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 Will Malaysian Broadband ISPs charge by byte soon?, What would you feel about this?

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TSeclectice
post Jun 16 2008, 01:35 AM, updated 18y ago

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What if Malaysian broadband ISPs start to charge by bytes you use (sort of Internet metering like a water meter) to follow suit with U.S.A broadband ISP counterparts?

QUOTE
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/06/15/technolo...2783&ei=5087%0A

Charging by the Byte to Curb Internet Traffic

By BRIAN STELTER
Published: June 15, 2008

Some people use the Internet simply to check e-mail and look up phone numbers. Others are online all day, downloading big video and music files.

For years, both kinds of Web surfers have paid the same price for access. But now three of the country’s largest Internet service providers are threatening to clamp down on their most active subscribers by placing monthly limits on their online activity.

One of them, Time Warner Cable, began a trial of “Internet metering” in one Texas city early this month, asking customers to select a monthly plan and pay surcharges when they exceed their bandwidth limit. The idea is that people who use the network more heavily should pay more, the way they do for water, electricity, or, in many cases, cellphone minutes.

That same week, Comcast said that it would expand on a strategy it uses to manage Internet traffic: slowing down the connections of the heaviest users, so-called bandwidth hogs, at peak times.

AT&T also said Thursday that limits on heavy use were inevitable and that it was considering pricing based on data volume. “Based on current trends, total bandwidth in the AT&T network will increase by four times over the next three years,” the company said in a statement.

All three companies say that placing caps on broadband use will ensure fair access for all users.

Internet metering is a throwback to the days of dial-up service, but at a time when video and interactive games are becoming popular, the experiments could have huge implications for the future of the Web.

Millions of people are moving online to watch movies and television shows, play multiplayer video games and talk over videoconference with family and friends. And media companies are trying to get people to spend more time online: the Disneys and NBCs of the world keep adding television shows and movies to their Web sites, giving consumers convenient entertainment that soaks up a lot of bandwidth.

Moreover, companies with physical storefronts, like Blockbuster, are moving toward digital delivery of entertainment. And new distributors of online content — think YouTube — are relying on an open data spigot to make their business plans work.

Critics of the bandwidth limits say that metering and capping network use could hold back the inevitable convergence of television, computers and the Internet.

The Internet “is how we deliver our shows,” said Jim Louderback, chief executive of Revision3, a three-year-old media company that runs what it calls a television network on the Web. “If all of a sudden our viewers are worried about some sort of a broadband cap, they may think twice about downloading or watching our shows.”

Even if the caps are far above the average users’ consumption, their mere existence could cause users to reduce their time online. Just ask people who carefully monitor their monthly allotments of cellphone minutes and text messages.

“As soon as you put serious uncertainty as to cost on the table, people’s feeling of freedom to predict cost dries up and so does innovation and trying new applications,” Vint Cerf, the chief Internet evangelist for Google who is often called the “father of the Internet,” said in an e-mail message.

But the companies imposing the caps say that their actions are only fair. People who use more network capacity should pay more, Time Warner argues. And Comcast says that people who use too much — like those who engage in file-sharing — should be forced to slow down.

Time Warner also frames the issue in financial terms: the broadband infrastructure needs to be improved, it says, and maybe metering could pay for the upgrades. So far its trial is limited to new subscribers in Beaumont, Tex., a city of roughly 110,000.

In that trial, new customers can buy plans with a 5-gigabyte cap, a 20-gigabyte cap or a 40-gigabyte cap. Prices for those plans range from $30 to $50. Above the cap, customers pay $1 a gigabyte. Plans with higher caps come with faster service.

“Average customers are way below the caps,” said Kevin Leddy, executive vice president for advanced technology at Time Warner Cable. “These caps give them years’ worth of growth before they’d ever pay any surcharges.”

Casual Internet users who merely send e-mail messages, check movie times and read the news are not likely to exceed the caps. But people who watch television shows on Hulu.com, rent movies on iTunes or play the multiplayer game Halo on Xbox may start to exceed the limits — and millions of people are already doing those things.

