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 BARF Diet, Bones And Raw Food Diet

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TSWhite Palace
post Nov 26 2008, 12:54 AM, updated 12y ago

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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Bones And Raw Food Diet

As per title, besides what most pet owners normally providing their pets - Kibbles. There is another interesting diet for us to discover about - BARF.

Personally, I'd been feeding my dogs on BARF diet for quite some months already. At first, I was quite reluctant to switch from kibbles to BARF, just as any normal person, I thought that feeding BARF is a troublesome + expensive thing to do. BUT if you were to ask me to switch back to kibbles now, I would say NO!

BARF, also known as Biologically Appropriate Raw Food by Dr Ian Billinghurst - vet who originated the BARF (Evolutionary Nutrition) feeding program worldwide, is an interesting subject to wonder upon. We admire him a lot and gotten a bundle of books written by him to munch about. We share the books among our friends and puppy buyers, trying to find out the best we can provide our dogs.

Well, through out the readings, we do noticed that BARF is not as simple as we imagine. BUT if we are willing to study more and research hard, we will actually able to make our pets healthier, and we do learn a lot on why feeding BARF will makes our pets better off. None of us are nutritionist or experts but we hope that through reading the books from the professionals, we would be able to provide the best for our pets.

Let's put aside the very much details and allow me to express what I'm able to observe as a normal owner. What are the differences after switching from kibbles to BARF.

1) The amount of poo is much lesser, as in very much lesser! Some of you guys might know, I do own quite a substantial amount of dogs. It is a disaster for us to clean up their big pile of poo poo many times a day! After feeding BARF diet, it is incredible. The poo poo size is much smalleer, very less smell, also they only poo once a day! I do believe that this is very much due to the enzymes in raw diets. Enzymes is an agent to help dissolves and digests the food and nutritions. During processing, heating and packaging to last for long shelf life, most enzymes in most kibbles are lost. Which means that if we are feeding diet losing the enzymes, what enters the stomach will only FILL the stomach, then most of the food will come out as poo poo! But when feeding BARF, the food and nutrients dissolved and digested appropriately, hence very litttle remaindings will come out as poo poo, also our pets will get healthier since the nutrients are better digested.

2) Water consumption lower, lesser wee wee. Unlike kibbles which are very dry and dogs will always thirsthy and need to drink a substantial amount of water, which makes them wee wee very frequently, BARF diets basically are not heated nor dried, hence the liquid remains. Eating do not make them thirsty, they will drink as needed.

3) Skin and coat and overall health being improved. We can see a very big different comparing our dogs when they are fed with kibbles and after they are fed with BARF for some time. We do brought back dogs with poor health condition and see obvious improvements. We are also glad to see by providing a suitable diet, our pets skin and coat is actually getting better, inside out!

The purpose of me opening up this thread is to share, i'm happy and satisfied with BARF and wish to share more. I'm not an expert but I do hope to share some of my experience and I believe that there must be many of you guys here are able to share some valuable knowledge with me too! Let's learn together.

But remember, a BARF diet has to be a "COMPLETE" one if we want our pets to be better off. For instance, let say you are feeding only RAW Meat but not with the bones, you will face problem. It is not a simple subject but it is interesting while we learn more! So, if you want something better for your pets, do study hard and drop by here frequently to enganged in our discussion.

Let's just ends here for the first post, and we shall share together for many posts to come.

FAQs

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FACTs

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This post has been edited by White Palace: Jul 10 2010, 12:46 PM
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 2 2008, 09:01 AM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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NOTE:

NOT ALL FATS ARE CREATED EQUAL

Fat is either saturated or polyunsaturated and your dog needs both. Together these fats supply the essential fatty acids (EFAs) necessary to maintain a dog's good health. Saturated fat comes from animal sources; Polysaturated fat comes from vegetable sources.

Not enough animal fat in the diet can create:

Lack of energy
Heart problems
Growth deficits
Dry skin
Cell damage

Lack of polyunsaturated fat can cause:

Coarse dry hair coat
Improper growth
Skin lesions on belly, inside the back legs, and between the shoulder blades
Thickened areas of skin
Horny skin growths
Skin ulcerations and infections
Poor blood clotting
Extreme itching and scratching

Some owners do remove the fat from the meat source, but I would say that's a big NO cause these animal fats are important for your pet! Dogs do not suffer from heart disease caused by higher levels of animal fat, or from fatty deposits in blood vessels. However, moderation is the key.

I would suggests owners to grab a bottle of safflower oil to adds into the diet. Safflower oil is one of the least allergic oil and it contains Vitamin E (At least the bottle I gotten has it) which helps to preserve the diet naturally besides providing polyunsaturated fat.

