The latest I saw on Discovery science: Ardi, the earliest fossil remains found that are closer to human than chimpanzee / gorilla.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ardi

This thread is not for people to paste their religion but debatable findings, you represent your religion and obligated to paste?

..why? can you explain more.

This post has been edited by kubing: Feb 2 2011, 09:04 AM

Because your religion is not debatable and this thread can move on with scientific findings than fixed religious scripture.

This post has been edited by 3dassets: Feb 2 2011, 01:20 PM

oh..okey

Can I just say this? - - Evolution never occured.

Every species that ever is and ever has been on this planet, has been, created.

I have been reading stuff about evolution and 'creationism' points out that there has never been solid proof of an in-transition species evolving.

I started not believing in evolution after the findings of the 150 million year old living fossil tree in Australia, the frilled shark in Japan, and of course my absolute favouritest - the coecalanth that was caught by Indonesian fisherman. All of these existed in the days of the dinosaur.

And dinosaurs evolved into birds? A big no from me. Dinosaurs STILL exist. Yes. There I said it. Locals in Congo have seen them all - a living T-Rex (brown + red stripped skin), stegosaurus (creature will 'diamonds' on its back), triceratops (was seen mowing down an elephant) and most infamous the Mokele-Membe, a saurapod.

Why haven't we seen video/photo evidence? Well, it is EXTREMELY difficult to get to and when you do get to see it, better hope the locals don't point a gun to your head. They worship these creatures and has denied a lot of researches from taking evidence. It might sound insane, but I believe the dense swamps of Congo (e.g Lake Tele) is a BLIND SPOT on Earth. I saw a documentary and it is said that Lake Tele is the largest and most dense swamp on the planet - - yet it has NO wikipedia entry! It is that uncharted.

So, evolution never occured. I believe in evolution like forever, but until recently, I truly believe even caveman and ancient humans (Bigfoot?) are still alive.

**According to wikitravel, the areas around Lake Tele are "completely inaccessible" and need to trek for days. In order to get to the starting point of the trek - you will have to hire (if you're lucky) locals to get you a 4WD and it will cost you I quote "An arm and an leg". Like $1000 for half a day.

This post has been edited by defaultname365: Sep 8 2011, 12:17 PM

Hmm... no evolution eh? What about ghost, god or alien? We don't see it in documentary but so many people believe those exist. You don't have to see anything to believe the strangest thing exist. I do believe some people's brain are like the caveman, however you try to educate them, they can't learn much and will remain stagnant at some level.

There are terms created for these people, known as dumb, stupid and idiot are very common, they are among us and may even be you and me, only the smart and clever one will know though. That is why some people are rich and many are poor...

Hmm... ok that's just plain weird. I thought we should be keeping an open mind. I know I am not a scientist or some expert in 'any' field but at least I did share some thoughts that I have culminated over the years of just observing, and rendering conclusions. Isn't that what discussions are all about? Again I am not genius of any kind.

I say evolution does not exist because there is no conclusive proof on an 'in transition species'. A living entity exists and that's it. It does not evolve into anything else or nothing has evolved into it. AND the reason I believe this is true is because of recent findings of 'living fossils' which seem unchanged since the days of the dinosaur. Surely we can't be finding these species just like they were in the fossil record. Share your thoughts instead of saying I'm shallow or lacking knowledge.

So the term "Evolution" does not completely cover all living things or some has reached its limit?
Why change and why extinct? Surely there are reason and no reason, if you understand the term well, how do you thing scientist is able to know the age of our planet, the sun and when a star will die? If no evolution, how about mutation? If that occur, its evolving. In your description, ghost / god don't exist because no proof but majority wins, don't matter if you believe or not, our one lifetime is too short to know and understand everything you conclude it does or does not exist.

chiwawa and great dane

same or different species?

Actually there is a documentary about GHOSTS.

Its called GhostAdventures.

Perhaps you could take a look at it

The terms given to the unexplained is fine but the story about it is crappy, story is all there is to it, how convincing is up to the script. It has great influence in people in the past but not in modern days where people are educated and rely on science. Science will change natural evolution.

Yup. Here they are...

Humans, Dinos, Lived Together

http://articles.timesofindia.indiatimes.co...ints-cretaceous

http://news.xinhuanet.com/english2010/chin...c_131194282.htm

http://www.china.org.cn/china/2011-10/17/c...nt_23641503.htm

http://www.examiner.com/paelenotology-scie...s-and-dinosaurs

Dinosaurs still exist today. The Ropen in PPNG and a whole bunch of dinosaurs at Lake Tele, Congo.

Anyone can write a story and publish everywhere, it has to come from credible source not the sos bottle.

Dude did you even read your links? Your last link is debunking the others.

That aside, I'm believe evolution is going on, just not as fast enough to be visible. If we were to follow the creationist time line(7000 year old earth?), most changes will be at gene level only. Lemme give an example, the Tibetans and Han Chinese share a common ancestor, but with just over 3000 years the Tibetans have genes mutated to allow their body to work on less oxygen, about 40% less IINM.

Oh my fascination with living dinosaurs cannot stop! :-) I can confidently say there are areas around Congo's basin (Lake Tele, borders to Zambia, etc.) which are complete blind spots. When I say blind spot, I mean an area where no human has set foot on - or, extremely rare cases where they do go. Having read countless expeditions to search for living dinosaurs in these areas, I am more confident now than ever that these are genuine blind spots on earth. It takes days to get to the place where the locals alledgedly have spotted these 'living dinosaurs'. Note that every expedition no photo/video evidence has been brought to light. One expedition in the 1970s yielded a photo - but due to the storm/weather, it was ruined. Herman Regusters in 1981 led an expedition and... he got his Super 8 camera to record the video of a saurapod. Unfortunately, he forgot to take out the lense in the excitement and the creature walked away.

