i simply LOL at this kinda remarks.
u mean we can't get better management and organization?

heck, i've been playing MTG for i dunno how many years. the management of events (be it a simple qualifiers, prerelease, a Grand Prix or even a friggin PRO TOUR) is amazing. they dun need govt money or much support. and i know the singaporeans are jealous with us because Malaysia has been chosen as a stop for Pro Tour over them. in case you dunno, Pro Tour is an event where most superstar players come and play for the chance to win up to USD250000 in cash and prizes.

you guys should see the Pro Player's lounge they got in KLCC during the tournament. simply amazing.

if they can do it. why not in2?
MTG is a world class too..

i've been working in event's company for a few years before. i know it's hard. but all it takes is proper planning and execution. no bullshit. it's Event Management 101!!!

oh, in case you are wondering what kinda events i used to work on.. try Le Tour De Langkawi for 1999 - 2001 series, all event stops thru out malaysia including the road shows and the finale concert. that's how big the event i used to do.

there's a saying in event's management world, "if you can't do a good event, better dun do". that's what i'm saying to In2.

they are neglecting the core and key elements of the event, which is the gamers. it's sad to see there's not even a water dispenser for the players to take a drink from. not even a proper player's area. simply bad.

how to grow the community then?

This post has been edited by technophile: Aug 18 2008, 06:49 PM

LOL. another brainless comment.
what's the difference then?

both require event management, both require sponsors, both are at a scale of grandeur.

simply put, PC gamers in malaysia are being treated like shit. like we are not important.

and MTG is not just a card game tournament, go to one and see for yourself.

as a competitor, i have my rights and needs.
it's a matter of respect. if the organizer do not respect the ppl who make the events work, then simply dun do that event.
asking for respect back from ppl who have been treated unfairly sounds so... Malaysian rite?

i call ppl brainless because they seem not to think before they speak.
at what basis he claim that e-sports is different from card tourney and le tour?

kindly state the basis of the claims, prove and facts. then i will not call it brainless.
dun just pluck something out of thin air.

in malaysia maybe not.
in South Korea and US, professional gamer can make a living from gaming.

hmm.. 2 malaysians have finished 4th in MTG World's before.

one player (Terry Soh) also got a card printed with his face on it.

it's the corporate sponsors i tell you. they see gamers as nothing. frankly speaking malaysians have been doin well abroad when it comes to gaming. be it a card game or e-sports.

it's the public mentality too la.

flip open a NDSL inside the lrt, you will see some office chicks giving you the snickers. stupid..

yeah, and i dun get the whole thing happening on fridays man. first no respect for Muslim that's goin to prayers. then it's the school kids ponteng sekolah.

my bro had to skip school to get his tag. aiyo.

can't they have a special counter on saturday whole day for ppl to get their tags from? it's mind boggling u know.

it is WOTC but thru some ppl (i.e micheal toh, you can find him in MTG section of LYN forum) and other local tournament organizers.

those ppl no need to work in events company as WOTC gave them a specific metrics to be followed and so far, it has been working tremendously.

so does this mean that WCG in whole didn't have any metrics that the local organizers can follow?
or simply the organizers dun wanna follow.

and are you saying that malaysian govt and sponsors give a damn about MTG tournaments?
without WOTC, i dun think we can live.

so you see, it goes back to the main sponsors and the company who is the main corporate sponsor.

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Added on August 19, 2008, 3:41 pmi wasn't angry. just stating the facts. read properly pls.

ok la. maybe it's my bad to compare WCG with MTG, but the thing is, for MTG, you can pre-register yourself and not have to force ourself to collect tags what so ever in order to play. the system is flawless whereby only the player is allowed in the playing field. spectators have their section to watch the games being played. maybe because registration is free (i'm not sure about this) for WCG, ppl can just ffk anytime they want and end up taking space for ppl who really wants to play. in MTG, registration requires money and if you ffk, there's no refund.

i dun have any qualms on having tourney running thru out the week. heck, that's how MTG invitationals and Worlds are being organized. but the thing is, like i say during friday, pls have some respect for muslim and give them leeway to perform their duties.

during the big MTG tourneys (except worlds and invitational), fridays are reserved for last chance qualifiers (that starts around 5pm and goes well into 11pm) and side events. the main events are played whole day saturday and sunday.

once again, i'm not angry. all i'm saying is try to take a look at how other sports (card game etc alike) are doin their events. there's a lot of room to improve on malaysian WCG. and with proper planning and promotion (to the mass media pls!), ppl will know that these things exist and will soon expand the scene here in malaysia.

