I vote a resounding no. What I want to do is to identify the numerous and gaping flaws in Septic Bladder`s latest harebrained scheme, the 6+5 rule. Bladder is globally renowned as a self interested moron. George Orwell once wrote that 'political language is designed to make lies sound true; murder sound respectful and give an appearance of solidarity to pure wind.` But Bladder doesn`t even attempt to cover his motives. He contends that having an all English final in this year`s Champions League is damaging. Strangely, he didn`t find 2003s all Italian Final a problem, nor 2001s all Spanish final. Well, simple suggestion Sepp, let`s go back to having one team per country competing Europe`s premier competition. Make the Champions League for Champions again. Problem solved. Of course, having the likes of Barcelona, Chelsea, Arsenal and Juventus excluded from next year`s competition would harm your profit margins, but hey, you`ve got the interests of football at your heart here haven`t you? Oh I see, its international football that also concerns you so deeply. (Another of your money spinning cash cows to be milked). Maybe if you didn`t insist on packing out the international calendar with so many useless (but money spinning) friendlies, players would actually get their desire for representing their country back and actually play like they give a toss. If you could unwrap your sweaty palms from around the udders for a second, you might see a generation of footballers who retire early from international football, under perform in tournaments due to burn out.

Still I don`t see how the 6+5 ruling will benefit international teams. Sure, more homegrown players will get a chance, but if they`re not good enough to break into their teams without this institutionally prejudice golden handshake, aren`t we just packing teams with average or below par players at the expense of quality? Brilliant, international managers will have more crap players to choose from. How does this enhance the quality of your product Mr. Bladder? What it does do is denigrate the quality of domestic competition greatly, to the point that people will not continue to line your pockets by paying extortionate sums to watch mediocre football. This 'throw s**t at a wall and see how much sticks` policy simply cannot work. It will not even the playing field with regards to domestic competition either, if anything it will widen the gap. If this ruling goes through, then Chelsea, ourselves, United and Liverpool will simply buy up the Youngs, Agbonlohors and Richards` of this world and stockpile them. With the price of indigenous players massively inflated, these clubs will not be able to afford even the most average replacements. So the quality of the overall league goes down and the megabucks "big four" widen the chasm.

Let me posit a scenario for you. Let us say this ruling was in in 2003. Arsène Wenger has to tell Cesc Fabregas, "you`re an excellent player, but I cannot play you. So Steve Sidwell will play and I will sell you back to Barcelona." Right, so Sidwell gets handed a place in the team, he enjoys an unmerited run and gets picked for England. Excellent. England play Spain, where Steve Sidwell comes up against Cesc Fabregas in the centre of midfield. Now, at some point, for the national side to prosper, Steve Sidwell has to outshine Fabregas and England have to overcome their foreign counterparts. How does the 6+5 rule help? Eventually, Fabregas` superior ability will supersede Sidwell`s and the whole exercise will have been a waste of time. By handing them guaranteed places in the starting line up, without the player having to work remotely hard or compete, where is the incentive for Sidwell to improve and make strides as a player. If I knew that, upon leaving school, I would be guaranteed a cushy job irregardless of my qualifications or ability, I would not bother going to get a degree or even try and build up my CV.

Football is the one of the only truly Capitalist institutions that exists, insofar as I understand the word 'Capitalism.` Sport is not politics. A person`s success in football is based entirely on ability and work ethic. Creed, colour, nationality and even social class (one doesn't have to be affluent to obtain a round ball and a couple of makeshift goalposts) do not inform somebody`s ability to be a successful and prosperous footballer. Best man succeeds, best team wins. Chelsea and United got tot his year`s Champions` League final because they knocked out every other team that stood in their way. Therefore, they deserved to be there.

In my honest opinion, it is utterly rubbish and I don't see how anyone could support such discriminative laws!

This post has been edited by disco333: Jul 4 2008, 03:25 PM

It depends on how you see it.If you are fonding of good and beautiful football in BPL, of course this rule is mere bullshit.But if you happen to be England fans and hope that they wont lose like get knocked out like this Euro, of course, you did fancy this rules.It all up to individual.

you cannot implement it directly at 6+5 right after its agreed
it must be done by phases

year 1 : compulsary 2
year 2 : compulsary 3
year 3 : compulsary 4
and so on

the benefit of this rule is that there will be youth development like that of france where their youngsters are churned out like factory products

They plan on giving team at least two years to prepare if it is ever passed but still I don't see it benefiting International sides

Fifa 'six-plus-five' rule, 6+5 ??? what is that? explain it plz

english & foreign players?

