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 Fund Investment Corner v2, A to Z about Fund

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aronteh
post Jun 29 2012, 01:06 AM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jun 28 2012, 02:14 PM)
newbie investors still ok...but those agents who have been using "lai lai lai dividend coming soon, fast fast invest b4 dividend so u can untung more" as their marketing technique...u correct them, they'd respond like u just burnt their house and beat their momma shakehead.gif
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I have been watching this thread for a long time and seen so many type of peoples, investors, newbies and agents. I really salute you guys for your patient in explaining the dividend issue. Can't blame them all. Some agents have been misguided in their training and even brain wash by they trainer in this matter. The whole objective of this is to sell more funds to your clients. drool.gif drool.gif

I know this as I had been an agent before whistling.gif , and I have seen many agents who are ignorance on how the dividend work.

The sad thing is many misguided agents use the dividend coming soon to get their clients aboard. sad.gif

I guess they feel like "u just burnt their house and beat their momma" because they feel you are breaking their rice bowl. cry.gif
aronteh
post Jun 29 2012, 02:03 PM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jun 29 2012, 01:19 PM)
Aiyoyoyoyo shakehead.gif

For illustration purposes, let's assume the funds here only have ONE investment, e.g. in BAT Malaysia Berhad. BAT share price = RM50

Let' say Fund ABC fund size = RM100M
Units in circulation = 100M
NAV price = RM1.0000
BAT share go up RM1 i.e. 2%
Fund ABC will go RM100M x 1.02% = RM102M
NAV price will go RM102M/100M = RM1.0200 i.e. EACH UNIT GO UP RM0.0200 i.e. up 2%

Fund XYZ fund size = RM100M
Units in circulation = 200M
NAV price = RM0.5000
BAT share go up RM1 i.e. 2%
Fund ABC will go RM100M x 1.02% = RM102M
NAV price will go RM102M/200M = RM0.5100 i.e. EACH UNIT GO UP RM0.0100 i.e. up 2%

Fund ABC go up 2 sen, Fund XYZ go up 1 sen...does that mean Fund ABC is "better"?

C'mon man...it's all RELATIVE... doh.gif

When u have MORE UNITS, movements in market value will be smaller in quantum i.e. ringgit terms, but in percentage terms, it's totally the same.

I'm investor in ABC, my investment is RM10,000. Market movement causes my NAV PER UNIT to go up 2 sen, but I hold 10,000 units
My friend invested in XYZ, his investment is ALSO RM10,000. The SAME market movement causes his NAV PER UNIT to go up 1 sen, but he hold 20,000 units
Difference between my holding value and his due to this market movement? ZERO
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That a good illustration. Kudos to Pink Spider rclxms.gif
aronteh
post Jul 16 2012, 05:02 PM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jul 16 2012, 04:44 PM)
Emerging Markets la shakehead.gif
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Have been very patient with the market since last year. yawn.gif Holding all ammo in 80% on Bonds now, 6% Cash and 4% Reits. Waiting for the right timing.
Markets is getting very exciting lately. Looking for opportunity of a life time here. drool.gif

With all the Sifu combine wisdoms here, hopefully we can time it correctly rclxm9.gif
aronteh
post Jul 16 2012, 05:13 PM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jul 16 2012, 05:07 PM)
Later turns out to be catching a falling knife, really bang wall lor laugh.gif
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Aiyoyo, don't shoot with "planet busting dragon ball-sized" la shocking.gif My gun not big enough to load such ammo.
Fire with bazooka good enough lah. icon_idea.gif Can fire many round. brows.gif
aronteh
post Jul 16 2012, 05:33 PM

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QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Jul 16 2012, 05:26 PM)
Yeah - controlled / calculated burst modes' the best hehe.

BTW, scary lar now markets - REITs and their related ilks are running up as if on fire.
Although i've anticipated REITs to have a good run due to QEs & $ printing, i haven't seen REITs run like this before... while the general world market is see-sawing worried  sweat.gif
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Asia markets are flush with liquidity from US and Eur crisis. We are seeing a boom in properties market due foreign inflow. rclxms.gif
But government is trying to control the properties market to avoid potential bubble.
aronteh
post Jul 16 2012, 07:11 PM

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QUOTE(Kaka23 @ Jul 16 2012, 06:43 PM)
Holding in which bond fund bro? Mind to share with us?

