dude, eventhough im an IPTS student, i have lots of friends studying in IPTA right now, and my cousins are IPTA grads, my uncle is a lecturer in UTM,my sister is a graduate from UITM, i know all about IPTA,their facilities, their lectures, and u wanna talk about tight schedule?? oh please...u think only IPTA have tight schedules???do you have friends taking A-level before? or AUP programme?

U urself dont have strong point to bring up here, please stop posting stuffs that are irrelevant, saying things like "they just drive nice cars" "in malaysia u cant really compare them" are baseless, what type of situation makes these people un-comparable?

calling me boy dosent make you wiser than me, well enough arguing here, sorry for the off topic TS

for your information
IPTA standard is rising
go google any universities(IPTA) in world rank
and yes
theres a lot of black people,arab and white people who stody in Ipta and they dont understand english
and thats why IPTA use english now

I have a question, let's make an assumption that I'm graduate from IPTS could I proceed to IPTA to continue the MSc??

IPTA IS GOV WORK
IPTS IS PRIVATE WORK

Yes i agree with your view to certain extend. however, do realise education shape a person's ability/personality/whatever. shame to say malaysia education failed to shape student to meet market needs as well to ultilise students to their full potential. (you may substitute it with "not success" if you found "failed" offensive)

Edited: hence, yes IPTA & IPTS do make a differecne. however we have to be specific which to compare. and the methods to compare is crucial to avoid bias

kita nk masuk U sekarang kena fikir short and long term brah..sekarang ni , macam kat satu company KL ni , dia nak graduan dari UTM,UTP and UM je , yang lain dia reject.sekarang camni cara diorang pilih orang berkualiti...

most likely kalau U yang suka tendang orang adalah U yang berkualiti LOL.

Get a jpa loan. Then repay the loan by working with the government for 10 years.

There. You got a job.

IPTS education quality are better than IPTA.
I mean some IPTS, but overall, yes.
I got some friends studying in famous IPTA such as UM, USM, UUM and UTM.
They keep complained that lecturers teach using 65% malay, 35% english.
Most of the IPTA students can't present themselves well enough in english too.
Me myself studying in MMU, although the status of MMU getting lower now to Top 200 only.
But most of us can speak english well enough compare to IPTA students.

And i saw the syllabus in IPTA, their coverage in courses are not so wide as IPTS.
So, private companies preferred IPTS students in most cases.

i think apart from reputation wise, the language they use to teach is fairly important especially for fields like business.. being taught in english will have an added advantage as this will brush up the student's command of the language in order to prepare for their work life..

furthermore, it is generally known that IPTS like Monash, Sunway, Taylors are more in tune to the industry where their syllabus content are decided with consultation and input from the industry leaders...Sad to say the public uni are not so where politics interfere with the efficient running of the uni...

this is why so many top firms have standing arrangement to recruit on campus from IPTS

you will be suprised, i have a fren who graduate from USM with bachelor of finance yet even he acknowledge that he is being passed over for promotions..at age of 28, his pay is still 3.5k only whereas my fren who graduate from Sunway (ACCA) are paid about 4.5k at age of 24...

i think it's quite fair comparison considering one the USM guy in BP, and Sunway guy in one of the big 4 firm... and both ahve the same years of experience as the USM guy graduate later..

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Added on November 27, 2010, 7:33 pm

but still the having a degree with 5 years working experience and still stuck at 3.5k pay is below par even with degree holders from IPTS, don't you agree? maybe there are other factors such as lack of soft skills...

and btw, i think most people queue for IPTA is because it cost less to study..a whole degree at less than 10k..i dunno about others but none of my friend who can afford went to IPTA especially those studying business and commerce as the tuition fees in IPTS for these course are affordable..oen of my frens' parents even said that they have never considered IPTA..

furthermore, have u seen statistics of unemployment in our country? 60k graduates from IPTA without jobs...most of those from IPTS get a job within 6 months whilst many of parents even securing jobs before the went for their finals.. IPTA are merely churning out graduates without considering the input from the industry on their skills requirements..if the graduates do not have the skills required by industry, then they can really be incorporated into the workforce unless further training is given which is an additional cost for them..

