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 Bogleheads Local Chapter [Malaysia Edisi]

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encikbuta
post Jun 2 2022, 01:18 PM

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QUOTE(sgh @ Jun 2 2022, 12:43 PM)
Just notice your own personal finance blog. I am curious those listed are all your investment instruments? You have zero dollars in say bank FD, govt bonds, endowment insurance etc? Those are considered safe and capital guaranteed investment.
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Yep that's all my investments. My emergency fund (RM43k) is in RHB Cash Management Fund if that's what you're asking? It can be withdrawn pretty quickly. And that RM7k cash in my bank account helps too.

Or if you're asking where is my 'fixed income' portion of my investment, I don't have any, lol! I decided to just go 100% equity.
Ramjade
post Jun 2 2022, 01:29 PM

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QUOTE(encikbuta @ Jun 2 2022, 01:18 PM)
Yep that's all my investments. My emergency fund (RM43k) is in RHB Cash Management Fund if that's what you're asking? It can be withdrawn pretty quickly. And that RM7k cash in my bank account helps too.

Or if you're asking where is my 'fixed income' portion of my investment, I don't have any, lol! I decided to just go 100% equity.
*
KDI save give better returns than RHB.

This post has been edited by Ramjade: Jun 2 2022, 01:30 PM
sgh
post Jun 2 2022, 02:55 PM

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QUOTE(Ramjade @ Jun 2 2022, 01:03 PM)
I have zero dollars in FD.
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Thanks for sharing so your investment instruments have nothing that is capital guaranteed correct? What about Msia EPF? That is also a form of "investment" by the govt on behalf of citizen just like Spore govt. Govt worry citizen dunno how to invest go and lose monies then old already no work stomach hungry ask govt feed them. But your govt quite lenient at age 50,55 can take all out unlike mine which come out with some Minimum Sum concept to buy annuity plan so every month got allowance from that in your retirement years and that is mandatory btw.
Ramjade
post Jun 2 2022, 03:03 PM

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QUOTE(sgh @ Jun 2 2022, 02:55 PM)
Thanks for sharing so your investment instruments have nothing that is capital guaranteed correct? What about Msia EPF? That is also a form of "investment" by the govt on behalf of citizen just like Spore govt. Govt worry citizen dunno how to invest go and lose monies then old already no work stomach hungry ask govt feed them. But your govt quite lenient at age 50,55 can take all out unlike mine which come out with some Minimum Sum concept to buy annuity plan so every month got allowance from that in your retirement years and that is mandatory btw.
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I don't waste time with FDs nowadays.

Yes got epf. I withdraw out the max.during last8 covid crash and invest in my own. Even the minimum amount allow to be use for investment via unit trust also I max it out. Already besting EPF returns.
sgh
post Jun 2 2022, 05:38 PM

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QUOTE(encikbuta @ Jun 2 2022, 01:18 PM)
Yep that's all my investments. My emergency fund (RM43k) is in RHB Cash Management Fund if that's what you're asking? It can be withdrawn pretty quickly. And that RM7k cash in my bank account helps too.

Or if you're asking where is my 'fixed income' portion of my investment, I don't have any, lol! I decided to just go 100% equity.
*
I am actually asking for your overall investment portfolio but seem you have it covered with emergency and cash in bank balance. This is I think the fixed income portion. Now I understand your blog those are the 100% equities portion. Thanks for sharing.
encikbuta
post Jun 2 2022, 06:39 PM

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QUOTE(sgh @ Jun 2 2022, 05:38 PM)
I am actually asking for your overall investment portfolio but seem you have it covered with emergency and cash in bank balance. This is I think the fixed income portion. Now I understand your blog those are the 100% equities portion. Thanks for sharing.
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Oh lol. Those posts I update monthly are for my investment portfolio only (cash I can control).

I have another page under "Net Worth" which shows my everything - fixed equity (home and car), current equity (investment portfolio) and retirement asset (EPF, PRS & insurance).
CoastFireSoon P
post Jun 3 2022, 09:21 AM

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QUOTE(Medufsaid @ Jun 1 2022, 07:51 PM)
sigh probably off-topic but here goes.

actually, since you've money in the Public Mutual eco-system (and already paid the hefty 3.5% entrance fee per ringgit), it has more options than a robo like say StashAway. you can easily switch to a US unit trust without needing to convert your RM into USD, since you are just buying UT units denominated in RM. during my time, the fee to switch is RM25 regardless of transaction amount

there are also Far East or even ASEAN based UT. no need to worry of reconverting from USD to HKD/SGD etc... all denominated in RM
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I could, but I'm literally down 10k so takut lol. I'd much rather move it out of the ecosystem to be honest. Don't like being charged up to 1.5% annual fees. A friend of mine told me to look at their top 10 holdings. If they got potential stay, If they don't, just cut losses. OUCH. It's a small caps fund.

