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 If weightlifting makes you age quicker, Would you change your mind about it?

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CoFactor-3
post Apr 20 2009, 04:26 PM

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Taking a piss...

QUOTE(mofonyx @ Apr 20 2009, 07:58 AM)
Note to readers and people replying: This is only for discussion purposes. I don't intend to sway anyone away from bodybuilding/weightlifting. I myself have not been affected by this knowledge. I still go to the gym frequently, eat loads and sweat it out!

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To start off, biogerontology is a fairly new area of research. Experimental studies in model organisms (C. elegans, D. melanogaster, M. musculus) have shown that:

1. A higher metabolism causes you to age quicker. This is consistent with the most popular theory of ageing: the free radical theory of ageing. The basic idea of the theory is that a higher metabolism results in greater energy expenditure. As we all know the powerhouse of the cell (so fondly named by all biology students) is the mitochondria. Energy is generated via the electron transport chain (ETC). However, coupling in the ETC is not perfect and thus, the generation of free radicals that can potentially damage DNA, protein, lipids etc.

The free radical damage is a viscious cycle. Once the mitochondria DNA (mtDNA) is damaged, the poor repair mechanisms causes mutations to accumulate with age. As you may be able to deduce by now, increased energy expenditure by a higher metabolic rate _would_ in fact cause you to possibly age quicker. This is assuming that this theory is true.

2. Corroborating the idea of free radical theory of ageing is the rate of living theory, whereby your lifespan is measured by oxygen consumption in litres/kg (also known as life energy potential - LEP) throughout your entire lifespan. It has been speculated that mammals have a constant value for the life energy potential. This was demonstrated in squirrels and horses. Despite huge differences in maximum lifespan, the LEP for both animals were about the same (60,000 l/kg).

Hence, a higher metabolic rate would limit your lifespan because you would reach your life energy potential quicker.

3. Larger animals have shorter lifespan. Big dogs die quicker. Birds live longer for their size. A study of baseball players (controlled for affluence, a major factor in today's measure of lifespan) showed that BMI was inversely related to lifespan. For every ~kg, there was a reduction in lifespan of 5 months.
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"You will be different, sometimes you'll feel like an outcast, but you'll never be alone. You will make my strength your own. You will see my life through your eyes, as your life will be seen through mine. The son becomes the father and the father becomes the son." - a quote taken from Superman Returns.

Long story short, it's a good reflection on what cure it can offer.



QUOTE(mofonyx @ Apr 20 2009, 07:58 AM)
4. Dietary restriction (DR) was shown to extend lifespan in model organisms. It was demonstrated that DR delays the onset of late life diseases such as cancer, diabetes, hypertension, autoimmune disorders. DR also slows age related decline in blood glucose control, fecundity, muscle mass, DNA repair and learning ability, to name a few. However, this has not been successfully demonstrated in humans, although it should be noted that Okinawans from Japan have the highest number of centenarians (or super-centenarians) to date. Their diet is largely responsible for this. They eat in moderation (children 60% less and adults 20% less when compared to world wide data).
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Some risks of calorie restriction diets included - reduced bone density, loss of muscle mass, anemia, memory loss, dizziness and depression. Ain't worth it if you ask me.
CoFactor-3
post Apr 20 2009, 08:37 PM

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QUOTE(mofonyx @ Apr 20 2009, 07:33 PM)
@cofactor3: The concept of DR is not being a glutton. If you eat right you will be okay, I believe. In fact, there are reduced rates of such ageing related conditions like you have described with Okinawan Japanese.
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Japanese have affinity for all things small. Scarcity of natural resources and cultural different played a role here. Small cookwares not doubt have the impact toward their daily serving size.
CoFactor-3
post Apr 21 2009, 09:58 AM

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QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 21 2009, 09:27 AM)
-One thing interesting about the Japanese diet is the focus on tofu, fish, green tea and lastly, seaweed. The seaweed may just be the last food ingredient left to really study. Green tea and tofu gain acceptance in worldwide culinary but not so seaweed. Coming from the sea, it would have an abundance of nutrients that wouldn't be found in land-grown vegetables due to the the richness of the sea compared to the depletion of the landsoil for farming.
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Umami - Ikeda K (November 2002). "New seasonings". Chem. Senses 27 (9): 847–9. PMID 12438213. http://chemse.oxfordjournals.org/cgi/pmidl...g&pmid=12438213. (partial translation of Ikeda, Kikunae (1909). "New Seasonings[japan.]". Journal of the Chemical Society of Tokyo 30: 820–836. )

