lol;; slightly noisy; but i can bare with it. its not like i drive a aston martin

federal is made in taiwan

well, it is true that driving attitude is the 1st priority no matter when its dry or wet.. but then again, i dont see any harm done in trying 2 be extra careful by choosing better tires 2 have better braking performance when its wet.. it all comes down 2 the matter of active safety n passive safety.. its like buying a car for all sorts of its safety features (abs, airbags, traction control etc), it doesnt mean that buying a car that has all these safety gizmos would imply that we're bad drivers, rite??

i mean can u really predict accidents?? if the event of an accident were 2 happen, can u really say that ure skillful enough 2 make sure u wont get involved in it?? its called an accident, as in it could happen 2 anyone, n i do mean anyone, wether how skillful or careful u r.. no harm in relying 2wards better tyres 2 increase ur odds, rite??

aggressive driving style is the cause of most self-inflicted accident.

can't say i'm not agree, just that of all the safety features one can buy under the sun, ultimately it's still one's pocket that have the say..
what i worry is that the difference is marginal, that the average driver would not notice the different..?

well, lets put it this way.. in the event of an accident, that marginal difference u so imply could mean either u leaving the scene without a single scratch on either u or ur car, OR otherwise.. if u know wat i mean that is.. its like school test results, that one mark that we think is so marginal could mean the difference of we getting an 'A' or a 'B'..

n also, u might wanna know that its not as marginal as u think.. different tyres could give very different stopping distances u know, especially on cars without abs..

how's so? mind explaining the theory behind?.. and in the case of lesser grip?

This post has been edited by weeluvmal: May 7 2009, 10:08 PM

as they say, a picture is worth a thousand words.. videos wit sound should be worth a gazillion words then, so this might help me explain it, n help u understand it..

if they involved in accident they will have to pay for the repair cost, you think they can take the risk? their income not that high although some are quite high.

and also in rain they drive slow, and they didnt involved in accident doesn't mean they are safe and the tyres are good, hydroplaning not only happen above 60 or 80km/h last time i drive in PLUS highway on the way to ipoh from KL, was heavy rain that time, even driving 60 still hydroplane, if i slow until 50km/h the lorry behind me can overtake me already.

you drive safe, doesn't mean other people driving safe, learn to drive aggressively, and passively

try to put your car with semi slick tyres then change to normal tyres, you will notice the difference, well, that is an obvious comparison from a different tier of tyres...

tyres with less thread will have less grip, so when you brake the wheels stop turning (wheel lock) and the car skid on it's on momentum.

if the tyres have good grip, it will "stick" to the road so the wheels wont lock up, it will still experience wheel lock, but you need faster speed for it to wheel lock

what i say might be confusing,, i'm not good in explanation

your car got ABS or not, it doesn't matter, the stopping distance will varies from tyres to tyres, and also your brake

i was constantly under the impression that, on normal DRY tar road, the lesser (or even no tread) tread actually gives better grip, much so for the racing tires,
that the tread is there for water draining, not so much for grip?

am also under the impression that the better 'grip' (coming from rubber material perspective), the easier the tire gets lock up during a hard braking scenario. so can't seems to rational when u say "good grip, it will "stick" to the road so the wheels wont lock up, it will still experience wheel lock, but you need faster speed for it to wheel lock". care to further explain the physics behind?

as for the taxi driver analogy i thrown, my point was simply to illustrate how different driving attitude can prevent accident, not so much about the tire they use being "good"..
after all one can always pay for the car damage, but can never buy life lost due to accident caused by careless driving..

that makes me wanna get continental for my next tyre

if that's the case, why do car manufacturer produce tyres with thread? dont compare tyres from track cars and normal cars, semi slick and racing tyres are far different from normal car tyres

as you can see i take a picture from google to see the design of semi slick (left) and normal tyres, Falken Ze912 (right) the thread on semi slick is to disperse the water during rainy day or in wet condition, semi slick tyres need warm up while normal tyres dont need, it need warm up because the rubber compound will partly melt and cause the tyres to be sticky and "stick" to the ground, not to mention semi slick are built for performance, not for comfort and silent, unlike the normal tyres that we use, comfort and silent while sacrificing the performance. if you see the video below you will know how the semi slick tyres work and why it is so good and so expensive, the thread in our car tyres are for both water disperse and comfort, i heard if more tiny thread make the ride comfort, well, i'm not sure about this.


for example when you play football, you and your friend, you wear normal shoes or worn out shoes that doesn't have any thread design under the shoes, while your friend wearing a football shoes, so who will have better grip and stopping power, our car tyres is just same as our shoes...

then again, there's always other good brands too.
Yokohama, Michelin, Pirelli, ... a long long list to go.

the fact that it's experimenting against that and only that named brand, actually makes me put on my skeptical hat.. sounds like a marketing propagation, no?

