Well, personally I didn't really think much about it so I didn't follow it. Thought I'd just go online to find whats the difference but I'm quite disapointed as usual with our local auto journalist being subservant shoe polishers all the time. I read one article here and couldn't find anything useful, then I read this article and they skirted around answering the issue totally.

So I'm not too sure what are the exact differences between the CKD and CBU.

A colleague of mine as the CBU version according to him it is very fuel saving. We went on a outstation trip from KL to Johor. It could be that the Honda Insight driver was pushing the car too much on the highway and being only 1300cc that little engine was probably near explosion going at 160kmh. Needless to say the Insight really needed to pump petrol for the trip back while the CX5 owner pump just because he felt it was safer as the needle was just below the middle mark while the insight was left to only its last quarter. Bigger cc does help when you need to cruise at highspeeds.

After that experience, I'm thinking the CX5 is a pretty good car. Good design, fuel saving, 5 years warranty and 3 years free maintenance plan. All sounds good, then again resale value is always going to bite. If you don't bother about it too much then you should be fine as I don't think it would be that bad since they going to CKD it, so there must be a decent size and volume already.

But then the choice is yours, I can't really say it's a good/bad car. Somewhere in between I guess, probably this model would be the success story for Mazda like Fiesta is the success for Ford while all other models aren't selling as well and have terrible resale value?

Anyway below are a few things to turn your mind

2009 Toyota bB - do you like funky JDM cars? this is another one of those square cubic cars from Japan, although made in 2009 but its unregistered so new car interest rates apply. It's a matter of taste, either you love it or hate it. I've been told it shares the same engine as the Vios but I doubt this a little so went to check...

Toyota bB uses:
The 3SZ-VE is 1.5 L (1495 cc). Bore is 72 mm and stroke is 91.8 mm, with a compression ratio of 10.0:1 and redline of 6500 rpm. Output is 80 kW (107 hp) at 6000 rpm with 141 Nm of torque at 4400 rpm. It features VVT-i.

Toyota Vios (2013/2014 model) uses:
The 1NZ-FE is a 1.5 L (1497 cc) conventional Otto cycle variant of the 1NZ-FXE. It has the same bore and stroke, but the compression ratio is lowered to 10.5:1, and it features VVT-i. Output is 80 kW (107 hp) at 6000 rpm with 141 Nm (103 lb·ft) of torque at 4200 rpm. The redline is 6400 rpm.

...so eventhough they're both 1500cc VVTI engines from Toyota they're not the same although output is more or less the same because its a JDM of course it will have a better engine than Vios is meant for the cheaper mass market of SEA.

2011 Merc G55 AMG - came across another funky model which might pique your interest, however I've to admit I don't know much about this model but it looks great though has some classic rugged Jeep looks but refined on the inside. I think you need to go Merc Club forums to find out more though I think for the price it is a good buy.

2009 Nissan Dualis - an SUV which I have recommended before and I think would satisfies your need for something which is rare/unique with an eye catching design yet it has a reliable engine and maintenance/service aren't too expensive because of its sister model X-Trail is all too common on the roads. Basically, they took off the ugly boxy body from the X-trail, shrunk the Murano body and slapped it on the chassis....thats what I think



This post has been edited by zenix: Oct 9 2013, 09:50 AM

really?

2013 Honda CRV - normally a CRV would cost you more than RM140k, however I found this advert which is quite interesting so I thought I share this with you if you're interested.

2008 Merc C180K Sport - IMHO this is much more worth it to buy than an Accord or Camry because it has better safety features, 5 stars NCAP rating, prestigious brand, reliable parts and quite decent part prices. If I were to choose between a BMW and Merc, I would choose a Merc because of the uncle culture here wanting merc's but not willing to pay sky high prices for parts there are alot of stockist bringning in compatible and OEM parts at low prices until even original parts need to reduce price to stay competitive. A good everyday runner, like most German cars of late it uses a smaller 1600cc engine with force induction (this one uses a supercharger) to give it all the required power.

2008 Toyota Estima - this model is so common on our roads I wonder why they never officially bring it over since I see every grey importer has at least 5 units at anytime ready to sell to customers. Being Toyota you know reliability and cheap parts is the key to their success. The advert didn't state this is the G-spec but the equipment list sure looks like it, do make sure with the seller that all is as according to the advert then I consider it a great deal.

