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 LYN Christian Fellowship Thread Ver 16, Welcome Christians, Love is the greatest

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SUSBrookLes
post Feb 10 2023, 05:34 PM

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QUOTE(TLIMS @ Feb 10 2023, 12:45 PM)
For Christians, our source and guidance comes from the Holy Bible. Any other books, religious teacher or prophet that contradicts the Holy Bible, we will consider it false teachings.

For Christians, our core believes are,
- Jesus Christ is the Son of the living God.
- Christ is the Messiah and saviour of mankind as promised and foretold in the old testament.
- that Christ was crucified on the cross of Calvary and He arose on the third day. This demonstrates that Christ defeated death which until today no man or religious teacher has demonstrated.
- the many miracles that Christ have performed during His ministry on earth. Such as healing the sick, resurrecting the dead and many more.
- Believers must believe and apply the blood of Christ in order to gain forgiveness of sins.

Any other books or individuals that contradicts our core believes are considered false. Only through Jesus Christ alone you will gain eternal life in heaven as promised in the Holy Bible.

Believing in Moses freeing the Hebrews from slavery or Jesus as a good man and messenger of God is not enough. Our covenant is in the blood of the perfect lamb Jesus Christ. There is no other way to heaven except through the blood of Jesus Christ.

No other religion emphasize on the blood except Christianity. Other religion says you must do good to make it to heaven. Christianity is the opposite and claimed that no amount of good works will save you. You can give all your money to charity or donate one of your kidney to a person in need. Still you will end up in hell if you do not acknowledge that Christ is the Son of the living God and that He sheds His blood on the cross so that we can be saved.

Men think that as long as their good works is more than their bad, they will be able to enter heaven. This is very wrong thinking and teaching.

Imagine if a heart surgeon drive recklessly and cause the death of another person. He goes up to the judge and tells the judge to set him free as he has save many lives as a surgeon. The surgeon thinks that by saving many lives it is ok to take away just one life in return for his freedom. If the judge listen to the surgeon and sets him free, what is your opinion of the judge? Would you think highly of such judge?

God is the perfect judge. Every sin or crime committed, SOMEONE has to pay the price. The Bible teaches clearly that all have sin and fall short of the glory of God. This means no man is perfect and men CANNOT atone for their sins let alone the sins of the world. Only Jesus Christ being the perfect sacrifice can offer Himself to take the penalty for the sins of humanity.

It is very important to grasp the basic meaning of Christianity. If you apply the blood of Christ in your life than you are be safe. This is the promise that the Holy Bible gives. Only by faith in Christ. If you don't believe then you can continue doing charity and good works. At the end of your life, your work is NOT perfect in the eyes of God as no man is perfect. Only Christ is. You can tell God how much you have donated or many hours you spend in an orphanage home, but men will never be able to meet God's perfect standard.

But as Christians, we must change our ways once we embrace the teachings of Christ. This means to change from our past life and to a new life under Christ. If you do criminal activity to get rich then you should stop it completely. If you cheat your customer just to earn more money, then you should stop doing it. If you hate you boss before this and always thinking or hurting him then you should stop thinking about it. If you're an alcoholic before this then you should stop doing it.

Its not easy. That is why we must constantly read the Bible and seek the help of the Holy Spirit. Try to understand what is God's plan for us.
*
You miss the point again. But I will pm you if you allow.

I dun mind spending time talking to you. But I dun want to just pm you and just get rejected out of a sudden.

But you are pretty near the Truth compared to that prophetjul guy for sure.

Your response to this post will determine how credible you really are. At least to me. I mean write so much and yet that is all you can do, then what you have written is a waste of time. Dun you think?

This post has been edited by BrookLes: Feb 11 2023, 12:55 AM
prophetjul
post Feb 10 2023, 05:42 PM

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QUOTE(BrookLes @ Feb 10 2023, 05:34 PM)
You miss the point again. But I will pm you if you allow.

I dun mind spending time talking to you. But I dun want to just pm you and just get rejected out of a sudden.

But you are pretty near the Truth compared to that prophetjul guy for sure.
*
And why am i so far from the Truth? laugh.gif
SUSBrookLes
post Feb 10 2023, 10:23 PM

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Looking at how fast he replies even though I did not tag him.

Looks like someone does not even have that peace that surpassed understanding.

And he seem to be worse then before. At least before the pandemic I would have a little respect for him. But now. No.

I remember this guy would at least block someone who is unreasonable and at least really not reply directly to a person who he has conflict with but now he seems to have behavior similar to another person in this thread. I guess it probably means that he really thinks I am "easy" meat and not very "unreasonable" that he has to "bully" me together with another person. At least in the past, he does not rely on "bullying" tactics.

