LOL ...

Simonyw_87 ....
Yeah... another violence supporter .... But what your example got to do with DotA??? If a thief comes to my house ... of course i wack him ....In law ... the thief would get punished anyways .... You are trying to say Leaving DotA game is againts the law ??

If violence continues ... sooner or later Everyone wont even have chance to play at cyber anymore when government closed it down .... Luckily for us ... those people who got wacked usualy wont go make the matter big by reporting to the police ....The government already enforce a rule to not allow school kids and after midnight cyber operation ... because??? someone actualy died getting wack in cyber ...

No wonder i saw parents these days extreamly discourage thier children to hang out at cyber cafe ....
Yes ... i agree that those people who lanci is trying to provoke the wacker .... but if the wacker cannot take it ... i suggest that he dont live in this world .... Unless he is a Bai Ga jai where parents dam rich that they are boss of the company .... Other than that .. they would definately work under people .... and i tell you .... Theres no such thing as BOSS never scold you before in your working life .....
As mentioned In my previous post ..... There is no reason to fight Over Leavers .... To show you again ... i repaste my statement ...
Ok now .. lets seperate this into 2 cases...

1- He got wack by his teammate
2- He got wack by the opponent
For 1, i felt that wacking that leaver is RIDICULOUS .... i mean ... If he leaves... its a benefit to them ..so why wack him??? you cant wack him because hes a noob feeder.....

For 2, This is more stupid.... The reason that the opponent wack the leaver is because ... they must have never OWN before ...

It is imposible for someone to leave if he is winning... If he left when he is owning ... reason is definately he got emergencies.... and if kena wack by that ... 100% no word to say.....
Dai lou ... you serious anot to use these kind of examples .... as you said ... when We watch football ... so i presume u say Premier League or international football ...
Its a competition.... you wont see leaver at WCG also right ... and the DotA we talking about here is CC dota .. not WCG ...



You go see the field there ... those football kaki who play for fun one .... Do you see people say " oi .. tak boleh pergi" altough they are tired or have reason to leave...

Dam ... how to say you adi ah =.=""
You say wacking people if he insult your family[in game... or even in real life] is a sure must and cannot be tolerated right???

Then why dont you think that ... if you wack him for insulting your family ... your no better than him??? you will be catagorize as the same uncivilized people like him ... Or even worst because you put a hurt on him ...

Moreover ..... The stupiest thing is ... if he scold your mum is a B*tch or scold your dad is a useless peace of shit ..... and you wack him up ... that just means that you admited that your mum is a B*itch or your dad is a useless peace of shit ... Make sence right????
Hope you understand ... peace ...

Ok now .. lets seperate this into 2 cases...

1- He got wack by his teammate
2- He got wack by the opponent


For 1, i felt that wacking that leaver is RIDICULOUS .... i mean ... If he leaves... its a benefit to them ..so why wack him??? you cant wack him because hes a noob feeder.....

For 2, This is more stupid.... The reason that the opponent wack the leaver is because ... they must have never OWN before ...

It is imposible for someone to leave if he is winning... If he left when he is owning ... reason is definately he got emergencies.... and if kena wack by that ... 100% no word to say.....

people that have urgent need n have to leave.= forgivable. pity him if get wack
people that join game n leave game for fun,enjoy spoiling ppls game= i wont wack him, but i wont pity him if he gets wack by ppl.

i somehow agree with him that some people really deserve to be wack.

ZZZ...

I guess you misunderstood my statement.

I said, you can capture the thief, but you cannot wack him AFTER YOU CAPTURED HIM.

If you happen to beat him, hit him with anything in order to:
1, Capture him
2, getting back your stuff
3, Defending yourself.

It's legal.
However, after he is being captured (being tied up or something).

If you beat him, you will get sued for injured people.
If you killed him... sorry, you will get sued for murder.

I feel free.

There are 2 parties: The Whacker, and The Leaver.

1st NO-NO: Whacker must not whack, whatever reason it is, it's wrong to start a fight. Unable to control your emotion is not a reason, it's an excuse.

Since the Whacker has such an obvious wrongdoing, he doesn't deserve any debate. He is wrong.

Now comes to the 2nd NO-NO: Leaver should not leave. Why?

1) If you sucked and losing the game, deal with it. You don't learn if you leave like that. Grow up and get matured.

2) If you sucked and your team is cursing you, deal with it. Live with the fact that you sucked, else train more, and you don't train yourself how to leave a game just because you sucked. Again, grow up and get matured.

3) You don't care if others pay to play, then you have to accept the fact that others don't care you pay to play too. So who's paying to play is not a reason to argue about.Remember this.

4) I don't agree with some who said that it's just a game, don't be serious. You don't generalize that quote to every game. Unless you're playing against the AI or 'The-Most-Not-Serious-Player-Wins' sort of game, you should be serious. Serious in terms of sportsmanship, not personal. By not having a serious sportsmanship mindset, it's a disrespect to others and a disgrace to yourself. Take an example in a football match, a player can be serious in tackling another player or serious in tackling the ball. It made the difference between getting a successful tackle or getting a red card.

