the design or construction process.

What I meant by saving myself, is that once I whistle blow, my career at the company is almost destroyed. Being thrown out of job is the last thing I'd want. Whistle blowing causes distrust in the company. Being labeled as one, I'd have difficulty to find another job, no?

Sorry, it doesn't ring any bell.

The sad fact is how unkind the world had become these days. A simple example, a stranger walking up to you asking for direction, your first reaction is to think that he's a conman. So materialistic has we became that we'd stay put if the trouble might affect us.

So the engineer have saved the public from a engineering disaster, but will the public essentially thank him? Perhaps, but only temporary.

Before a person blows the whistle he should first be extremely aware of how things work in the circumstances and situation he is in.

Let's have a hypothetical example: where the mass media is controlled by the government, or by people and persons with vested interests, and where the line between politics and business is blurred and the two are in fact connected, where there are no regulatory mechanisms or branches of government separate from one another.

There would simply be no "official", safe, legal way to whistleblow because there is no meaningful protection given.

And if there is no protection given to whistleblowers, that is because people WANT it kept that way. The public, simply have no say, because they have divested their say to people they have "entrusted" to take care of them.

This does not mean that it is not possible to blow the whistle. This only means that blowing the whistle will become more akin to espionage, because in the end that is what it is: the leaking of secrets into the public domain when that is proscribed, and the penalty for sabotage, even if in the best interests, would be very severe.

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Added on November 3, 2009, 4:50 pm"God" and "Karma" is just a way of saying that there won't be any consequences in this life.

So we have to invent fictional causes and effects and do our best to make people believe such stories in order to influence their behavior.

LMAO!

All of this Jesus talk makes me want to vomit.

The public owes its individuals just as much responsibility and protection that we expect from one.

You cannot ask a person to "sacrifice" and "do the right thing" without giving back anything in return, which is exactly what we often do.

This post has been edited by Dickson Poon: Nov 3 2009, 04:50 PM

Yes! Nicely done, exactly the problem I wanted to address. Therefore in such situations, what can be done?

Nothing if you feel nothing could be done. As simply as that. The decision to make is basically in your hands.

Regards, Joey

But one's guilty conscience would be biting on the inside. I believe that would ultimately lead to depression. Such is 'Damned if you do, damned if you don't' situation.


Shouldn't a law be legislated to protect whistle blowers? And if there is, what should be contained in the law?

Should, would, could. All the ifs. Yes, it should exist, but will it? No.

The world is a fickle place, and people just want money money money.

Dreamer , ' Treat others like how you like to treated.'

I always treated others as my best friend and as one of my family member , I'm an ENFJ , so I give a lot to others. But sometimes people just don't appreciate my deeds , Ie. I have bought medicines for a friend few times yet now he is avoiding me like hell. He stop talking with me since I don't know when. And I found no logic reason behind why he is angry me, and I always have this in mind , he got no right to angry me because I sacrifice a lot for him to build this friendship. Yet he don't appreciate...

But as an ENFJ , I always believe that the universe will provide whatever things that the others din't appreciate. The things that you given will be returned , although not by them themselves , but the universe will pay somehow or rather.

But the problem is , shall I continue treat others like how I like to be treated ? I sometimes feel I give too much and take back so little or non appreciation at all! But I still give , thats why the universe has been so kind to me.

Laws of Malaysia (Act 588) Communications and Multimedia Act 1998. I cannot write much here but it helps if you read through it and understand it.

Regards, Joey

Dickson Poon,

Who say that karma and God only affect a person ONLY after they die??

This is WHAT people choose to believe in order to hope that they can escape the PUNISHMENT. But, they have NO ESCAPE.

Dreamer



This post has been edited by dreamer101: Nov 5 2009, 10:33 AM

A law alone isn't enough... in a hypothetical country where its richest and most powerful have their fingers in all branches of government including the security apparatus, the problem is that these people collude with one another to circumvent laws and public interest.

I don't see Dubya and Blair getting punished so far. These two men have done far worse than you or I ever could.

Keep on believing that fantasy if it helps you sleep better.

