Null vote for me.

imho, both mods has their pros and cons. I don't like the removal of gun sway neither do I like the idea of banning too much weapons/perks/attachments.

Is the game balance on it's own? No. How do we know that? Coz we all have more gaming experience (in CoD4) than the developers/beta testers themselves whilst the game was still under developement. Since IW is currently busy with CoD6, we can only hope/dream/pray that IW will release a patch to fix all the crap that we're going through now. All we had ever done so far is to ban anything that is ghey and design our own mods with changes without reasoning or even considering the consequences of the changes that was done.

Lets take for example, this upcoming WGT ruleset. What bothers me the most is the fact that hardcore hp will be changed to 60. This will render stopping power redundant. For those who have completely no idea what I'm trying to rant, plz visit www.xanga.com/DenKirson. Den (the author of that site) had summarised all the technical stuffs in the game's file into layman's terms.

Now, for my quarter cent opinion, I think all of us (the Malaysian CoD4 community), should gather at a round table, sip a cup of coffee, and discuss reasonable changes to be implemented for tournaments while considering the consequences of those changes.

Peace out.... plz dun flame me

This post has been edited by Luftwacko: Oct 19 2008, 01:09 AM

Er.... you didn't read properly did ya?

Stopping power: increases dmg by 1.4x
That means if...
20 dmg, + sp = 28 dmg
30 dmg, + sp = 42 dmg
40 dmg, + sp = 56 dmg
50 dmg, + sp = 70 dmg

Stopping power is designed is such a way that you'll need to take 1 LESS bullet to kill a target (applies to hp = 100 aka normal mode)

Only M14 (50-40), Skorpion (50-20), Deagle (50-30) and M60 (50-40) will benefit from hp = 60 in CQC if coupled with sp (1 hit kill).

Other weapons like:
M16 (40-30)
AK-47 (40-30)
G3 (40-30)
MP44 (40-30)
M249 (30)
RPD (40)
Will need 2 bullets to kill regardless whether you have sp or not.

M4 (30-20)
G36c (30-20)
MP5 (40-20)
Uzi (30-20)
AK-74u (40-20)
P90 (30-20)
M9 (40-20)
USP (40-20)
M1911 (40-20)
Will need 3 bullets to kill at long range regardless whether you have sp or not.

This post has been edited by Luftwacko: Oct 19 2008, 04:05 AM

Hmmm... I've calculated the number of bullets it takes to kill... yea, it DOES reduce the number of ammo needed to kill people hiding behind objects.

Can't believe SP is the new DI when hp = 60 (it doesn't perform as good as DI though). Funny things happen if you tweak stuffs beyond what the developers originally programmed.

I don't get what you're trying to tell me. I think you've forgot to take into consideration that:

1. It's quite impossible to kill a target through a brick wall in 1 shot when hc hp = 42 even IF you have sp + di as your perks (unless if you use a sniper rifle + sp + di + damage multiplier)
2. There's no hit blip through walls for the tourney so you'll never know if you hit the target or not.

This post has been edited by Luftwacko: Oct 19 2008, 02:54 PM

Chill man, chill.

There's like.... 5 pages in this thread so far, so it's quite understandable that not everyone is hardworking enough to read previous posts.

Wadafak?

You're not specific at the bolded part. 1 shot from AK is NOT enough to kill WITHOUT sp if hp = 42. If what you meant was AK + sp, then forget what I've said earlier.

Penetration is a fairly complex thing in CoD4, it's damn blardy difficult for me to explain to you in layman's term...

... but I'll try anyway *deep breath*

There are several factors that'll determine the damage you'll deal on the other side of the object you're trying to penetrate:
1. The type of weapon you're firing.
There are basically 3 categories of weapons when it comes to penetration:
SMALL -- All smgs, shotguns and pistols (exception: AK-74u and Deagle)
MEDIUM -- All assualt, AK-74u and Deagle (exception: M14)
LARGE -- All LMGs, sniper rifles and M14

2. The type of material you're penetrating

Obviously, materials that are zero will not penetrate at all.
anything less than "0.32" will not penetrate for Small without Deep Impact.
game rounds the numbers to the nearest whole

3. Damage of the weapon
This one is simple: basically, the higher the damage your weapon deals, the more damage it'll deal after the damage is reduced through the material.

4. Perks
Although stopping power does help a bit with penetration, it's nothing compare to the benefits that deep impact will give you (DI will double the damage done through materials, so if you shoot through a brick wall with an AK-47, instead of dealing 8 damage on the other side, the damage will be doubled to 16.)

5. Angle of penetration
The penetration values I've given earlier only shows the damage dealt through the other side of the material if you shoot at the material STRAIGHT ON. At about a 20° angle, that value will be halved, and at 45°, 1 damage. More than 45°, the bullet will not penetrate.

there are probably more factors that I miss out. Plz do remind me if I do miss out anything.