RM40k doesn't get you much in terms of new car.

Your choices are full spec Viva, medium spec Myvi, medium spec Saga or basic Persona

2013 Mitsubishi Attrage - I don't know if it will be the final pricing because agents in Mudah and Oto are toying around with RSP of RM59k while the official websites states the tentative RSP of RM71k....so I am not too sure....however if it is RM59k it would be a very very good deal undercutting the current cheapo king Nissan Almera



Not really.
He likes to buy second hand cheap conti to do up.
He has a Fiat which he has done up nicely and is very reliable, the Skoda is another project as he got it very cheap but needs alot of parts to do a proper restoration but he is an engineer so he won't go for all original parts from the official dealer so he sourcing from everywhere and even use compatible parts.

2002 Skoda Fabia - why not consider this one? it is less than RM10k, perhaps you can buy it cash. If it is in working condition and you don't need to fix it up much then it is a very very good buy.

2004 Skoda Octavia 1.8T - this is another MK1, price is right and advert states it is well kept. If you don't need to make any repairs it is a good buy since it is still loanable you can loan it and repayment can be very low you can save cash for that repair which would be coming since it is a almost 10 years old

Would you consider the Inokom Matrix as a car with good fuel consumption, reliable, and not underpowered?
Because the majority of people I know consider the car underpowered, so they drive the car harder which in turn the doesn't give back good fuel consumption.

2013 Nissan X-Gear - this is the new just facelifted model, looks great isn't it? Basically they shrunk the Grand Livina abit and did away with the rear row of seats so this car is a smaller 5 seater (doesn't have rear aircond blowers like the Livina) but that's okay since its like a normal sedan format for seating the cabin cools pretty quickly. At around RM85k being a C-segment crossover is a very very good deal, it has the high seating position you like, plus reliable Nissan engine -- talking about the engine it is only 1600cc compared to the Grand Livina which has a 1800cc engine but with the X-Gear being smaller and lighter I don't find it underpowered but then again there would be people that say it is underpowered, those are the people that would always complain of underpowered issue but will never pay for a powerful car like VW Golf GTI so better go test drive yourself and judge for yourself

Merc is always cheaper to maintain than BMW/Audi.
Audi would depend on which model as certain models share alot of common parts with VW/Skoda so cheaper.
Can't expect a good car and prestige car to have cheapo maintenance like a japanese econobox, that's the reality.

Erm for 10k you can't get any new car, unless that's just the deposit.
Perodua cars are pretty good for small size people.
Though I think for safety reasons you should get something better.
Are you the type of girl that won't care for the car just leave it to your dad?

For a BMW? Nope if there are a few niggling issues.
Full service record at reputable 3S is a must.

Please read here and here and here and finally here.

When you go and view the car make sure you get to start the engine from a cold start to see if it has this issue.


Not too sure what you mean.
You're looking for Suprima or something else as an alternative for the budget given?

i refuse to answer because you didn't even bother to go toyota's website

This post has been edited by zenix: Oct 9 2013, 11:25 AM

<--- CEO

2013 Perodua Viva 660M - if you can handle a manual transmission then you can give this a shot, considering its almost your full budget for such a basic car you might think it is not worth it but this can't be helped the market is such we can't change that unless everyone stops buying cars for a year to force the government or car companies to make them cheaper else buying cars is always going to be a loss to everyone. Anyway, this is a basic A to B car, don't expect much just barely passing all minimum requirements set by the government for cars. If you value your life (which I think you do) don't buy such crap eventhough its new, better buy something used which gives you better value, of course some might say used car is problem car, well not all new cars are problem free anyway so its about equal. I'd rather feel safe in a car I drive everyday.

2007 Toyota Avanza 1.3 - now we move into used Japanese cars as something like this would be a good buy because it is not very old made in 2007 (that's about 6 years old which normal age for people to trade-in their cars for something new), its a very common car (common cars means more shops going to stock parts for it and it would be cheaper due to economics of scale), and slightly safer to be in than a Viva. Granted it is very ugly but at least you have something big, so even if someone bangs into your rear there is a huge buffer space before it reaches you....ipsofacto....its safer....another good point for having a big car for girls is bigger cars then to have better driving visibility because you sit higher on the road and of course bigger cars tend to not get bullied on the road as much as smaller cars.