Streaming an hour of video on Hulu, which shows programs like “Saturday Night Live,” “Family Guy” and “The Daily Show With Jon Stewart,” consumes about 200 megabytes, or one-fifth of a gigabyte. A higher-quality hour of the same content bought through Apple’s iTunes store can use about 500 megabytes, or half a gigabyte.

A high-definition episode of “Survivor” on CBS.com can use up to a gigabyte, and a DVD-quality movie through Netflix’s new online service can eat up about five gigabytes. One Netflix download alone, in fact, could bring a user to the limit on the cheapest plan in Time Warner’s trial in Beaumont.

Even services like Skype and Vonage that use the Internet to transmit phone calls could help put users over the monthly limits.

Time Warner would not reveal how many gigabytes an average customer uses, saying only that 95 percent of customers use under 40 gigabytes each in a month.

That means that 5 percent of customers use more than 50 percent of the network’s overall capacity, the company said, and many of those people are assumed to be sharing copyrighted video and music files illegally.

The Time Warner plan has the potential to bring Internet use full circle, back to the days when pay-as-you-go pricing held back the Web’s popularity. In the early days of dial-up access, America Online and other providers offered tiered pricing, in part because audio and video were barely viable online. Consumers feared going over their allotted time and bristled at the idea that access to cyberspace was billed by the hour.

In 1996, when AOL started offering unlimited access plans, Internet use took off and the online world started moving to the center of people’s daily lives. Today most Internet packages provide a seemingly unlimited amount of capacity, at least from the consumer’s perspective.

But like water and electricity, even digital resources are finite. Last year Comcast disclosed that it was temporarily turning off the connections of customers who used file-sharing services like BitTorrent, arguing that they were slowing things down for everyone else. The people who got cut off complained and asked how much broadband use was too much; the company did not have a ready answer.

Thus, like Time Warner, Comcast is considering a form of Internet metering that would apply to all online activity.

The goal, says Mitch Bowling, a senior vice president at Comcast, is “ensuring that a small number of users don’t impact the experience for everyone else.”

Last year Comcast was sued when it was disclosed that the company had singled out BitTorrent users.

In February, Comcast departed from that approach and started collaborating with the company that runs BitTorrent. Now it has shifted to what it calls a “platform agnostic” approach to managing its network, meaning that it slows down the connection of any customer who uses too much bandwidth at congested times.

Mr. Bowling said that “typical Internet usage” would not be affected. But on the Internet, “typical” use is constantly being redefined.

“The definitions of low and high usage today are meaningless, because the Internet’s going to grow, and nothing’s going to stop that,” said Eric Klinker, the chief technology officer of BitTorrent.

As the technology company Cisco put it in a recent report, “today’s ‘bandwidth hog’ is tomorrow’s average user.”

One result of these experiments is a tug-of-war between the Internet providers and media companies, which are monitoring the Time Warner experiment with trepidation.

“We hate it,” said a senior executive at a major media company, who requested anonymity because his company, like all broadcasters, must play nice with the same cable operators that are imposing the limits. Now that some television shows are viewed millions of times online, the executive said, any impediment would hurt the advertising model for online video streaming.

Mr. Leddy of Time Warner said that the media companies’ fears were overblown. If the company were to try to stop Web video, “we would not succeed,” he said. “We know how much capacity they’re going to need in the future, and we know what it’s going to cost. And today’s business model doesn’t pay for it very well.”
This post has been edited by eclectice: Jun 18 2008, 08:40 PM
kamenx
post Jun 16 2008, 02:04 AM

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unblock P2P and stable connection, then u say.
suns8630
post Jun 16 2008, 02:09 AM

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QUOTE(kamenx @ Jun 16 2008, 02:04 AM)
unblock P2P and stable connection, then u say.
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yes .. with the above 2 matters overcome . ... i support fully ....
Alpha_Tay
post Jun 16 2008, 02:31 AM

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TM Let's Talk.

nightmarej4ck
post Jun 16 2008, 02:34 AM

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if they unblock p2p and charged by bytes i agree with it so it can limits our bandwidth by rates....
Zard
post Jun 16 2008, 03:17 AM

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hmm..... blink.gif

This post has been edited by Zard: Jun 16 2008, 03:22 AM
Suk
post Jun 16 2008, 03:29 AM

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Streamyx got RM20 package which is for light user... but how many ppl subscribe for this package ?