Enjoy...

biggrin.gif

CoFactor-3
post Apr 21 2009, 04:03 PM

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QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 21 2009, 02:03 PM)
Cheeky monkey here... tongue.gif

The text is on taste lah, not about health benefits lah. tongue.gif
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Glutamic acid was indicative for the taste as found by the study from seaweed extract. Its isolated chloride-salt compound is Monosodium Glutamate, MSG. Now, where that load of health benefits from MSG you have grown accustom to?

Merry go round…stupid lah.

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CoFactor-3
post Apr 21 2009, 05:39 PM

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QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 21 2009, 04:34 PM)
smile.gif It's currently a merry-go-round because the Westerners haven't yet figured out how is it that Japanese ppl can take so much salt and MSG in their diet and still live so long? This includes having majority of their male population having high blood pressure, heavy smokers and drinkers and yet statistically, compared to countries worldwide, they still have less heart problems.
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Do you have the study to support your purported claim above?


QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 21 2009, 04:34 PM)
So even though seaweed does contain MSG, how is it that their people doesn't seem to have the violent reaction that others do? Probably the combination of diet and exercise (they walk a lot, even in the city).
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Again, please forward a study to support your argument above, i.e. intakes of MSG contributed a violent reaction, etc.


QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 21 2009, 04:34 PM)
Sabarlah kawan. U need to be more positive lah, instead of bitter.
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...waiting.

CoFactor-3
post Apr 22 2009, 05:02 AM

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QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 21 2009, 10:19 PM)
Sarcasm doesn't become u. tongue.gif And there I was, thinking that was hope. tongue.gif

The first claim is by sheer observation, considering that it's the Western researchers who did a 180 degree turn when it came to the health benefits of weight training.

2nd claim on MSG contributing violent reaction : should have been written as extreme. By observation of ppl around you who are sensitive to MSG is good enough claims. I've had friends and relatives who either have fainted or agitated from the effect of MSG. Don't u? If you haven't, count yourself lucky.

However, why the seaweed doesn't give that same reaction? It could be that the MSG is not in it's purified + crystallize form as the MSG used for cooking. Or it could be that there's other stuff in the seaweed that negates the bad effects of MSG when eating seaweed. Hypothetical. tongue.gif

And you will keep waiting. tongue.gif
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Now that's hypocrite. Noted: Myremi likes to make baseless and unfounded claim.

What's more pathetic? Nobody seem to able to bring up a valid study to support the claims either.

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CoFactor-3
post Apr 22 2009, 08:12 AM

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QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 22 2009, 07:09 AM)
LOL! If that's your best shot, you must seriously be running out of ideas now.
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Another self indulged hypothetical claim.

Sick.


CoFactor-3
post Apr 22 2009, 08:37 AM

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QUOTE(fearz @ Apr 22 2009, 08:14 AM)
Yup my father is like a live MSG detector too. Everytime I go to eat something new with him he can detect whether the food has MSG or not, he's very sensitive to it. No fainting or anything of that sort but, still has negative effects.
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Sensitivity to MSG could easily be masked by other substances present in particular - disodium 59-inosinate (IMP) and disodium 59-guanylate (GMP) - which are also common among food enhancers.

You can't hold MSG solely responsible for his sensitive taste receptors.




... awaiting a study on MSG contributed to violent reaction as claimed by Myremi.

blink.gif

This post has been edited by CoFactor-3: Apr 22 2009, 08:52 AM
CoFactor-3
post Apr 22 2009, 11:44 AM

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QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 22 2009, 10:06 AM)
cofactor-3 : Then you just have to wither and wait then. Because you're obviously unwilling to even share much until the other party has posted. So wait.

One thing about food enhancers is that most of them aren't in the foods unless it's processed food. Not all food enhancers are available in the market, not to mention that it may not seem practical to go and identify it down to the individual component and then erase it out from the menu.

