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TSLemonfish
post Dec 27 2007, 07:36 PM, updated 12y ago

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Hello guys.. Can anyone explain me the full pathway to become lawyer?? I meant from a normal SPM student to lawyer that can open their own consultant firm. What about doing law in US or Australia?? Is there any specific test to take if i am doing them in both of the country compare to doing it locally?? I am asking on behalf of my friend. What is the best institute that offer law program in Malaysia??

Thanks for taking your time to explain.
bidfordun
post Dec 27 2007, 07:41 PM

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well, after taking spm, u will have to take pre u like a level or stpm b4 u can become a lawyer. b4 u can open ur own consultant firm,i am sure u will have to work a couple years first. never heard of a fresh graduate will open a consultant firm so soon.

well, for the aus or us part, i will leave it to those who know beta than me. but even those taking law at private college or uni will have to take a clp test b4 they can become a qualified lawyer. well, this doesnt not apply for those who take law at public uni like um bcos they will automatically pass the clp once they graduate.

a couple of famous law colleges in malaysia are atc kemayan, brickfield and mentari etc.
Naota-kun
post Dec 27 2007, 07:48 PM

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no doubt, playing Phoenix Wright helps too.
kennykck
post Dec 27 2007, 08:00 PM

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toby.c13
post Dec 27 2007, 08:01 PM

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law in malaysia and the us are different.
we malaysia are following the uk system..
so if ur fren is planning to work in the us as a lawyer..
suggest he choose his path correctly such as enrolling into a us institution instead of a uk one.. laugh.gif
bidfordun
post Dec 27 2007, 08:26 PM

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QUOTE(Naota-kun @ Dec 27 2007, 07:48 PM)
no doubt, playing Phoenix Wright helps too.
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huhu, i doubt it. tongue.gif
alsree786
post Dec 27 2007, 09:15 PM

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Following information is for becoming a lawyer in Malaysia...im sorry, have no idea about Australia coz the requirements is state specific, and the US has a whole different system as stated above, coz well, the US is always different from the UK systems...

The fastest route would probably involve taking A levels...they call it pre law and involves one year...this can be done at a number of institutes like atc, mentari, nirwana so on...

The next step depends on three factors.

1) Marks scored in A levels

2) Whether the student wants to go overseas

3) Whether the student wants to do a foreign (incl UOL external) or local law degree

This is of course subjective. In addition there are the scholarship options to think about but i shall not go into detail on that. If u intend to do a foreign degree whether it be from Australia or UK, when u r done u will have to sit for a qualifying certificate. To do so, you must graduate with a minimum of a second lower honours degree.

If however, u do your degree at a local uni such as IIUM or UM, u will not have to sit for a qualifying cert i.e. the CLP but can straight away go for your chambering. However, note that degrees from IIUM and UM take 4 years whereas you can complete a UK law degree in about 3....many ppl agree that the CLP however is very difficult to pass.

Upon completion of the CLP, you must complete a full 9mths of chambering and upon that can apply for membership to the malaysian Bar.

The alternative for the CLP is the Bar Exams taken in the UK at the four different Inns...if u have a recognised qualification and intend to do this course be ready to stay in the UK for a couple of years. The BVC, as it is called alone takes well about 10 mths, but u must, as from 2008, complete your chambering i.e. min of 9 mths working under a qualified lawyer/firm (pupillage) in the UK itself. This is quite hard to do, for usually they'll take local law graduates and the best from the foreign ones, but u can try if u want. Upon completion of your chambering there, you will become a barrister and can apply for membership to a number of commonwealth legal bodies incl the Malaysian Bar.

About opening a consulting firm, well that might take a few years after completion of all this crap...coz you'll probably need to be quite established. anyway, hope this helps...
barrister
post Dec 27 2007, 09:50 PM

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Oh, i think i am quite 'expert' about this, that's why i am barrister.

Routes to become a lawyer (advocate&solicitor)

SPM - STPM/MATRIKULASI/A-LEVEL - LLB - CLP - PUPILAGE - CALLED TO THE BAR - LAWYER - OPEN UP A FIRM/WORK FOR OTHER FIRM

1) Pre-university (STPM/matrikulasi/A-level/....)
-nowadays, most universities either local or foreign, do not require a student to take subjects related to law in their pre-u studies.

