i really cannot stand the quality of photo from the normal camera dy after i saw those photo taking by his dslr, any advise for me? wanna buy a dslr for beginner. wat i heard is nikon is better and buying second hand camera is good for beginner.

The prosumer (a consumer who knows more than the average consumer, but not a pro yet) cameras are a good start, you needn't go right away for a full DSLR.

Prosumer cameras are those that look like a DLSR, has some features of a DSLR, but none of the complexity of a DSLR.

An example of a prosumer camera would be like the Canon Powershot SX10 IS.

But if you really want to start with a DSLR right away, going for the lower end EOS cameras are good, like the 450D. Admittedly, I'm not too familiar with the other brands, so I can only recommend Canon cameras for now.

Maybe someone else can recommend other brands that are in the same range as the ones I described above?

i would like to straight away go for dslr, bcause im still a student, i dont think that i can keep changing my camera. btw, tnx alot for ur advise, appreciate. i will check the 450D out.

DSLR is not a cheap hobby

try the nikon d60...i using it and good for me.

wat u mean is ask me to forget about it n stick with normal camera? T_T

if u can afford...nobody can stop u frm buying SLR..actually good investment for future as u can change the lens for different use and maintain the same body..

i would recommend you to go to any camera shop and test a few entry level cameras such as 1000D from Canon, D60 from Nikon and A300 from Sony. Both are good cameras for beginner. Tested both and pick the one that u feel comfortable with. Those cameras only cost around rm2k IINM. But if u can't resist the temptation it can expand to rm20k in no time

This post has been edited by kapalterbang_737: Sep 25 2009, 02:21 PM

1 more thing is the lens, wat i noe is very expensive, i would like to hav a lens that can really zoom, my budget is below 2k plus lens, izit possible?

yea then go get the those sigma 35mm-200mm

or 70mm-200mm just the problem is because the lens is too long its very hard to carry. You need to carry a big bag.

I usually go out i carry the 35mm to 70mm only.

lens that come with the camera izit? 35mm to 70mm? so that means it is the normal lens?

i suggest u get a camera + kit lens. kit lens is enough for a beginner. alot of things u can explore with it.
then only u can know, what u want, and what u need. what i means is the lens (wide/tele/micro/potrait etc.).
so be patient, u dont need to buy everything in ur first buy, unless u got alot of cash. lol.

hmm... agree with u

learn what u'll lack of from the kitlens. from that u'll get a wishlist

2k just can get standard package with 55mm kit lens. If u like 200mm can consider A230 twin lens kit cost RM24xx.

Else u can try an used DSLR entry level 1st then upgrade to Pro when u are ready.

the nikon 18 -105 vr lens would be ideal for u...price around rm1k..

beginner DSLR usually comes wit 35-55mm kitlens.
If u want anything higher or lower u need buy extra lens sometimes it can cause half of your DSLR or more

So like alot ppl say here buy those come wit kitlens when u think dslr suits u then only upgrade. When u upgrade those lens for same brand can be used as well

From my personal opinion, screw the A230, A330, A380...Those models are jz not worth the money.
I'd rather have an A200 over the A230 to be honest.
Try both out and you're most likely to understand why i made this statement.

A230 sounds good for me, got 2 lens somemore.

Try to find the A300 twin lens kit...Shd be about that price too...

If you ask in forums (or anywhere for that matter) each brand's fanboys will try to brainwash you into buying their favourite brand.

As stated above, go to the camera shop and try out a few brands of camera. See which one you are most comfortable with. Then see how much you are willing to spend on it.

But BEWARE!!!

This hobby is a never ending black hole where you will throw your money... only very few people ever see money coming back to them

go for D90.
LOL

No such thing...
I'm a Nikon user, but recommend him Sony...

This i have to agree with...
It's a never ending thing, u start by testing the water, u end up getting ur whole body wet.
And it ain't easy to get out of it... (not many can resist the temptation to quit once they've started)

compare the A200 and A300 twin lens kit, its like almost same with me, but the price for A200 is more near my budget, wat is saw on sony web is RM2099. A200 or A300 is better?

1 of my fren said 450D is the most reasonable, any1 noe the price?

I'd still say get the A300...
The A300 twin kit should be about 2.4k retail nowadays.
The 450D with a 18-55 lens would have cost you about 2.4k as well.

To compare between the 2, will pretty much depend on your own feel.
If you like the Sony more when u have it in your hands, go for it.
If you like the Canon more, then go for it.