Unlimited and Fix rate can earn more in my opinion.
cracksys
post Jun 16 2008, 03:49 AM

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QUOTE
In that trial, new customers can buy plans with a 5-gigabyte cap, a 20-gigabyte cap or a 40-gigabyte cap. Prices for those plans range from $30 to $50. Above the cap, customers pay $1 a gigabyte. Plans with higher caps come with faster service.

surprisingly low priced ... and we here pay RM60 for lousy connection shakehead.gif

it would be horrible if our ISP charge using byte .. do you think TM net will settle for RM3.50 per GB ? nawh
he-sham
post Jun 16 2008, 03:52 AM

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why bandwitdh so pricey ? is it that hard to get it ?? is it as hard as must dig the earth to find fossil fuel ??

is the broadband not wide or broad enough to accomodate heavy internet user ??

why it's so unefficient in carrying data ?? tnb transmission carry massive amount of electrical energy with no problem... broadband provider just need spectrum to wider bandwitdh of their not so broad internet connection...

i dont know my analogy relevent or not...but broadband provider really provide crappy service...

i'm really confused now.... rclxub.gif
Goneraz
post Jun 16 2008, 04:33 AM

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I think its a freaking good idea. Because all the stupid ISP will have to improve their serivce or go bust. For example if TM net throttle the P2p then we use less which means we pay less. Instead of having paid 100 bucks and getting sucky service we pay for wat we use. So if they give us stupid slow connection we will use less and they get paid less. Also then we dont have to sign their stupid annually contract. We can change ISP if we r not happy with their serivce,
SUSsassyset
post Jun 16 2008, 08:03 AM

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agree with goneraz. if they want to charge by rates,

1) no contract. can terminate anytime if not happy with service.
2) p2p friendly. no throttling whatsoever
3) same speed for upload n download. (gamer and anime otaku detected)
4) uninterrupted service guaranteed. stable connection, and no dc unless crittical problems occurred.
Kenneth85
post Jun 16 2008, 08:15 AM

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1 more. We get what we want. not they give what we dont want.

Service down, no charges applied to us. We paid what we getting. Doesn't that awesome?

The fact, TM will lose profit by implementing this because almost all people are getting sucky service. 1mbps at the rate of 20kbps when torrenting, omg.. but hell yeah, they paid same rate as we do.
SUSsharkteef
post Jun 16 2008, 09:10 AM

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dont forget the stability issue. while downloadin a 700mb file, if u dc, thats it, u have to start from ground zero.
so definitely stability improvements is a must. no point paying by bytes if u dc every few minutes.
Goneraz
post Jun 16 2008, 09:59 AM

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If you use download amanger or P2p then tha solve the issue. imagine even if they force u to sign a 1 year contract and chare u a minimum of rm20. If you not happy with their service u only need to pay max 240 to terminate their service or even better sign up with a few different isp then u have a back up and u only pay 10% of wat you are paying now to have 2 isp? There will be bigger competition and then they will be fighting for our bytes... Its improve their service or die by the sword.
haya
post Jun 16 2008, 03:30 PM

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Australia and New Zealand have been charging per-gigabyte for years, if not ever since broadband was affordable to the average household. There is nothing new on this. For these 2 countries it was more of economics than net neutrality. NZ has only one internet cable to the rest of the world, and the effects were well felt in 2006 when Auckland lost power for 18 hours, and the rest of NZ was left with minimal internet access.

I could go on about how it just takes a flick of a switch to increase bandwidth, but in a nutshell, there are too many external forces, political, economics, that influence bandwidth. I'm not saying the internet is going to collapse any time soon, but there is a shortage of bandwidth in specific parts of the world.
lionheart23
post Jun 16 2008, 06:01 PM

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tmnut forever nut.
service and product successfully failed!!