2) Degree
- LLB is actually 'bachelor of law'.
- Malaysia's legal system is quite similar[I] to other legal systems practised in UK, Hong Kong, New Zealand, Australia (commonwealth countries).
- If one wants to practise law in malaysia, he or she should not study law in USA, because the legal system there is totally different.
- if one wants to read law in Australia or New Zealand, he or she should check whether that university is recognised by malaysia bar and other bodies.
- if not mistaken, all UK universities are recognised by malaysia for its law degree.
- one needs 3 years in UK, 4 years in malaysia , new zealand and australia.

3) CLP
-CLP stands for certificate in legal practice, a certificate given to a person who passed the examination conducted by malaysia bar for law graduates from universities outside malaysia.
- alternatively, a student who studies law in UK for example, may choose to take BVC(bar vocational course) at UK which also accepted by malaysia bar to replace CLP.
- law graduates from local universities do not need to take CLP.

4) pupilage/chambering
- it is compulsory for all law graduates to work under a senior lawyer (at least 7 years of practising) for 9 months.

5) called to the bar
-after completed CLP, a law graduate will be called to the bar, which means a ceremony showing that he or she is a qualified lawyer in Malaysia.


* in Malaysia, lawyers are advocate and solicitor, all can represent their client in court.
in Hong Kong, only barrister can represent their client in higher court, same thing happens in UK.

Glassy
post Dec 27 2007, 10:27 PM

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QUOTE(barrister @ Dec 27 2007, 09:50 PM)

- if not mistaken, all UK universities are recognised by malaysia for its law degree.
Well, if one intends to take the CLP in Malaysia after completing his/her LLB degree in the UK, please bear in mind that only around 30 UK universities are recognized. That's the rough number, based on the MABECS information booklet I received during one of their talks. So, please check to ensure that the university is recognized, before you go.

Also, while the BVC is allowed as a substitute for the CLP qualification at the moment, it may not be so in the near future...there has already been talk about disallowing this practice, so it might be good to pay attention to any updates on this topic, so you can plan accordingly.
alsree786
post Dec 27 2007, 10:43 PM

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QUOTE(Glassy @ Dec 27 2007, 10:27 PM)
Well, if one intends to take the CLP in Malaysia after completing his/her LLB degree in the UK, please bear in mind that only around 30 UK universities are recognized. That's the rough number, based on the MABECS information booklet I received during one of their talks. So, please check to ensure that the university is recognized, before you go.

Also, while the BVC is allowed as a substitute for the CLP qualification at the moment, it may not be so in the near future...there has already been talk about disallowing this practice, so it might be good to pay attention to any updates on this topic, so you can plan accordingly.
*
yup true, not all uk universities are recognised so one shud check with the malaysian bar website to get a list of recognised uk unis.

i have honestly not heard about talks of the BVC not being recognised in Malaysia anymore, tho there are a few talking about it. Any references...coz in Malaysia, anything can happen suddenly!!
schizophrenic
post Dec 28 2007, 01:18 AM

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QUOTE(alsree786 @ Dec 27 2007, 09:15 PM)
The alternative for the CLP is the Bar Exams taken in the UK at the four different Inns...if u have a recognised qualification and intend to do this course be ready to stay in the UK for a couple of years. The BVC, as it is called alone takes well about 10 mths, but u must, as from 2008, complete your chambering i.e. min of 9 mths working under a qualified lawyer/firm (pupillage) in the UK itself. This is quite hard to do, for usually they'll take local law graduates and the best from the foreign ones, but u can try if u want. Upon completion of your chambering there, you will become a barrister and can apply for membership to a number of commonwealth legal bodies incl the Malaysian Bar.
I would just like to highlight the response by the BSB to the deferral of call. Please refer to
Deferral of Call - Final Report August 07 (Word file)
http://www.barstandardsboard.org.uk/consul...llconsultation/

also the Bar Vocational Course is taken at certified providers (currently at 10 locations) and not from the four different Inns.
The Inns are local authorities with the exclusive right to call someone to the English Bar.