I had a friend who started with a Sony A200 about 7 months back, went on for a short stint with the Nikon D60.
He liked the Sony, did not like the D60, so went on to get the Canon 40D, which 1 month ago, he just ditched.
And now, he ends up with a D90. And he said he's satisfied and never regretted the switch.

You will not want to go through so much before you find yourself the perfect one, so go down to the shops, and try them out.

tnx A meh noh!

exactly.........handling is important

its like choosing between cars.........if that car handling is suck, of course u will not buy that car

I say buy the A200 too. Coz got so many benefits from Sony like free trips n lessons u can attend. the trips outstation r a whole lot of fun. then when ready, make a big jump 1 shot to full frame.

saw A230 yesterday, very cheap. But A200 is very good too. Try a few brands out, which one you like most. Then it'll be worth the money for you

A200 is very good price package for starter.

A200 is good. A300 is good...........BUT, maybe you guys should let TS know why Alpha price are so cheap.

not possible.

unless..... you manage to find a used 18-200 for about RM 1.2k and a used body for RM 800. that also not including other accessories.

best bet is the Sony twin kit lor.

Can try to get Sony A350 twin kit. Or you can buy D60/40x 2nd hand with kit lens (18-55mm) + new/2nd hand nikon 55-200mm zoom lens. New one cost around rm800-950.

Total will cost you rm2000+

many DSLR owner said "this is expensive hobby" so think properly before you buy.

This post has been edited by lighter: Sep 25 2009, 06:04 PM

if u really want big zooms u shud get those superzoom cams intead
cheaper, but still got limitations to DSLRs la...

i think i get what u mean
i prefer Sony older models over new models' body grip
jz too small n uncomfortable to my liking

anyway, if u really wanna save cost, Sony Alpha series is the best bet
Sony lenses, flash n accessories r significantly more affordable than other brands

Why is it so?

always wonder sony stuff will burn our wallet and trousers too.

most of them.but not all.anyway, mee too looking for an entry level DSLR. Just now i went to Digital Mall PJ. The 2nd floor shop offer me below 2K for the D60(raya promo) and the shop at Gnd Flr offer me 1999 for Canon 1000D. The Canon guy said, which I think it is true, when you buy a camera, buy from someone who make their own camera's/lenses. I dont know whether Sony make it's own,but I knw Canon and Nikon do. So he recommeded me the Canon 1000D coz it uses CMOS sensors (which until now I still dont understand). Anyone here who expert in DSLR,please advice. My hands already itchy. I think I want to go and grab them now. but dunno which one. ahhh, almost forgot.the 2nd floor shop give tripod for freeeeee

D60 has a CCD sensor, 1000D has a CMOS sensor

CCD (charge-coupled device) and CMOS (complimentary metal-oxide semiconductor)

more on CCD & CMOS

thanks bro. So,which one is better. I dont care about zooming.as long as i can get a better shots and easily edit on my computer, it should be fine. I dont want end up strugling to get a good pics.

I would like to know why too

I would recommend A200/A300 over the A330/A230 models......IMHO sony screwed it all up....if you stil can find a200/a300, go for it by all means.

as for canon, perhaps only 1000d fits into ur budget..

i will not recommend d60 because it has only 3 focus point and without AF ....

why do you say so?

Coz the new Sony models look like cartoon n feel like cartoon. The old models are much better.

what about the Nikon latest model from Nikon D3000? the price is just around RM2000+ with guide mode really good to teach beginners.. looks same or maybe better than Canon 1000D from the spec alone.. except no live view..

go for 1000D. CMOS sensor is better. and IINM the sensor in Nikon cameras was made by Sony,no?

All brands sensors r made by Sony, this is what i heard from another forum

ah..that is where you are wrong my fren
Canon actually has it's own fab to make CMOS sensors for them
that's why you have APS-C 15 mp, 18mp, FF 21 mp and APS-H sensors
the others uses Sony sensors, that's why you see most Nikon and Sony uses same format and mp count sensors

then this confirm my suspicion
i was like, 'how the heck Sony would be manufacturing the sensors for all brands?!'

interface and buttons and all, simplified from the previous version until people don't like it. even changing AF point also take more steps.

this is a good thread and useful for me due to I also wanna start playing wif DSLR... I think I will go for Canon 450D for my starting point~

Besides, I think if you have a gang for friendship playing the same brand DSLR with different Lens, that will more fun in your learning... Can do lens exchange and try out more effect~

