As long as politicians are involved in the game, nothing will change. Pampered sons of ministers who are afraid to break a toe nail will always get selected in place of hard working blokes with strong desires to succeed. As long as corruption is rampant, players will never play to their full potential, preferring instead to earn money the easy way, disregarding their pride and dignity.

I for one didn't notice. Why? Because I don't give a rats ass anymore. Our players consist of spoilt brats or those with little ambition. As such the standard of football they dish out is an EMBARRASSMENT! Corruption and greed has killed our football just as it will everything else in this country. It's frustrating to say that we are where we belong to be. We are reaping what we have sown. "Dai Sei!".

You can dig up an old thread on Malaysian Football a page or 2 back. There are a few comments on our team of old.

They key is that they were multi-racial. Now, it's dominated predominantly by one race. I've heard suggestions that they Chinese aren't interested anymore because of the low pay. Come on, a good footballer here earns decent money does he not? Couple that by the amount they take in bribes and you live a good life, no??? If you ask me, it's the politics that sicken the other races from wanting to play for the national team, or at club level for that matter? What's the point of being the most skilled footballer around but not being selected because you aren't a son of so and so? It's frustrating and it's like banging your head on the wall. The other races are just sick of it, has nothing to do with the pay and so on.

I just think that players should be selected based on meritocracy, regardless of race. It's not just about race, it's about letting your ability determine if you deserve a spot in the team, not who you know and so on. I'll bet that there is a kampung boy somewhere who is better than his Malay counterparts at club and even national level, but doesn't get an opportunity because he is a nobody. Some Datuk comes along and tells the coach to put his son in instead, and it's done.

Why do I think it's important for the squad to be multi-racial then? It's no secret that the racial divide has widened. Many Malaysians of Chinese or Indian decent are less patriotic now, I'm one such example. I feel like I'm a 2nd class citizen when this is my country. Let's not go into politics, I'm sure you know what I'm getting at. The Chinese and Indians are looking out for themselves now and as a collective nation, we are growing further apart from one another. In the past, the team fought as one, Malaysians.

The mental strength of our current crop of players is another thing. They don't seem to have any aspirations and are afraid of change. Take the players that were sent abroad only to get homesick as a case in point. Here you are, given an opportunity to play for some of the best youth setups in the world, and you choose to come back to play for Pahang because you miss nasi lemak and the weather is too cold? I'd bet my bottom dollar that if someone with more desire, and has not adopted the 'kampung' mentality were given the opportunity, they would jump at it. Take Titus Palani as an example. Our players are spoilt, they don't even have a proper diet regiment. They are mentally weak and crumble or panic under pressure. They don't show the willingness to fight till the end.

You may not want to admit it, but racial politics does exist in football, just as it does in every other sector in Malaysia.

Brings a tear to your eye doesn't it? We all want to see our nation united again and I think sports is one way to do it. Just look how Iraq winning the Asian Cup stopped the war if only for a day. Unfortunately certain individuals don't see it the same way and prefer to fuel their own personal greed.

Bring back the semi-pro days. The formation of a professional league only serves to fatten the wallets of certain individuals. It is a shame to think that even with a professional league, we struggle against farmers from Cambodia, Laos and Philippines, who do not even have a decent pitch, let alone a professional league. It's diabolical! Shame on us!

Don't come back Titus. Maybe he'll even turn out for France one day. Godspeed.

But surely the terms of their contract do not dictate that they will be bonded to a local club side for life? Did Titus go over on his own or was he given funding?

The pay locally may be better but prospects abroad are brighter? Delayed gratification, no?

I really think that it has to do with the mentality of players more than anything. I do not deny they may be bonded to club sides here but I fail to accept the fact that there is absolutely no avenue for them to progress abroad if they wanted to.

So what do you lot reckon about our national coach being sent over to shadow Queiroz? We have had stints in the past with foreign clubs and we've yet to see any progress. My guess is he'll come back, report what he's seen and that will be the end of that, job well done! If you ask me it's not about knowing how to do things. It is about implementation and whether or not, our local brats can cope with it.

2 weeks stint? 3 days training? How much can they realistically improve?

Exactly, it's not exactly the best kept secret. Kick the fecking cash hungry politicians out of the game! How nice was it to watch local football during our semi-pro days? Back then we could attract English Division 1 stars like Tony Cottee, David Roecastle and Chris Kiwomya. At one point, Pahang was even intending to bid for Liverpool centreback Glen Hysen AND Arsenal forward Ian Wright, during his prime!!! Now ah? Mouyvi Trusjihoffnios from the Laotian 10th Division or Cheong Ah Pek from Taiwan wont want to come! Perhaps Pei Yan *** from Hong Kong may be interested!

Malaysian players??? Same wherever you look so long as they are trained domestically. One cannot be blamed for thinking someone like Akmal Rizal would have learnt from his stint abroad and kept himself in shape. Now he looks like a fecking potato! Our players are pampered cunts. Look at our badminton scene and what Rexy Mainaky said after he announced his resignation. Malaysians simply don't have the discipline or mental toughness to succeed at the highest level. You have to take the kampung boy out of his kampung is you want to see progress. Notice that most of our successful athletes either train abroad or have foreign trainers.

