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 Anyone here using spec 53 racing block ?

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TSbluecat68
post Jun 2 2024, 04:23 PM, updated 2y ago

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I planning to up my Kriss MR1 engine to spec 53 but I wonder if the block really make more noise than the standard block, some say the oem racing block usually make looser cylinder block for easier piston movement but that also causing the piston make louder noise when working, is that true ?? Would like to hear the experience from anyone who using/used spec 53 block right now or before. Thank you.
iambryan1234
post Jun 2 2024, 05:13 PM

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The amount of money you spend modifying a Kriss 110 would be better spent on a used FZ150 that can reliably go over 100 kmh all day long unless you only have space for one single bike

But yes, local OEMs do make blocks that usually also make more noise because of the cylinder block as you say.

This post has been edited by iambryan1234: Jun 2 2024, 05:15 PM
TSbluecat68
post Jun 2 2024, 05:33 PM

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QUOTE(iambryan1234 @ Jun 2 2024, 05:13 PM)
The amount of money you spend modifying a Kriss 110 would be better spent on a used FZ150 that can reliably go over 100 kmh all day long unless you only have space for one single bike

But yes, local OEMs do make blocks that usually also make more noise because of the cylinder block as you say.
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Even the well known quality brand like Tobika's cylinder block also has the same noisier problem ??

By the way I willing to spend around RM1K if necessary to reborn my MR1 with everything DIY myself. If everything goes smooth and the bike work excellently for at least another 5 yrs then I say it is well worth.
Harold2009
post Jun 2 2024, 05:50 PM

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QUOTE(bluecat68 @ Jun 2 2024, 04:23 PM)
I planning to up my Kriss MR1 engine to spec 53 but I wonder if the block really make more noise than the standard block, some say the oem racing block usually make looser cylinder block for easier piston movement but that also causing the piston make louder noise when working, is that true ?? Would like to hear the experience from anyone who using/used spec 53 block right now or before. Thank you.
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Modenas apa nak hairan, kualiti ke laut, for reliable, only Honda & Yamaha still acceptable. Others good luck.
TSbluecat68
post Jun 2 2024, 06:05 PM

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QUOTE(Harold2009 @ Jun 2 2024, 05:50 PM)
Modenas apa nak hairan, kualiti ke laut, for reliable, only Honda & Yamaha still acceptable. Others good luck.
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It's not that bad to me. My MR1 serve me well for 10 yrs even I use it quite rough and drive aggressively most of the time.
iambryan1234
post Jun 2 2024, 07:42 PM

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QUOTE(bluecat68 @ Jun 2 2024, 05:33 PM)
Even the well known quality brand like Tobika's cylinder block also has the same noisier problem ??

By the way I willing to spend around RM1K if necessary to reborn my MR1 with everything DIY myself. If everything goes smooth and the bike work excellently for at least another 5 yrs then I say it is well worth.
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If you want the bike to work properly, you keep it stock. Generally speaking aftermarket local blocks will have looser tolerances hence the additional noise

QC however can be all over the place for these blocks

QUOTE(Harold2009 @ Jun 2 2024, 05:50 PM)
Modenas apa nak hairan, kualiti ke laut, for reliable, only Honda & Yamaha still acceptable. Others good luck.
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ko igt ni Kriss ciplak baru tu yg pakai enjin China ke?

This post has been edited by iambryan1234: Jun 2 2024, 07:43 PM
TSbluecat68
post Jun 2 2024, 10:12 PM

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QUOTE(iambryan1234 @ Jun 2 2024, 07:42 PM)
If you want the bike to work properly, you keep it stock. Generally speaking aftermarket local blocks will have looser tolerances hence the additional noise

QC however can be all over the place for these blocks
ko igt ni Kriss ciplak baru tu yg pakai enjin China ke?
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I wonder if brand like Tobaki or Wstandard make better quality racing block consider they usually come with much higher price.

What do you mean by keep it stock ?? Don't change the block but only replace the piston ?? Unfortunately I pretty sure my block is seriously damage due to the vibrate and sound it make if I apply like 50% throttle.
iambryan1234
post Jun 2 2024, 11:14 PM

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QUOTE(bluecat68 @ Jun 2 2024, 10:12 PM)
I wonder if brand like Tobaki or Wstandard make better quality racing block consider they usually come with much higher price.

What do you mean by keep it stock ?? Don't change the block but only replace the piston ?? Unfortunately I pretty sure my block is seriously damage due to the vibrate and sound it make if I apply like 50% throttle.
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Meaning don't gatal modi2 hehe

Tobaki selling their brand name based on cub prix prestige, but either way do not expect consistent QC
mADmAN
post Jun 3 2024, 12:36 AM

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QUOTE(bluecat68 @ Jun 2 2024, 04:23 PM)
racing block usually make looser cylinder block for easier piston movement but that also causing the piston make louder noise
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u mean piston to wall slap?

if thats what u mean, then.... get ready for THIS

not sure about kapchai applications... or even the type of piston (ie what material used) especially for all these local brands.

but in modified cars, the higher piston to wall clearance is due to some forged pistons will expand more when heated...but they are also quite strong. downside is when cold, before it expands, u get piston to wall slap. might be the reason why the bikes setup is noisier than stock.
iambryan1234
post Jun 3 2024, 01:13 AM

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QUOTE(mADmAN @ Jun 3 2024, 12:36 AM)
u mean piston to wall slap?

if thats what u mean, then.... get ready for THIS

not sure about kapchai applications... or even the type of piston (ie what material used) especially for all these local brands.