Reference: Holistic Guide for a Healthy Dog, 2nd edition, by Wendy Volhard and Kerry Brown, D.V.M.
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 5 2008, 02:17 AM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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Updated the 1st post, just incase you guys didnt notice.

For those who plan to introduce BARF, please do remember that we are doing it for the good of our pets. So, we must make sure that we learn continuously and keep improving the diet. Failing to provide a balanced and quality BARF will ends up with troubles, too!

So, we either make sure that we do loads of readings and research and make sure our pets getting a complete, balance BARF, else selecting the best kibbles and supplement it with the right supplements might do a better job than "not so complete BARF".

This post has been edited by White Palace: Dec 5 2008, 02:18 AM
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 6 2008, 03:38 AM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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Anyone starts feeding BARF already? Please share your experience here. smile.gif
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 13 2008, 01:30 AM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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Normally what I do is to get the whole chicken and grind everything in. Once a while I will give my dogs some chicken necks or wings or legs to chew on.

As for the other ingredients, certain ingredients we use it consistently and many we rotates.

A sample recipe for this batch of BARF we did:

The proportions are according to Doctor Ian Billinghurst's formula and the decision made on which ingredients to choose from is based on our group readings and discussions.

I'm striving hard to educates people regarding BARF diets but at the same time learning whatever I yet to know of. So, please acknowledge if there is any suggestion.

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I do agree that it would be good to give dog owners a choice to get the grinded meat + bones only and let them mix in the rest since some dogs might be allergic to certain ingredients and some owners might prefers to get things done on their own, PROVIDED we make sure they are well educated regarding BARF.

BUT on the other hand, for owners who only own 1 or 2 toy breeds, it might be too costly to get all the other ingredients and supplements, the dog might not be able to finish them before they even expired! Also, some owners might not border to do research before preparing the meals, or thought that missing out certain ingredients is alright and leads to problems which totally forfeit the purpose of feeding BARF diets.

dongdong, I disagree that darker red = use too much liver. My 1st batch of BARF is dark color and liver % is not high, it is due to the apple we place in and apples arent cheap. icon_rolleyes.gif

This post has been edited by White Palace: Dec 13 2008, 01:42 AM
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 13 2008, 04:02 AM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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That's why you see I rotates the fruits tongue.gif Pros + Cons lor~ The purpose we use Apple for the 1st batch is because we need some moisture to grind the veges nicely but we do not want to mix water. So we use one of our fruit selection ---> apple. Well, it turns up well and I do not mind the darker color coz all our dogs love it very much! It is an amazing experience feeding BARF. I felt sorry to my dogs coz I fed them kibbles for quite some time. I love to see their "THIS IS WAT I CALL FOOD!!!" expression when feeding them BARF. laugh.gif
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 13 2008, 08:54 PM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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QUOTE(PangurBan @ Dec 13 2008, 02:25 PM)
You give your dog eat chicken wing neat not afraid the bone cucuk his tummy meh?
*
If you are feeding cooked bones, then you need to be very worry cause it makes the bones sharp.

But if you are feeding raw bones, your dog can chew it nicely and your dog's stomach is much more acidic than human's, bones are no problem for them to dissolves at all.

But of corse, no matter what we are feeding or treating our dogs, we must always keep an eye on them. Some dogs love to swallow everything without chewing, this type of dog no matter you are feeding raw or kibbles or giving them chew toys, must keep an eye.
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 15 2008, 10:26 PM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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QUOTE(iluv2zzz @ Dec 15 2008, 01:00 AM)
FYI I don't do BARF  tongue.gif  I do HCF (homecook food) but I came across a lot BARF when I doing my research. So I am just sharing with what I know. Generally most ingredient in BARF and HCF are similar. The major different is the preparation, proportion, and the bone tongue.gif

Perhaps we should have another proper thread for HCF includes all the treat baking recipe. Planning to bake some this week.

Alright, back to BARF. other then Dr.B that dongdong and yang said, what about Pitcairn? Anybody have a copy of Dr.Pitcairn's Complete Guide to Natural Health for dogs n cats?

http://www.drpitcairn.com/books/pitcairn_book.html
*
Holistic Guide for a Healthy Dog, 2nd edition, by Wendy Volhard and Kerry Brown, D.V.M.

Actually I'm focusing more on this book, Dr B's book are "swallowed" more deeply by my frens. We sort of read different books and share the knowledge.

