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 Chubby Hamster V10, Rolling Fat Furballs

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Reanne
post Aug 27 2008, 06:37 PM

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Wah, hamster smoothie war. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion with anything, but the RC is genetically prone to diabetes and feeding any fruits or veggie high in sugar should be avoided. This includes carrots, apples, corn, mango, watermelon, etc.

Our stock of winter whites are also not 100% considered pure and many petshops/mills etc tend to mix RC and WWs together, so some wws may have campbell blood, which makes them more susceptible to diseases RCs are prone to, likewise vice versa. Puddings wws are a suspected product of mixed genes so they may be more susceptible to certain diseases or genetically prone to either species of RC or WW. I did have a pair of puddings and they were OBESE even though I didn't really feed them much sweet stuff other than their staple.

Hamsters from Malaysia aren't the same as from Singapore. Here the quality of the hamsters are not as good as from Singapore. We don't even see solid blacks or silver greys for syrians. Mostly cinnamons, some black eyed creams, goldens, red eyed creams, sables. Our Malaysian stock is profusely inbred and kept in poor conditions, so perhaps comparing keeping hamsters in Singapore to keeping in Malaysia may not be the best.
Like for example the dosage/amount of feeding fruits/veggies etc.

A reputable breeder who is also the chief judge for hamster shows in California which specializes in RCs did state that we should avoid feeding any fruits or veggie with is high in sugar to RCs. We're not saying it will succumb to diabetes, but this is stated to diminish the likelihood of the hamster getting diabetes.

Hamsters from US are different. They are heavy bodied, larger, basically bigger in terms of bone structure and body size. There they preserve their breeding lines and genetics well, here our stock is, as said before, inbred until they are almost half the size of US stock. So stating that it's ok for them to be bigger(horizontally), because hamsters in US are naturally bigger?

As a last note, I strongly advise caution with the use of 'Balanced' because nothing is really 100% balanced in terms nutrition. I'm curious to know, was a vet or nutritionist consulted during the creation of the product or was it all based on experience?

This post has been edited by Reanne: Aug 27 2008, 06:42 PM
neshie
post Aug 27 2008, 08:39 PM

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Crazymouse said her internet's down ATM, so she cant reply or anything.
sangels
post Aug 27 2008, 08:45 PM

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QUOTE(Reanne @ Aug 27 2008, 06:37 PM)
Wah, hamster smoothie war. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion with anything, but the RC is genetically prone to diabetes and feeding any fruits or veggie high in sugar should be avoided. This includes carrots, apples, corn, mango, watermelon, etc.

Our stock of winter whites are also not 100% considered pure and many petshops/mills etc tend to mix RC and WWs together, so some wws may have campbell blood, which makes them more susceptible to diseases RCs are prone to, likewise vice versa. Puddings wws are a suspected product of mixed genes so they may be more susceptible to certain diseases or genetically prone to either species of RC or WW. I did have a pair of puddings and they were OBESE even though I didn't really feed them much sweet stuff other than their staple.

Hamsters from Malaysia aren't the same as from Singapore. Here the quality of the hamsters are not as good as from Singapore. We don't even see solid blacks or silver greys for syrians. Mostly cinnamons, some black eyed creams, goldens, red eyed creams, sables. Our Malaysian stock is profusely inbred and kept in poor conditions, so perhaps comparing keeping hamsters in Singapore to keeping in Malaysia may not be the best.
Like for example the dosage/amount of feeding fruits/veggies etc.

A reputable breeder who is also the chief judge for hamster shows in California which specializes in RCs did state that we should avoid feeding any fruits or veggie with is high in sugar to RCs. We're not saying it will succumb to diabetes, but this is stated to diminish the likelihood of the hamster getting diabetes.

Hamsters from US are different. They are heavy bodied, larger, basically bigger in terms of bone structure and body size. There they preserve their breeding lines and genetics well, here our stock is, as said before, inbred until they are almost half the size of US stock. So stating that it's ok for them to be bigger(horizontally), because hamsters in US are naturally bigger?