This post has been edited by lionheart23: Jun 16 2008, 06:01 PM
prasys
post Jun 16 2008, 06:28 PM

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QUOTE(sassyset @ Jun 16 2008, 08:03 AM)
agree with goneraz. if they want to charge by rates,

1) no contract. can terminate anytime if not happy with service.
2) p2p friendly. no throttling whatsoever
3) same speed for upload n download. (gamer and anime otaku detected)
4) uninterrupted service guaranteed. stable connection, and no dc unless crittical problems occurred.
*
Lol wut ?.

No seriously , you need to understand the concept of consumer Internet. surely you can get that kind of service if you are willing to take the enterprise package. That means the Bandwidth is dedicated and if you are within the coverage area you should get superb speeds. ISPs enforce QoS (Quality of Service) and bandwidth is shared among users (a very good example is Maxis). This is because bandwidth doesn't come cheap. It isn't cheap as you think. Its just like the oil , its scarce in resources. Same speed for upload and download. That isn't possible with ADSL. We are talking about Asymmetrical DSL here (3G/4G falls in another category. The maximum upload can be achieved by UMTS is 384Kbps/384Kbps. Now that is symmetrical). As for your last point , It is nearly impossible for ISPs to provide uninterrupted service. Even in any best service. IF YOU need one , you'll be using a leased line. Now that is truly uninterrupted !


QUOTE(lionheart23 @ Jun 16 2008, 06:01 PM)
tmnut forever nut.
service and product successfully failed!!
*
Here we go again. TMNet is still the best among the worst. Have you tried other broadband before ?

GameSky
post Jun 16 2008, 06:47 PM

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Alpha_Tay
post Jun 16 2008, 06:54 PM

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tmnet is as good as a kidz at his own backyard. how good it is was determined by how they perform at real competitive market, especially those at other country, not by having a gov on his back that setting alot of rules to their competitor.

another way to compare was, lets compare malaysia "NO.1" isp TMNet to other country No.1 isp around the world, is TMNet really that good?

singnet & tmnet, both having gov on its back, which 1 perform better than the other at its own country? no doubt about the answer then.

the most funny thing out of no where was Malaysia ISP business was very competitive, Malaysia has ALOT of ISP, and what? why they cant do anything, who set abc rules to forbidden them to do so?

lionheart23
post Jun 16 2008, 07:15 PM

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don't compare localnet lar, compare with other country.

Always compare local thingy only, how to improve?
nut always nut, only like to compare with local product, how sad it is?

talking about 2020?
It's nonsense, nothing gonna change for sure!!
prasys
post Jun 16 2008, 07:37 PM

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QUOTE(Alpha_Tay @ Jun 16 2008, 06:54 PM)
the most funny thing out of no where was Malaysia ISP business was very competitive, Malaysia has ALOT of ISP, and what? why they cant do anything, who set abc rules to forbidden them to do so?
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Exactly. TM knows that small ISPs would be a total failure. Lets face it , who is going to invest on buying bandwidth. It will cost them a lot of money. Heck ,that is why maxis caps their user and limits p2p and blocks many things. This is ensure that nobody hogs up the whole bandwidth\


QUOTE(lionheart23 @ Jun 16 2008, 07:15 PM)
don't compare localnet lar, compare with other country.

Always compare local thingy only, how to improve?
nut always nut, only like to compare with local product, how sad it is?

talking about 2020?
It's nonsense, nothing gonna change for sure!!
*
You're talking non-sense. Its people like you that make the country into something else. Surely , TmNet isn't the best ISPs but among the other malaysian isps it is certainly the best. I am happy as I've streamyx (Yes youtube takes ages to load , i can't access some sites and tons of other rants) , but after trying a lot of ISPs in Malaysia. You'll find streamyx is the best. We will have to give them time for TM to improve , it might take some time for them. Surely its not the best. No , I am not a TM supporter but I am just someone who is being grateful to have a "Decent Broadband". You'll learn to appreciate streamyx once you have tried other ISPs.
Suk
post Jun 16 2008, 07:51 PM

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Yeah. Happy user from streamyx too.