This post has been edited by technophile: Aug 19 2008, 03:41 PM

another good point.

to me, WCG should be a haven for gamers and enthusiast plus ppl who are interested to start gaming (there's a lot of these kinda ppl, who thinks that gaming is for kids and just a waste of time and money).

therefore, my suggestion should be, have exhibition of upcoming games from the developers. if the developers dun support you first time, nevermind, just download upcoming game's demos and have booths and booths so that ppl can try. document the ppl's response towards the idea, then send it to the publishers and distributors. while you are at it, try to educate the crowd on why the games and softwares are expensive and how ppl should not resort to piracy. i bet my RM100 that out of 10 random non gaming ppl out there in malaysia, nobody knows why they are expensive and why software piracy is bad. i think that should be your responsibility to the public and the general masses.

trust me, these big companies will want to jaga their faces and for the next year, knowing that you guys can pull a lot of crowd, they will happily supply you guys with the demos and setups for display.

it's common sense. sometimes in dealing with BIG companies, you gotta prove to them that you are capable of doin it before they can jump in.

that's how malaysia was chosen to become the stop for Pro Tour over singapore, phillipines and thailand. our community here is strong, we got 2 top 4 finishers in Worlds (Sim Han How and Terry Soh), a malaysian has won the Invitationals (Terry Soh), and our purchasing power is quite good too.

we've showed WOTC that malaysia has the potential ourself. then only WOTC came and decide that malaysia is a good place as a FIRST EVER STOP for south east asia for Pro Tour.

stop blaming gamers when it comes to support and success. the first line of fire is you guys, the organizers. if you want these event to gain acceptance, please the current crowd first. they in return will do the marketing for you. from all the comments i see here, they are not asking for a golden mountain to be handed to them, but a little more respect as gamers and competitors.

pamper them as they are your asset. without them, even the biggest company in the world's money (READ: GOOGLE) can't save your event if the participants are not happy. entice them.

all i see and heard, from my limited judgment, it seems that you guys are doin this event "just for the sake of having it" and not try to contribute to the public and the society as a whole. what good is participation of MDEC if the knowledge is not there to be shared with other ppl?

anyway, to say that we as gamers are asking for a lot, that's too much. we are the driving force of the industry, we bought the games, we bought the hardware, we committed time to train and become better.

that's why any sportsman in other foreign countries can earn a living from just playing. because ppl recognizes their commitment and their role in the industry.

lastly, i would like to stress again, that it's no point in doin major, world class events if you can't keep the participants happy and content. that is what i'm trying to point since my first post in this thread.

p/s: i am not pointing fingers, it's just a point of view of a person who loves the gaming industry and would love to see the gaming industry bloom in malaysia. it's really frustrating to see that the event was poorly done given the duration of time it was planned and implemented. like i said a few times already, if In2 do not know how to organize a proper gaming event, then let some other company with much enthusiasm do it. that company might not have the financial resources, but they sure love gaming and know how to jaga hati gamers. i think the case of In2 is mostly they do not know what the gamers want, and see the expanded view of the event (after event awareness to the public, etc) and how it would help sponsors generate their sales. again i'm sorry if i sounded really harsh. i'm just frustrated to see ppl who are doin this is doin it without soul and heart. it destroys the passion.

This post has been edited by technophile: Aug 20 2008, 02:04 AM

1. we know that the game is hyped up so much that any prick of the pin would just blow it out of proportion. it was one of konami's best kept secret. i should rephrase the demo part. it's "demos and trailers". so for games like MGS4 and other big games, just play the publicly released trailer. trust me they are many ppl who do not know anything about the game here in malaysia (except gamers).

2. this is what i call an initiative. sometimes this separates between "doin a job" and a "job well done". i'm sure it will tax the organizers, but they should know how to work around their budget and their limitation.

3. i dun think big companies are that cheapskate. considering that they are earning BILLIONS per year. journalist will take pictures of the event, and they will see how you did it. trust me, it took one big company to jump ship, then the rest will jump. again i'm using my Le Tour experience as my case. a big company, let's call it Company A (i can't name names) decided to advertise with us for the event and sponsor quite a few things. when COMPANY B found out about this, they want to jump ship too, sensing the competition and exposure they will not get if they dun put their ads. it's one of the most basic business strategy. once again, if you do it right, THEY WILL OPEN their eyes seeing the potential of revenue coming from that.

that's why i'm suggesting that the organizer have an "public education" module to educate the public. the way i see it, this piracy problem is preventable with proper education, not enforcement from BSA.

like i said, most general public fail to see why the games are expensive in the first place. if organizers can slot in an education booth, would that be a good image to the ppl from outside of malaysia? it will surely give good face to MDEC too.

tell the public about the development cycle of a game, about the ppl involved into making it, everyone from the modelers to the director. it's a huge business.

a huge business that's generating billions per year. i'm sure malaysia have the market for these games. therefore a revenue for the companies. again this goes back to the company itself.