This post has been edited by jeffreyng: Sep 26 2009, 10:11 AM

the brothers/sisters here very often organised a TT (teh tarik) session.
You can post in the Nikon, Canon or Sony thread and look for any TT session. Then you can try and ask questions with those photo kakis. Good way to learn (and get poisoned as well) this TT thing

Ya.. I have a question to ask... My hand is not a steady hands..

so am I suitable to play around DSLR? I think that many photographer need the hand very steady only can get the nice picture..

but somehow, my friends said it can be solve with the lens itself.. so any advices?

your friends talk as if lens so magical. LOL. don't think they know what they're talking about.

so Goldfries... any advices? is DSLR suitable for me?

the advice all given already. just refer to page 1 and 2. there's no way to tell which one is best for you - in the end there will be ONE that suits you.

about the hand shake, you must understand that whether stabilization on LENS or on BODY - it NEVER solves your lack of steady hand problem. it just help by making the situation better.

Nikon and Canon (now Sigma also has) has lenses that has the mechanism that tries to compensate camera shake (some call it image stabiliser, etc). However those lenses are wee bit pricey.
On Nikon, the lenses are the VR models (VR = vibration reduction iianm)
On Canon, the lenses are IS ( = image stabilizer)

However on Sony Alpha camera has the image stabilizing mechanism on the camera body. (sony's term is SSS = Super Steady Shot). Advantage of having the image stabilizing mechanis on the camera body is, you can have SuperSteadyShots on any lenses you put on your Sony Alpha camera body.

Hope Ive explained it clearly Im not too good with words

since the thread is concerning beginners, what kind of focal length advancement is recommended for a normal learning curve? Everyone starts out with the kit lens. Would the nifty fifty be a good next step? Or a constant-aperture lens that has a range before and after 50mm? Or exploring the remaining focal length from 55 to 200mm? Flashgun?

For focal length this might help

Focal Length

so If let say I buy Canon 450D with IS Kit.. it means it got image stabilizer effect?

If the Canon lens has the IS written on it, then it has the image stabilization mechanism. Im not sure is the 450D kit lens has it though. The Canon IS lens are not cheap IMHO hence I do not think those IS lense are offered as kit (ie they are sold separately). Kit lenses generally are basic lenses that should be enough to get beginners started shooting with less hassle.

However, to avoid shaking, you can experiment shooting photos with higher camera shutter speed too.

Am I confusing you?

---

Added on September 26, 2009, 10:55 am
normal learning curve?

It depends on the person's requirement IMHO. If the person likes shooting in low lit surrounding eg indoor/house/etc... then lenses with shorter focal length with big aperture.
For shooters that shoot sports / games... then a longer lense would be the logical advancement.


This post has been edited by Banzai_san: Sep 26 2009, 10:55 AM

no.. u are not confusing me... very thanks for your advice!

---

Added on September 26, 2009, 10:59 amif it stated:
EOS 450D Kit (18-55IS)

consider IS lens?

This post has been edited by jeffreyng: Sep 26 2009, 10:59 AM

Yes that kit comes with IS means got Image Stabilisation.

should be.

IMHO the 450D camera are good beginner DSLR camera.
The suggestions by the brothers (and sisters?) here are sound.

Shop around first. Try the 450D or other canon beginner DSLR camera. Try also the Nikon entry level cameras. And try and test Sony Alpha A200/230/300/330/350/380 (A380 I think is not available in Malaysia) range of beginner level camera.
Try holding those cameras and feel them in your hands. You would then have a better view / personal opinion on those cameras.

Once you hv short list which one... then compare price. Some shops give lower price but jack up the price for accessories. You can even post here the pricing and ask the bros (sisters?) here whether the pricing is acceptable or rediculous
Just dont get conned into buying everything the salesperson push to you...

cool!! You are kind and nice person! Very thanks for your advices~

for Canon actually even 1000D more than enough for beginners.

but my friend said the holder for 1000D is not that good because that is plastic..

The best DSLR camera for a beginner is the most expensive one in the market.....

......


......


......


...... that way you never have to upgrade again in the near future.

Aiyoooo. Then want what? Magnesium Alloy body on a rm1000 body meh. Sure plastic lor. All entry level SLR is plastic.

haha.. dunno leh.. if use plastic... and your hand is always keep sweating... then the holder will become not comfortable lo~ kekeke

so? what's not good about that?

seriously la beginners, i not rich person using 350D only.

you get the lowest grade camera today would still be high-tech compared to my dinosaur.

edited : is that the same fren who say can SOLVE hand shake ah? if the same one then seriously, you might want to consider changing consultant. LOL.