Most my ammo already into AmDynamic, if there is a fire sale, I dont htink I will cash out as well. Now accumulating ammo again.. gawds know how long.. shxt!
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AmDynamic my anchor fund, due to 1% exit charge this will be reserve ammo. AmBond and AmBond Islam ever ready amno.
aronteh
post Jul 16 2012, 07:26 PM

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QUOTE(Kaka23 @ Jul 16 2012, 07:20 PM)
Ah.. I am doing Value Investing. Haha.. Thanks!

Doing value investing only comodities fund Energy and Gold till I scared and tired bro. Keep on falling like catching the falling knives... I hope I can see the light in the tunnel la. Dont make me do value investing on these funds for so long la.. I need keep ammo for other funds value investing right? Also for fire sale time!!!

Ya.. every night, without a fail I will go into bloomberg app on my iPad. just to see some headlines and markets around the world.
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I have been doing cost averaging on GOLD from about 1760 to 1555 sweat.gif , understand how you feel.
aronteh
post Jul 16 2012, 08:04 PM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jul 16 2012, 07:33 PM)
Why not go Genneva then...2-3% PER MONTH hibah yo rolleyes.gif
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Don't touch Bro. I got burn by a few Gold companies. cry.gif mad.gif One after another promising 3% and above per month.
There are no special formula, just ponzi scheme. shakehead.gif You are paid with your own money, by buying GOLD markup >30% rclxub.gif
If will continue to work as long as more investor come in and Gold price keep increasing.

Don't want to name the companies. But you can find out from BNM list.


Added on July 16, 2012, 8:06 pm
QUOTE(Kaka23 @ Jul 16 2012, 07:31 PM)
Bro.. we are looking at long term. tongue.gif Just making myself feel better.. haha
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Gold for me is for long term inflation protection. My view is 10 to 15 years.

This post has been edited by aronteh: Jul 16 2012, 08:06 PM
aronteh
post Jul 16 2012, 10:00 PM

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QUOTE(Kaka23 @ Jul 16 2012, 09:00 PM)
Ya.. Aaronteh, how much you got burned in gold? 4 pr 5 or 6 figure?
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7 figures. doh.gif Police reports have also been made many times. So far recover only about 15% cry.gif
That my experience to share. Make sure it is regulated or else you better understand how the whole business work in and out.
Don't be overcome by greed. This is how our emotion is being play.


Added on July 16, 2012, 10:04 pm
QUOTE(TakoC @ Jul 16 2012, 08:52 PM)
Same here. Don't think I will switch out from AmDynamic. But who knows..

I'm more interested in what Aronteh is planning to buy. Equity? Emerging Market?
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Actually, I am exploring Emerging Market now. brows.gif I feel our local market valuation is high now. blush.gif Just my 2 cents opinion.
Will do some portfolio rebalance soon. icon_idea.gif


Added on July 16, 2012, 10:17 pmIn the weekend edition of The Business Times, 30 June - 1 July 2012:

"I am a proven liar. Don't believe anything I say," said Samuel Israel. He is the hedge fund manager convicted of running a US$450million Ponzi scheme who faked his own suicide in 2008 to avoid his prison sentence before turning himself in after a worldwide manhunt.

When asked what can an investor do to avoid being conned, he said, "Seek as much transparency as possible. If they do not understand exactly how a manager is making money, do not invest. If there is a secret process that cannot be explained, run."

Investors are sometimes too busy looking for profits to notice where the truth ends and the deception begins.

Quote I read from another Investment Blog.

This post has been edited by aronteh: Jul 16 2012, 10:17 PM
aronteh
post Jul 17 2012, 12:22 AM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jul 16 2012, 11:28 PM)
Well, they DO promote funds from Pacific, AmInvestment and Kenanga... tongue.gif
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From their list of recommended funds, I think FSM is fair and not bias to OSK-UOB funds.
aronteh
post Jul 20 2012, 11:35 PM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jul 20 2012, 11:22 PM)
If u can know when it is lowest, I'd sell all my properties and show hand with u doh.gif
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Me too. drool.gif
aronteh
post Jul 24 2012, 11:06 PM

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QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Jul 24 2012, 02:55 PM)
Nah.. P/E 8.6.. 8 more ong hehe.