2005 Nissan Sentra 1.8SG - around this price range it is quite common to find the Sentra's with 1600cc engines but getting the 1800cc one would be better because the engine is more powerful and more fuel efficient. Sentra is a very long lived model as it is still in production until today so you don't have to worry about the car going obsolete and can't find parts for it anymore.

I did have a few more in my mind but I thought they would require additional car knowledge and willingless to learn to keep the car in shape so it won't get faulty to cause you a huge bill at the workshop, so I think above is a good spread for your thoughts.

A local brand new car but relatively not so safe and small.
A japanese brand used MPV but bigger and taller.
A japanese brand used sedan which is powerful but still light on your pocket.

Preve and Suprima are very very good value buys if you don't mind the brand Proton.

Is turbo a must?
Size must be c-segment?

LOL! Why is it your dream car?

Toyota Avanza at least got crash tested and got 4 stars...


What does Perodua Viva have?

The Mitsubishi Mirage would be great since it is within your budget and is fuel efficient, however, might be too small and not enough of an upgrade to you. Though if the sedan version called the Attrage comes within your budget it would be great, though I've a feeling the Attrage won't be as cheap as the Nissan Almera since it is imported.

2012 Honda City - not many are this cheap but there are many pre-facelift owners discarding their cars because the facelifted Jazz and City have much better price for the same price (both come with VSA for starters), another is because the facelifted cars all have the bugs all ironed out as pre-facelift owners did receive a few letters for Honda for recall on certain components to go replace (probably frustration on their part to give up on the car when dealing with problematic 3S). In a nutshell a good car, fuel economy decent -- might be poor if you've got a heavy right foot.

This is the webpage for the most basic Viva here, notice it doesn't state it has airbags?

Now this is the webpage for the Viva Elite here, notice it clearly states it has airbags?

So only the most expensive Viva with the Viva Elite spec starting price of RM37k has airbags, others nada.

So Avanza, good I think it is the minimum you should look for.

2007 Renault Kangoo - interested in this car? actually it is very good but kinda ugly

Meaning the car price in total only RM5000?
Sounds abit too good to be true.

MB G55 nice and funky, yeah?

Quashi/Dualis/Rogue would do the job for you but of course it is not in the same size league as the CRV/CX5.

Murano would be in the comparable size, but the catch is....new facelift more expensive, you mind to get the pre-facelift version? All are recon's anyway, however the price is near CX5/CRV though you can still find something within your RM140k budget depending on spec and year made.

I think very soon.

Vios 12 - unless you get clear stock car which is new, its an expensive choice.
Attrage - agents taking booking saying its going to be 59k but mitsu website say its 79k

I think 140k can get you a nice 2008 Merc C180K recon

This post has been edited by zenix: Oct 10 2013, 04:14 PM

I'm quite busy this week.
Hopefully can answer your questions before Friday

Why not?
You can also get a 2010/2009 VW Golf TSI for that price.

Limited service centers is hampering its growth.

RM160k only gets you a mid-spec Mazda6.
RM160k gets you a mid-spec to high-spec C200 depending on the seller/year made.

Prestige: Merc
Power: Merc
Reliability: Merc
Maintenance: Merc

What's the reason for choosing the Mazda6?
The looks? Or because it is new?
For the looks and technology might as well buy a 2013 Suzuki Kizashi which is just as rare and expensive to maintain but has much better safety features.

2013 Honda Jazz Hybrid - for about RM79k you can get yourself a new jazz hybrid which is a pretty sweet deal considering it is a new car. Everything about this car is good except when you start to think about resale value, unfortunately currently resale value for hybrids is terrible because generally people think replacement parts are expensive especially for the battery which everyone is most worried about they think it is 3 years warranty and rm20k to replace.....but actually it is more like 8years warranty and rm3.5k to replace. So be at the front of the curve because generally people think hybrids are no good thats why companies selling them cheaper to get the volume....get it now while its cheap....prices and resale should go up when people clear the stupid myths away.

if you think VW's i recommended are "high maintenance cost" then Peugeot, Mazda and Ford are in the same category, frankly speaking it all depends on what is most important if speed is a main criteria then maintenance is of course going to be costly because to generate speed the hardware needs to work harder and the harder it works the more maintenance it needs in terms of parts wear and tear, plus quality of parts used.