Sorry for the late reply guys, just finished my final examinations
And here we go

Indeed. Materialistic? For me, I view the problem roots from capitalism. While it is good for the economy to a certain extend, it does tend to disregard important social issues and morality/ethics.

I see. I'll do a quick search on that. Thanks.

I'd hope this discussion wouldn't steer too much into the direction of religious teachings.

And thus we will all be doomed to live in a world of self-preservation rather than sustainable development of the society?
Idea is, if a law exists, there can at least be a legal platform to whistle blow, and hence providing a more substantial case in the court. Previous court cases involving whistle blowing, such as the 3 engineers from BART, eventually lost the case even though their act saved lives.
Sure they've done remarkably for the society. But at the end of the day, they've lost their jobs. A case of 'Buat baik dipanah kilat.'

Well, in all cases society is perverted and skewered in such a way that, even had I done much good for the benefit of everyone, the most I'd get is a "I couldn't care less what YOU did". Being of good moral fibre exists in such a minority sometimes, and everyone else (even those who are "morally good") are just out to save their own skins. Admit it, we're all selfish to that extent. Mother Teresa's don't exist nowadays..

One question:
Under Human Resource Management spectrum, is there a whistle-blowing policy and procedure document to be signed? Something related to provisional step by step instruction on how to proceed in the event that an employee wishes to make a whistle-blowing complaint. Your company have that sort of thing?

Regards, Joey

p.s: It will provide legislative and organisational assurances of support if you happened to whistle blow.

Have you watched Prison Break? Micheal Scofield is an engineer with brains

whistle blowing is an act by an employee to inform higher management or the public about unethical or illegal behavior of an employer or supervisor (which also included product which is unsafe like what you want us to discuss). It divide into 3 which are internal, external and also anonymous/acknowledge.

How do you know when you should do whistle blowing?
- when you should (morally permissible) when
need: a clear important harm can be avoided
proximity: in a clear position to report the problem
probability: higher chance of success
last resort: no one can do it other than you

- when you must (morally obligatory)
four point in morally permissible are met
and the problem give imminent danger to a person if it continue

in corporate point of view, whistle blowing is undesirable because it can create distrust, disharmony, lead to inability to work in team and also threat of violence

Remind me of Ethics and Governance syllabus. Whistle blowing is right or not is based on various factors. 1 very significant is whether the whistleblower has proof or not.

I've learnt the concept of "whistle blowing" in International Business, Code of Ethics and Conducts, Business Management, attending Corporate Governance symposium, HRM policy and procedure practices....it's more than enough to know the inside out of whistle blowing.

However, the ultimatum belongs to us and at the end of the day, you'll just have to make a decision and act upon it or simply ignoring the whole ordeal.

Regards, Joey

p.s: The cookies are there. It's literally up to you to take one and grab a bite on it.

As an engineer, you have professional code of conducts and if you know something is obviously wrong but decided to keep quiet, you are equally guilty of the mistake. Also, most whistle blowing act should stop internally because it is in the interest of the company to rectify the problem else they'll get themselves sued into oblivion.

I can't recall which program this was on, but there was once a plane crash due to an inherently unsafe component/maintenance procedure. The engineer responsible flagged the issue up but it was ignored by the company due to additional cost.

In the UK, there are laws, such as this http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2007/ukpga_20070019_en_1 which would require companies to be responsible.

This post has been edited by Geminist: Nov 11 2009, 03:42 PM

Your statement sounds cruel but sadly that is how the world/society is.

Sorry I find your posts quite hard to understand.
Are you meant to say that if I signed up to work in a certain company, are there any black and white about whistle blowing?
Pardon me I'm still an undergraduate, haven't step into the realms of working life yet.

Ah.... I suspect we've read the same textbook XD XD
It's exactly the same, conditions to whistle blow. Haha.

1. Aha, that's a new way of putting it.

2. I remembered reading on that case too. In most of the cases, it seems that the engineering department are always in the lower position, i.e. they have to do this and that, but ultimately the decisions lies in the hands of the management department.