This post has been edited by goldfries: Sep 26 2009, 12:00 PM

That 1 is not qualified Consultant ler. That 1 is speculator.

LOL

bro..since u'r friend already got a DSLR..why don't u test with their camera 1st?

This one?


or this one?



Yup. No need to upgrade. Want to upgrade also kenot.

thats when you need practice. lol

buy also not able to buy... how to upgrade leh??

Can upgrade wat. Just gold. silver or platinum plate it, add some diamonds, kautim.

This post has been edited by ianho: Sep 26 2009, 12:12 PM

haha... those zaman jepun cams only muzium can afford la.

---

Added on September 26, 2009, 12:15 pmso many screws, humongous buttons, and even levers ??!!
not for beginners

This post has been edited by Banzai_san: Sep 26 2009, 12:15 PM

Actually kenot. You sneeze on the camera let alone touch it, it will no longer be considered authentic antique collectors item. Price drop like a rock and camera become no more world expensive cam.

u mean 1000d doesnt hav the rubber grip??

ya.. check and c...

Get one with kit lens and a flash. Should be Rm 2k (used one la). Then, from there decide what lens you need next, telephoto, macro, uwa, etc . Then prepare more money

currently i'm using d40 with kitlens...so far i'm very satisfied..the build quality of this model also beyond my expactation even to compare with a200 or a230..juz it kenot AF for certain lense..other than that.it suite me well for starter like me

currently aiming for sb-600.

what is sb-600?

what is the minimun acce.for a beginer?
bag,tripod,dslr with kit lens,flash?

does the std.dslr c/w.flash as well?for night shot.

D60 no AF?means no auto-focus?

Tq

no such thing as minimum. buy what you need.

sb600 ? look here
http://www.kenrockwell.com/nikon/sb600.htm

minimum accessories for a beginner?
well you would (obviously) need
1- camera body
2- camera lens
3- battery
4- memory card
IMHO those above a the bare minimum

D60 does not have built-in (ie in-body) focus drive motor. Meaning D60 can only auto focus with lenses which have their own drive motor (AF-S and AF-I lenses).

This post has been edited by Banzai_san: Sep 26 2009, 07:54 PM

i choose 450D!!!

imyself also a beginner and really new in DSLR thing. But i found that when i bought a Nikon D90 i start fall in love with it especially when u take a shoot using Nikon 50mm lens

Im kinda interested to get a DSLR,how much would i need to start photography hobby? 2k?

2k more than enuf. U can even spend 1k+ only, if u buy 2nd hand.

wow that D90 is more like a mid-range than is for beginners..
for me i look good long zoom, but long zoom lens very expensive.. so still pondering over whether to get dslr..

why do u need a long zoom lens ?

18-55 mm lens is sufficient for beginner

well for bird watching.. and maybe wild animals photography like those in africa sometimes even useful for butterfly as they tend to fly away when get near..

Thanks.

My friend is considering to sell me his Olympus DSLR with 2 lens for 500AUD.

after long consideration and comparison, finally yesterday I took the Canon 1000D.got them at Digital Mall PJ @ RM1999 with bag,4gb sd card,kit lens 18-55mm IS and a cheap tripod.still experimenting but so far the pics are lovely. tried a few set ups and it never fail me. I did consider this camera with the new Nikon D3000. The input that I get from the salesguy
-This camera only have 7 focus point compare to 11 in D3000
However,
-This guy have CMOS sensors
-Live view (love it and I find it very useful)
-slightly bigger than the D3000 (more grip less shake)

another one, the sales guy said the 1000D made in Japan, the Nikon D3000 made in Thailand. So think about it guys. None of the shop I went recommend Sony as the best choice. i dunno why coz i test and i didnt see the flaw. Some of them said that the accessories for Sony DSLR are expensive (ie lenses etc.).

If you are really a beginner like me and dunno anything about photography, I think 1000D should be sufficient. Dont waste ur money buying the 4K camera and end up another 6 month post a thread in the LYN trade zone. Hahaha.

This post has been edited by iwan_iwan: Sep 28 2009, 12:09 AM

End up in trade zone cud be good news too. Cud mean upgrade ler.

your 1000D also more advanced that my little 350Dino la.

This post has been edited by goldfries: Sep 28 2009, 01:52 AM

Don play play. Like Ken Rockwell always say, even his 6mp Nikon D40 kicks a$$.