something cheap and slow like a Saga is okay to use lower quality lubricants and parts because it is designed as a basic transportation workhorse going from A-B, but you want to go from A-B faster the parts will wear out faster so to put back reliability into the equation manufacturers need to use better parts and higher quality lubricants.

now you come to the zone of pugs, mazda, ford, vw where the cars are fast but maintenance is also high, so now the balance is to choose which car is worth the headache of extra maintenance cost (time and money) so then you look at what else it can offer you.

lets say the maintenance is equal and performance is equal - then you're only left to choose the design and brand you like, but in the real work you need to balance more than that.....performance, maintenance, looks, brand, resale value, etc. all comes into play.

So lets make a quick look at the cars...

2013 Mazda 3 - speed is decent since it is 2000cc, but it is more of a hatch than a sedan, but no turbo means no rush of power, resale value ain't never good for this car.

2014 Peugeot 408 - this is seriously cheap as I remembered this model isn't sub-100k priced, if it is really this price then of course its quite worth it, its got a nice turbo and good power output, maintenance is a pain but getting something like this on the cheap might be worth the trouble, resale ain't never good for this brand.

2013 Nissan Sylphy - safe choice, decent resale value, decent power, decent safety equipment but lacking traction control for this segment, overall....might be abit too mundane.

2009 Honda Accord 2.5 - if you're going to get a second hand Accord then aim for the 2400cc version as it has better power output, the 2000cc is decent and power difference ain't noticeable when you test drive it at the showroom but you'll know the difference in real world driving when your highspeed cruising uses more petrol than it should when maintaining highspeeds, pickup is abit less responsive for alot of start/stop traffic, and going up genting is a little bit harder.

2010 VW Golf TSI - can't afford the GTI then just get the TSI, still much better than getting a Sylphy/Mazda3/Focus.

In terms of what?

Brand: Vios - many people will say you made the smart choice, getting your father-in-law to like you also easier.
Resale: Vios - undeniable after so many generations.
Power: CFE tuned, stock condition CFE isn't much to shout about.
Size: CFE is C-segment, bigger than Vios B-segment

1. He gave you a ballpark number based purely on the model and how much the bank is willing to loan for this car, lets say the bank will allow this car to loan up to RM20k only then he will sometimes quote you lower expecting you to negotiate with him if not he may just pocket the difference. Usually, whatever accessories you put in doesn't count unless you're selling it directly to another guy else just sell the accessories seperately and give the used car salesman an empty car.

2. Every salesman has alot in his pocket, you can always try. Even if one declines you can always get from another salesman in the same showroom or from another showroom. Do check what is the market price for cars of your spec on websites such as mudah and oto.

3. Yes, the bank/insurance valuation of your car when you buy the insurance. So you see how much the insurance willing to cover for your car if total lost or stolen - that's the true value of the car. Accessories if not factory fitted aren't counted.

4. New car just launch, you're on the losing end if you expect they'll drop the price for 2013 year end sales.

5. IINM RM300 for swap, you can double check at JPJ website. But that's the price if you do it yourself, when runners are in the picture at least need to inflate the price by RM100.

Dunno bro, koreans never gave me a good impression, don't follow their cars much.
Why not up abit for the mitsubishi mirage/attrage?

Probably for a used FN2R but definately not FD2R.
What is FN2R? Look here.

The one in the advertisement is decent.
You need to see the real condition to judge, but from the pictures look mint.
I have seen many pictures that look mint but when on closer inspection there are scratches and stuff, the worst is when the interior is in bad condition if the paintjob isn't good you can always repaint but interior will cost alot to replace, plus this car is rare so parts aren't easy to find nor would be cheap.

The rim doesn't look like what an original FN2R would wear.
Additionally better get real good insurance for your rear window, it would cost a bomb to replace when broken.

I do know many people would be comparing FN2R to the 208 GTI since they're about the same price range, 208 GTI is new while FN2R is recon. Well, can't really compare since FN2R is actually much more expensive if imported new should be about RM170k above, plus FN2R would be easier on your pocket when it comes to maintenance.

2012 Toyota Avanza 1.5 - you might see something like this and think it is a good buy since its spec is quite high, but by comparison a new Avanza (lowest spec) is only RM6,000 more if it is a good buy or not depends on what you think but considering the other cars available at this price the seller is really going below market rate.