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Shit posting won't count as to upheld your claims without the support of a valid study. Will wait while you do your shooting frenzy elsewhere.

BTW: I got a cool PM from Pizzaboy (salute). Here's what it said:
---------------------------------------------
Hello. Good day.

Your posts in the weightlifting makes you age quicker, is clearly flame baiting. In 1 hour, you've had two posts reported for flame baiting. Please stop flame baiting or we'll have to give your account a holiday.

Enjoy the forum, but please don't misuse it.

Thank you for cooperating.
---------------------------------------------

It seem the accuse of flame baiting was used to extradite in aiding Myremi failure to produce any valid study as requested by me. Cheeky monkey, you two. There are ways to measure a hypocrite then there is Myremi. Real pity.


Added on April 22, 2009, 11:46 am
QUOTE(mofonyx @ Apr 22 2009, 11:06 AM)
myremi: Indeed, very cool stuff. The Japanese are smart people indeed. I wish I could contribute more but exams nearing. I will await patiently for your review. wink.gif
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That's lame. In the span of two days starting this thread your exams are nearing already?

doh.gif

This post has been edited by CoFactor-3: Apr 22 2009, 11:46 AM
CoFactor-3
post Apr 22 2009, 01:46 PM

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QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 22 2009, 12:37 PM)
Sigh. The only reason I stop dealing with you is because you wouldn't give a damn anyway. So what is the point? All I see is a bitter man who takes pleasure in making others feel miserable.

Meh enough.

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Obviously a reason strong enough to be claimed as flame baiting and be used as material for the moderator to issue me a good warning. What are you trying to hide so hard? I just requested for a valid study on your purported claims if you seriously give the *damn from the beginning.

Why need to put miseries into everybody else for this? I've covered somebody thought on his father MSG sensitivity with other possible causes. Yet why can't you relief me with the valid study on your claims, if any? Remember, it's you the one who dragged and fueled the matter out of proportion.

Say there are none and we are through with these nonsense or else put them on the table. Simple enough.
CoFactor-3
post Apr 22 2009, 04:18 PM

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QUOTE(myremi @ Apr 22 2009, 03:18 PM)
I wonder if you really know what you're saying when you say that I'm drawing this out of proportions. For I do not take low-blows method that you do. If you feel that my conversation with pizzaboy is one of it, then so be it. Getting victimized is something that I don't relish so why shouldn't I speak to the mods about it?

In any event, my final post on this topic on MSG in terms of food safety.

There are controversial studies at this point of time when it pertains to MSG. Yes, there are, apparently, other food enhancers in the market but the most common would be MSG.

http://www.foodsafety.gov/~lrd/msg.html
http://www.fda.gov/FDAC/features/2003/103_msg.html

These are overview of studies done by the FDA (the latest being the one in 1995) that even though they could not conclude firmly that MSG was detrimental to health, the reaction of an unknown number of people warranted them to instruct food manufacturers to declare for glutamate substances, be it MSG or other types of food enhancers.

Note that Obama has also requested that food labelling system maintained by FDA be reviewed (http://www.truthinlabeling.org/). One area will probably be this.

Some of the different types of food enhancers worldwide :

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flavour_enhancer

Another link about MSG is here : http://www.msgtruth.org/

The reaction of MSG lead to the study of Excitotoxicity (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Excitotoxicity) which included reactions to aspartame.

Research links are included at the end of wiki pages and the various links above.

So, have digress enough. You can find whatever reasons to flame bait or blackball me so it's making no sense to further answer your queries.
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The study by [8] Geha RS, Beiser A, Ren C, et al (April 2000). "Review of alleged reaction to monosodium glutamate and outcome of a multicenter double-blind placebo-controlled study", is a real contrast to what your asserted claim was, i.e. violent reaction.

I only read a little of what to favored my argument. Can't find any that support yours. tongue.gif

Overall conclusion from wiki dated 21st April 2009:
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «

These are the works from the credible researchers and well reviewed studies. May be you only came to aware of them after my request for the study support on your claim. Hence, the reluctant and persistent waiting cautionary issued to me. For what???

Like it or not, flame baiting was never my intention. How it came about I also don't know seriously.

...enough Aji no Moto already. The truth served.

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