It's that the Holy Ghost leading him to be worse?

I wonder why?

But speaking about prophecy. He really fulfils it.


This post has been edited by BrookLes: Feb 11 2023, 12:52 AM
SharpSword
post Feb 11 2023, 09:21 AM

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QUOTE(BrookLes @ Feb 10 2023, 10:23 PM)
Looking at how fast he replies even though I did not tag him.

Looks like someone does not even have that peace that surpassed understanding.

And he seem to be worse then before. At least before the pandemic I would have a little respect for him. But now. No.

I remember this guy would at least block someone who is unreasonable and at least really not reply directly to a person who he has conflict with but now he seems to have behavior similar to another person in this thread. I guess it probably means that he really thinks I am "easy" meat and not very "unreasonable" that he has to "bully" me together with another person. At least in the past, he does not rely on "bullying" tactics.

It's that the Holy Ghost leading him to be worse?


I wonder why?

But speaking about prophecy. He really fulfils it.
*
Relaxlah friend no need to get carried away. He is also a sinner saved by grace and prone to mistake and failure.We are all still learning. He was just trying to answer your question. Maybe he misread the intentions behind your line of questioning and "reacted".
Anyway I hope by now you have gotten some answers and I hope you will find grace to know who the true Jesus is. Shalom.
TSunknown warrior
post Feb 11 2023, 10:37 AM

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Jesus Christ wants to be savior, not as an example, teacher or prophet PART 1

1 Timothy 4:10 (NIV) - That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.

The meaning of savior is one who saves others. And I'll come straight to the point, Christ wants to be a "complete" savior, not a partial one. It's either He saves you completely or you do it yourself.
There is no God do his part, you do your part. The only part on you is your faith ie believe. Not doing. God would not have it.

Where do I base this theology from?

Romans 11:6 (NIV) - And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace.

The word "work" in Greek "Ergon" means the following;
work, task, employment; a deed, action; that which is wrought or made, a work.

So it's not just charity work but any "action". Including your performances to God.

Because if you have your part then according to Romans 11 verse 6, grace would no longer be grace.

Grace = Unearned, Unmerited favor of God. Something given to you without your effort or merit. If you think you have your "action" part then you will contradict entire

QUOTE
Romans 4:1-5 (NIV) - Abraham Justified by Faith

1 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, discovered in this matter? 2 If, in fact, Abraham was justified by works, he had something to boast about—but not before God. 3 What does Scripture say? “Abraham believed God, and it was credited to him as righteousness.” a

4 Now to the one who works, wages are not credited as a gift but as an obligation. 5 However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.


Read this verse 5 over and over again until it becomes a revelation to your spirit and your heart.

However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.


I underlined the word trust. That is Faith. No action of yours is involved, neither permitted in this verse.

STOP! Think for a moment here. It would make MUCH SENSE to say; God justify the Godly. Wouldn't it? Well for sure!

But why say God justify the "UNGODLY"????? I submit to you, even after being saved, you will do some ungodly things and I don't mean to discourage or discredit you. I'm talking reality. Talking about real Christian life processes.

God justify the Ungodly's faith. Think about that. Let this sink in.

There are very few preaching/teaching in churches on this because they are afraid people will misunderstand thinking it will lead to licentious lifestyle. So I continue to be ungodly therefore I can be credited righteousness. Same argument; Let us sin that grace may abound. (Romans 6:1)

These are very corrupted thinking if not insincere. At the heart of it, you don't trust God completely, you need your own works or effort for partial insurance for Salvation.

No Friend. You need to come to a place of vulnerability and trust God completely of what He said. No doing of yours...IE your obedience will merit you for Salvation. You can self justify and say it's a "response to faith" you can use whatever words but at the core of it, this theology does not solve this problem: you know you're going to heaven because you "acted" right before God. And that is "Works" my friend.

What about "we are God's workmanship" verse and what about "Faith without works is dead"? Many more, I'll address them in Part 2. In part 2, I will address first on "carrying your cross, hate your father, mother, cost of discipleship" arguments.

Suffice for now Grace is what saves you, Grace is what will bring you Home.

God Bless.



























prophetjul
post Feb 11 2023, 11:49 AM

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QUOTE(BrookLes @ Feb 10 2023, 10:23 PM)
Looking at how fast he replies even though I did not tag him.

Looks like someone does not even have that peace that surpassed understanding.

And he seem to be worse then before. At least before the pandemic I would have a little respect for him. But now. No.