5) If you really have an emergency, which I don't buy it at all because it's the rarest of reason, you've to figured out a way to leave properly, and not just leave like that. Find someone who's standing or not playing around you, kindly ask them to take your place as you've paid for it. I'm sure there is always someone who's willing to play. If he leaves after you, that's another case.

6) And finally, if you are on pre-paid game and your time is almost up, do not, I REPEAT, DO NOT join a multiplayer game. This reflects your ability to think as a matured person and not just some 'ah-who-cares? spoiled kid'. Either you topup your pre-paid to finish a game that you joined, or don't join at all. Do something else. Not realizing about that your time's up means you have time-management issue, it's not a reason, it's an excuse.

Maturity is what separates true-gamers from noob-losers. Not skills, not levels.

Why do you think so? Because I disagree with you that not all leavers are bad? So you want everyone to except the fact that all leavers as bad as the Gospel truth? Everyone knows that violence is bad. In fact, from post #1, people already know it. Just that some Dotards or Retards try and justify it by saying that they will turn a blind eye on people using violence on people who breaks Dota Rules. To say that there is a reason as to why people get beaten up as leaving is considered as an insult to people is just plain nonsensical. In that case, if i knock into your car, are you justified to beat me up just because you are upset? This really shows the mentality of those so called dotards or retards trying to justify indirectly the usage of violence. A person who breaks Dota Rules do not deserve violence just as much as a person who do not break it. Get this into your head. I think the fun has just begin. It is normal for retards who do not know Dota to come and flame us. But if the administrator or TS thinks that this thread should be closed, then they have the right to do so.

You do not leave games when you are losing given that those people in your team are competent enough. You still can have some enjoyment in it. If those people in your team are like those who always aim the light strike array(Lina) at himself whenever chasing enemy even if we were chasing enemy 2 vs 1. Do not know how to use her ultitame when the other hero has low life. You have very little heart to play.You shout at them, scream at them, they still keep quiet.  I am sure you have met ppl as such. You play with this kind of ppl, the whole team all demotivated already.

Perhaps the people you play with are all pros. So you do not get so frustrated when playing. I get my points across.  But to say that those people deserve to get beaten up is wrong. It is enough to go up to them and tell them not to leave game if you know who the person is. But to beat someone else is way too much. It is totally inexcusable.

When most people leave, it is because they see the entire game as hopeless. Very little chance of a turnaround barring a miracle. The people around them could be totally hopeless,etc. I am sure when you play against such opponents you do know what is the likely outcome. So why continue bullying them?

Normally people do not leave after first blood. It is when they get pawned over and over again. Ppl start scolding them. I have seen others who get pawned over and over again even though they made few mistakes but ppl still hammer them.

So can you imagine if you are put in a situation whereby you are in distress. Dun you think that it is normal that you get out of that situation?

I normally play on even if i lose badly given that the people surrounding me has a good reputation. At least I respect their skill set.

Ive seen quite a few posts about Fighting in Cyber-Cafe because of DotA...

Some cases about People Lunci/Scolding the oppenent during a DotA game that result a fight while some is about leaving a dotA game which made the opponent come and wack you up...
To me ... These people are extream SOHAI ... I know the people who lunci/scold you in game is wrong .. but why not just settle by scolding them back in game too?? why need to use brute force?? or better still ... just let it be...

But the worst case i think would be Idiots wacking people who leave game... I mean WTF!!! What if the leaver have emergency/important that forces them to leave game .... Even if the leaver leave just for the sake of leaving, he doesnt deserve getting wack too.. its not like they play in the cyber-cafe for free.. they PAID TO PLAY for GOD sake .. Why cant they leave as they like??? who are they to control you.... ARE THEY mentaly INSANE ??? These people should go to REHAB and they should be barred from playing dotA....
What you guys think about it... Please feel free to state your toughts......

Actualy ... i know that when people leave game ... its actualy annoying ...

but they paid the money to play ... they have the rights to play anygame they want , leave any game they want and do what ever they want ... what makes you the one who set the rules for him??? he doesnt owe you anything ...

Unless the warcraft3 Button in the CC there wrote [ For Serious player access only] then i got nothing to say ...
Just think about it ... If you hit someone who left a game ... the next day newspaper headline "Sohai Hits boy for quitting a game" ..... i ask you ... What the whole world would think??? the whole world would definately think that you are having a mental break down right???