Also, one is only required to stay in UK for at least 11 months from Sept(Start of BVC) till July(Early July for the results assuming the student got through and End of July for the Call assuming the student got a place for the July Session and got a Master to move the call). Else, the student will be called to the English Bar at later sessions.


Added on December 28, 2007, 1:21 am
QUOTE(toby.c13 @ Dec 27 2007, 08:01 PM)
law in malaysia and the us are different.
we malaysia are following the uk system..
so if ur fren is planning to work in the us as a lawyer..
suggest he choose his path correctly such as enrolling into a us institution instead of a uk one.. laugh.gif
*
we are both(US and MY) following the common law system.
I am not commenting on the recognition of any qualification with regard to practising under specific jurisdiction.


Added on December 28, 2007, 1:23 am
QUOTE(bidfordun @ Dec 27 2007, 07:41 PM)
well, after taking spm, u will have to take pre u like a level or stpm b4 u can become a lawyer. b4 u can open ur own consultant firm,i am sure u will have to work a couple years first. never heard of a fresh graduate will open a consultant firm so soon.
I know some who opened their own law firms after they gained full right of audience but I do not know anyone opening a consulting firm immediately after.

This post has been edited by schizophrenic: Dec 28 2007, 01:23 AM
alsree786
post Dec 28 2007, 02:37 AM

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QUOTE(schizophrenic @ Dec 28 2007, 01:18 AM)

also the Bar Vocational Course is taken at certified providers (currently at 10 locations) and not from the four different Inns.
The Inns are local authorities with the exclusive right to call someone to the English Bar.

*
haha yeah sorry my mistake, i dunno why i mentioned the Inns...
dupicalz
post Dec 28 2007, 03:03 AM

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I've currently completed my SPM and waiting for my results.
assume that i have either completed my STPM or Matrikulasi and continue my degree in law in an IPTA.
upon completing my degree in an IPTA, am i require to take CLP or i'm done with it once i graduate?[just to confirm] unsure.gif

as highlighted in blue from the quote below, i must complete CLP in oder to be called to the bar.
what i'm confused about is that studying in local uni in Malaysia that i do not need to take CLP? unsure.gif then when am i called to the bar? Am i called to the bar once i've completed my chamber period? or.....? unsure.gif

icon_question.gif icon_question.gif

QUOTE(barrister @ Dec 27 2007, 09:50 PM)
Oh, i think i am quite 'expert' about this, that's why i am barrister.

Routes to become a lawyer (advocate&solicitor)

SPM - STPM/MATRIKULASI/A-LEVEL - LLB - CLP - PUPILAGE - CALLED TO THE BAR - LAWYER - OPEN UP A FIRM/WORK FOR OTHER FIRM

1) Pre-university (STPM/matrikulasi/A-level/....)
-nowadays, most universities either local or foreign,  do not require a student to take subjects related to law in their pre-u studies.

2) Degree
- LLB is actually 'bachelor of law'.
- Malaysia's legal system is quite similar[I] to other legal systems practised in UK, Hong Kong, New Zealand, Australia (commonwealth countries). 
- If one wants to practise law in malaysia, he or she should not study law in USA, because the legal system there is totally different.
- if one wants to read law in Australia or New Zealand, he or she should check whether that university is recognised by malaysia bar and other bodies.
- if not mistaken, all UK universities are recognised by malaysia for its law degree.
- one needs 3 years in UK, 4 years in malaysia , new zealand and australia.

3) CLP
-CLP stands for certificate in legal practice, a certificate given to a person who passed the examination conducted by malaysia bar for law graduates from universities outside malaysia.
- alternatively, a student who studies law in UK for example, may choose to take BVC(bar vocational course) at UK which also accepted by malaysia bar to replace CLP.
- law graduates from local universities do not need to take CLP.

4) pupilage/chambering
- it is compulsory for all law graduates to work under a senior lawyer (at least 7 years of practising) for 9 months.

