ＳＡＷ A brand called GC guess... looks interesting
is it expensive? it is produced by guess?

I have to agree with u..
but SEIKO..the way it pronounce it cantonese, is abit ridiculous...lolz

they are in fact within your budget.
oh.. didn't know u looking for clean dial TW Watch as they are mostly chrono and all chrono tend to cluttered the face.
I would think the Armand Nicolet /Alpina /Edox fits your perfectly. on the dial just 3hands and a date/day display.
Dievas is best just 2 hands can't get any cleaner than that!

Sinn??? not sure U can get it at your budget with 45mm size. iirc they have nothing beyond 44mm.
sinn U1 is within your budget but its 44mm, sinn 656 are small at 39mm, 657 is at 41mm also small
856 is also small at 40mm
http://www.watchbuys.com/store/pc/sinnwatches.asp
http://www.sinnwatches.com/products.php?cat=3

ORIS FLIGHT TIMER is small at 42mm, the chrono is very cluttered.
the diver below is at 44mm. else this ORIS TT1 DIVERS DATE is also at 44mm


This post has been edited by patryn33: Apr 8 2010, 07:59 AM

'


all experts..especially those already in watch hobby for long time....any comments/advice...

(i only recently got interested in watches...no real ownership experience of major Swiss brands yet...)..

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Added on April 8, 2010, 7:50 amthanks.....good point...

This post has been edited by nando: Apr 8 2010, 07:50 AM

I was thinking of Oris Aviation Hunter...Limited Edition...
but its slightly larger....47mm...and not sure if you'll fancy the 9 marker being half eaten up by second dial..





patryn..would love to hear your opinion on the Ball vs Sinn i posted 1-2 pages ago....but knowing you, you'll probably ask me to consider the movement...

This post has been edited by nando: Apr 8 2010, 08:04 AM

clean dial.. 46mm... fits his budget very nicely. only thing is its base off 2836... mode the date/day thing for the GMT hand. cheap way of doing it.
http://www.authenticwatches.com/oris-swiss...YEk+index.html+


Ball vs Sinn? Sinn of course... even without the Diapal escapement the innovations put into the case is more value for money.
of course entry level Sinn u don;t find much tech in their Case for that.. maybe a Ball cause of light tubes
else for entry level sinn without fancy Case design I would go for a Guinand, since they did make those basic Sinn watches at 1 pt.

This post has been edited by patryn33: Apr 8 2010, 08:18 AM

thanks...one more question

the second time zone in the Ball Aviator Dual time i posted...the minute hand is redundant right? meaning the minute hand of the 2nd time zone will always be the same with the minute hand of the main dial right? I check all pictures of this watch and find that the minute hand of both time zones are same...

Which is why normally for dual time zone watches, they have 2 hour hands and share the same minute hands right?

the subdial on the left is the seconds.
timezone also differ by the hour never by the minute. thats why they always have a hour hand.

yeah, the Oris second dial on left is for second..i was refering to the Ball..


thanks...so we can say that the minute hand in the 2nd dial of the Ball Aviator Dual Time is redundant right? I mean GMT watches shouldnt need 2 separate minute hands?


anyway, the summary on technology of the Sinn 857,,,
Stainless steel case and bezel with TEGIMENT technology
Dehumidifying technology
Second time zone on a 24-hour basis
Nickel-free case back
Magnetic field protection up to 80,000 A / m
Captive pilot's bezel with minute ratcheting
Sapphire crystal glass with anti-reflective coating on both sides
Pressure resistant to 20 bar (= 200 m water depth)
Resistant to low pressure at high flight altitudes

This post has been edited by nando: Apr 8 2010, 11:17 AM

second time zone on 24 hour basis, what if there's a second time zone which is off by +3:30 hours?

correct me if i am wrong, but resistant to low pressure at high flight altitudes..isn't it the same as pressure resistance to 20 bar? bar isn't a resistance to water depth but pressure.. the pressure at high altitudes and deep sea diving is the same force

and what is TEGIMENT?

This post has been edited by Jason: Apr 8 2010, 11:27 AM

i googled Tegiment....
tis is what i got
any Sinn watches are fitted with Tegimented cases produced in-house by Sinn's case making company in Glashutte, Germany.

Standard steel used by most watch companies has a hardness of between 200 and 240 HV (Hardness Vickers is a common scale used to measure material hardness). The Tegiment layer has a hardness of 1,200 Vickers which is five times harder than standard steel (and on some Sinn models even higher - up to nine times harder than standard steel).

The Tegiment layer is not a coating consisting of a foreign material, instead the steel itself that has been hardened using a special engineering process that creates a hardened barrier. The base material is a type of stainless steel also used for surgical implants, and the stainless steel resistance to corrosion is even further improved by the Tegiment hardening process.

The primary advantage to a Tegimented case is extreme resistance to scratches and other case abrasions.

nando, you don't have swiss watch now? I thought you got a few?
Anyway, my vote go for Sinn, for its name and the material used. I do like the tube gas of Ball, but I find its price is on the high side.

i got 2 poor man's Tissot only ..3-4 years old...quartz....if paste here all the sifus laugh..hahaha..

so i consider my coming purchase to be the first `luxury' item.....
too bad...no-one giving me 15k present..haha!