I remember this guy would at least block someone who is unreasonable and at least really not reply directly to a person who he has conflict with but now he seems to have behavior similar to another person in this thread. I guess it probably means that he really thinks I am "easy" meat and not very "unreasonable" that he has to "bully" me together with another person. At least in the past, he does not rely on "bullying" tactics.

It's that the Holy Ghost leading him to be worse?

I wonder why?

But speaking about prophecy. He really fulfils it.
*
You remind me of the penguin. laugh.gif desmond2020
Judgemental as hell.
Bittz
post Feb 11 2023, 01:44 PM

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QUOTE(unknown warrior @ Feb 11 2023, 10:37 AM)
Jesus Christ wants to be savior, not as an example, teacher or prophet PART 1

1 Timothy 4:10 (NIV) - That is why we labor and strive, because we have put our hope in the living God, who is the Savior of all people, and especially of those who believe.

The meaning of savior is one who saves others. And I'll come straight to the point, Christ wants to be a "complete" savior, not a partial one. It's either He saves you completely or you do it yourself.
There is no God do his part, you do your part. The only part on you is your faith ie believe. Not doing. God would not have it.

Where do I base this theology from?

Romans 11:6 (NIV) - And if by grace, then it cannot be based on works; if it were, grace would no longer be grace.

The word "work" in Greek "Ergon" means the following;
work, task, employment; a deed, action; that which is wrought or made, a work.

So it's not just charity work but any "action". Including your performances to God.

Because if you have your part then according to Romans 11 verse 6, grace would no longer be grace.

Grace = Unearned, Unmerited favor of God. Something given to you without your effort or merit. If you think you have your "action" part then you will contradict entire
Read this verse 5 over and over again until it becomes a revelation to your spirit and your heart.

However, to the one who does not work but trusts God who justifies the ungodly, their faith is credited as righteousness.


I underlined the word trust. That is Faith. No action of yours is involved, neither permitted in this verse.

STOP! Think for a moment here. It would make MUCH SENSE to say; God justify the Godly. Wouldn't it? Well for sure!

But why say God justify the "UNGODLY"????? I submit to you, even after being saved, you will do some ungodly things and I don't mean to discourage or discredit you. I'm talking reality. Talking about real Christian life processes.

God justify the Ungodly's faith. Think about that. Let this sink in.

There are very few preaching/teaching in churches on this because they are afraid people will misunderstand thinking it will lead to licentious lifestyle. So I continue to be ungodly therefore I can be credited righteousness. Same argument; Let us sin that grace may abound. (Romans 6:1)

These are very corrupted thinking if not insincere. At the heart of it, you don't trust God completely, you need your own works or effort for partial insurance for Salvation.

No Friend. You need to come to a place of vulnerability and trust God completely of what He said. No doing of yours...IE your obedience will merit you for Salvation. You can self justify and say it's a "response to faith" you can use whatever words but at the core of it, this theology does not solve this problem: you know you're going to heaven because you "acted" right before God. And that is "Works" my friend.

What about "we are God's workmanship" verse and what about "Faith without works is dead"? Many more, I'll address them in Part 2. In part 2, I will address first on "carrying your cross, hate your father, mother, cost of discipleship" arguments.

Suffice for now Grace is what saves you, Grace is what will bring you Home.

God Bless.

*
Can't wait for part 2 rclxms.gif
Thank you. thumbup.gif

SharpSword
post Feb 11 2023, 05:48 PM

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What is faith? How is faith define? How do you know if you possess faith the Bible speaks of?
prophetjul
post Feb 11 2023, 08:39 PM

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QUOTE(SharpSword @ Feb 11 2023, 05:48 PM)
What is faith? How is faith define? How do you know if you possess faith the Bible speaks of?
*
Faith is PERFORMANCE! laugh.gif

17 (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.

18 Who against hope believed in hope, that he might become the father of many nations, according to that which was spoken, So shall thy seed be.

19 And being not weak in faith, he considered not his own body now dead, when he was about an hundred years old, neither yet the deadness of Sarah's womb:

20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;

21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform.

22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.
SharpSword
post Feb 11 2023, 09:13 PM

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QUOTE(prophetjul @ Feb 11 2023, 08:39 PM)
Faith is PERFORMANCE!  laugh.gif

17 (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.

18 Who against hope believed in hope, that he might become the father of many nations, according to that which was spoken, So shall thy seed be.