As a last note, I strongly advise caution with the use of 'Balanced' because nothing is really 100% balanced in terms nutrition. I'm curious to know, was a vet or nutritionist consulted during the creation of the product or was it all based on experience?
*
Hmm... hmm.gif I do agreed with you that our stock of hamsters are mostly with poor quality but still a lot of people go round and buy. Even for some of the home breeder, they even sell hamster that have genetic disorder like flipping and claim that their hamster is healthy. doh.gif Then means whether feed or not doesn't matter since the disorder is contained in their gene. So if someone who feed and till the end the hamster is well and living healthy but on the other hand, someone who do not feed fresh and yet the hamster get diabetes or diseases? How can we know 100% where is the problem coming from? We can't judge 100% for their food intake (maybe only 80%?) cos the hamster also will get some snack or something, will that be the cause instead?

All these while the Mod here are encourage hamster owner to feed fresh veges and fruits to hamsters (at least this is what I learn here when I was a newbie), so we are trying out best to feed all these but we have limitation to give in variety as we hardly keep it long in out fridge, so someone who are good enough to think of a new way to help us out with the problem, blend and keep it frozen so that easy for people who have only 1 or few hamsters. After we feed, we did see our hamsters are growing well and healthy, no disorder noted so far. That's why we still continue on. If you say like carrot can not feed to non pure WW and RC (I thought we can feed in small amount with the info provided all these while), then maybe should advice the certain flavor which make the feeder uncomfortable is advice not to feed, but not SMOOTHIE can't feed cos indirectly saying is, FRESH food can not be fed to hamsters? So what are we suppose to feed them? Plain staple food? Then all the hamsters will be like my size. sweat.gif sweat.gif sweat.gif I do believe different people will have own preference of hamster size, not everybody like chubby hamster and say chubby hamster are obese, just because they never see one in their whole life but thin thin hamster around. So I think whoever think that fresh veges and fruit (in solid form or in smoothie form) is harmful or not good for your hamsters, then you can choose to stop feeding, but no need to be keep discourage other people who wanna feed it. (Just for example: I'm allergy to seafood, I can't go round and force and discourage other people that seafood is not good for health as they are unknown for allergy with prawns until proven). Same theory to all. I hope this will be stop right here as this is definitely upset someone who make this without earning profit but out of the pure heart to help and love for the animals. icon_rolleyes.gif

FYI: If home pet food maker need to consult vets or vet nutritionist, then we will need to pay very high price for the same thing we have here. As I know of other home pet food maker also do not have vet nutritionist consultation even for the snack and treats selling in the market. Maybe I can provide service as for human's nutrition. Hahaha... laugh.gif

This post has been edited by sangels: Aug 27 2008, 08:55 PM
mikelim2020
post Aug 27 2008, 08:56 PM

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this is posted on a website where ppl can consult vet for advise....
Title: Diabetes in Hamster
From: Jason Date: 14-Oct-2003 12:15:18 PM
Type: Answered Question
I have a 8 month old Roborowtski hamster. I would like to find out how can diabetes be noticed as i understand that it's a hereditary illness and i do not wish to breed him if that is the case. In addition, if he does have diabetes, what can i do? Thank you.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Answer
Dear Jason,

Thank you for your question.
It is true that diabetes may have an hereditary component. However, diabetes in hamsters is not a major concern. Signs of diabetes include: drinking and urinating more than usual, diminished activity, weakness, loss of appetite, etc. However, we should keep in mind that these signs can also occur with other conditions. If your hamster is showing any of those signs, I would strongly suggest that you bring him to a veterinarian.
In order to prevent obesity or any kind of digestive disturbances in hamsters, the best option is to feed them a good quality diet. Hamsters have a prominent forestomach and have a higher requirements for vitamins and minerals compared to rabbits and guinea pigs. Adult hamsters consume about 5-10g of food per day. They should be fed on fresh pellets and their diet supplemented with seeds, grains, fruits (banana, grape, kiwi, lychee, mango, melon, papaya, etc.) and green vegetables (broccoli, celery, cucumber, asparagus, etc) on a daily basis. Fresh and clean water should be available at all times.

Best regards,
Dr Joan de Carbonnieres
(BSc, BVMS)

http://www.petlovers.com.sg/VetOnline/ViewQnA.asp?id=78
hazzy
post Aug 27 2008, 09:10 PM

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QUOTE(Reanne @ Aug 27 2008, 06:37 PM)
Wah, hamster smoothie war. Everyone is entitled to their own opinion with anything, but the RC is genetically prone to diabetes and feeding any fruits or veggie high in sugar should be avoided. This includes carrots, apples, corn, mango, watermelon, etc.