and i'm again using WOTC as an example. when Magic just started, not many ppl know about the game in malaysia. but how did they managed to sow a strong field here? by participating actively and promoting it.

in US, EA is actively doin it's Madden Bus Tournament. where they go to city after city to find the best Madden players and in the end crown the National Champion. that's how they should do it.

if WCG can be promoted properly and gain acceptance from general public in term of awareness and attendance, i dun think any company would not want to invest their resources here. there's a saying in business, "any market is a good market". thing is, they need to know if there's market here or not.

yes you may say that promotion is not cheap. but it's a price to pay for future gain, that's what i say.

if none of the guys in In2 are passionate about gaming and know about being a gamer, i'm offering my services as a consultant. i'm charging quite cheap!

i'm still waiting for your explaination and comments that you've promised yesterday.

well i seek out business opportunities


any business is good business.

guys, quick question.

just want to know why WCG didn't use Counter Strike:Source but still using 1.6?

i thought Source is the better version?

well that's too bad then. because i think Source is the better version out there with better physics and graphics.

guess WCG dun want to evolve eh?

and what do you mean by that?

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Added on August 21, 2008, 5:19 ami was about to make another reference to the card game world in this.. but nahhh..

This post has been edited by technophile: Aug 21 2008, 05:19 AM

hats off to you mate!

i agree in what you said. stop blame the gamers if the event is not enticing. take initiative to plant seeds of interest in new players. ppl who haven't picked up this hobby needs to know the potential of the event and the possible outcome.

again, i'm in no position to comment about the marshalls, but to me, if someone were to judge an event, he/she must have a VERY DEEP understanding of the game, the rules, even the tiny bits that can jeopardize the game.

i know again, it's bad for me to compare this with MTG, but from what i see and heard, PC gaming needs a universal governing body to make sure all the rules are standardized and laws are being followed.

not only MTG has this, but i think all the games and sports have it. it's iffy that PC gaming doesn't have a set of standard rules that need to be followed.

on top of my head is : standard PC configurations, standard mouse and keyboard (reason : players who cannot afford Razer (or other gaming mouse) has disadvantages over ppl who has it), standard LCD monitor (response time, Gamma settings), and standard version of the game (this is the most basic).

seeing one tourney go for CSS and one tourney go for CS 1.6 is just bad. shows to the world that the PC gaming world is not serious.

This post has been edited by technophile: Aug 22 2008, 12:48 AM

have official equipment standards. like football you have a certain size of ball with certain size of weight for official tournaments. like badminton your racket must not be lighter than a certain weight.

things like that.
that's what i mean when i say standard equipments.

without standardization, the sport has no prestige and therefore, normal ppl will look at it with one eye.

again like i said, it's damn hard since PC gaming world has no unified governing body like FIFA, BAM etc.

MTG got DCI. warhammer 40K got their codexs. DnD got their rulebooks.

a unified standard is a must for a sport/game to be accepted at a universal stage.

This post has been edited by technophile: Aug 22 2008, 02:34 AM

that's why i said it's kinda bad. there's no standard equipments for the game.

imagine for 100m dash the runners can choose any equipments they want. i'm sure one random dude will come up with a anti matter spike shoes that somehow defy's the rule of gravity that provides him less body weight to push.

by having standard and official set of equipments, advantages can be eliminated thus making the field equal so that everyone has an equal chance to win.

i tried to be competitive, but the lack of standardization hinders me from goin further. thus i just stayed in the console realm. now i'm trying to be competitive again for COD4 since i love the game so much. it's something different from CS.

to have a standard rules for console game's competition is easy. because all console is built the same.

i agree on the equipment's level of comfort arguments you guys have brought up. but like i said, there must be a standard on it's shape, weight, keys (for keyboard), etc while not giving any advantage such as auto fire or anything.

having an official brand for those things (i dunno.. logitech maybe?) will be a good thing. similar to the tyre manufacturer for F1. while i dun agree that now only one company having the monopoly, the rules they they've used before this year is good.

if gamers and organizations have complaint about it. then like i say, no one in this world will take this sport seriously as the standard from one tournament changes to one another.

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Added on August 22, 2008, 2:44 pmbro, what i meant about "standard equipments" is not a same equipment to be used from one person to another. but rules about that certain piece of equipment regarding it's size, weight, DPI's (for mouse), keys (for keyboard), etc.

football's boots have a certain weight they must not go lower for. they have a certain rules about the front part of the boot. and the ball have certain sizes that can be used. the ball also must be around the allowed weight area before it can be used.

not standard by saying they must use the same thing thru out the world. but the "standard" must be there.

This post has been edited by technophile: Aug 22 2008, 02:44 PM