Can I remind all, any legitimate public investment need to have Securities Commission approval first.

So if STG is a public investment scheme, it might violate the SC's rules/law already which is an offence to do so.
But fellow members have explained STG is not a public investment scheme, so please don't contradict it.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Jul 25 2008, 02:46 PM

For MLM company, they still need to register under KPDN, if not mistaken.

For public prepaid, some fellow forumers have mentioned need BNM approval

For public investment, SC approval is needed.

Based on your recent reply, a lot of people saw it is a grey area investment due to (I am not saying it is or not, just stated the possible reason why people think so),

1. If it is an public investment scheme (repeated mentioned), then it must have Securities Commission approval. STG is not having Securities Commission approval based on the feedback on previous post, as claimed by Siliconwiper, because it is not a public investment scheme so approval is not needed. Siliconwiper claimed it is a prepaid scheme. But public prepaid scheme still need BNM/BAFIA approval. Then come out MLM issue while MLM still need KPDN licence to run. That's the basic for any public want to know.

So general public might be confusing or have no clear mind of it. While with your previous post saying a lot of company business is running at grey area line, then others might think this scheme also one of it although you might not stated it after all. I am not saying they are right of thinking this way or not either.

Don't get me wrong, I am not saying or commenting anything on it whether it is grey or not grey or a legitimate scheme after all.

2. In this scheme, even one 'invests' into it, one is not the shareholders of STG, right? "Investors" will be enjoying the return rate given by STG, but not participating in STG as a shareholder, right?

To all,

Another point I want to make, as moderator, I want to highlight is that please leave personal issue and attack aside, as lately, the posts replied has nothing to do with STG discussion at all, all just personal confrontation issue. It serves no purpose for this forum.

We are discussing on this particular scheme issue (STG), while Steven Corner is having good business or lousy business has nothing to do with this thread discussion. As STG and Steven Corner are two separate entity even though it might be run by the same boss or family business.

This thread discussion is all about STG prepaid and get paid scheme issue. Whether it is legitimate, or grey area investment or MLM or a scam, or sustainable issue of the scheme is the main discussion point.

For all,

The first priority of this thread is finding out the legitimate issue of the scheme which is the most concern part by the public.

So do your own due diligence based on information available. But please don't 'invest' into something that you don't know about it or unsure about it. You only invest when you are fully clear about it.

So future discussion should be concentrated on this part. Then only proceed from here.

The main point is the legitimate of the prepaid scheme, not the shop or company itself.
As those joining the prepaid scheme is not owning the STG nor a shareholder of STG either.

Public out there is not blind or foolish. People have their own judgement after reading information and facts. So if really want to help people stay out from scam out there, then posting information and with critical view and opinion, then people will find a way to judge already.

Just put up facts and real information you have, don't need to have personal confrontation. By then this thread will become more informative to others. A truth is always a truth, a scam remains a scam. Well informed people can easily spot it out. So just put up information you got and critical view is good enough to help poeple out there.

Above is just a general statement, nothing related to STG scheme issue.

Can we put both of yours challenge beside? Both of you can quarrel in the PM message as well or sign up lawyer agreement for betting of both if you want to. No offence.
But forumers here won't be interested to know.

What interested by forumers out there is the information, opinion regarding this issue out there. The first and foremost for public out there is to know the legitimate issue of the scheme!

Just hope this thread won't be dragged on and on with only personal confrontation which serve no purpose at all.

Cheers.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Aug 1 2008, 04:37 PM

bro, thank you for you picture.
But the main discussion point is the scheme or prepaid scheme as you mentioned. Whether STG menu is class or not is not the main point of discussion
This thread or section is always on financial, busines and investment stuff, not about whether STG food is tasty or menu is class or STG is having good business or not which is totally different issue from the scheme we had talked about some long until now. No offence.

If really want to discuss on those stuff, it might have to move to Kopitiam talks section already.

Cheers.

The legal issue of the scheme is not proven by anyone until now.