This post has been edited by Calvin871989: Jul 4 2008, 04:28 PM

errr...i vote yes....based on my view...tis is to limit the exploits of many big clubs on talented foreign players.....yes its unfair to put up such a rule but then credit to those clubs who really did use up their national players and has established a strong squad....most noticeably Man Utd....well i am not a fan of theirs but yeah credit to them.....they haf a strong squad mostly consisting on english players....wel if i am not mistaken , tis rules implies to all leagues in the world...so overall its fair....the rule as well can cultivate more competition between nations as their players are thoroughly trained week in and week out in domestic competitions.....

They will degrade BPL with tht system. Besides tht, the economy in football will be affected. Smaller club will find it harder to expand due to lower interest in their homegrown players. on the other extreme, club will b forced to pay extremely silly money to get a local like BPL experiencing now.

Generally, football will be affected.

affected it will but without tis quota , many rich football clubs will continue to rule over the transfer market without limit...so its a nice step ahead to prevent tat from happening....its quite unfair too for poorer clubs wudn u say?? (poorer clubs more interested in homegrown players from youth system)

This post has been edited by shenshenshen: Jul 4 2008, 04:49 PM

disco is an Arsenal fan...they'll be in deep shit if this ruling is applied next season..haha..no other reason on why he voted "no"

lol yeah his an arsenal fan.

disco yeah his rite

if arsenal dont do anything soon then arsenal will be in some really deep shit trouble.

better do it now before fifa try and change this in some season's to come.

good luck...

I support the above, but enforce this ruling at UEFA games only; this will be fair to all teams weather they want to concentrate on their own league or Champions League.

rubbish policies. This will make Euro league less attractive.

well, if all 20 teams in EPL using foreign players...including the subs and reserves
who will Capello gonna pick in the future? those playing 1 division below EPL?

that rule is pretty good actually.. for english themselves
ur example in 1st post is not good enough, coz sidwell isnt even in front of carrick and barry in the pecking order
more english players actually helps the their growth as a player.. u need to play at the highest level to reach ur highest peak

i agree but it needs to be implemented slowly.. maybe after 5 or 6 years

This post has been edited by MADReaLJL: Jul 4 2008, 07:10 PM

i voted no.
if one country cannot produce their own good player tht can compete with foreign players,
thats their problem.
this is fair competition.Football will be less attractive with this kind of system.
we as malaysians,knows well wats the negative impact implementing a quato system to field.

I Vote Yes

dont worry, Arsenal sure have lots of homegrown youth waiting. (quality superior)
Arsenal wont have any problem. Unless, suddenly the rule is implemented tomorrow.
chill~

It should not be implemented immediately but there should be some sort of regulations to prevent clubs from just buying successes.

It has to be introduced gradually so that good English players prices are not inflated exponentially and there is time for clubs to get their youth development in place. And instead of spending massive amount of time out of the country, scouts can now concentrate on weeding out the hidden talents that are probably there in the country.

The 6+5 rule is not utterly rubbish if implemented correctly.

The 6+5 rule proposed by FIFA



Based on that explanation, FIFA is actually urging major clubs to look for talents within their country, rather than spending money to send scouts for talent searching as far as Argentina and South Africa. FIFA proposed regulations still don't restrict clubs' freedom to look for talent within the country, as the regulation said those six players are not necessarily homegrown players. Furthermore, FIFA said clubs are still allowed to import players as many as they want, because the rule only restrict the number of foreigners on the field in each match.

So, regarding on TS example, it is not necessarily be Steve Sidwell, Arsenal is still allowed to look for talents like Gareth Garry, or Paul Scholes, or Jermaine Jenas. So, clubs like Arsenal should not be worried about the rule. They still have one of the best scouting team to look for the best english potential talents. I think TS has misunderstood about the rule here.

Of course Arsene Wenger is worried. He likes to look for French talents. But for Arsenal, nothing needs to be worried about.