Our stock of winter whites are also not 100% considered pure and many petshops/mills etc tend to mix RC and WWs together, so some wws may have campbell blood, which makes them more susceptible to diseases RCs are prone to, likewise vice versa. Puddings wws are a suspected product of mixed genes so they may be more susceptible to certain diseases or genetically prone to either species of RC or WW. I did have a pair of puddings and they were OBESE even though I didn't really feed them much sweet stuff other than their staple.

Hamsters from Malaysia aren't the same as from Singapore. Here the quality of the hamsters are not as good as from Singapore. We don't even see solid blacks or silver greys for syrians. Mostly cinnamons, some black eyed creams, goldens, red eyed creams, sables. Our Malaysian stock is profusely inbred and kept in poor conditions, so perhaps comparing keeping hamsters in Singapore to keeping in Malaysia may not be the best.
Like for example the dosage/amount of feeding fruits/veggies etc.

A reputable breeder who is also the chief judge for hamster shows in California which specializes in RCs did state that we should avoid feeding any fruits or veggie with is high in sugar to RCs. We're not saying it will succumb to diabetes, but this is stated to diminish the likelihood of the hamster getting diabetes.

Hamsters from US are different. They are heavy bodied, larger, basically bigger in terms of bone structure and body size. There they preserve their breeding lines and genetics well, here our stock is, as said before, inbred until they are almost half the size of US stock. So stating that it's ok for them to be bigger(horizontally), because hamsters in US are naturally bigger?

As a last note, I strongly advise caution with the use of 'Balanced' because nothing is really 100% balanced in terms nutrition. I'm curious to know, was a vet or nutritionist consulted during the creation of the product or was it all based on experience?
*
blink.gif really!!!!!???????
meaning everyone is selling the inbred Hamster,Gerbil,Fat-Tail Gerbil,Mouse & Mice in malaysia?
no wonder la my Pearl WW male that i bought from this LYN member are smaller than my WW sapphire, but the male that i bought is only 1 week younger than my female WW. meaning its inbred too?
bahahaha, lucky i fed my female with BALANCED diet, at seems to be more bigger (but no obese) than the male that i just bought sweat.gif sweat.gif


QUOTE(sangels @ Aug 27 2008, 08:45 PM)
Hmm... hmm.gif I do agreed with you that our stock of hamsters are mostly with poor quality but still a lot of people go round and buy. Even for some of the home breeder, they even sell hamster that have genetic disorder like flipping and claim that their hamster is healthy.  doh.gif  Then means whether feed or not doesn't matter since the disorder is contained in their gene. So if someone who feed and till the end the hamster is well and living healthy but on the other hand, someone who do not feed fresh and yet the hamster get diabetes or diseases? How can we know 100% where is the problem coming from? We can't judge 100% for their food intake (maybe only 80%?) cos the hamster also will get some snack or something, will that be the cause instead?

All these while the Mod here are encourage hamster owner to feed fresh veges and fruits to hamsters (at least this is what I learn here when I was a newbie), so we are trying out best to feed all these but we have limitation to give in variety as we hardly keep it long in out fridge, so someone who are good enough to think of a new way to help us out with the problem, blend and keep it frozen so that easy for people who have only 1 or few hamsters. After we feed, we did see our hamsters are growing well and healthy, no disorder noted so far. That's why we still continue on. If you say like carrot can not feed to non pure WW and RC (I thought we can feed in small amount with the info provided all these while), then maybe should advice the certain flavor which make the feeder uncomfortable is advice not to feed, but not SMOOTHIE can't feed cos indirectly saying is, FRESH food can not be fed to hamsters? So what are we suppose to feed them? Plain staple food? Then all the hamsters will be like my size. sweat.gif  sweat.gif  sweat.gif I do believe different people will have own preference of hamster size, not everybody like chubby hamster and say chubby hamster are obese, just because they never see one in their whole life but thin thin hamster around. So I think whoever think that fresh veges and fruit (in solid form or in smoothie form) is harmful or not good for your hamsters, then you can choose to stop feeding, but no need to be keep discourage other people who wanna feed it. (Just for example: I'm allergy to seafood, I can't go round and force and discourage other people that seafood is not good for health as they are unknown for allergy with prawns until proven). Same theory to all. I hope this will be stop right here as this is definitely upset someone who make this without earning profit but out of the pure heart to help and love for the animals.  icon_rolleyes.gif