But I feel jealous to someone paying 1Mbps but getting 2Mbps.
(mine only 1.5Mbps)

However, I do not have any peak / non-peak hours all the time stable..

but, I hate the bad routing.

prasys
post Jun 16 2008, 07:59 PM

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QUOTE(Suk @ Jun 16 2008, 07:51 PM)
Yeah. Happy user from streamyx too.

But I feel jealous to someone paying 1Mbps but getting 2Mbps.
(mine only 1.5Mbps)

However, I do not have any peak / non-peak hours all the time stable..

but, I hate the bad routing.
*
You are being greedy. You should be thankful that you are getting 1.5Mbps when you are paying for 1Mbps. But alas , that is what keep us going. Its the greed
stormer
post Jun 16 2008, 08:06 PM

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If TMNut can't do their job here...government should allow other player (doesn't matter from outsider ie: Singtel, Verizon etc..etc ) to play some role here...

...I don't even care either their charge me by byte or like current one, as long the service are in top notch...

NB: I'm no gamer nor P2P user...so this suit me very well wink.gif
Alpha_Tay
post Jun 16 2008, 08:07 PM

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QUOTE(prasys @ Jun 16 2008, 07:37 PM)
Exactly. TM knows that small ISPs would be a total failure. Lets face it , who is going to invest on buying bandwidth. It will cost them a lot of money. Heck ,that is why maxis caps their user and limits p2p and blocks many things. This is ensure that nobody hogs up the whole bandwidth\
*
and who build up TM and TMNet to what it is today? all using malaysia citizen money one way or another, and who said all those money should be used executively for TM, and who said/allow TM to monopoly the market? and like i said, when compare thing, lets compare the exactly the same thing, but not compare those who has gov support and those without.
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post Jun 16 2008, 08:07 PM

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Yeh! me also thanks to Streamyx. Scare to use other ISP tho..

Dial - up = Slow!
Streamyx Broadband = Terrible!
Other ISP = Worst!

Really don't understand what this people want!

prasys
post Jun 16 2008, 08:15 PM

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QUOTE(Alpha_Tay @ Jun 16 2008, 08:07 PM)
and who build up TM and TMNet to what it is today? all using malaysia citizen money one way or another, and who said all those money should be used executively for TM, and who said/allow TM to monopoly the market? and like i said, when compare thing, lets compare the exactly the same thing, but not compare those who has gov support and those without.
*
There isn't anything. Well thats governments intervention. There is nothing much you could do and we can't compare any other weird ISPs as they are uh like one by JARING but it is very limited. Well I do agree some of our money goes to TM to improve their infrastructure and other things. But , then you can't compare the ISPs here in Malaysia. Lets see how things goes. This is a very subjective statement.
Alpha_Tay
post Jun 16 2008, 08:59 PM

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QUOTE(prasys @ Jun 16 2008, 08:15 PM)
There isn't anything. Well thats governments intervention. There is nothing much you could do and we can't compare any other weird ISPs as they are uh like one by JARING but it is very limited. Well I do agree some of our money goes to TM to improve their infrastructure and other things. But , then you can't compare the ISPs here in Malaysia. Lets see how things goes. This is a very subjective statement.
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that's why i am saying this in the 1st place.

QUOTE
another way to compare was, lets compare malaysia "NO.1" isp TMNet to other country No.1 isp around the world, is TMNet really that good?

singnet & tmnet, both having gov on its back, which 1 perform better than the other at its own country? no doubt about the answer then.
wenhui100
post Jun 17 2008, 12:55 AM

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If tmnut is going to charge by byte, they will do so and plus blocking ur p2p .. thats how sucky tmnut is. prasys, i have tried other ISPs and they are whole lot better than streamyx. thailand too has a better isp and promises their bandwidth. And blocking P2P isn't the ISP's job ... they are just blocking p2p to increase bandwidth and sell more bull tmnut packages .. ...

 

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