So lets say if you're using AK-47 + sp + di and you're shooting a moron through a brick wall if hp = 42, damage done at the other side of the wall will be 22 dmg (assuming that you spam at the target straight on). If the target survives the 1st shot and somehow manages to run, you'll be shooting at the target at an ever increasing angle as the target flees, so you'll be needing more and more bullets to kill him if he's not an idiot staying put in one spot.

Note: this is an extreme case where you have sp and di as your perks. You'll need to spam more lead to kill if you don't have either of those perks.

Capped at 35 dmg?!!

That'll render sp useless on most guns would it? Or are there any more changes to balance out sp?

Report who?

hope it's not me wei....

This post has been edited by Luftwacko: Oct 19 2008, 11:08 PM

Hmmm... then is there any way that I could contact them? I want to PM them for the values...

Hey guys, can you do me a favour? Plz help me check if there's any ammo share between AK-47 and M249 in Promod.

Thx in advance

Coz there's a file called "promod_ak47_mp" that have the same exact data as "saw_mp". So I am clueless as to whether the mod is using the "ak47_mp" file or the "promod_ak47_mp" file for the AK-47.

Plz help me check. Thx. I don't have a copy of CoD4 in my pentium 3 lappy

<------- LAN gamer here.

This post has been edited by Luftwacko: Oct 20 2008, 12:23 AM

Hehe. Sry bradder. I can't help replying to ppl who replies to my posts >.<

My apologies

This post has been edited by Luftwacko: Oct 20 2008, 12:07 PM

Ever heard of AP (armor piercing) rounds?

Saying that "bla bla" is illogical/unrealistic is kind of a moot point if you ask me, quizically, there are many things in the game that's already pretty damn unrealistic:
-It's possible to snipe with a pistol across maps like Wetwork/Crossfire when in reality, the bullets will fall short before they even reach the target.
-Sniping in the game is pretty much a scope-and-fire weapon. While in RL, a true sniper will need to consider environmental effects like coriolis effect, air humidity, temperature of the bullet, etc. and compensate for these effects before they even pull the trigger.
-ACOG on Skorpion? Now that's funny.
-We can ban imba weapons such as the almighty grenade launcher in the game. In RL, however, the world is a cruel place -- apparently, majority of the US Marines forces are considered "noob" to CoD4 players like us.

Well, it's a game anyway, the perks are there not for the sake of realism, but for the sake of enhancing tactical gameplay. This game is no longer the typical pick-up-a-farting-gun-and-blast-your-way-to-victory-wakakakaka type of shooter. With the implementation of the perk system, it opens up a wide range of methods and strats to achieve your goal. Banning too much of these perks will defeat the purpose of calling this game Call of Duty 4: Modern Warfare in the first place.

Just for your info, I'm currently figuring out a way to balance up the game without banning too much stuffs. All we need now is a modder to key in the numbers and you guys to test it out.

That's all my rant I have for now... plz don't kill me, t3q

But not practical lor.... imo lar of coz...

Wah, Adi, you damn siao >.<

Er... nothing...

Although Promod does reduce the dmg of smgs (AK-74u: 40-30 reduced to 32-20, MP5: 40-20 reduced to 33-20), the modder somehow increased the damage multiplier to body parts:
Head: 1.4x (default: 1.4)
Neck: 1.4x (default: 1)
Upper torso [chest]: 1.4x (default: 1)
Lower torso [stomach]: 1.4x (default: 1)
Limbs: 1 (default: 1)

Overall, Promod INCREASES the damage of smgs slightly (but the effects won't be felt if hp is 100). The only differences is that you'll need more bullets if you hit the limbs and the effects of penetration will be greatly felt?

Hehe, change edi... that post was PromodPedia

Source: promod_release3_final.iwd

Hmmm... the range is somehow.... same as the default CoD4 initial values (750-1000). So at range, both the stock CoD4 (hehe, dunno what 2 call it) and Promod's MP5/AK-74u deals the same damage as each other. The only difference is that one has dmg multiplier up to the torso, the other only has multiplier to the head.

Source: "maxDamageRange\750\minDamageRange\1000" from either the ak74u_mp or mp5_mp file.

I think I shall post my source from now on... just to prove my point... and also for you guys to double check for my mistakes

This post has been edited by Luftwacko: Oct 21 2008, 02:56 PM

Gun sway is a..... bug?

Guys, if you want to know more about Promod, I think you should download it (or if you already have it, then) and go to promod_release3_final.iwd file to analyse the changes. (to open the .iwd file, rename the extention to .zip/.rar)