FYI: If home pet food maker need to consult vets or vet nutritionist, then we will need to pay very high price for the same thing we have here. As I know of other home pet food maker also do not have vet nutritionist consultation even for the snack and treats selling in the market. Maybe I can provide service as for human's nutrition. Hahaha... laugh.gif
*
agreed!
if we cannot fed them with FRESH, then just feed them with staple? then we MALAYSIAN, keep on breeding the small size hamster larh laugh.gif
ahahah what a joke

sangels
post Aug 27 2008, 09:50 PM

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QUOTE(hazzy @ Aug 27 2008, 09:10 PM)
blink.gif  really!!!!!???????
meaning everyone is selling the inbred Hamster,Gerbil,Fat-Tail Gerbil,Mouse & Mice in malaysia?
no wonder la my Pearl WW male that i bought from this LYN member are smaller than my WW sapphire, but the male that i bought is only 1 week younger than my female WW. meaning its inbred too?
bahahaha, lucky i fed my female with BALANCED diet, at seems to be more bigger (but no obese) than the male that i just bought  sweat.gif  sweat.gif
agreed!
if we cannot fed them with FRESH, then just feed them with staple? then we MALAYSIAN, keep on breeding the small size hamster larh laugh.gif
ahahah what a joke
*
Err... I don't mean they are selling inbreed hamster, gerbil, fat tailed gerbil, mouse and mice la. If yes also I wouldn't know cos I do not see them breed mah. Can not put statement if no prove and without knowing.

LOL.... You are very funny! Hahahaha.... Do not blame the seller la, blame the gene.
hazzy
post Aug 27 2008, 09:59 PM

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QUOTE(sangels @ Aug 27 2008, 09:50 PM)
Err... I don't mean they are selling inbreed hamster, gerbil, fat tailed gerbil, mouse and mice la. If yes also I wouldn't know cos I do not see them breed mah. Can not put statement if no prove and without knowing.

LOL.... You are very funny! Hahahaha.... Do not blame the seller la, blame the gene.
*
laugh.gif sarcastic tongue.gif
laugh.gif just saying that my new WW is abit smaller in size, maybe due the lack nutrition icon_rolleyes.gif
d100200
post Aug 27 2008, 10:15 PM

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Long time didnt come in here and post.

Here are my babies...

Goldie - Because he is GOLD in color.


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Greenie - Because she looks GREEN in color. Like those light Gray proton car but looks like green color.

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This post has been edited by d100200: Aug 27 2008, 10:17 PM
UNDERGROUND
post Aug 27 2008, 10:16 PM

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My 1st hamster ran away on Tuesday sad.gif
Haven't seen her until now, bought a "replacement" today...

She probably went to Permatang Pauh for election doh.gif
Aeon_Clock
post Aug 27 2008, 10:17 PM

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my god...I think the big hamster is actually biting the smaller ones. When splitting them apart...the big one bit me...
iluv2zzz
post Aug 27 2008, 10:19 PM

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QUOTE(Aeon_Clock @ Aug 27 2008, 10:17 PM)
my god...I think the big hamster is actually biting the smaller ones. When splitting them apart...the big one bit me...
*
I find your explaination so cute.. the last part, the big one bite u... "why u take away the small one! now i bite u!!"

laugh.gif ROFL
CheeseBeT
post Aug 27 2008, 10:24 PM

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QUOTE(Aeon_Clock @ Aug 27 2008, 10:17 PM)
my god...I think the big hamster is actually biting the smaller ones. When splitting them apart...the big one bit me...
*

biggrin.gif yea...ur explanation more sounds like that...lol.. tongue.gif

RyoKenzaki
post Aug 27 2008, 10:26 PM

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QUOTE(Aeon_Clock @ Aug 27 2008, 10:17 PM)
my god...I think the big hamster is actually biting the smaller ones. When splitting them apart...the big one bit me...
*
.....
Seperate them asap...
YiaNBoY
post Aug 27 2008, 10:26 PM

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QUOTE(sangels @ Aug 27 2008, 01:10 AM)
oops.gif Don't mean to have war. Like I say, my English is not that fantastic and I'm just giving feed back on how I'll understand with your statement.  blush.gif Maybe you are too sensitive with our replies, thought that we are firing or flaming at you, but we are NOT.  icon_rolleyes.gif