I would say the book i'm reading is a good choice as well cause it is not so one sided to feed BARF only, it also explains how to select the right kibbles and ways to supplement it properly.
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 16 2008, 12:18 AM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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I havent finish the whole book yet, but yap, it does talks about kibbles + supplements also explanations on ingredients.
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 23 2008, 04:05 PM

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QUOTE(acsyen @ Dec 19 2008, 09:58 AM)
Hi,

I would never encourage for the meat and bones to be grinded unless it is a very young pup or maybe the dog has lost it's teeth. I feed my young pup from 2-3 months old chunks of meat and bones. Only the vege and fruits are blended.
*
vege and fruits are blended with anything else?
TSWhite Palace
post Dec 25 2008, 08:23 PM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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I see. Coz doggies normally dislike vege alone. Thanks for the info!
TSWhite Palace
post Jan 24 2009, 02:41 PM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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Well, that's what they meant to eat! I believe animals are quite simple. They eat what they meant to eat, and refuse or reluctant to eat what they are not meant to. We don't say that a Wolf is too pampered because he doesnt take kibbles so must force him, he should eat raw!

bluepuppygirl, do give us feedback on how things go feeding raw alright?

This post has been edited by White Palace: Jan 24 2009, 02:42 PM
TSWhite Palace
post Jan 25 2009, 02:10 AM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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Not advisable, the digestion rate for BARF and Kibbles is different, mixing them up or frequent switching might upset the stomach.
TSWhite Palace
post Feb 9 2009, 01:25 PM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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Thank you for all the useful links. It sure helps for those who wish to learn more!
TSWhite Palace
post Feb 27 2009, 02:56 PM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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Extracted from one of the post of Rayne:

"9. Some newbie dogs vomit or poop bone bits. There is an adjustment
period, so you want some bone in most meals at first, but too much bone may
not be digested and the dog will just hork it up or poop it out.

NPs, its just the dog's way of saying "Too much right now, no thanks."

10. Some dogs will get the Bile Vomits or Bone Bits Bile Vomits (BV or BBBV)
when new to raw simply because their schedules or routines of eating have
been changed.

When a dog adjusts to raw, his gastric 'juices' become much more acid, to
better digest the raw meat and bone. If he's expecting a meal at a certain
time, the juices start flowing in anticipation of getting a meal. When the
meal doesn't happen, the dog often will hork up the yellowish, foamyish
bile, with or without bones.

Sometimes they hork up BBBV because raw digests faster than kibble, the
tummy is empty, so it must be time to eat. NP for the dog, he's gotten rid
of the irritation. He may react as if he feels bad, just because you are
upset that he did it on your new comforter, or on the white carpet."

P/S: My ability to extract this post proves that i'm very hardworking guy, read every single post here. rolleyes.gif

This post has been edited by White Palace: Feb 27 2009, 03:19 PM
TSWhite Palace
post Feb 28 2009, 10:53 AM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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QUOTE(n3sbaby @ Feb 27 2009, 05:20 PM)
yes you are and I am not...haha....
but now my boy is really allergy to chicken....so i got to stop for a while sad.gif
*
Where do you get your chicken from?
TSWhite Palace
post Mar 1 2009, 12:50 PM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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I'm wondering, does it makes a different for our dogs, for those chicken with brands / without brands sold at hypermarket? Since those with "brands" seems to position themselves as a better ones.
TSWhite Palace
post Mar 2 2009, 02:56 AM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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I'm not sure whether is there any difference, coz certain packaging got written stuffs like "no hormons, no antibiotic" something like that.
TSWhite Palace
post Jul 10 2010, 12:52 PM

Angel - Top Maltese 2006 @ Best Malaysian Bred In Show
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Juz read back this thread, it seems so wonderful that after about 2 years time, we do notice there are more people actually accepted BARF and we can even see many kind people here sharing their knowledge!

I start to feel that my first post is not detailed enough already. If you guys felt that there is anything I should adds on to the first post, please do PM me alright?
TSWhite Palace
post May 14 2012, 03:28 PM

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QUOTE(beawolf64 @ May 14 2012, 03:08 PM)
barf recipe for my bengal cat :

1) Raw Meat - Chicken,Beef, Buffalo meat
2) Alfafa sprout
3) Sweet Potato
4) Raw Egg
5) homemade Ground Egg Shell(from fitrah link)
6) Fish Oil.

Additional Suppliment that seperately added from those recipe,and appllied 3 time a week.

1- Brewer Yeast
2- Dr. Clauder Multivitamin
Result = 1 week shedding fur...replace with soft ,pelted gilitter coat...ideal weight, poo and pee less that before plus its odourless...

note : cat will drink water lesser while in Barf Diet
*
Aside from that, poo is small and solid, non sticky on cat sand, save on $$ for cat sand also. biggrin.gif

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