Interesting you mention price....that's one of the reason why i am debating on the Ball...the original price is RM..9500..AD will give 30% discount, so it will be selling at around RM 6600. Someone is selling his 1 year old good condition Ball Dual Time for RM4700..if i consider in terms of value....this looks live value for money...

Of course the Sinn brand new is about RM5000.....

Or is it a case of Ball pricing already too high in first place....i thought Ball watches always value for $?

Ball is value for money, but this model the price is on high side, in my opinion la.
Since you read many forums, any shortlisted watches in your mind?

This post has been edited by ck77: Apr 8 2010, 04:19 PM

this webpage serve a very good understanding of Tag Heuer...
http://www.calibre11.com/calibre-1887-story/#more-2189

Ohh the Sinn blue dial looks nice. Classic, i think with such a nice watch should be applicable for what job you're working.

If wearing office attire, IWC, Sinn should have to WOW Factor
Sorry for noob question, does 10k able to get IWC or Sinn? not too entry level ~~

hehehe....at present..the Sinn U1 and 857 impress me.....

i also kind of like the Oris i posted..the Limited Edition Hunter

although i am also keen on the PO Seamaster....

thought long and hard about the Jean Richard Bressel...decided no for now....

This post has been edited by nando: Apr 8 2010, 05:38 PM

u're right, thats only useful for places such as the below. otherwise most countries time diff is by the hour. the watch will come in handy esp u travel to India freq!
- Adelaide, South Australia, Australia +9.30hr
- Caracas, Venezuela -4.30hrs
- Chatham Islands, New Zealand +12.45hrs
- Darwin, Northern Territory, Australia +9.30hr
- Delhi, Delhi, India +5.30hr
- Esfahãn, Iran +3.5 or +4.5hrs
- Mumbai, Maharashtra, India +5.30hr
- Nãgpur, Maharashtra, India + 5.30hr
- Ludhiana, Punjab, India +5.30hr
- Lucknow, Uttar Pradesh, India +5.30hr
- Kolkata, West Bengal, India +5.30hr
- Kãnpur, Uttar Pradesh, India +5.30hr
- Jaipur, Rajasthan, India +5.30hr
- Indore, Madhya Pradesh, India +5.30hr
- Patna, Bihar, India +5.30hr
- Surat, Gujarat, India +5.30hr
- Sri Jayawardenapura Kotte, Sri Lanka +5.30hr
- Lord Howe Island, Lord Howe Island, Australia +10.30hr
- Kingston, Norfolk Island +11.30hr
- Kathmandu, Nepal +5.45hr
- Kabul, Afghanistan +4.30hr
- Rasht, Iran +3.50hr or +4.50hr
- St. John's, Newfoundland and Labrador, Canada +3.50hr
- Taiohae, Marquesas Islands, France -9.30hr
- Yangon, Myanmar +6.30hr

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Added on April 8, 2010, 6:11 pmBALL prices are really high today. dump the money into a Sinn.
Sinn U1 is nice and clean cost ~RM5.5k after discount I think. Sinn 857 cost a little more. somehow I like U1 better don't like the 2nd timezone look although its trad on pilot watches.

Jean Richard Bressel.. U don't get the high tech case design but a nice movement with pwr res.

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Added on April 8, 2010, 6:13 pmI like the design, but watch is too light even for the 46mm! felt like my 80grams Tag Heuer.

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Added on April 8, 2010, 6:20 pm10K for IWC is the most entry level such as the below. Sinn most of the watches in the collection are within reach.




This post has been edited by patryn33: Apr 8 2010, 06:20 PM

yeah...i love the U1...clean and simple and yet speak ACHTUNG... if order online from Sinnwatches.com...the rubber-strap U1 is slightly less 4.5k...

This post has been edited by nando: Apr 8 2010, 06:40 PM

basically, both conditions have to do with pressure, which is the basic thing here. technically, the design of a pressured equipment and a pressurized equipment, are different. an equipment that can withstand 2bar pressurized condition might not withstand 2bar pressured condition. different calculation/design.

BUT, in vacuum condition, a watch will only have 1bar of pressure in its case, so i don't think it's strong enough to destroy the watch.

disclaimer: i might be talking nonsense since i've only experience in designing pressure equipments on land (about at sea level) with vacuum in them. never designed equipments for use high in the sky.

This post has been edited by miaopurr: Apr 8 2010, 07:38 PM

least you got Tissot, still swiss mah.

Out of the choices you mentioned.. I'd lean towards the Sinn U1 SDR on bracelet. In my personal book I'd rank Oris below Sinn and definitely the Omega as a brand, and in terms of case/build/technology & innovation, also below both Sinn and Omega. between PO and U1.. that depends on how much $ you wanna spend. I say go for the Omega and call it a day if you have the cash. if brands don't bother you that much. then Sinn is fine.

patryn33: thanks for the heads up, so I guess that 0.30 minute market not so vital.. that way I can justify getting a watch with second time zone without minutes hand... Oris Artelier Complication anyone? looks a bit small on the wrist though, even at 40mm

This post has been edited by Jason: Apr 8 2010, 09:41 PM