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 Home solar 4 months in.

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razr_sped
post Oct 3 2023, 04:37 PM

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just to share mine, 800kwh average monthly usage which is RM341 per tnb calculator. Installed a 7.6kwp system for around 28k, using huawei invertor which after NEM could install with its battery system of up to 15kw. Current bill average around rm40, but my petrol bill also went down a bit as I had a phev after solar installation.

No upfront cost but i took EPP for 24month. If the tariff increased in coming budget, then the ROI could be shorter or would be less affected. Main target is to get the bill to using only subsidize rate as i don't see a point to not utilize it, but on top of that I can utilize AC as needed esp. on hot days. Currently I have a 2.5hp running from 8pm - 6am daily.

Quoting from earlier comments, these are money need to be spent anyway to TNB, must as well do something to it and in future get a minor battery for backup in the event of power failure. So, if purely numbers it doesnt make sense, but i'm not good with finance tongue.gif

user posted image

This post has been edited by razr_sped: Oct 3 2023, 04:58 PM
razr_sped
post Oct 3 2023, 05:30 PM

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QUOTE(bee88 @ Oct 3 2023, 05:11 PM)
Is May your highest yield with 766kwh? That is about 24.70kwh and 3.25 sun hour. 

I feel like ur system should have performed better.  Something wrong? At least 800 based on 30 days and average 3.5 sun hour.
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roof angle i supposed as I'm facing east-west orientation, so in the morning rear is angle directly which make peak power but the front is facing to north rather than west which lowered the performance it seems.

QUOTE(netflix2019 @ Oct 3 2023, 05:19 PM)
Actually toward the end the supplier hinted to me they can install extra panel than allowed by TNB, under table stuff. I never ask further since not possible for my case.

I think the main point to be considered. Are u going to shift new house in the next 10-20 years? Is the upfront cost going to affect ur lifestyle. I definitely don't which the biggest reason i go all in for solar.
Hmm... why the need for battery when u already have NEM? How much the battery cost and how many panel? Can last for whole night?
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my supplier said the same too on additional panel later, but my idea is to see when/what is available then. I see this a 15yr cycle so maybe that time got better gears to upgrade and incentive given.

NEM doesn't allow battery, but its mainly the idea for selco after NEM ends, not now to power the house. but currently i do have those smaller battery for camping use.

QUOTE(Drian @ Oct 3 2023, 05:26 PM)
What is the huawei inverter specs?

Are they undersizing it.
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i manage to get the 9kwp one

This post has been edited by razr_sped: Oct 3 2023, 05:32 PM
razr_sped
post Oct 3 2023, 05:46 PM

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QUOTE(bee88 @ Oct 3 2023, 05:38 PM)
You mean your inverter is 9kwac? This spec pair with 7.6kwp seems unbelievable. 

Just heads up. You need to share the mode of the inverter.

Coz when you mention 9kwp inverter, I suspect you are getting the inverter that support up to 9kwp. But usually the kwac is around 6-7.

It’s best u can share the model. 

To be honest, if you roof has angles, should have gone for micro inverter. 

Yours come with optimizer?
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i just reread the spec for sun2000-6ktl-m1, 9k kwp in, 6k out so i guess you r right on undersize inverter.
well, there is a lot of should have
razr_sped
post Oct 3 2023, 06:11 PM

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QUOTE(bee88 @ Oct 3 2023, 05:49 PM)
So the idea of adding panel is actually pointless

And your yield is limited by the inverter. Not so much panel placement. 

Panel placement usually can’t do much because that’s something the roof you can’t simply change when u are using alll of it.

I hope your system comes with optimizer?
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could be, but my roof angle and orientation means one string is not getting full sun shine for first half of the time, then second half of the day for the other string. from netflix pic can see a nice bell curve but mine will usually have a sharp drop after 4pm.
and my roof can have one more extra string but shading/cost/usage requirement.
so might look abit lower performance if benchmark to 800kw, but there is a roof design issue that is unavoidable
increasing panel means more area to have the inverter at 100%, but honestly i fell the added cost not viable.
i dont have my roof picture with me, but cant change the roof as you say

and yes, optimizer included

This post has been edited by razr_sped: Oct 3 2023, 06:17 PM
razr_sped
post Oct 3 2023, 06:38 PM

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QUOTE(netflix2019 @ Oct 3 2023, 06:20 PM)
How do u check how many hours?