2004 Honda Stream 2.0 - if this car was younger or cheaper I'd fully recommend it but as it is I think it is quite expensive, I don't think it is viable for you since it is going to be 10 years old soon plus you need it for travelling outstation so you need something reliable and won't be too expensive, so if you see cars around your budget but they're old do skip them.

2008 Nissan Grand Livina 1.8 - looking around for a good car for your usage was difficult however I do think such a car would be good for your needs. Although your family only need 4 seats the additional seats would be good when you balik kampung and need to take your relatives out, as my experience are when 'balik kampung' when travelling the car is full with luggage when at the kampung its full with people as you bring them out to makan as a family or outing so the additional seats are a plus either as people transport or folded as luggage space. I'd recommend you to take the top spec with 1800cc engine as although the 1600cc is capable, you'll have much better fuel efficiency and higher highway speeds with the 1800cc....plus overtaking is easier as this is important especially when overtaking lorries at trunk roads. Maintenance wise its easy and cheap. Even if you bring it back to Nissan 3S you can bring your own parts and lubricants they'll still accept but charge you the labor fees.

If you're going to buy a local car no matter if it is Saga/Persona/Inspira/Preve/Suprima.....don't put your expectations up too high.

When Preve came out it ticked all the boxes when it comes to safety (5 stars from ANCAP), performance (turbo engine), design (european look with DRL built into the headlamps), space (modern c-segment space for passenger and luggage), etc.

However, there were some disappointments but that's normal for every product and also not every manufacturer does anything about it. The performance of the turbo is sluggish was one of the biggest issues consumers had, there were other smaller niggles too, but many of these issues have been ironed out in the Suprima -- but it's still new so we cannot pass judgement yet.

In Malaysia <100k is still B-segment territory so don't put such a big hope.

The two brightest stars for this price range is either Ford Fiesta or Honda City, then those two also have their issues, so never perfect.

People usually have this problem because they bought a car in the middle of the year when the car companies have big promotion's for Raya or year end sales clearance. Yes, you get a big discount but in the future this will be the problem you're facing now. You've got two choices about this either wait until next year to get the Vios and take a hit on the resale value of your old Proton, or just buy the Vios now while you have a good price for your Proton as Vios normally has good resale value so the difference wouldn't be a big issue.

Of course the W204 would be more compact than the Mazda6, as the Mazda6 is the flagship car of the brand so it has to have the best technology, looks and space. So comparing to a W204 is quite silly, similarly you can also choose to compare Accord/Camry/Mazda6/Teana 2013 model with the W204 and they're all going to be much bigger than the W204 but when it comes to safety, spec, performance and prestige they'll all fall behind or are on par with the W204.

Plus also Merc has a weird way of classifying their cars. Their A-Class (which should be an A-segment car that would pit it against basic cars like Kancil/Viva) is much more of a C-segment hatch. Their C-Class (which should be a C-segment car that would pit it against cars like Civic/Jetta/Altis/etc) is thought to be a D-segment car which would pit it against Accord/Camry/Passat/etc.

Then there is what is termed of as compact D-segment which the W204 is part of, which are D-segment sedans but with compact body because of its sporty nature, such cars are like Suzuki Kizashi, Honda Accord Euro-R, etc.

So end of the day if size matters to you then go for Japanese D-segment such as Camry/Accord/Teana/Mazda6 they're always going to be cheaper and bigger, and some of them do match the safety and spec of Germans but not always.

which model you're talking about?

this is the best so far, but any special deals are still only available at the bank itself.
you can usually get better and some rebates sometimes.

http://www.imoney.my/car-loan

it's gotta be older.

2006 Honda Accord 2.0 - the 2000cc considered abit underpowered is usually cheaper to buy used than a Camry, a good buy in many ways, however not many are up for sale below RM60k and going to 2006 meaning that in 3 years time the car would be 10 years old. if you don't mind the age because honda's if kept and maintain well shouldn't be much of an issue then it's alright.

Did you test drive the car?
Engine start any issues? Even if it hesitates abit you should think twice, sometimes they say is battery weak and will change it before giving to you but sometimes its a starter issue so a new battery just is a temporary fix.