As you said, those RC have diabetes in their genetics, so it'll be their genetic problem and not so much of the diet they take in. Maybe even they just take staple food also they'll get diabetes? Just like human.
*
QUOTE(jayniel @ Aug 27 2008, 01:33 AM)
i dont think that ALL RCs with diabetes in their line end up having diabetes.. there must be some factor to trigger it..

i do agree that breeding RCs are not easy.. one gotta choose those without genetic problems then only can breed.. that's y i've stopped breeding my RCs before ascertaining that they're free from genetic disorders.. but i have not tested for diabetes before.. all this while, i've only given fruits to my ww & robos, but not RCs, as there are just too many sites which are against RCs taking sugary foods.. Wikipedia specifically mentioned FRUITS..
therefore i hope this will make ppl stop & think (i'm referring to RC owners only, other hamsters no prob..)..

but dont be so against RCs lar.. once ppl start doing proper breeding, perhaps these problems wont be so significant anymore..
*
i think health problems r genetic..
bt when they r young, i think no harm 2 feed a small amount 4 them 2 grow..
bt older 1.. maybe shld avoid it o js take as treats..
anyway..
i decided 2 continue feed bt decrease da amount..


QUOTE(JyEn @ Aug 27 2008, 04:12 PM)
i ad separate them la... male doesnt care i feed him. but my female is kinda swing mood de
*
u sure she dun pregnant?
anyway.. giv her time..
i think js da matter of time..

TSnezumitaro
post Aug 27 2008, 10:42 PM

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wait ah ppl i will come n settle the problem.. let me feed my babies 1st..
jayniel
post Aug 27 2008, 10:52 PM

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QUOTE(hazzy @ Aug 27 2008, 09:59 PM)
laugh.gif sarcastic tongue.gif
laugh.gif just saying that my new WW is abit smaller in size, maybe due the lack nutrition  icon_rolleyes.gif
*
yo..
obviously u're talking bout me lar.. u do always seem to accuse without any proof.. the hamster u bought from me is inbred? what a joke! u think i only have few hamsters in stock till i have no choice but to inbreed them ar? have u seen an inbred hamster before? do u know how inbred hamsters look like? google before u comment.. and who is lack of nutrition? when u bought from me, how old was the hamster? 1 month old, or barely there.. u go around & look at petshops or other ppl's hamsters.. whose hamsters are big sized at 1 month old? i can guarantee u that my hamsters are bigger in size than those in petshops..

if u do not agree that malaysian hamsters are of poor quality, that's up to u.. just go walk around all the pet shops if u're so free, & observe the hamsters condition there.. and where do u think us breeders get our stock from? even if we chose the best hamster from the petshop, it is still of poorer quality than overseas..

btw, ur Ebony that u dump to me is similar in size with my adult hamsters.. obviously Ivory is way way older than ur new hamster, not just 1 week difference.. did u actually ask the petshop owner how old is the hamster? no right? u can only estimate her age, which is not precise.. if u're not satisfied with the hamster u bought from me, why buy?


Added on August 27, 2008, 11:16 pmwell in case ppl misunderstood the difference of fresh & fruits..
fresh veges i've no prob with that.. only fruits, and u guys should know why by now..

nezu, have u been accustomed to receiving compliments about ur smoothie, that u become agitated when u see 1 line of bad comment? we, the users, have no idea what are the proportions of ur so called BALANCED smoothie.. therefore, misunderstanding is easy to happen.. it would be good to list the fruits & veges used in the smoothie, not so that we can steal ur recipe (in case some ppl may think that way), but so that we know what we are feeding to the hamsters, not just based on hear-say..
u've repeatedly said that the smoothie wont make u earn money.. if that's so, why not just share ur recipe to others? instead u chose to not disclose it & continue selling..

about not feeding the smoothie to my hamsters, i dont think it's a must for me.. i have lots of hamsters and it would be unwise for me to spend on smoothie if i can make my own combination of fresh foods at a cheaper cost (cos no need to spend on tupperware & sticker labels).. also, i told u my problem regarding feeding the smoothie beforehand..

Reanne made an interesting point.. was a vet/nutritionist consulted?

This post has been edited by jayniel: Aug 27 2008, 11:16 PM
YiaNBoY
post Aug 27 2008, 11:16 PM

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i sense some oil here..............

take 3 of my ww as example on hw 2 estimate ww's age based on size..

sort by age..