And yes, this rule may help grooming talent. The idea is to reduce the number of foreign players in a league and local players may have more chance to play at the top level. Right now, even not-traditionally-powerhouse clubs have many foreigners. Just look at Manchester City and Villareal (La Liga). Now that is a problem, isn't it?

That has happened before, right? McLaren was forced to pick Robert Green while playing for Norwich City after they were relegated from BPL. Am I right?

I have nothing to say against the rule.

Are you sure?The summer transfer window will be less attractive. But that can't be said in terms of league competitiveness.

for my own opinion i would say no to this new rule..
yes i think it would help england national team but it would not help so much..
they should try give their players the chance to go and play at league out of britain..
this would help them much better as this will give their players the chance to play abroad and give time experiance..
i think for current england squad, beckham is the only player that play outside britain..
with this new rule..
the beautiful game of BPL..
it would change the game a lot..
now the price of enlish player is already consider high as said by wenger the reason he didnt buy english player.. with this new rule i can see that the price of the english players will increase..

Even those not established like Ramsey cost 5m, i wonder how much will the better players cost.
and every team will all out to hunt for the best english players.

Agree with you.
Man Utd will rulez with that rule being implemented.

stupid rule. if you are good enough, you will make it doesn't matter anywhere you play. babysitting them by removing the competition i.e. forcing the club to play x number of local players just will make them worse

anyhow, i thought the proposed rule was against EU rules or something and had been rejected

As i mentioned in my earlier post, FIFA already has answered to this. They say clubs are still allowed to buy imported player as many as they want as EU rules allows all employees in EU region to choose their work place wherever they want within EU countries. But FIFA will allow not more than 5 of them foreigners to play on the pitch. Well, they really have the right to handle what happen on a football pitch, right? Moreover, Platini also is a strong supporter.

thanks bro for the info

however, as i mentioned before it's a stupid proposal. will not serve the purpose whatsoever

dont think that manu will rulez..
with the new rulez i cant see any of top 4 will rulez unless they buy youngsters from somewhere else..
clubs that produce a lot of english youngster will rulez..
the clubs like man city..

Why not?By itself,Man Utd can field 6 regulars already whereas other teams can't. I wouldn't say they would rule for sure but they definitely has a decent advantage

As for the topic, i agree that this is a stupid rule as well. Period

i voted for no...
BPL will suffer if this rule implement coz alot of 'star n quality' player will leave...
btw, forign player will not have the opportunity to shine n prove to the world without a competitive league n matches each week...

Won't happen. The EU prides itself in it's fairly un-discriminatory labor law. Putting a quota on the amount of foreign talent will cause the quality of the English Premier League to drop severely and I don't see how giving more opportunities to the English players will help the national side. Most if not all of the England players are first teamers for their clubs anyways, and having great players from abroad plying their trade alongside them will help them in their development and knowledge of the game.

Agree with ya. Voted No. IMO, its the way the english media treats the players and managers and the pressure they receive. True, they want the national team to do well. But it affects the mindset of the english players as well. For example, who's gonna screw up this time and take all the heat from the press? Judging from the past, its been Steve Mclaren most recently, beckham in '98, phil neville in '00 and david seaman in '02. This shows that half the time, the english players are afraid of making mistakes because they know they'll be screwed inside out by the english press. They won't be free to express themselves on the pitch as well in fear of making a mistake. In short, this rule will hardly give more opportunities to the English players, and i really don't think it'll help the national side either. Not to mention the increase in the prices for english footballers.

To those who seem to think that United won't be affected please explain how? The rule will be implemented in 2012/2013 at the earliest in which time Rio, Carrick, Hargreaves and Brown will all be in their 30's. That would mean that United would have to spend more on replacements as well as compromise on the ability of that particular individual.

Like I said in my first post, there is reason why English players don't get t play, it's because they are not good enough. Why should you be picked based on nationality, isn't that discrimination. If the rule was implemented, the quality of football will severely decrease. Sidwell is just one example, they are many young English players out there competing for places. If player A being English was competing against player B who is foreign, wouldn't player A just say f*** it I am already guaranteed a place. This would cause him to put in less effort thus making him a poorer player, competition makes you stronger. If you are competing with players who are better than you don't you think you will raise your game.