19 And being not weak in faith, he considered not his own body now dead, when he was about an hundred years old, neither yet the deadness of Sarah's womb:

20 He staggered not at the promise of God through unbelief; but was strong in faith, giving glory to God;

21 And being fully persuaded that, what he had promised, he was able also to perform.

22 And therefore it was imputed to him for righteousness.
*
Cool...... Heb11:17 by faith Abraham offered up Isaac.
Heb11;7 by faith Noah moved with godly fear and build the ark.
This is a difficult question.

prophetjul
post Feb 12 2023, 07:37 AM

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QUOTE(SharpSword @ Feb 11 2023, 09:13 PM)
Cool...... Heb11:17  by faith Abraham offered up Isaac.
Heb11;7  by faith Noah moved with godly fear and build the ark.
This is a difficult question.
*
Faith demands action. The word faith in Hebrew is a an active.
The Hebrew word emunah (אמונה, pronounced “eh-moo-nah”)
This is important because the Western concept of faith places the action on the one you have faith in, such as "faith in God".
This is passive ascendence.
But, the Hebrew word אמונה emunah places the action on the one who "carries out their Faith". It is not knowing that God will act, but rather I will do what I can to “carry out my Faith” in God.

That is the reason James says:

QUOTE
17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone.

18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works.

19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.

20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?

22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?

23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.

24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?

26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

King James Version (KJV)

SharpSword
post Feb 12 2023, 07:59 AM

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QUOTE(prophetjul @ Feb 12 2023, 07:37 AM)
Faith demands action. The word faith in Hebrew is a an active.
The Hebrew word emunah (אמונה, pronounced “eh-moo-nah”)
This is important because the Western concept of faith places the action on the one you have faith in, such as "faith in God".
This is passive ascendence.
But, the Hebrew word אמונה emunah places the action on the one who "carries out their Faith". It is not knowing that God will act, but rather I will do what I can to “carry out my Faith” in God.

That is the reason James says:
*
Wow. Good that you are diligent to research the Hebrew. A very useful person to know.
It's obvious there is a polemic on the definition and understanding of the concept of faith when we look AT Paul's pov and James pov.
I think they are both looking at the same thing but from different vantage points.
So there is a danger we oversimplify it and swing to one extreme.
We should note that Paul is writing from the context of the apostle to the gentiles. At that time there was influence creeping into the new gentile church from Judaism and his writing was intended to stem this.
James makes an intriguing point. The devil also believe but tremble. So when we talk about believe we need to qualify it.
I wonder if James wrote the epistle in response to Paul's overzealous views?

This post has been edited by SharpSword: Feb 12 2023, 08:03 AM
prophetjul
post Feb 12 2023, 08:36 AM

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QUOTE(SharpSword @ Feb 12 2023, 07:59 AM)
Wow. Good that you are diligent to research the Hebrew. A very useful person to know.
It's obvious there is a polemic on the definition and understanding of the concept of faith when we look AT Paul's pov and James pov.
I think they are both looking at the same thing but from different vantage points.
So there is a danger we oversimplify it and swing to one extreme.
We should note that Paul is writing from the context of the apostle to the gentiles. At that time there was influence creeping into the new gentile church from Judaism and his writing was intended to stem this.
James makes an intriguing point. The devil also believe but tremble. So when we talk about believe we need to qualify it.
I wonder if James wrote the epistle in response to Paul's overzealous views?
*
i think the modern Christian is affected by the following:

a) Reading and interpreting scriptures only in English
b) Viewing them through a modern worldview
c) Affected by Luther's Sola Fide. There is no Faith alone in scripture. Only Faith alone line is refuting it: James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Paul's understanding have been consistent with the Jewish ways.
I would not say Judaism perse without understanding the difference Judaism of those days and present. Jesus was practising Judaism of those days.
However, due to Jesus, the rabbinic Judaism of present is different from that of those days. Many blocks were placed by the pharisees to ward off the Messianic claims of Jesus.
Did you know that the early Jews already believed in the 2nd divine person of God?
The early Ararmaic Targums attest to that.

Roman Catholic
post Feb 12 2023, 11:56 AM

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QUOTE(prophetjul @ Feb 12 2023, 08:36 AM)
i think the modern Christian is affected by the following:

a) Reading and interpreting scriptures only in English
b) Viewing them through a modern worldview
c) Affected by Luther's Sola Fide. There is no Faith alone in scripture. Only Faith alone line is refuting it: James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.