On a serious note, i usually take a peek at the PE and DY, just in case something weird at the time with PEs tongue.gif - happened to me before with local stock SHELL and a local REIT  sweat.gif
A discount of 50% on average PE of 5 or more years is enough to entice 1/3 to 1/2 of my dry opportunity ammo  laugh.gif
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With all the conditioning. Slowly boiling the frog. I think we might not see such a drastic drop. PE of 5 might be a bit optimistic, likely to be 8 I guess.


Added on July 24, 2012, 11:09 pm
QUOTE(gark @ Jul 24 2012, 02:56 PM)
You do realize that EPF is using YOUR money to boost the share market so that YOU feel good right?  rolleyes.gif
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Feel good factor before election. rclxm9.gif After election and if BN lose, baru tau. cry.gif


Added on July 24, 2012, 11:15 pm
QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Jul 24 2012, 05:30 PM)
Check out this thread/topic.
http://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?showtopi...=income+builder

Added on July 24, 2012, 5:30 pm
Dont lar Pinky.
Some ppl may not want to be as involved as U in their building of financial freedom.
U think so many people thinks like us meh - where "I AM THE ONE THAT CARES MOST FOR MY $ AND ASSETS" is our war cry, apart from "GET YOUR FILTHY PAWS OFF ME MONEY!" before striking people blind and deaf tongue.gif
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Some people prefer to leave they money under other people care. Worse still under the pillow. Free world mah


Added on July 24, 2012, 11:27 pm
QUOTE(LamJLCF @ Jul 24 2012, 05:31 PM)
Thank you PinkSpider, a friend of mine told me about their plan. Still dont know to invest in it or not. a few friends of mine invested and some didnt and was very against it as well i dont know why. And not you too asking me to stay away from it, it sounds really interesting and its by Hong Leong. Should it be safe?
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There is nothing wrong with it. It all depend on your personal objective.
If you prefer force saving plan + insurance throw in then it is a good plan to many peoples.
But if you are an experience investor looking to get more return for you buck then this is not a good idea.

Then again not many people actually do all the hard work of research, learning to read balance sheet, fundamental analysis of companies and economy.

As for me managing my investment is my job as I depend on it for income, so have to be more hand on.


Added on July 24, 2012, 11:40 pm
QUOTE(howszat @ Jul 24 2012, 08:45 PM)
If look through the list, for eg the website below, most countries are in deficit. Even countries like USA, UK, Japan etc.

http://www.gfmag.com/tools/global-database...l#axzz21XbqlYs0

Whereas the countries in Euro, eg Greece cannot even pay their bills if they don't get the next round of loans.

Therefore comparing the troubles in Euro to Malaysia or any country in deficit is like comparing apples and oranges. Or durians and rambutans, whichever you prefer.

Don't get me wrong - I'm not defending, nor condemning the actions of this government as running a deficit is NOT necessarily a bad thing, just like a company with debts is not necessarily a bad thing. But this topic would easily take up another forum section all by itself and more. And it's not my point.

The point, which you missed altogether, is the fact that the Euro is grouping of different countries tied by a common currency, but not the fiscal or political responsibilities. For eg, if Greece had its own currency, and given its problems, it would have (1) defaulted, or (2) devalued it's currency long ago. But it can do neither, because the Euro is not for it to do as it pleases. And therein lies the problem.

So no, I wasn't talking about simple deficits.


Added on July 24, 2012, 9:14 pmIt's not just a case of feeling good. The value of your investments have gone up as well, in real value.

On the other hand, what do you think the downside(s) are?
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Deficit is good if the money go to infrastructure development the grow the economy and grow out of debt. But is deficit go to subsidies and unproductive expenses than that is another story. The country debt will keep increasing and GDP grow become stagnant.

Devalue the currency is a short term solution and a country can't keep doing that for long term or else end up like toilet paper. Unless the currency is the world reserve currency thumbup.gif

This post has been edited by aronteh: Jul 24 2012, 11:40 PM
aronteh
post Jul 25 2012, 06:29 PM

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QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Jul 25 2012, 08:01 AM)
PE of 5? no lar bro - U reading too fast
"A discount of 50% on average PE of 5 or more years is enough to entice 1/3 to 1/2 of my dry opportunity ammo tongue.gif"
Average PE of 5 or more years lar.
PE of 5? er.. there were some REITs at those numbers end 2008 & 1st qtr 2009 but stocks like PBANK, LPI, etc. were more than PE of 7.
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Already miss the boat on the REITs with PE of 5. That will give about almost 20% yield drool.gif
Waiting for the next boat, hopefully not too long. smile.gif
aronteh
post Jul 25 2012, 08:07 PM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Jul 25 2012, 06:38 PM)
Pls nudge me when u do so too notworthy.gif
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No problem. thumbup.gif Like wise if you come across any good deal. notworthy.gif
aronteh
post Jul 25 2012, 11:38 PM

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QUOTE(techie.opinion @ Jul 25 2012, 10:16 PM)
Benefit for all adults here then, crystal clear. Maybe need to be aware that invest at your (people) own risk, do not blame others due cause any failure.