Besides ...  I wonder in court.. how the judge will penalize him ... when someone use brute force because hes being insulted ... maybe everyone would just think that he has a bad temper... but if someone uses brute force because the other guy leave game ... OMG!!!i realy got no EYE see... i wonder if he would use the word "the so called DotA rules" in court =.="""

Well, then I guess in your eyes, Dota is your life. When someone irritates you or break the rules in Dota, that person is justified to beat up another person. You compare a person who leave the game with a person who actually purposely knocks into another person's car? I am just trying to let you guys know that this guy who beats a leaver because he gets irritated will do the same thing if someone knocks his car accidently. I guess Dota has eaten so much into a person's head that they cannot think with any sense anymore. You really never get the meaning of my posts do you when i am trying to highlight that a person who beats another person up over leaving is actually a monster.

I have already highlighted the effects of noobs in a game and i dun want to do so again.

Justify to leave as in because of the rules of Dota. If you like to waste your time and play for a lost cause then please do. In fact Dota should change the rules to allow people to concede defeat if the other person can prove that there is no chance of winning or there are noobs who is affecting the game. Mayby you should follow this and be more gracious when someone concedes defeat if he has a reasonable reason.

And to GrandElf, to me a good gamer is a gamer with the right skill set regardless of whether he follows the rules or not. If you follow all the rules and you dun have the skills you are still a noob in my eyes. I will not look upon highly on you just because you follow the rules.

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Added on September 11, 2008, 3:20 pm

I bet you fail to see the significance of what i am saying then. Pity you

Well, then I guess in your eyes, Dota is your life. When someone irritates you or break the rules in Dota, that person is justified to beat up another person. You compare a person who leave the game with a person who actually purposely knocks into another person's car? I am just trying to let you guys know that this guy who beats a leaver because he gets irritated will do the same thing if someone knocks his car accidently. I guess Dota has eaten so much into a person's head that they cannot think with any sense anymore. You really never get the meaning of my posts do you when i am trying to highlight that a person who beats another person up over leaving is actually a monster.

I have already highlighted the effects of noobs in a game and i dun want to do so again.

Justify to leave as in because of the rules of Dota. If you like to waste your time and play for a lost cause then please do. In fact Dota should change the rules to allow people to concede defeat if the other person can prove that there is no chance of winning or there are noobs who is affecting the game. Mayby you should follow this and be more gracious when someone concedes defeat if he has a reasonable reason.

And to GrandElf, to me a good gamer is a gamer with the right skill set regardless of whether he follows the rules or not. If you follow all the rules and you dun have the skills you are still a noob in my eyes. I will not look upon highly on you just because you follow the rules.

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Added on September 11, 2008, 3:20 pm

I bet you fail to see the significance of what i am saying then. Pity you

Are you sure about that quote over there? Gary Kasparov quits after conceding to deep blue. He is not a winner? Quitter never wins. I seen many familiar names who quites twice but won 6-7 times on average.

If i concede defeat i dun leave? Then why do i concede defeat in the  first place.

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Added on September 14, 2008, 3:02 pm

Reasons as to why I quit has been given earlier. I just want to play a game with people with some brains not those without it. Some people just cannot play Dota just because they just do not have the logical thinking to do so. There is no way you can get any kills with those people in it. I play on even if i know i am going to lose if those people are competent enough unless 2 barracks has already been destroyed and that is the time you know you will surely lose unless your herores are all late game. But at least you still have the fun of getting the rare kills which is satisfying given that you have lost the game.

I played yesterday night and I remembered that our team was owning the other team. One of the person from the other team quit. Instead of saying the usual f*** word that i am sure  you guys say all the time regardless of whether the game is meaningless or not, I just ask the other team whether they are crying or not. I joked around with them and later another guy quit. No one in our team made a fuss and my team mate just leave the game after that. And we joined another game.There was no temper at all being thrown around. We were happy and jovial after that "win" instead of some of you here who always f*** here and f*** there even though you have "won" the game.

Dota is a team game when you play with pros.Just one noob and the entire team loses. You understand that right?

In that case i bet with you 80% of the time you will never be happy because 80% of the time, ppl leave pro or not when they see the game as hopeless. Unless the players they played with is competent. You want to talk ethics with me. Then I guess you will never ever be happy because rich people do not follow ethics and that is why they pay less taxes and you guys just complain or why is this guy earning 100 times more then me but paying less taxes.

simon, leave him alone already, if we really should discuss about leavers in dota, why not someone create a new debate thread about "Leave a dota game. Right or wrong?" We'll carry our debates there. Talking about leavers in this topic is already going off-topic, and arguing with people who thinks there's nothing wrong when doing something wrong, sigh~

ok then, should people put laws in to their hands especially violence act ?

your method seems to be violence = lessons, how sure are you people are gonna learn thier lesson through violence act ? do you know that by inflicting violence upon others you're actually promoting it, thus the creation of many merciless crime nowadays, violence leads nothing much positive and with that reason alone i do not support people being bashed up just because the person leave a game regardless of how it is done, cheers

btw, i heard there are hidden rules/ethics about dota can you tell me what are they ?