in my opinion, the syllabus of IPTA is too politically influenced where many of the subjects are unrelated to the fields the graduates are gonna work in..

lol...i'm not really that anti-IPTA..it's just that i like to play the role of devil advocate..since so many ppl are bashing IPTS here, therefore i spoke in defense of IPTS..then we can have a balance discussion..both have good and bad actually...

returning to my role,

the subject of accreditation are fundamentally political..look at accountancy profession..to be a chartered accountant in Malaysia, one have to be a member of MIA...there are two routes to achieve that; one is to be a member of professional accountancy bodies like ACCA,CPA,ICAEW..second is to be a graduate from public universities like UM,USM...

this is considered a joke in our profession in that a degree holder is considered to be on par with the same technical knowledge and skills as a member of professional body... as such, even if government allow a public uni graduate to be a chartered accountant in Malaysia, Big 4 accountancy firms would require these graduates to purse foreign professional accountancy programmes..this will tell u whether the industry truly recognised these graduates or not...in paper they may, but deep inside they do not..

and one of most ironic thing is, the graduates from Oxford and Cambridge are not allow to directly registered as member of MIA without professional accountacy bodies membership whereas graduates from UM does..what a joke...does the government think UM is better than Oxford?

as for my opinion on the architecture industry, the government is merely raising barrier of entry by only recognising the public uni graduates..this does not mean the IPTA are better..try go otehr country and see if they recognised UM more than the degree awarded by private uni.. let's put this in perspective, is Proton really better than foreign car? not only their quality are just so so, they are actually more expensive..a honda city if without import duty will cost less than 50k...a korean car will be even cheaper where they are selling for 10,000 USD only..that is 30k ringgit..

and i quote from George Benard Shaw, one of teh founder of London School of Economics..  "Patriotism is, fundamentally, a conviction that a particular country is the best in the world because you were born in it… "

okay, then it's my bad

btw..the IPTS does not qualify, is it because they are not awarding their own degree but due to their twinning nature?

anyway, isn't IPTS like Taylor Uni also accredited?? http://www.taylors.edu.my/courses/arc/arc_...ing2.php?id=267

should create a poll.. let everyone to vote. 

IMHO
I come from IPTA and have been involved in accreditation business in my case for engineering as opposed to Azrimy for Architecture.

The difference between IPTA and IPTS is in the environmental setting of the institutions. The IPTA mainly have ppl who cannot afford to go to IPTS. Therefore the socioeconomic environment is different.

IPTS due to business reasons do not invest in education and facilities as much as IPTA. Therefore most facilities and infra of IPTS is inferior to IPTA, as also education syllabus and ppl.

However due to socioeconomic status of students in IPTS there is easier to make connections in business etc. Thus the student who in this line in IPTS will have better connections etc and will be more successful in this line of work as opposed the technical oriented architecture/engineering where due to their limited exposure (in IPTS) will make them fail or have to work harder then IPTA counterpart.

So to sum that up.

To fully maximize utility...

For business related degrees, you will need to go overseas (worthwhile only if within world 200), the foreign university branches in M'sia, or the IPTS in Tier 5 Setara.

For technical degrees, it's either in the branches of foreign universities, or the IPTAs in Tier 5 Setara, or other IPTS in Tier 5 Setara that provides 1+3 or 2+2 etc but NOT 3+0. The choice between the three is dependent on personal career aspirations/planning (e.g. one might choose IPTA instead of Nottingham for Engineering degree as he wants to be accredited) or financial constraints.

Sums it up properly?

here i will list out all the cons of a local u based on my personal experience,

for IPTA, you will not get the EXPOSURE , you will be like a katak di bawah tempurung , you will not be exposed to real university life, western education styles, western thinking .....bla bla........, in local u's , its more like schooling than uni, wif strict rules and stuff,such as gals hav to wear long jeans to classes and even around the campus, same applies to guys, and the environment and atmosphere around the campus is just so dull and boring. it sounds more like you are in an islamic university.

and IPTA do hav long credit hours, at more than 20 hours a week, and you hav to learn stupid subjects that are not related to the course at all....
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a student from an IPTS will possesses high social and PR skill ,sporting, open mindedness, pro-activeness, high exposure, western style thinking, outgoing, high self esteem, extrovert..............

a student from an IPTA will be close minded, conservative, shy, lack the social and PR skill, getting virtually no exposure at all, malaysian and 'islamic' style thinking, low self esteem,introvert................

academically and skill-wise, both will be almost the same altho IPTA will have a slight advantage on this....