That's why we need to put our own effort as well, at least the risk at minimal as we can see it, not just smiling when we at earning side.... sweat.gif
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I believe there are good deals around everyday. The problem is with our limited time and resources we can't possible spot every deals. I look to network with friends that have the same outlook and direction.

Then of course not every investment is suitable for everybody due to different make up of risk profile. We all have to do our own due diligence before investing in any UT, shares and etc... icon_rolleyes.gif
aronteh
post Aug 8 2012, 12:32 AM

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QUOTE(alexkos @ Aug 7 2012, 11:21 PM)
I want to buy some bond funds but AmDynamic Bond is not offered for sale. So sad..... will it open anytime soon?

Or any recommendation for a risk adverse like me?
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I spoke to the Fund Manager of AmDynamic Bond last month. There are not going to increase the fund size as it is at optimum level now. So it will not be open again.
But a new fund will be launch still pending SC approval, which have similar investment strategy biggrin.gif
aronteh
post Aug 9 2012, 01:11 AM

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QUOTE(Kaka23 @ Aug 9 2012, 12:51 AM)
Thought the new fund is AmDynamic Sukuk?
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As to my knowledge it is not AmDynamic Sukuk.

Sukuk and bond are a different animal.


Added on August 9, 2012, 1:39 amAnybody notice a big drop in AmDynamic NAV to 0.6142 as of 7 Aug 2012? unsure.gif
The latest quote is from Bloomberg.

There is no update of the fund price from normal channel since 3 Aug.


Added on August 9, 2012, 2:33 amNo worries. Just found out 31 July 2012 is AmDynamic Financial Year End. smile.gif
Expecting the usual dividend of about 0.02.

This post has been edited by aronteh: Aug 9 2012, 02:33 AM
aronteh
post Aug 9 2012, 10:33 PM

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QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Aug 9 2012, 04:10 PM)
seefood must EAT food lar. Like those char siu pohs from Ling Dan & Chong Wei - cannot respect oneself if don't eat tongue.gif

eh - just a word of caution (methinks - which may be obvious to U & i but maybe useful for newbies) ar.
If / when REITs' DY% becomes near FD-ish, better start running the other way from REITs / REIT funds as the market price is "not too smart" liao.

When the gap closes, most folks will  go.. duh - why am i taking more risks than FD to get slightly more returns than FD?  doh.gif

And thus, the cycle flows again to MM (remember one stretch of time, MM was getting more returns than Bond Funds?) and other vehicles.. ohm.. ohm..  laugh.gif
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Good thought. notworthy.gif Especially Malaysia REITs yield going lower from 6% to 5% before tax. Singapore REITs still going strong with 9% to 8% yield with no tax.
aronteh
post Aug 14 2012, 01:04 PM

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QUOTE(wongmunkeong @ Aug 14 2012, 09:52 AM)
Whoa.. bro, 2008 "prices" = KLCI at 838.28 lowest.. THAT would be a real lelong bargain  shocking.gif
I think the local erection won't have such an impact, UNLESS combined as a 1-2-3 combo of erection + EU kabloey + Japan or US kabloey
Just a thought ar, no crystal balls  notworthy.gif
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Wah so early wet dream already tongue.gif But everything is possible if you want it bad enough icon_idea.gif
aronteh
post Aug 15 2012, 12:44 PM

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QUOTE(Pink Spider @ Aug 15 2012, 09:31 AM)
My ammo for a local equity fund tumbuh cendawan and wild bush already doh.gif


Added on August 15, 2012, 9:34 amand those waiting to enter US equity positions when Dow drops below 12,000 also must be doh.gif now laugh.gif
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This where many will get hit by chasing the market, new high also very tempting for newbies. Must not miss the boat. We must be patient loh.

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