5) called to the bar
-after completed CLP, a law graduate will be called to the bar, which means a ceremony showing that he or she is a qualified lawyer in Malaysia.
* in Malaysia, lawyers are advocate and solicitor, all can represent their client in court.
in Hong Kong, only barrister can represent their client in higher court, same thing happens in UK.
*
huix
post Dec 28 2007, 10:28 AM

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if u study law in usa, u can stay there to make big money if you want. everything is cheap there coz of heavy competition. to become a lawyer, you must have very good comamnd in english though coz you job mostly is to twist the wording of the english.

if u intend to come back to malaysia and wanna be in blue ocean, i think u can consider the syariah law also since we may implement it in future tongue.gif
Roy_Syd
post Dec 28 2007, 12:44 PM

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QUOTE(huix @ Dec 28 2007, 12:28 PM)
if u study law in usa, u can stay there to make big money if you want. everything is cheap there coz of heavy competition. to become a lawyer, you must have very good comamnd in english though coz you job mostly is to twist the wording of the english.

if u intend to come back to malaysia and wanna be in blue ocean, i think u can consider the syariah law also since we may implement it in future tongue.gif
*
Syariah law has already been implemented, silly.

Anyway, yes, syariah has good prospects for practise, muslims or non-muslim lawyers.
kvys2000
post Dec 28 2007, 02:07 PM

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I'm stuyding Law at HELP University next week under UK law Twinning Programe.

By the way, anyone has any idea or info about any scholarships? I'm eyeing one..
alsree786
post Dec 28 2007, 02:16 PM

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QUOTE(huix @ Dec 28 2007, 10:28 AM)

if u intend to come back to malaysia and wanna be in blue ocean, i think u can consider the syariah law also since we may implement it in future tongue.gif
*
haha funny, "may implement in the future", but u do have a point...syariah law is developing in importance with the growth of islamic banking and the focus on islam with all these worldwide problems...
barrister
post Dec 28 2007, 02:52 PM

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QUOTE(dupicalz @ Dec 28 2007, 02:03 AM)
I've currently completed my SPM and waiting for my results.
assume that i have either completed my STPM or Matrikulasi and continue my degree in law in an IPTA.
upon completing my degree in an IPTA, am i require to take CLP or i'm done with it once i graduate?[just to confirm] unsure.gif

as highlighted in blue from the quote below, i must complete CLP in oder to be called to the bar.
what i'm confused about is that studying in local uni in Malaysia that i do not need to take CLP? unsure.gif then when am i called to the bar? Am i called to the bar once i've completed my chamber period? or.....?    unsure.gif

icon_question.gif  icon_question.gif
*
Yes. If you choose to read law in IPTA, you will be exempted to take CLP, that's why u take 4 years to get a degree in IPTA.
kvys2000
post Dec 28 2007, 03:59 PM

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QUOTE(alsree786 @ Dec 27 2007, 09:15 PM)
The fastest route would probably involve taking A levels...they call it pre law and involves one year...this can be done at a number of institutes like atc, mentari, nirwana so on...
*
Err... i think the fastest route would most likely involving taking SAM/Ausmat! I finished SAM this year and is joining last year's A-Level students studying first year nx year. So, I will be one year younger than my other law coursemates I beliv.

But this is a very tricky and risky route. To enable one self to be accepted into UK Unis, one shd obtain a very high TER as told by many. UK Unis don't likely to accept SAM result.

But I last checked, oxbridge accept TER >90

This post has been edited by kvys2000: Dec 28 2007, 04:00 PM
alsree786
post Dec 28 2007, 11:10 PM

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QUOTE(kvys2000 @ Dec 28 2007, 03:59 PM)
Err... i think the fastest route would most likely involving taking SAM/Ausmat! I finished SAM this year and is joining last year's A-Level students studying first year nx year. So, I will be one year younger than my other law coursemates I beliv.

But this is a very tricky and risky route. To enable one self to be accepted into UK Unis, one shd obtain a very high TER as told by many. UK Unis don't likely to accept SAM result.

But I last checked, oxbridge accept TER >90
*
yeah probably, but will depend when u start your A level course. keep forgetting that spm finishes in november...i did o levels so i finished in june. If u start ALE in sept, and finish in june, then no diff betwen sam and ALE, both will start the first year of a UK uni course in sept...furthermore, doing ale would be easier to get into UK uni...

but you're rite, will ultimately depend on when u start ALE...

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