1. greda, female :
pet shop told me she is 4 months old..
i keep 4 around 4 months..
medium

2. batman, male:
petshop told me is near 2 months..
i buy him on batman prime show...
so can conclude is 3 months
bt look like 1 month old...
- smallest

3. donald, male
son of greda..
1 month 1 day old.
bigger than his mum.. shakehead.gif
his siblings also almost same size..
js a bit smaller only

so how 2 estimate?
rclxub.gif rclxub.gif rclxub.gif rclxub.gif rclxub.gif
unknownhammie
post Aug 27 2008, 11:17 PM

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QUOTE(jayniel @ Aug 27 2008, 10:52 PM)
yo..
obviously u're talking bout me lar.. u do always seem to accuse without any proof.. the hamster u bought from me is inbred? what a joke! u think i only have few hamsters in stock till i have no choice but to inbreed them ar? have u seen an inbred hamster before? do u know how inbred hamsters look like? google before u comment.. and who is lack of nutrition? when u bought from me, how old was the hamster? 1 month old, or barely there.. u go around & look at petshops or other ppl's hamsters.. whose hamsters are big sized at 1 month old? i can guarantee u that my hamsters are bigger in size than those in petshops..

if u do not agree that malaysian hamsters are of poor quality, that's up to u.. just go walk around all the pet shops if u're so free, & observe the hamsters condition there.. and where do u think us breeders get our stock from? even if we chose the best hamster from the petshop, it is still of poorer quality than overseas..

btw, ur Ebony that u dump to me is similar in size with my adult hamsters.. obviously Ivory is way way older than ur new hamster, not just 1 week difference.. did u actually ask the petshop owner how old is the hamster? no right? u can only estimate her age, which is not precise.. if u're not satisfied with the hamster u bought from me, why buy?


Added on August 27, 2008, 11:16 pmwell in case ppl misunderstood the difference of fresh & fruits..
fresh veges i've no prob with that.. only fruits, and u guys should know why by now..

nezu, have u been accustomed to receiving compliments about ur smoothie, that u become agitated when u see 1 line of bad comment? we, the users, have no idea what are the proportions of ur so called BALANCED smoothie.. therefore, misunderstanding is easy to happen.. it would be good to list the fruits & veges used in the smoothie, not so that we can steal ur recipe (in case some ppl may think that way), but so that we know what we are feeding to the hamsters, not just based on hear-say..
u've repeatedly said that the smoothie wont make u earn money.. if that's so, why not just share ur recipe to others? instead u chose to not disclose it & continue selling..

about not feeding the smoothie to my hamsters, i dont think it's a must for me.. i have lots of hamsters and it would be unwise for me to spend on smoothie if i can make my own combination of fresh foods at a cheaper cost (cos no need to spend on tupperware & sticker labels).. also, i told u my problem regarding feeding the smoothie beforehand..

Reanne made an interesting point.. was a vet/nutritionist consulted?
*
You still got a lot of WW?

jayniel
post Aug 27 2008, 11:21 PM

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QUOTE(YiaNBoY @ Aug 27 2008, 11:16 PM)
i sense some oil here..............

take 3 of my ww as example on hw 2 estimate ww's age based on size..

sort by age..

1. greda, female :
pet shop told me she is 4 months old..
i keep 4 around 4 months..
medium

2. batman, male:
petshop told me is near 2 months..
i buy him on batman prime show...
so can conclude is 3 months
bt look like 1 month old...
- smallest

3. donald, male
son of greda..
1 month  1 day old.
bigger than his mum..  shakehead.gif
his siblings also almost same size..
js a bit smaller only

so how 2 estimate?
rclxub.gif  rclxub.gif  rclxub.gif  rclxub.gif  rclxub.gif
*
genetics do play a role.. if the parents are bigger in sized, there's a high chance that the offspring will be bigger in size compared to others..

QUOTE(unknownhammie @ Aug 27 2008, 11:17 PM)
You still got a lot of WW?
*
ww & rc & robos.. i can easily finish feeding them with spinach in 3 days, in addition to other foods..
YiaNBoY
post Aug 27 2008, 11:27 PM

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QUOTE(jayniel @ Aug 27 2008, 11:21 PM)
genetics do play a role.. if the parents are bigger in sized, there's a high chance that the offspring will be bigger in size compared to others..
ww & rc & robos.. i can easily finish feeding them with spinach in 3 days, in addition to other foods..
*
nt really...
food do play a part too..
donald's dad nt tat big too...
only slightly bigger than his mum..
bt all children r big size

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