IPTS will be 10x the price of IPTA.............

so which wan do you choose? or more specifically, which type of person do you choose to be?

Well azarimy I believe that it the perception of many people, I'm not sure if it's the majority or not, but it's a huge chunk, i.e. if you've got the financing, you better stay clear from the IPTAs, due to the reasons given by rooney.

Well I'm in the middle of the fence, since I've never been exposed to IPTAs nor met a student. But I guess you know about the "network effect". When you've heard nothing but negative stuff (okay perhaps didn't hear much negative stuff, but the strong perception about having money and staying clear remains), it naturally spreads throughout communities.

One of the major reasons that I believe fuels this issue, comes from how the government might be managing the talent. Some stories here, they're true, no reason for me to make them up.

1970s, a person I know was working in the bank. One day, mr. old and senior engineering lecturer (bank customer) mentioned that he was quitting his job. This person I that I knew asked: why? you've got such a good job why quit? The answer was something in the lines of portraying the skewed marking system and having to pass those who fail. And the concluding sentence was something like:"It is against my conscience and my profession. Can you imagine, these people are the ones who are going to build your bridges and buildings."

Fast forward to very recently. Things that portray racial discrimination.

I remember reading a news clipping in some forumer's blog here, mentioning a patriotic Malaysian Chinese coming back from Canada and felt neglected by the racial policies, and went to NUS instead, and he's now head of the Faculty of Medicine, leading a team of international scientists to conduct cutting edge research. Well this is not recently, but it also happened in the 70s and 80s.

Anyway back to stuff that I personally know.

Scenario 1.

- Science related
- Secured a PhD post at Harvard.
- PTPTN not only blocked the person from going, some more charge with a court case, wanted full settlement.
- Personally obtained Fullbright Scholarship. Vowed to say bye bye to M'sia.
- Pulled strings and got the case settled. On top of the Fullbright scholarship, got another scholarship from Malaysia.
- Now this person says doesn't mind coming back to Malaysia. However, had it not been for the scholarship and the settled case, you imagine lah, M'sia would have lost a top scientist to another country.

*I know the actual facts above are abit vague. Because this is third person account. But you should get the idea of what I mean.*

Scenario 2.

- Bright young student, straight As in everything
- Secured a place at Cambridge
- Secured PTPTN loan (note that it's loan, not even scholarship).
- Started at Cambridge U, however, while studying there, loan didn't arrive! Stuck there with no money to pay uni fees 
- Appealed to Cambridge U, obtained full scholarship.
- You can imagine, contrary to the above scenario, this one confirmed say bye bye to M'sia. The education was fully funded by the M'sian government, till a bright young student was nurtured, and picked up with a few cents by the British. 

* And you guessed it right, the above two were not Malays.

Scenario 3.

Foreign scientist who did his PhD at one of the IPTAs told me that his research results were blocked from being published, and were destroyed by the U (they said it went lost). His research was on the agricultural soil composition of Cameron highlands, and of course, the results were bad. My best guess is that these results would bring on negative implications to the industry.
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So with all these spreading around, and me being only a student, all these were passed on to me by the older generation, it doesn't help but to fuel the negative perception of (and perhaps the minority races) towards a public education in M'sia.

However, I personally know and respect some people who are really hard-working and do not have the funds to go to IPTS. They make the most out of their time in IPTA.

Reiterating that I'm in the middle of the fence. Perhaps you can give comments, both towards what I've written above, and also some points contradictory to rooney's statements. Because, I would also also be compelled to think in that way, though not as extreme. However I compare the environment, not the people.

Scenario 1.

As I said, the actual facts are abit vague (coz I forgot).

Focus on the general story instead.

Btw, the person's very poor, fought all the way till current qualifications!
Scenario 2.

Again clause as above (forgot facts).

Focus on general story again please.

If it's not PTPTN then think of it as some other government fund lah.