Encikbuta - Nice to find a personal finance blog! I love reading them. I have one too where I document my journey but not in such detail as you. I'm terrible at math lol: Lowyat won't let me include the link cos still probation so later I share. Also glad to meet another one investing in VT. 100% equities is so brave!

I am planning of just simplifying into that from VTI + VXUS cos I really tired of paying MIDF's super high trading fees. Just buying via Rakuten Trade now. When I realise all I have to do to invest every month is just funnel fix amount every month there, I'm like, eh, so easy ah? Lol. Before, I had to funnel to so many different places, roboadvisors lah, UT lah, brokers lah ... glad to know all I have to do is just that for now.

My funds are quite songsang right now. My equity part of my portfolio (Excluding EPF) is 55%. Fixed income is 45% - a mix of FDs, bonds and MM. I'm hoping to bring the equity up to 70%. My Malaysian equities almost half of my equity portfolio rclxub.gif but I'm quickly catching up with my foreign investments, so soon it'll be at least 30% of the portfolio. It'll take me some time to gather the bullets. I suppose as I'm 45 already, It's reasonable to have about 30% or more in Fixed Income.

IBKR - still conflicted about that. My question is, if anything happens to the company, how do we get the money back? No one can answer that for now so I still takut.

Glad to learn from everyone!
toiletwater
post Jun 3 2022, 09:51 AM

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35 aged semi-booglehead here. Surprised to find MY version.

Most of my investments is in ASNB (non-bumi fund) and local stocks, but past 4 years I have been pumping more money into IBKR account to hold VOO. The reason I use VOO despite its tax disadvanages is that the differences are minimal.

Also, recently I have been dabbling with individual stock picks (US and HK) and crypto. As it has been too tempting to stay out. But I try to keep it within 5% max for these risky securities.

I'd kill for a low-cost KLSE index fund ETF. And maybe other ASEAN market stock indexes too. So tired of looking at local markets, news, valuations. When US market seems bleak or the exchange rate is unfavourable like now, there's no choice but to put funds into local markets.
encikbuta
post Jun 3 2022, 09:54 AM

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QUOTE(CoastFireSoon @ Jun 3 2022, 09:21 AM)
I am planning of just simplifying into that from VTI + VXUS cos I really tired of paying MIDF's super high trading fees. Just buying via Rakuten Trade now. When I realise all I have to do to invest every month is just funnel fix amount every month there, I'm like, eh, so easy ah? Lol. Before, I had to funnel to so many different places, roboadvisors lah, UT lah, brokers lah ... glad to know all I have to do is just that for now.
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Yea, this is exactly what I did! damn tired distributing my savings into so many investment vehicles so I just reducing them to mostly VT helped with my sanity.

QUOTE(CoastFireSoon @ Jun 3 2022, 09:21 AM)
I suppose as I'm 45 already, It's reasonable to have about 30% or more in Fixed Income.
*
Yea agreed. Risk appetite is relative to age. I go 100% equity coz I believe I'm still young (at heart, lol). I might change my tune once I hit the 40!

QUOTE(CoastFireSoon @ Jun 3 2022, 09:21 AM)
IBKR - still conflicted about that. My question is, if anything happens to the company, how do we get the money back? No one can answer that for now so I still takut.
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same here. aside from fees, legacy planning plays a big role in my consideration of overseas broker selection. the amount i have invested in VT is quite huge (to me) and on top of that, i have a few dependents. so the thought of having my funds 'stuck' overseas upon my sudden demise is worse than the death itself! it has to be an SC-approved broker and for now, it looks like a toss up between Rakuten Trade or FSMOne's ETF RSP plan.
CoastFireSoon P
post Jun 3 2022, 10:12 AM

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QUOTE(toiletwater @ Jun 3 2022, 09:51 AM)
35 aged semi-booglehead here. Surprised to find MY version.

Most of my investments is in ASNB (non-bumi fund) and local stocks, but past 4 years I have been pumping more money into IBKR account to hold VOO. The reason I use VOO despite its tax disadvanages is that the differences are minimal.

Also, recently I have been dabbling with individual stock picks (US and HK) and crypto. As it has been too tempting to stay out. But I try to keep it within 5% max for these risky securities.

I'd kill for a low-cost KLSE index fund ETF. And maybe other ASEAN market stock indexes too. So tired of looking at local markets, news, valuations. When US market seems bleak or the exchange rate is unfavourable like now, there's no choice but to put funds into local markets.
*
Me too man. I explored the Malaysian ETFs, we do have a KLSE-type index fund ETF - FTSE Bursa Malaysia KLCI ETF but apparently it doesn't track the entire index but just certain companies (30 biggest listed companies), so it's not as diversified as we'd like. Performance some more not so great.

Speaking of Malaysian ETFs wonder why not many people exploring them? I bought two funds mainly:
- ABF Malaysia Bond Index Fund (0800EA)
- TradePlus MSCI Asia Ex Japan Reits Tracker

Glad to know you're into VOO. Irish domiciled funds have higher expense ratio than US Vanguard funds and also the brokerage fee is higher apparently, so I think it more or less evens out in the end. Well, until you amass too much and then you start feeling the WHT pinch and get worried about estate tax.