This has nothing to do with Arsenal or whatever of the sort, please read the first post before posting nonesnse

Still Have Few Years To Go..

The New Rules Won't Affected Any Team..

All The Clubs Still Can Survive

http://www.arsenal.vitalfootball.co.uk/article.asp?a=507314

If anything Arsenal are the best prepared so any such scenario. In England's U21's,19's,18's,17's and 16's, Arsenal have more representatives than any other club.

you talk bout you last post before you posted this post was that it has nothing to do with arsenal but now you're the man who is talking bout arsenal. lol

A number of idiots have said that Arsenal will be affected more than any other club. So I am just disproving it, Arsenal will be fine and now back on topic if you don't mind.

oh ok sorry then... plz sir go on continuing your topic of fifa six plus five rule

ill leave now in peace

OUT!

but as long as the 6+5 rule doesn't implement, those youth can hardly get first team action except they are like a.cole ...

who still can play week in week out for mu by that time?


stronger stay, that's all

Ask the MU fans.
Once they think abt this 6+5 thingy, first thing comes in their mind is Arsenal in deep sh*t. lol

True and that's the way it should be. Cole was made it because he was good enough not because he was English. If any of the current lads in the academy are good enough, they will be given an equal bite at the cherry as any one else. The rule would prevent such competition and base selection on nationality not ability.

Rooney,Carrick,Ferdinand,Foster sure can.

I wouldn't say they are in deep sh*t but the fact is there will be some disadvantages to them.

Rio will be around 34 or 35, Carrick and Hargreaves will be 32 or 33, Brown will be 33 or 34 and Scholes would have retired so that leaves Rooney and Foster as starters as the rest can't play every game as they are aging.

tat time is showtime for Walcott and the rest...

wenger bought sol campbell,who is english,when he was around 26-27.wenger thinks that campbell was great and he became one of the key member of the invincibles.this proves that great player will be in the first team regardless of his nationality.

In theory, it looks like it will help national teams and even out local leagues, but in practice, I don't think it will happen.

Remember when the (then) M-League decided to have quotas and bans on foreign players because it was "degrading" our national team? I didn't see improvement at all. Sure, more players got to play on the first team, but as for affecting the national team, it didn't make much difference.

Like I've said if you wanna keep EPL entertaining, don't enforce it in the domestic league & cup ties. Maybe you can win the league back home but cannot even go beyond KO stage in Champions League. Or another example the whole field playing a UK home game & all 11 players don't even know what the home crowd is shouting about as none speak a word of English incl the coach, of course this is for the sake of quality football for the paying spectator. The same goes to our local league where there were some foreign imports to spice up the game here & it really increase crowd attendance due to the extra quality in games, but when they took them away the crown also stayed away; not to mention also the illlegal -betting $$

IMO, the whole thing is to cover the failure for England that did make it to Euro2008. They blame lack of quality players in the squad. When u have Gerrard, Rooney or Ferdinand, i don't think that's lack of quality players. All I blame is on the manager.

There's something wrong with the English player themselves. First, majority English players can't play abroad. They're stuck with playing for English club & if they play for other country's club, they'll suffer. I'm not saying all of them, but most of them. Secondly, English players are damn overpriced! Carrick for 14m pounds, Bent for 16m pounds, Ferdinand for 32m pounds, Wright-phillips for 24m pounds & recently, Barry for 15m pounds? There's this saying if Barry was Swedish or Danish, he'll worth around 2m or 3m pound, max.

Thirdly, English players do not have the qualities as they used to have. Players such as Shearer, Wright, Smith or Liverpool's Macca have long gone. There's still qualities English player around but only a handful. Even Carsson is a 'reject' in Aston Villa.

If the 6+5 rules implement, it will not only effect Arsenal, but all the other English teams, for sure. So i voted a no & Blatter, leave my game alone.

IMO, I personally think that it is good for the International side..but for the club like and us and Arsenal it will bring them a very big impact..

in my opinion, whoever is good, he gets to play..
implementing this rule will not directly upgrade the quality of the players... but may just spoil them...

of course Man United gonna to sign more english young players when those players getting older each year

---

Added on August 2, 2008, 7:43 pmbut football is not 1 man game

This post has been edited by clsiluf: Aug 2 2008, 07:43 PM