If we do send our players over for stints, I suggest avoiding the bigger more glamorous clubs and choosing instead feeder clubs like Crewe who have a reputation for developing young players, who are later snapped up by Premiership clubs.

On the radio recently, you could hear an ad about how Malaysian's don't support our local league anymore and instead embrace foreign clubs. I seriously think they should have a good hard look at themselves before ridiculing us for this. Our national football league is shameful what with all the politics and corruption. How can one support a corrupt league? You can bring the donkey to the well, but you cannot for the donkey to drink from it. Perhaps if the FAM clean up their act and revert to the days of the old semi-pro league, will fans flock back into the stadiums.

Nice thoughts. The bolded part though doesn't solve racial politics or favouritism.

We're behind Palestine? This is an embarrassment. How can a developed nation not do better than one constantly at war?

I would really like that. In those days, it wasn't always about the money. Players of all races felt proud representing 'our' country. The strong patriotic spirit that existed back then simply doesn't exit anymore. Why? It's hard to love a country that doesn't love you back. Why all the protests all of a sudden? Things said during the UMNO assembly didn't help either. I won't go into politics but I find it hard to ignore that role it may have played in all this.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: Feb 23 2008, 04:08 PM

If you read what I posted again, you'll notice I actually said, "It wasn't ALL about the money". Different meaning when you conveniently remove the "ALL" in my sentence. As for nationalism, would you as a player not strive to improve if playing for a country you are proud off? It's the same at work, no? A happy worker is a productive worker. The more you love your job, the more effort you put into it. Is talent important? Of course but without any heart, the talent is wasted.

I don't get your comparison between the professional and semi-professional leagues. You are saying that players back then played better because they had financial security? Shouldn't that mean that without the financial security, they should play harder and work at improving because their salaries come from football, only one source as opposed to two?

What does all this have to do with what I said? There is a racial divide. Many more people today (more so other races) are less patriotic and some of it has to do with politics. This then means that people don't feel as proud anymore putting on their national kit. What does what you just said have to do with this?

One could argue that like leaders, players are either born with talent or without. I'm sure that by training they can probably push themselves to play to their fullest potential but the question is, will they if they don't have heart? I don't suppose there is a right or wrong answer here. It's just that in my opinion, you can't buy heart but you can develop a set of skills over time with the proper training and guidance. You can teach someone to play football but you can't force him to want to.

As for the issue of patriotism, I'm basing it on my own experience. I made a trip to Jakarta over the weekend and met with a Regional Manager from my clients end. He is from India and the group of us were having a discussion on our countries. He made a stark observation; that many Malaysians now refer to themselves by their race before their nationality. What this means is that someone like me would most likely go, "I'm Chinese" instead of "I'm Malaysian". "I'm Chinese but I live in Malaysia". Well you get my drift. I have personally noticed that those around me don't even countdown to Merdeka anymore. Far as they are concerned, it's a public holiday and nothing more. How many fly their flags? Why does the government have to keep urging the public to do so?

I don't know what existed before the Semi-Pro league but I do think we still played decent football back then. Not as well as in the 70's of course but we could still score two against England and not lose to teams by a rugby margin.

I do see where you're coming from with the 'intelligent players' bit and I have to agree completely. Field a bunch of monkeys and before you know it, they'll be scratching each others backs. In the case of our players, they often look lost at sea and have no idea what to do with the ball when under pressure, resulting in long hopeful punts up the park or wayward passes to the opposition.

I see where you are coming from in terms of pay as well. To some, RM 2 - 5K may seem like a lot but as you pointed out, the people in this category probably have little or no education. Those who are educated would most likely opt for other career opportunities because football in this country does not present you with many career options after you retire. At least by playing and having worked in a bank or whatever, a player has options to pursue his secondary career.

I can't name you a single national player with the exception of Akmal Rizal. My source come from friends who were either former league players that got sick of the politics and sought other means of income, or those who are friends with football players.

I take it you are suggesting our current selection policy is fair and just; and that the current crop of players who have helped contribute to our nation being ranked below war torn countries, are the best we can find?

I would like to know as well. If I remember correctly, Selangor held open tryouts before the beginning for the season and only like 20 odd people turned up. As I said, I may be mistaken but I do remember something very similar happening. What could have contributed to the lack of interest? I mean this is to the point where a club side is holding open tryouts hoping for youngsters to want to join them. Where is the QC? In other leagues, budding players would give anything for a chance to join a club side and here we are begging for people to come. Could it be that players are sick of all that's happened to Malaysian football; politics and all? Could it be that they simply don't feel any national pride anymore? Well you be the judge. All I know is we're in the doldrums now.

Talent has to be groomed from a really young age. I don't know how PE classes are run these days but when I was in school, the teacher would just chuck a ball in the pitch and have 30 odd students chase after it. Even during a proper school team selection and training process, it was run by the same PE teacher. My question is if this particular PE teacher is even a qualified coach? Chances are he isn't. The proper mentality and discipline has to be drilled into players at a very young age. Your mind is like a sponge when you are younger.