My neighbour same setting but generate 10% extra. I always assume because of roof angle. His conventional two slope. My roof a lot pattern with bug sun window in middle. So my solar arrange many different patch.
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user posted image

your roof design determine how your panel can be place
assuming you are the corner unit you already have 2 panel that doesnt face the sun orientation nicely at some point of the time which could impact performance

sun hour is merely calculation of total generated per month/number of days in that month/system size

razr_sped
post Oct 3 2023, 06:50 PM

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QUOTE(bee88 @ Oct 3 2023, 06:42 PM)
Corner lot should generate better yield. From what I see.  Unless sun come from left to right in the picture.
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well..i forgot to mention my sun travel assumption which is top-bottom but left-right if for sure.
but the 2 corner pieces are actually less generation for some period during early and late days to my understanding as the shine angle are not on all cell.


razr_sped
post Oct 4 2023, 01:08 PM

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QUOTE(brkli @ Oct 4 2023, 11:21 AM)
not sure what is better for the environment, use less electricity or install tons of solar panels to accommodate ones outrages energy usage for residentials.
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installation of solar shouldnt be excuse to rake higher energy usage but it sometimes incentivized ppl reckless behavior like my neighbor could have walk to tempat beribadat but he drove his big ass SUV.


QUOTE(yeapsc73 @ Oct 4 2023, 12:37 PM)
two ways to look at it.

if u keep the money in epf, u still need to pay tnb bill right? say u withdraw money every month to pay 800 to TNB, how much of this 47k will be left after 4 years, or how many years the 47k totally depleted by using it to pay tnb bill?

if u use the 47k to install solar pv, say 800 tnb bill saving per month, what u can do is to invest the 800 into something that can give u 5.5% return, i dont think thats difficult to find such investment (say just buy maybank shares lah that give annual dividend 6 to 7%), in 4 years, u will get about 44k in investment, in 8 years, your investment value will be about 97k, while if the money still in epf, that 47k will increase to about 73k in 8 years, the gap will grow larger and larger
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i think even i have the 47k for epf/other instrument for upfront, i'll still EPP it.
i think a lot of ppl see it as investment first and thinking they have 47k upfront to foot it (or maybe they have but i dont), like bee mention my system seems perform lower but from a longer stance perspective i still stand to benefit financially from it based on current situation.
so in my case i have a monthly 400 bill which i pay to cc instead of tnb, but in 5-7th year these 400 become extra which i could put in to epf
razr_sped
post Oct 4 2023, 01:24 PM

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QUOTE(yeapsc73 @ Oct 4 2023, 01:19 PM)
just saying, of course EPP even more beneficial as its 0% interest and the epf money still giving 5.5%

how many years EPP u r getting? what i heard max 4 years only

if 4 years EPP, your monthly installment will still be higher than your tnb bill and can only see net saving after 4 years
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i only took 2yr epp, dont feel like locking up cc too long so in my case mmg nett saving is way after i paid my system off
speaking of that, i also got 1600 (tngo) and some among cashback from the cards i use to EPP it.

This post has been edited by razr_sped: Oct 4 2023, 01:24 PM
razr_sped
post Oct 4 2023, 04:31 PM

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QUOTE(Drian @ Oct 4 2023, 03:59 PM)
I stand corrected, I did not take into account that the electricity still need to be paid for EPF case.
Basically the moment once the gains from EPF cannot cover the electricity bill, you cannot rely on compounding value to beat solar case.

user posted image
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this is a little over-simplified with the assumption of 47k upfront, for most solar user it will be usually EPP of 2-5yrs card dependent.
using the same logic to gradually increase the capital over the same period, you will not get 2.5k. Furthermore using epf as benchmark the dividend given also depends on when the funds goes into epf pool so it is even much lesser when partial capital funds are being inputed over the same 2-5yr period.

user posted image
so using same way of the first 5yr where the amount is contributed to investment instrument with 5.5% (i shouldnt use epf cos that cant be taken out till 55yo) by the end of the 5yrs, it will be a little ahead with 4.8k, but then for the next 10yrs with the expectation of 15 years cycle, i could still put this extra which i dont pay to tnb now.
i'm also not using the invested fund to pay tnb as calculation, meaning one will need even more disposable income to sustain the ROI.

user posted image
and if i have 47k upfront, then same result as yours with year 6 running out of fund if i dont put into solar.
this is of course provided after completing the EPP repayment the extra that i dont pay EPP/tnb is also put into investment instrument for the total course.

user posted image
to put the field even, for the first 5yrs i'll also put in the same amount per the EPP as i should have that extra disposable income (as otherwise i wouldnt be able to pay the EPP); which by yr14 i would run out of funds.

This post has been edited by razr_sped: Oct 4 2023, 05:11 PM
razr_sped
post Oct 5 2023, 02:37 PM

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QUOTE(Drian @ Oct 5 2023, 11:42 AM)
If you don't take invested fund to pay TNB as if you take from another source , it means the amount of capital used is higher , which means it no longer is 47k but 47k + extra money to pay TNB bill.

I'm trying to make it apple and apples as much as possible, you have 47K money and 9.4k electricity expense every year. Which would come up at the top?
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yes, thus i've put up different scenario as calculation comparison, and i believe for apple to apple calculation it should start from 0 instead of having the 47k upfront as most solar will be in EPP form
one thing to consider is i'm not using the money i put in my investment account to pay for solar, i'm using my electricity money to pay for solar.