I've my doubts they will repaint the car for you at no cost, most likely they'll bring it to a shop get the guy to touch-up spray a few bits here and there which is cheap then use cheap polish to grind it all down blend in the colors, then wax it (come don't even wax) to make it shine.

You're happy they're giving you 19" unknown rims instead of originals?
Original FN2R or FD2R rims are perfectly weighted for the car to give maximum performance, they are also sought after as used items so any car dealer can make a quick buck selling those off and putting on some cheapo taiwan rims with Honda logo's.

Around this range you can consider either 2007/2008 Scirocco/Golf GTI for recon/used.

Don't be an ignorant fool the 208 GTI comes as a coupe only, where got 4 doors.

Can't really say, even if you bring a mechanic with you unless he can take it apart he can't let you know.

They might know there are issues with the car but will still try to hide it from you as repairs or discounts will eat into their margin, best to be vigilant and informed -- remember you're not obliged to buy if you feel it is not worth it no matter what they say so don't get bullied.

It could be that they already sold the rims when the car arrives, easily RM2000-4000 depending on condition.

Well, GTI is good and powerful but the TSI is no slouch.
GTI MK5 is within your range but then the warranty would be over, unless you get recon at least you got 6 months.
GTI TSI is within your range and still have 2-3 years warranty.

This post has been edited by zenix: Oct 18 2013, 01:52 PM

here is the skinny:

2010 Honda City 1.5 E-spec - got paddle shifters, not facelift model so no VSA, 59k mileage consider decent.

2011 Vios G-spec - no such thing as a recon Vios don't get conned, remember that the Vios didn't depreciate as much as the City so it might not be worth purchase since its not going to be worth much as 3rd hand.

2010 Nissan Latio 1.6 - although it looks like a B-segment car it has the space of a C-segment, and is about 10k cheaper, in terms of features it loses out to the City (infact all loses out to the City in this price range) but being more basic means less chances of it having problems.

You're welcomed

They won't allow you to do that because it will reveal all their flaws before they sell you the car.
They'd offer to bring it to JPJ for inspection then of course claim the car is in great condition if it passes the JPJ inspection, but realistically the JPJ inspection is a farce -- as long as the engine can start the car can move and brake, and the car doesn't have any illegal modifications then it passes the test.

One month or one year warranty doesn't matter if they don't honor it.
Many sellers want to be price competitive so they don't factor in the warranty into the car to sell cheaper so that 1 month is a small gamble if anything goes wrong they either bring it to their workshop to fix (quality or not depends on their sincerity), of course there are some reputable sellers like Naza but you notice their price is higher because they factor in the warranty cost for selected components.

2013 CRZ looks like a good deal right now.
They giving 8 years warranty for the battery, 5 years warranty for the car, and 3 years free maintenance (which works to around 6 visits because they stretch the service intervals to 10,000km).

For the unprepared go for the CRZ.
If you know what you want and know how to maintain cars then go for FN2R.
For myself only the FD2R matters.

Considering it is a high mileage car and it is already 3 years old, probably the current owner wants to trade-up to the new Vios?

Don't think it is worth it. You can probably get something better from Nissan for that price either Latio/Sentra.

VW PS - You should be able to get some pretty sweet deals around now, I've seen some going as low as RM85k. Of course you instantly take a hit in the resale value when it becomes 2014 because you buy a car in 2013 year end but everyone does it and what most important is to buy a car at a cheaper price now that you can afford don't worry about the future too much.

Vios - Haha! Maybe you father-in-law will love you more?

City - Similar kind of deal with the VWPS, you get a big heavy car with lotsa of safety features (only City and PS got traction control for under 100k cars) but of course because of the weight it is not very nimble of course it has adequate power for driving around, highway speeds also not bad and feels secure, however it is not going to feel as zippy as a Vios (Vios is lighter and less safety features).

Latio - within your price range, has the space of the VW PS but would feel abit more budget. The VW PS feels quality and looks quality. The Latio looks and feels like a basic C-/B+ segment car, the major difference is of course the Latio would have more power you get a choice of 1600cc or 1800cc engine but it doesn't come with any traction control feature.

I think the VWPS would be the best bet, getting a year end sale model for RM85k (around there) is a big discount as it then puts the car in the price range of the Honda City and Nissan Latio.