Which diet is best for you and why? Bincangkan result anda.

I go for the mixture.

Morning - normal coffee + 2 half boiled eggs.

Lunch - eat whatever foods available with the colleague, no restriction. Once full, stop eating even though there is leftover foods on the plate. Don't use the motto "don't waste food, must tuck in everything into the stomach". Adopt "stop when full".

Dinner - with restriction. Usually low calories foods with high fiber ( lettuce, bell pepper, cherry tomatoes ) + protein with low fats (shrimps / chicken fillet run with boiled water)

If I do above, I can get 0.2~0.3kg average reduction in body weight if I workout on the same day.

Weekend usually will take some high calories food ( cheat days) but always follow up with some vigorous sport during late evening / night time. Weekend I usually gained 0.5~1.2kg over my eating habit.

Keto was the one that got me to first time see the abs.

Not sustainable tho, with one of the reason being rather expensive. Best diet is the one that you can stick to it in the long run. Took me a while to modify a normal diet eating watever i want and got me close to the result keto did.

I'm five years in. Why expensive?

Well my keto was aiming for 65% fat, 30% prot, 5% carb. That means on a 2500cals diet (standard for my cut), Need to ingest quite abit of meat to reach the prot intake.

Beef is not exactly cheap (more so the price is crazy now) so can't have it as often. only left with the usual chicken, eggs and cheese (processed). Got tired of them lol

I try not to deep fry stuff since it makes counting the calories even harder thus making the diet alot more rigid too.

I never court calories. Calories doesn't matter in keto. I picture the percentage as a plate. U know like a pie chart

This post has been edited by Satanist: Aug 24 2022, 11:43 PM

Not exactly true. Calories do matter in any diet. Even keto. Just that ppl tend to lose weight thanks to the diet being more satiating.

I've seen plenty of ppl not losing weight on keto just because they think it's a magical gateway to infinite fried chickens and cheeses.

I wanted to portion size initially, but as I was dead set on reaching a goal, I added calorie counting just to make sure I'm on right track.

It became a habit now lol

Lost 15kg on first attempt on dirty keto which is mostly KFC. Calories only matter when it's carbs. When u know how to do clean keto u can sustain it.

Of course you can lose weight while on kfc. To give some perspective, 15 pieces of kfc chicken if all drumstick and wings only equates to about 2250 to 2500 calories.

6 pieces of the biggest piece which is the breast is around 2100 to 2500.

If you're 100 kilos and exercises at least 2-4 times a week, you tdee is around 2600-3000.

You're in a caloric deficit, you just didn't realize it.

Not trying to argue anything,but just trying to shed some light that no diet is magical

Only thighs and little drumstick. Skin on. I don't take wings or breasts. Now I see where u went wrong. Ur protein too high.

This post has been edited by Satanist: Aug 25 2022, 09:20 AM

Lol there you go. Thigh and drumstick. At most they're only 450-500 cals together if youre on snack plate. Twice a day still at most 1k. How can you not lose weight.

And of course I needed the protein. How am I gonna recover from all the lifting if I don't consume enough

Plenty of research already debunked all these diet myths, keto,IF etc. But if your believe is already set in stone, nothing I say will change your mind unfortunately. If you can sustain it in the long run, then go ahead and keep on. Keto got me to where I wanted, but I didn't wanna miss out all the good carbs lol

Dinner plate dude. Point is i don't count calories. Plus calories are metabolized differently in your body. That where you are lacking

Dinner plate is still 750-800 cals. Twice a day still 1600. Even if 3 times a day still 2400 max. Nope lol. What's next

3 dinner plates is 2,583kcal per day. kcal get it?



Whoops i spoke too soon, ill admit i was wrong.


Plus 2 coleslaws every plate thats 300kcals screw the bun.. In total 3 dinner plates is 3483kcal.



This post has been edited by Satanist: Aug 25 2022, 10:28 AM

Lol

The 2573 is only if you have all 3 thighs, for 3 sets of dinner plate. The figure i gave was based on 2 thigh 1 drumstick. It was just estimate. And do you even have Dinner plate 3 times a day in the first place? If yes everyday? On 1 sitting even? No exercise at all?

And it cost 60 bucks (if really dinner plate 3 times), that's not very sustainable for a lot of other ppl too, financially.