Paul's understanding have been consistent with the Jewish ways.
I would not say Judaism perse without understanding the difference Judaism of those days and present. Jesus was practising Judaism of those days.
However, due to Jesus, the rabbinic Judaism of present is different from that of those days. Many blocks were placed by the pharisees to ward off the Messianic claims of Jesus.
Did you know that the early Jews already believed in the 2nd divine person of God?
The early Ararmaic Targums attest to that.
*
When you say that modern Christians are affected by reading and interpreting scriptures in English language ONLY, is that a positive (understand) or a negative (don't understand) ?
prophetjul
post Feb 12 2023, 01:14 PM

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QUOTE(Roman Catholic @ Feb 12 2023, 11:56 AM)
When you say that modern Christians are affected by reading and interpreting scriptures in English language ONLY, is that a positive (understand) or a negative (don't understand) ?
*
Negative. Since the scriptures were written in Hebrew and with a Jewish worldview.
Therefore, you get many funny doctrines due to different language understanding and worldviews.
Roman Catholic
post Feb 12 2023, 03:33 PM

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QUOTE(prophetjul @ Feb 12 2023, 01:14 PM)
Negative. Since the scriptures were written in Hebrew and with a Jewish worldview.
Therefore, you get many funny doctrines due to different language understanding and worldviews.
*
Ok so let me try to get this straight. A proper understanding of scriptures can only come from an individual who has training or knowledge both in the Hebrew language and also an understanding about Jewish faith & their worldviews ?

This post has been edited by Roman Catholic: Feb 12 2023, 04:01 PM
prophetjul
post Feb 12 2023, 05:04 PM

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QUOTE(Roman Catholic @ Feb 12 2023, 03:33 PM)
Ok so let me try to get this straight. A proper understanding of scriptures can only come from an individual who has training or knowledge both in the Hebrew language and also an understanding about Jewish faith & their worldviews ?
*
God has chosen to reveal His will and purpose of Messiah through the nation of Israel.
His scriptures is communicated through the use of Hebrew in The OT. If one has no understanding of this scriptures properly, how does one identify His Messiah?

You will be surprised how much we miss out on the depth of understanding the OT without a true knowledge of Hebrew.


Roman Catholic
post Feb 12 2023, 05:09 PM

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QUOTE(prophetjul @ Feb 12 2023, 05:04 PM)
God has chosen to reveal His will and purpose of Messiah through the nation of Israel.
His scriptures is communicated through the use of Hebrew in The OT. If one has no understanding of this scriptures properly, how does one identify His Messiah?

You will be surprised how much we miss out on the depth of understanding the OT without a true knowledge of Hebrew.
*
Oh I see, it's about the OT.

Ok what about the NT ? Will the modern Christian still be impacted negatively or positively on trying to study and understand the NT ?
prophetjul
post Feb 12 2023, 05:21 PM

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QUOTE(Roman Catholic @ Feb 12 2023, 05:09 PM)
Oh I see, it's about the OT.

Ok what about the NT ? Will the modern Christian still be impacted negatively or positively on trying to study and understand the NT ?
*
The OT forms the foundation for the NT.
Therefore, it is good to understand the OT before the NT.
Even when Jesus in his dialogues, they are conversed in Hebrew/Aramaic with lots of Jewish idioms.
How will we understand Him if we do not know these?

Although Paul wrote in Greek, his mindset is predominantly Jewish.

Reading English translation alone and thinking with a modern mindset and world view will surely mislead one.
prophetjul
post Feb 12 2023, 05:33 PM

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An example: Binding and Loosing

In Matthew’s Gospel Jesus said to his disciple Peter, “I will give you the keys of the Kingdom of Heaven and whatever you bind on earth shall have been bound in heaven and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven” (Matt 16:19). A couple of chapters later he said very similar words to his other disciples (Mat 18:18).

What are the most common explanations and teachings about these “binding and loosing” verses that one hears today? Most people assume that they have something to do with spiritual warfare and binding the devil. Indeed, the surrounding context is about disciple’s authority, only the devil is not involved here.

In reality, binding and loosing are known technical legal expressions in the ancient Jewish world. “To bind” is to restrict, to confine, to limit and in a legal sense “to forbid something”. On the opposite side “to loose” is to unbind, to untie, to free, to release which in a legal sense means “to permit something”.


Here is an example from the first-century Jewish historian Flavius Josephus. He writes that under queen Alexandra of Jerusalem, the Pharisees “became the administrators of all public affairs, empowered to banish and readmit whom they pleased, as well as to loose and to bind”. (Jewish War 1:111). Josephus said that the Pharisees had the authority “to loose and to bind” and no, not demons or Satan.

When Jesus used this terminology in the Gospels, he did not speak about prayer or spiritual warfare either. The context is legal and the terms should be interpreted through first-century Jewish context. Just like the Pharisees in Josephus’s quote, the disciples were given a right to legislate, a right to make rules and norms, allowing and forbidding things in their own community. And that is binding and loosing first century’s style.

https://weekly.israelbiblecenter.com/bindin...-century-style/

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