Here is a list of alledged living dinosaur:

Most reports of allegedly surviving dinosaurs come from African rain forests in the Congo Basin and the rain forests of South America, although others include those from Australia and Scotland.

-Emela-ntouka, allegedly a living ceratopsian.
-Kasai rex, allegedly a living theropod.
-Mbielu-Mbielu-Mbielu, claimed to be a living stegosaur.
-Mokele-mbembe, claimed to be a living sauropod.
-Muhuru, allegedly a living ankylosaur.
-Nguma-monene, allegedly a living Spinosaurus.
-Ngoubou, allegedly a living Styracosaurus.

Other Mesozoic reptiles such as the winged pterosaurs have been reported as well.

-Kongamato, hypothesised to be a living Rhamphorhynchus.
-Mahamba, hypothesised to be a freshwater mosasaur.

If it were up to me, an expedition would be heading directly to Lake Tele. A staggering 5-day journey through which wild animals roam freely and your live in danger (both animals and humans, thanks to Congo's civil war history). Then, the weather element. A truck or some sort had to be flown in since the locals charge exorbitant amount of cash to travel with their worn down vehicles for a day. Then, the supplies. Food supply is scarce and would recommend a week's worth of food stacked up and stored properly. Then, base camp for a week, not a day or two. Most expeditions I see, sees folks leaving after a day or two. They barely have time to explore the area. The locals would never stay a night so you're own your own but with a team, why not. Just hope a saurapod does not stomp your tent at night.

With all these, no researcher would dare even think about going to these places. And with the locals only on occasions encountering these creatures AND the fact that these creatures are feared by them, almost entirely possible these creatures have been blinded from humans for ages, for hundreds of thousands of years.

One could read the legends and tell-story from the river basin in Congo...read
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mokele-mbembe

---

Added on November 23, 2011, 9:31 pmpertaining to above, some may want to further read on atavism. Human embryo do grow tail; its an extension of coccyx. The longest recorded is about one feet.

This post has been edited by VeeJay: Nov 23 2011, 09:31 PM

I've read it before, and always wince when the encounters are too close. So close yet so far.

Should start a fund to collect money for an expedition to Lake Tele! I'm serious... if no one is going to distance, probably we will never have conclusive evidence for decades. And not just footprints (which btw have been found - giant three toed prints).

It was filmed by a Japanese crew, but it was too far and grainy
http://www.unknownexplorers.com/mokelembembe.php

Having dinosaurs still roaming around does not disprove that evolution occurs. It actually strengthen the theory of evolution in your case. If evolution did not exist, dinosaurs would still be everywhere instead of some remote part of the world. The theory of evolution says that a species continue existing because it is adapted to a particular environment. The environment of today is much different from the environment several million years ago.

If evolution did not work, we wouldn't need to worry about antibiotic resistance making more and more antibiotics unusable resulting in the return of dangerous diseases.

OK, but then again, going back to the basics of "human evolution" - Evolution is any change across successive generations in the heritable characteristics of biological populations. Evolutionary processes give rise to diversity at every level of biological organisation, including species, individual organisms and molecules such as DNA and proteins..

If indeed evolution occurred (and is continuing to occur), no animal living today should resemblance their fossils millions of years ago. This includes crocodiles. As for dinosaur fossils, the 'so-called' living dinosaurs should not even exist since they supposedly have evolved into birds. So it matters not if the environment has changed compared to millions of years ago, what matters is that the biological features of these "living fossils" remain the same for millions of years ago.

Another perfect example, coecalanth - - a true living fossil. From wikipedia it self


Yet, this...



And of course, ultimately, the "discovery" of this fish bares unfathomable similarities to the "discovery" of living dinosaurs throughout the ages:

1938:
The coelacanths, which are related to lungfishes and tetrapods, were believed to have been extinct since the end of the Cretaceous period until the first Latimeria specimen was found off the east coast of South Africa, off the Chalumna River (now Tyalomnqa) in 1938

Museum curator Marjorie Courtenay-Latimer discovered the fish among the catch of a local fisher, Captain Hendrick Goosen, on December 23, 1938.

Since 1938, Latimeria chalumnae have been found in the Comoros, Kenya, Tanzania, Mozambique, Madagascar, and in iSimangaliso Wetland Park, Kwazulu-Natal in South Africa.

1998:
Based on a specimen discovered by Erdmann in 1998 and deposited at the Indonesian Institute of Sciences (LIPI), the first specimen of this species was only photographed at a local market by Arnaz and Mark Erdmann before being bought by a shopper.

2002:
In 2002, the South African Coelacanth Conservation and Genome Resource Programme was launched to help further the studies and conservation of the coelacanth. The South African Coelacanth Conservation and Genome Resource Programme focuses on biodiversity conservation, evolutionary biology, capacity building and public understanding.

....

So if you could just think coecalanth = living fossil, why not living dinosaurs. It is only a matter of time before the finding of a real living dinosaur in the wild that breaks the evolution theory. Every living creature has and always will be, in their respective states.

This post has been edited by defaultname365: Dec 5 2011, 03:02 PM