And take the figures as a reference only.with kfc malaysia now mainly serving spring sized chicken, the value is likely less.

Yes i request for 3 thighs it was possible back then. Exercise never changed. same routine. Dude that was dirty keto. Plus u forgot the coleslaw.
You're right in the morning it was 5 bacon and 3 sunny side up eggs and bulletproof coffee. Sustainable is up to your knowledge and experience.

Of course i was trying to lose weight not bulking up.

axtray

ok then we compare with 3 nasi lemak ayam goreng fuhhh best. Which is 2250cal perday. But i increase weight. How now?

Since you wrote quite abit

Breakfast -
5 bacon 225 cals
3 ssu eggs 300 cals
Bulletproof coffee 140 cals per 100ml. I assume 200 so 280cals.
Total approximately 800 cals

For the dinner plate, coleslaw is 150 cals. With the 3 thighs equates to about 1011 cals. So how many servings of this dinner plate you have? Twice a day? Everyday even in thr 15kilo weight lost journey (congrats on this part)? Total will be approximately 2800 cals. If 3 servings 3600 cals with breakfast . Honestly I doubt you did this everyday.

Next will be how heavy were you when you first started. And how many times you exercise per week.


Sustainability is of course up to knowledge and experience. But as a first mentioned, keto is just not a cheap diet, for me at least. With the budget I allocated for food per month, majority of the time is chicken and egg (fast food or home cook). Beef or lamb on occasion.

And I wasn't on keto for just few months. I was on just as long as you

Lol the funny thing is, this was the main reason why I quit keto.

When you're on keto, you're so glycogen depleted that you don't hold as much water. I can happily say that from the 15 kilos you lost, 3-5 kg (depending how overweight you were) is water.

You introduce carbs back into the diet, your body will hold more water, thanks to the glycogen. And to make it worse sodium will further help increase the water retention. Which makes you look soft and bloated.

I went on keto, got my abs. Mission accomplished. then introduced carbs back, with same calories while on keto, immediately gaining weight.

That's why I said, if youre able to sustain keto, just go for it.

Oh, fitness pal information may not be accurate. If the nasi lemak ayam that you're talking about is from lets say village park where they give whole leg, the calorie count can go up to 900 per plate. Just saying.

This post has been edited by axtray: Aug 25 2022, 11:24 AM

Still u didnt address why same or higher calorie i lost weight compared to..'normal' diet. Water weight or not i got from 38 inch size pants to 31-32. Actually the weight is nonsense because fat is lighter than muscle. If your body learn how to use fat as fuel thats the key to losing size.

I did actually if you read again.

Keto, lost weight thanks to mainly on calorie deficit and less water retention

Normal diet, you gained likely due to water is introduced back to the body. Or probably underestimating the calorie count even.

You'll be surprised how water weight I. E. Bloating can change the shape of your body, if you properly take time and observe that is.

And I emphasized do not simply refer to my fitness pal. Any tomdick and Harry can update info there. A plate of kueyteow for 350 cals? No way.

Being fat adapted, yes. But you cannot run from the law of conservation of energy. If that's the case i wouldn't have lost more than 25 kilos since mco1.0 till now eating watever I want, but watching my calories.

I'll also leave this here

Also more on the bit where no diet is magical.

IG

Not sure how to embed ig lol

Yea at the end he did promote his app which you can ignore. But he did quote studies to support the claims. So that's why I've been saying since earlier, if you can sustain keto, by all means go for it. The weight increase while on normal diet, as I mentioned simply because of how the body reacts to the macro, micronutrients and even sodium. If you actually eat 750 cals of nasi lemak, 3 times per day and continue exercise as how you did with keto, the gain is temporary until it reaches a certain threshold and you'll eventually start loosing the weight.

Well as long as you're in a deficit that is

This post has been edited by axtray: Aug 25 2022, 11:53 AM

Theres no deficit if we compare nasi lemak ayam 750cal with he above calories. You're deflecting.

Is all water weight gained back?? ..LOL you're wrong . As i told you before. Calories from different foods are metabolized differently in the body. No gym required. Never once i went to gym.

Another one of my fav b4 keto. 620cal per plate when plus 1 telur mata.. LOL calorie in calorie out debunked.
Btw I was vegetarian for 3 months as well even lost a 1kg +- thats it.