but in  modified cars, the higher piston to wall clearance is due to some forged pistons will expand more when heated...but they are also quite strong. downside is when cold, before it expands, u get piston to wall slap. might be the reason why the bikes setup is noisier than stock.
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Pretty much what he's referring to I think

That's also the reason why modified kapcais are usually associated with engine noise kek
TSbluecat68
post Jun 3 2024, 05:57 AM

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QUOTE(mADmAN @ Jun 3 2024, 12:36 AM)
u mean piston to wall slap?

if thats what u mean, then.... get ready for THIS

not sure about kapchai applications... or even the type of piston (ie what material used) especially for all these local brands.

but in  modified cars, the higher piston to wall clearance is due to some forged pistons will expand more when heated...but they are also quite strong. downside is when cold, before it expands, u get piston to wall slap. might be the reason why the bikes setup is noisier than stock.
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Stock piston won't expand to temperature ??
mADmAN
post Jun 3 2024, 11:54 AM

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QUOTE(bluecat68 @ Jun 3 2024, 05:57 AM)
Stock piston won't expand to temperature ??
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Of coz they will...but...stock pistons r usually cast iron

Cast iron pistons expand less than forged aluminium pistons n cast iron pistons expands faster than forged aluminium pistons.

So cast iron pistons can have tighter piston to wall clearance
TSbluecat68
post Jun 3 2024, 01:05 PM

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QUOTE(mADmAN @ Jun 3 2024, 11:54 AM)
Of coz they will...but...stock pistons r usually cast iron

Cast iron pistons expand less than forged aluminium pistons n cast iron pistons expands faster than forged aluminium pistons.

So cast iron pistons can have tighter piston to wall clearance
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So am I right to think that the forged aluminium pistons will make more noise when cold start and become less noisy after the heat is up because it expand and the gap smaller to the wall ??

By the way from Google it looks like aluminium and aluminium alloys are the main materials in modern engines. So every modern engine suppose to be noisy ??

user posted image

This post has been edited by bluecat68: Jun 3 2024, 01:09 PM
TSbluecat68
post Jun 3 2024, 01:11 PM

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Here another one about aluminium vs cast iron. Looks like aluminium not really that bad comapre to cast iron yeah ??

user posted image
TSbluecat68
post Jun 3 2024, 02:01 PM

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Looks like forged aluminum piston block is what I should looking for.

user posted image

Source: https://global.yamaha-motor.com/business/mc...gingPiston.html
mADmAN
post Jun 3 2024, 05:45 PM

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QUOTE(bluecat68 @ Jun 3 2024, 01:05 PM)
So am I right to think that the forged aluminium pistons will make more noise when cold start and become less noisy after the heat is up because it expand and the gap smaller to the wall ??

By the way from Google it looks like aluminium and aluminium alloys are the main materials in modern engines. So every modern engine suppose to be noisy ??

user posted image
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correct... it will quiet down once its expanded but again im speaking in car applications... not sure about these kapchai brands as i dunno wat they are using.

as for the term "in modern engines"...gotta remember its not limited to the pistons... can mean block, conrod etc etc.

can read here for more indepth about pistons: https://www.motortrend.com/how-to/impp-1110...tech-knowledge/

summary:
» Click to show Spoiler - click again to hide... «


QUOTE(bluecat68 @ Jun 3 2024, 01:11 PM)
Here another one about aluminium vs cast iron. Looks like aluminium not really that bad comapre to cast iron yeah ??

user posted image
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as u can see in ur screenshot... cast iron has reduced thermal expansion. n this is talking about blocks... ur main concern in the first post is the piston n its piston to wall clearance.

also the block may be made out of aluminium... but ive never seen the cylinder itself made of aluminium... as alu is soft.. all the sleeves ive seen (including aftermarket sleeves designed to handle 1000hp n above) are usually made of steel.


QUOTE(bluecat68 @ Jun 3 2024, 02:01 PM)
Looks like forged aluminum piston block is what I should looking for.

user posted image

Source: https://global.yamaha-motor.com/business/mc...gingPiston.html
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y u keep saying block when its talking about the piston? again... forged alu pistons are strong... much stronger than cast iron, but the noise is what ur concerned about. and ive already informed u of the reason for the noise and also the possibility of piston to wall slap. u can read the summary in the spoiler above to get a basic understanding on the type of pistons.

again, block may be alu, but the sleeve is probably gonna be some steel.

croydon
post Aug 7 2024, 09:56 PM

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find reputable workshop to upgrade blok, cam, carb, clutch, sproket

change blok only not much different

buy good quality piston and piston ring, usually those cheap blok came with low quality piston, piston ring

back in 2003 upgrade my EX5 with 53mm racing blok and carb RX100... couple years later changed to ori blok and rebore to 53mm without resleeve, high cam, carb wave125. used this spec till now

This post has been edited by croydon: Aug 7 2024, 10:00 PM
TSbluecat68
post Aug 9 2024, 03:40 PM

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QUOTE(croydon @ Aug 7 2024, 09:56 PM)
find reputable workshop to upgrade blok, cam, carb, clutch, sproket

change blok only not much different

buy good quality piston and piston ring, usually those cheap blok came with low quality piston, piston ring

back in 2003 upgrade my EX5 with 53mm racing blok and carb RX100... couple years later changed to ori blok and rebore to 53mm without resleeve, high cam, carb wave125. used this spec till now
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I bought all the necessary parts online and do the overhaul my self about a month ago, the process is very challenging but the result is very satisfying.

 

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