QUOTE(vin6 @ Oct 5 2023, 01:22 PM)
Remember your sheet shows after 10 years you cant sell back because nem contract is over (not sure if government will continue or extend confirm have to reapply).
Take note - ppl who did their homework abt NEM solar already know after 10 years they buy batteries and store access energy for night use. This will also consider as saving already but upfront cost would be battery .

Currently estimate price for 5kwh = RM5k-6k (can get cheaper , battery and solar prices keeps dropping).

Average we need at least 10kwh per house depending on lood/usage.
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yea...its important to know its a 10yr cycle and will need to see how the government and energy player propose any mechanism then.
but it is best to treat it as SELCO by then and plan second phase improvement for battery installation which hopefully reduces by then.
razr_sped
post Jul 14 2025, 10:09 AM

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QUOTE(LaiN87 @ Jul 12 2025, 10:39 PM)
Ya you’re right.
I did more simulations with TNB calculator. Doesn’t matter below 600kWh or above.
EEI will get less and less but they offset your EEI based on import - export.

Meaning… if 1000kWh, you get -RM0.005 / kWh but only they calculate based on the net (import - export).

So as you go higher in kWh each extra kWh will only get more expensive, they give you less rebate based on net import… funny method of doing this EEI. Just a bad overall for NEM user and penalize NEM if usage exceed their export quantity.

Best is as Bee88 mention where to make sure is net 0. Then no bill changes.
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there is a cost to use the grid as in the more it load in the less incentive you are getting back,
i guess many new users overspec their system, when i spec mine my target is to reduce to i only pay the subsidize rate only since its national benefit instead of the thinking of my future bill should be 0

QUOTE(yeapsc73 @ Jul 13 2025, 02:27 PM)
In and out 650 where got excess credit?

Or u mean negative tnb bill after applying EEI?
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the calculator doesnt allow export > import, as my previous month is on work travelling my export is 559 but import is 376, so the calculator still calculate E = I as u can see the figure auto lower upon finishing typing

QUOTE(I-Kurosaki @ Jul 14 2025, 08:21 AM)
Doesn't make sense if NEM users are not qualified for EEI. Not all NEM users are with heavy consumptions.

My gut feel is that the 'formula' was in place to prevent negative bill calculation. For instance, those under 600kwh and with net import-export. TNB would have to 'pay' them with EEI as reward based on new tariff, which again doesn't make sense.

TNB need to fine-tune how the EEI adjustment is calculated.
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i suppose the high variance in day night impact the traditional power generation efficiency, thus this high difference of Export vs Import is not prefered by the grid which brings in the "penalty"
i guess we all have to wait and see
razr_sped
post Aug 7 2025, 12:36 PM

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QUOTE(bee88 @ Aug 6 2025, 10:44 PM)
Actually it’s like this. 

The incentive is for users who use less. Let’s say u use 600kwh. Each kWh is 50 cent.  (For the sake of calculation)  And ur eei entitlement is 10 cent per kWh. (For the sake of easy calculation ) that means u get 60 ringgit off from ur 300 ringgit.

That means lah. Actual price is 40 cent per kWh right. ?

And so coincidence u have NEM, u suppose to offset 50 cent right?  And let’s say ur generation is 600kwh. Ngam ngam. So u suppose to get offset 300 ringgit right? But this will cause Tnb to be at a loss. They charge u 40 cent per kWh after the eei incentive, and suddenly u want them to pay u 50 cent for each kWh u generated. Hence the pelarasan of 10 cent per unit for 600kwh generated.  Which is rm60.
But in another month, let’s say u generate 500 units only.  And use 600 kWh.

So Tnb still charge u 600 units at 50 cent, and offer 10 cent back as eei, which effectively make it 40 cent per unit.  Which is rm240 in total. (Eei is worth rm60)

And since u only generate 500 kWh unit this month, if based on 50 cent rate, Tnb should deduct rm250, but since  u only need to pay Tnb rm240, so this will make Tnb rugi rm10. So to avoid This, the 500 units that suppose to be used to offset should not be in 50 cent, it should be only 40 cent.  And u will only get 200 ringgit worth of offset.  And need to still pay rm40. (240-200).( Pelarasan eei is rm50)

In this month, u get only 10 cent for eei for the 100 units which is not offset due to not enough generation. (600-500)
(Your actual eei is rm10)

Hopefully it’s clear to understand.
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coincidently mine is 600ish usage and i still dont understand how it is calculated. i mean i understand the eei logic, but the offset with/wo ST and the nett import logic is what throw me off
in essence in my example compared to earlier bill is the caj peruncitan (previously caj NEM/min charges) at RM10, which is an increase of rm7 + SST. earlier is is RM3 w/o SST

my nett import is 80kwh for the bill

This post has been edited by razr_sped: Aug 7 2025, 12:56 PM


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razr_sped
post Aug 7 2025, 12:58 PM

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QUOTE(WhitE LighteR @ Aug 7 2025, 12:56 PM)
U where got nett import. U nett zero.
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i suppose nett draw from network for the month,
it zero due to earlier credit


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