OK mali, snack plate vs maggi goreng ayam. LOL calorie in calorie out?



This post has been edited by Satanist: Aug 25 2022, 12:26 PM

What the hell man. Which part am I deflecting.

"Calories from different foods are metabolized differently in the body"

This bit, you are technically correct. But rather than food, it's macro nutrient. you can read more on thermo effects of food.

"Is all water weight gained back?? ..LOL you're wrong."

I can confidently say I am not wrong lol. As I said, you'll be surprised on how well your body can hold water, especially if you pair carbs with high sodium foods.

This post has been edited by axtray: Aug 25 2022, 12:59 PM

Damn son, I can confidently say that I was almost in the same boat as you, thinking that keto was magical when i first started seeing my abs. but here's the hard truth, if you're not losing weight on watever diet you're on, you're just not on a deficit.

i've mentioned it before and ill mention it again. stop referring to myfitnesspal for your calorie tracking. it's a good place to start at first. But in your case, your supposed "3 thighs + coleslaw" you're nowhere near the 1.3k calories as quoted by the site.




This post has been edited by axtray: Aug 25 2022, 01:07 PM

wrong son look at the calories again i posted and tell me im on a deficit. I should be on a deficit in 'normal' diet. Denial mode now? Calorie counting is obsolete.

which i did respond. 1.3k snack plate for a dinner plate

your version of 3 thighs + coles law are not even close to it.

and can you confidently confirm that the supposed 620 cals maggi+telo mata is the only thing that you have for the day? no way

newsflash, actua maggi goreng + telo mata probably nets more than 700 cals. Again, do not only refer to myfitness pal for calorie tracking.

This post has been edited by axtray: Aug 25 2022, 01:12 PM

OK fine.. KFC snackplate 1.3k cal vs 620 maggi goreng telor mata. but the diet i lost weight is on 1.3K cal. You understand the simple logic son?

Lol son, ive been quoting sources where in them, "actual" studies are being quoted.

You on the other hand, simply spewing stuff without any backing. Just because you lost some weight by sheer luck eating something that 1) puts you on a caloric deficit and 2) able to sustain the deficit in long term which lead to the weight loss makes you full time believer that keto is the holy grail of weight lost diet. Sorry son that's not how it works.

My argument is simple, if you're not losing weight, you're not on caloric deficit. If you get out of keto and ate your maggi telomata and gained weight, my previous post already covered on the cause behind it.

CICO, It's old, but it's physics. sorry son

Where the studies? Show me? All you show me are some idiots on youtube. My results are repeatable, 5 years in yo theres no sheer luck involved and Theres no deficit as shown in the calories of a a typical 'normal' meal(maggi goreng ayam telor mata) vs keto (snack plate). You want to count calories keto vs normal snacks? I assure you will lose gram for gram. Sorry son, its biology, not physics.

The so called "idiots" that i shared are basically the frontline people who are fighting against the people who glorify and spread fad diets. like you lol. And if you even bothered to read my posts properly, i did share an IG post which literally QUOTED the studies.

your results are repeatable and 5 years in and it's no sheer luck? It's simple. You just got it right from the start. you were on a deficit.

How are you so convinced that you were not on a deficit? by relying on myfitness pal that claims dinner plate is 1.3k calories? Newsflash, that's called overestimating. and it's one of key diet method for overweight ppl to lose weight. you want to know the actual calories, "WEIGH" them.

LOL why need to fight? Because those fellas are gym owners and CICO works for their business model.

Nope no deficit stop lying. Already shown screenshot you denier.

Weigh them? Do you even know how calories are determined son? And you claim physics? Want to check fat vs carbohydrate in energy density? Bring it. I know the answer.

LMAO you call this a study? axtray

There are 10 posts in it. Scroll them son. Look up the pmid numbers. Everything is there.

While as for your claims, I'm still waiting for any scientific evidence from you "claiming" calories don't matter while on keto.

Because they simply want to stop misconception being spread? calories don't matter on keto is one of the biggest balooney i've ever heard.

As i said, it is deficit if you lose weight. if you are simply basing the numbers on myfitnesspal or google. they are not accurate. period. your dinner plate is not 1.3k
calories. period.