Taking money from public for investment without Securities Commission is illegal
Taking money from public for prepaid scheme without BNM/BAFIA approval/consent is illegal
Running a MLM business without KHPD licence is illegal.

Even three issues and above haven't sort it out in the first place until now.

So STG scheme is none of three above?

I knew there are lot of grey area that anyone can exploit at. Sort it out first above three issues, otherwise already KO in the first hurdle, then nothing much we can discuss further, then only proceed to state out the grey area or fishy part of the scheme which people feel or risk of the scheme or unsustainable issue of the scheme, otherwise the debate will go on and on without much improvement (which we had seen lately)

PS: What I am trying to do is to put everyone focus step by step on the discussion part of the issue.

Taking aside of issue of the legitimate of the scheme.

Fyire just warning in general of potential of clauses which potential might not in favourable to the investors 'prepaid buyers' which can or might be openly dictated or abused by the offerer depended on the sincerity of the offerer.
I don't see nothing wrong with that. Can't educate and warn people so that to be more alert in whatever investment , prepaid scheme or whatever stuff or contract?

You are the one had signed up the contract, you are the one knows all in and out of the contract compared to forumers out there. You are the one have the copy of the contract as well (after you signed up, you should have the copy, right?)
If sincerely want to help people out there, then you are the one that can help. Please don't be out of topic or twist the focal point by asking people to find out, you should have already knew as you are the one familiar the most with the STG scheme.

Keep on shifting the focal points and twist and turn might lead to more suspectibility of the scheme on the public view.

Cheers.

Scam or not scam, we do our own due diligence to find out. Everyone can have their own view. Even until now, there are people believe some pyramid scheme out there might be legitimate.

We can only say it is a scam if it turns out to be scam, right?

Just as normal public out there, we can find out the legal issue of the scheme offered only, as I mentioned repeatable time already. MLM needs KHPDN licence to do so. Investment part for public need Securities Commission and BNM/BAFIA etc. If STG offering MLM scheme, then it should have MLM license to run the scheme, otherwise, it might mean illegal in the first place to offer MLM scheme. BTW, until now I don't know whether STG scheme is MLM or prepaid, because confusion information being posted. So I don't comment on it whether it is or not.

The scheme of this issue is actually quite similar to MW we had discussed before.
http://forum.lowyat.net/topic/553560/+120

Don't get me wrong, I don't say or comment STG issue is scam or legitimate scheme.

Just the T&C issues can be as same.
A lot of T&C are largely depended on sincerity of the company totally.

To be precise, if the contract stated payout ratio can be changed by the sellers without consent of buyers, then it is no different than saying this payout is projected, but not guarantee will be.

I don't think we need to drag on the T&C part. As mostly there are clauses that we discuss about it for 100 pages long also won't finish.
Just like we open an account with banks, there are T&C stated that banks can change the interest rate offered in the future without notice given. It might seems a disadvantage to the depositor, but we knew the sincerity of the banks, as mostly we trust they will offer some average market rate out there.

Whenever, there are T&C which are disadvatange to the buyers then it is totally up the sincerity of the sellers. Buyers risk is totally exposed to the sellers. In this kind of situation, just like above bank account issue I mentioned, it is fully up anyone to trust on the sellers. We had not much problem with banks because mostly we trust banks won't run away with out money.

Another even T&C is perfect taking interest on buyers side (seldom ), if the company closed shop, then whatever T&C is also useless, right?
It is same with banks, (but we knew banks won't close shop easily).

This post has been edited by cherroy: Aug 7 2008, 10:28 AM

Then it becomes an investment scheme already.
No longer a prepaid scheme.

In the eye of BNM and Securities Commission, without relevant authority approval, it is illegal to collect money from public for investment purposes if it is an investment scheme

This post has been edited by cherroy: Aug 12 2008, 08:21 PM

The scheme doesn't mean one is a shareholder of the STG, the scheme is just like saying they will pay (it might not mean guarantee as well, depends on signed contract clause) 5% monthly on your RM3,000 'investment/prepaid'.

That's all, even STG make hundreds of millions, you still get the same amount.