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Added on May 7, 2009, 11:47 pmi concur hearing this too, to make it quiet, so to say..
also heard that the bigger the "blocks" on the tire tread, the noisier it goes..

as for the no-tread = more grip, was coming from contacting surface perspective.
since the slick tires comes in material and operating theory of its own class, i agree that it's not a fair comparison point.

This post has been edited by weeluvmal: May 7 2009, 11:47 PM

that video is comparing a 2nd hand tyres/worn out tyres with a new one, so you can see the result on the tyres affect the braking distance, same goes to other tyres, and i have personally tested, last time when i was running on a NCT5 that is almost touch the safety marks, the braking is so bad, at first i thought is the brake problem, maybe need to refill the fluid or what, but found out it is ok, then after that i changed to the new Falken Ze912, the braking is much better...

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Added on May 8, 2009, 12:11 amyou can just compare like that, grip isn't just about the more surface of contact the better it is

i dont know which logic is best to explain, i feel hard to explain in here, all this come from my experience, after the chinese new year trip back to my hometown, i finally realize how much a tyres can contribute to a human life...

if you try to think out of the box, you can visualize, semi slick tyres gain grip with the heated/melting rubber, the rubber will become hot and soft so it can stick to the ground, thus improve handling and acceleration.

on the other hand, our car tyres are made of harder compound and it will not melt (unless you go over the tyre rating), so when the thread run out, the tyres will have no grip and will be prone to wheel lock (for car without ABS) because it doesn't stick to the ground like what semi-slick tyres did, the thread on the tyres not just for comfort and water disperse, it also help the tyres to "stick" on the road, the thread on the tyre if actually slip between the small rocks in the road surface (our road surface is not as smooth as silk, it is rough), and when you check your tyres, you will actually see there are some rat bite at the thread there, this is due to the constant friction on the ground.

that's just my opinion, correct me if i'm wrong.

This post has been edited by amduser: May 8 2009, 12:11 AM

indeed it's not only about the contacting surface, the way the brake is pressed, the experience and judgement when in crisis, the (bad) habits could all play a role in the final outcome.

come across a website about braking techniques, will just share it here:
http://www.driftingstreet.com/braking-technique.html

both of you right here....both good tyre and braking skill are needed to get a better braking..

as for abs, u could always simulate it by brake and release and brake gradually...

the point of that video isnt 2 promote continentals, or in fact any sort of brands (as the TS skeptically claims).. its juz 2 show u that tyres do play an important role..

it is true that.. but juz think bout it, in an emergency situation when panic starts 2 kick in, how many of us would actually do it??

if you want to talk about tyres, then dont take the driver behaviour in the calculation, assume everything is exactly the same, situation and all that, but with different tyres, sure there's a difference...

i always thought by compressing the front suspension will improve the grip, but not to the extend of wheel locking...

for me, the maximum point i apply my brake is about 80%, if suddenly there's a car in front of me suddenly pop out or stop, i will choose to avoid it by changing lane instead of stop there, i believe with the help of engine brake, it will improve the limit to wheel lock, but i dont know engine brake and wheel lock are related or not, yet to try it out.

weight shifting is really important on how the car deliver it's power to the wheels

when panic, haha...i guess if u practice enough hopefully u apply it...

driver who have a reaction time 10x better than normal human

just joking, it is true that not all of us are able to do that much job in a short time, the maximum i can do is step on the brake and hold it and rely on my judgement whether the car can stop in time or will bang, then i will slowly change to lower gear to do engine brake, and it help alot...

i do try to press and depress the brake pedal, it does improving braking distance, but you will have a shaky ride when doing so, and the passenger will start complaining

now i'm practicing to brake in a more comfort style to try to comfort my passenger, use a longer distance to slow down the car when not needed, when the car almost stop, at the point where the suspension started to bounce back to original position, the car will choke awhile, at that time, release the brake pedal abit and apply abit more, it will eventually do a smooth braking

bro, personal experience, go for Falken ZE912.. i notice the price is getting lower compare previous price.

i still using it and satisfy with the comfort & grip. indeed a good tyre

Just my 2 cents

pumping the brake (repeatedly press and release) will indeed help the braking, true too for enginee breaking.
experienced both the same time on an age old car (>30 yrs suzuki?). handbrake was not release when travelling, and when reaching toll booth, the heat caused the braking capability to drop dramatically. putting it to gear 1 / gear 2 plus brake pumping put the car to halt just before hitting the fence.

dun hold it to luck when talk about emergency response, granted not everyone got the chance to practice driving / braking techniques on the track, but that shouldn't be the reason to stop anyone from mentally preparing oneself mentally, to react upon emergency, e.g. by pulling to low gear to engage engine braking, staying alert while keeping sufficient distance from the car at the front unless overtaking, and so on..
believe me, the mental preparation does help, much more so than praying hard at the point of impact, if u get what i mean..