Another news flash, your kfc thigh may likely not even be 287 calories (as per the pic you posted earlier). With kfc chicking size being so pathetic, it's way lesser. so yea you're on deficit lol

hahaha what do you mean energy density. 4 cals for 1 gram of carbs vs 9 cals for 1 g of fat? this is no rocket science.

This post has been edited by axtray: Aug 25 2022, 03:56 PM

Those PMID dont even detail what food they ate. Useless.


25182101 no keto. Low carb fastest weight loss.
32238384 no keto.
35443107 no keto

28193517 K.D.H. has received funding from the Nutrition Science Initiative to investigate the effects of ketogenic diets on human energy expenditure


I cite PMC2716748 then.

the 28193517 literally stated it already. tho it is meta analysis.

PMC2716748 on the other hand,
OBJECTIVE:
To determine the effects of a 24-week ketogenic diet (consisting of 30 g carbohydrate, 1 g/kg body weight protein, 20% saturated fat, and 80% polyunsaturated and monounsaturated fat) in obese patients.

It did not state whether they're on a caloric deficit or not? Not able to calculate the caorie based from the vague fat intake percentage they gave. and these patients are obese too.


And to counter that, here you go
link

But we're getting abit off topic here. I am not trying to compare benefits of keto vs non keto. i've done both and i don't care. Im more interested with your claim that calories don't matter part.

I did found 1 research article that argues if calories matter or not on, but dated waaay back in 2004 which detailed on it. But it did also highlighted the rapid lost was also due to losing water as the diet has similar effect as diuretics.

This post has been edited by axtray: Aug 25 2022, 05:37 PM

Unreliable and contain conflict of interests.

Water weight 3-5kg only what u said that yourself. . No caloric deficit is the aim of the ketogenic diet waattt..

Then I invoke PMC506782 "A calorie is a calorie" violates the second law of thermodynamics lor.

The 3-5kg is obviously estimate. The fatter the person, the more water heshe carries. How is this not obvious enough to you seriously.

That's the 2004 article that I was referring to. You can cherry pick the studies all you want. But I've found plenty of other more recent ones published after that, which states otherwise. One which I shared earlier, and one other example
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/18025815/

So yea my point still stands you were on caloric deficit lol

While Im at it, below are all the studies that I've found confirming no diet is superior to another.

https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC8017325/ - 2021
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/33107442/ - 2021 meta analysis.
https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31525701/ - 2020 meta analysis

Seriously im not against any form of diet. just do watever that you are able to sustain in the long term and not yo yo like what happened to me in the last few years.

If you're talking on celular level then i agree calorie deficit because calories from different foods are treated differently. But im talking about the food going into your mouth.

Everyfood that you consume contains macro nutrients. Every macro nutrients contains calories.

You eat 3 pieces of fried chicken totalling 900 cals. Is still 900 cals. Where the calories coming from protein and fats.

You eat 900 calories worth of pasta, is still 900 cals where it comes combination of carbs, protein and fat.

Yes they are not exactly the same simply because each macro nutrients have different thermic effect in order for the body to digest them. FYI protein is the highest at about 20-25% with fat actually being the lowest. I've mentioned this already in my previous post and even shared a video by Layne Norton, which you immediately discarded calling those ppl idiots.

So from the above example after taking into account thermic effect of food, net calories for the chicken is indeed lower. But it is mainly thanks to protein's high thermic effect. Not fat.

If someone is anal enough to go into such crazy length to track their calories, all the power to them. But the basis is still CICO, no matter what diet you're on

I support "beans diet"

No good.

I agree with this. The foods with higher thermic effect gives better effect. The regular foods with high thermic effect in my diet are shrimps, chicken breast, eggs, Greek yogurt, cashews, almonds, jalapenos , orange bell pepper, sweet potatoes, plums, banana, berries, apples.

the more popular system to determine thermic effects would be the GI index

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glycemic_index

Interesting & eye opening. Thanks for the link.

GI is inadequate. You hv to look at the GL also

After reading the related GI & GL, basically for all the refined carbs( flour & rice ) products need to be reduced in the daily meal intakes if the work nature is not labor intensive type.

This post has been edited by nihility: Sep 3 2022, 11:46 AM

natural sentiment would be to reduce given the obesity rate nowadays.

However, your caloric intake is dependent on how much you burn on a daily basis. Sometimes you need to increase