You don't grow with the company as the scheme buyer, you only grow with the company if you are the shareholder whereby as shareholder of the company, every piece and asset of the company is belonged to the shareholders. Scheme buyer or membership is not.

---

Added on August 13, 2008, 9:23 amAlways this kind of answer. "Find out yourself".

Why can't have the answer, like 'yes, it has BNM or Securities Commission approval' or No, it doesn't need to, because under the law, stated xyz issue doesn't need BNM approval.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Aug 13 2008, 09:23 AM

That's becoming an MLM model already.

With giving 5% monthly, it somehow similar to those money game out there. Don't get me wrong, I don't say STG scheme is or not. Just the similarity raised a lot of concern, that's why people want to find out the legitimate issue of it. You only invest/preapid if fully clear of it, right? One of the reason of active of this thread.

Whether it is a financial instrument or not, it can be a grey area to be discussed. It is not up to we define, it is up to relevant authorities define it under the existing law avaliable.

In term of UT comparison with STG scheme, it is a weak point to show rather a good example.

In investment or business world, return is something no one can control. The term of control part which most people talk about is the capital part.

1. In investment of UT, you have totally control on your initial investment, so whenever you don't wish to participate or invest anymore, then you can withdraw your money at any time (the initial fund is gaining of losing is another story, as we are talking of aspect of control).
But for STG scheme, based on information input by those had joined (not mine), you have no control on your initial capital as you can't withdraw it as any time you wish compared to UT.

2. Return rate control. In STG scheme, the return rate is all depended on sincerity of STG to give out the 5% as stated while UT return is depended on the stock portfolio they are investing in.

Above statement doesn't mean anything STG scheme is or not fully legitimate under BNM/Securities Commission issue. Just to discuss the control part and comparison.

Just to remind,

STG and Steven's Corner are separate entity, even though the boss or CEO or shareholders might be the same (I don't know, but it doesn't matter), they are totally independance with each others in term of company wise.

Wrong, shareholders only loss the money invested, liability in Sdn Bhd,, Bhd or limited company is tied to the capital input only. That's why people want to set up sdn bhd to limit the liability, after all that's why people called limited company.

2nd question, I already give example of only 2 possible answer. So your advice is still go out and find yourself, right?

I am not in both. Just as moderator of this forum, I am asking question so that to point out the correct way of discussion in the neutral way and find out in depth of it in order to be fair to all aka to safeguard everyone interest in this forum. If STG scheme is fully legitimate and sincere, then no one (including scheme members) should be feared of being asked question on it, people just ask and pointed the curiousity and suspectibility of it, then if the scheme or prepaid is sincere and fully legitimate (like UT out there), then it is very easy to explain to others. Instead if those questions and suspectibility being answered then it only wil clear up the potential of doubtfulness which eventually increase the public confidence.



We don't want this forum become a place that provide wrong or mislead information input that potentially resulted in loss of other hard-earned money because of mislead information.
That's why legitimate of any scheme posted in forum is an important issue. What we want in this forum, is every truth and sincere information of it.
Personal opinion can be varied which is nothing wrong as it is up to individual view but information and truth behind is only in between yes or no.
Above statement has nothing to do with STG nor comment on STG scheme issue, just a general statement that pointed the importance of finding out correct and truth infomation in everything especially involved investment related product.

So this thread should be all talk good only on it while others having contradict view and opinion can't post at all?

20,000 x 3,000 = it is potential 60 million money in stake, not Rm 60 bucks. Open 60 outlet also no problem. But one thing that to be fair to those 60 million money owner has the right to ask and ask and ask again before they commit the money.

It is not only 3K, it is total 60 millions in stake. Money owner has every right ask. Since you are the messenger, then ignore the question. Then why use the word 'we' as you are just the member taking up the scheme, you are not the shareholders of STG either. Using the word 'we' be looked by others you are also represent the company also.

Again, legal or not legal is not up to members pr public to decide, if is under existing black and white law written. Just people want to find out about it. This is not a question either.

What people care is their money in stake.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Aug 13 2008, 02:26 PM