QUOTE
same here. aside from fees, legacy planning plays a big role in my consideration of overseas broker selection. the amount i have invested in VT is quite huge (to me) and on top of that, i have a few dependents. so the thought of having my funds 'stuck' overseas upon my sudden demise is worse than the death itself! it has to be an SC-approved broker and for now, it looks like a toss up between Rakuten Trade or FSMOne's ETF RSP plan.


encikbuta I remember reading up about people trying to get back money from an investment bank that kantoi, it wasn't easy. somemore it resides overseas. I don't know lah, I don't have that risk apetite - totally understand since you got dependents. Thanks for telling me about the FSMOne ETF plan. Will check it out.
Medufsaid
post Jun 3 2022, 10:19 AM

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since 2009, the KLCI index has been revamped to only have 30 companies. the only official successor to the original index (maybe want to follow dow jones). this new index is the one that Edge and thestar refers to.

There's a top 100 (a combination of FBMKLCI and Mid 70) but hardly anyone knows it exists

This post has been edited by Medufsaid: Jun 3 2022, 10:21 AM
Davidtcf
post Jun 3 2022, 10:24 AM

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QUOTE(CoastFireSoon @ Jun 3 2022, 10:12 AM)
Glad to know you're into VOO. Irish domiciled funds have higher expense ratio than US Vanguard funds and also the brokerage fee is higher apparently, so I think it more or less evens out in the end. Well, until you amass too much and then you start feeling the WHT pinch and get worried about estate tax.
encikbuta I remember reading up about people trying to get back money from an investment bank that kantoi, it wasn't easy. somemore it resides overseas. I don't know lah, I don't have that risk apetite - totally understand since you got dependents. Thanks for telling me about the FSMOne ETF plan. Will check it out.
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not true, your returns from VOO will be lower than that of VUAA/CSPX due to the 30% tax on dividends. For VUAA/CSPX it will be 15% tax on the accumulated dividends which is lower. Short term you do not see much difference in the % gained, but long term wise after many years it will be apparent. For countries with tax treaty with US or US citizens, they will able to claim back part of those dividend tax or offset them.. for us, EU and Singaporeans investors that has no tax treaty with US, it will be an extra 15% loss for us each time when dividends are paid out.

This is even more apparent for ETFs like VOO as they are distributing the dividends. Every time you receive dividends it already has an extra 15% tax charged to it.

Better stick to Irish domiciled types like VUAA/CSPX. Currently no way to buy them via brokers in Malaysia, so have to use brokers like IBKR to do so.
The part we will be charged higher is the transfer fees from Malaysia to US. Even using Wise to IBKR has some fees, but most people prefer transfer from Wise to CIMB SG, then to IBKR pay USD2 per conversion to USD (spot rate). For long term investing then it is worth it.

This post has been edited by Davidtcf: Jun 3 2022, 10:26 AM
Medufsaid
post Jun 3 2022, 10:32 AM

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sometimes the pro and cons are not so clear cut. for example, yesterday US markets rallied, however if you stuck to only Irish Domiciled etfs, you are unable to topup more units on the spot as LSE had a public holiday. chasing today when Irish Domiciled starts trading later is too late

my stand could change if Irish domiciled can give me 0% tax instead of still a 15% rate

This post has been edited by Medufsaid: Jun 3 2022, 10:33 AM
Hoshiyuu
post Jun 3 2022, 11:17 AM

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QUOTE(Medufsaid @ Jun 3 2022, 10:32 AM)
sometimes the pro and cons are not so clear cut. for example, yesterday US markets rallied, however if you stuck to only Irish Domiciled etfs, you are unable to topup more units on the spot as LSE had a public holiday. chasing today when Irish Domiciled starts trading later is too late

my stand could change if Irish domiciled can give me 0% tax instead of still a 15% rate
*
Well, part of the Bogleheads modus operandi is to invest at fixed intervals and don't time the market anyway, so it's surprisingly a smaller deal than it is. For broad market index, it's really hard to profit or loss from the movement, no need to worry too much about it.

I wouldn't bother with KLCI Index - Index investing doesn't mean you buy anything that says it's an index or an ETF. You buy VWRA/VT because its a representation of the broad market that it covers the broad market that in general trend up.

KLCI as a whole has been trading sideways or down for the last decade, you couldn't even beat inflation even if there was an index for it.

Keep it simple. Stay with broad market indexes, don't overthink it and end up with diworsification.

This post has been edited by Hoshiyuu: Jun 3 2022, 11:21 AM
CoastFireSoon P
post Jun 3 2022, 11:32 AM

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QUOTE(Hoshiyuu @ Jun 3 2022, 11:17 AM)
Well, part of the Bogleheads modus operandi is to invest at fixed intervals and don't time the market anyway, so it's surprisingly a smaller deal than it is. For broad market index, it's really hard to profit or loss from the movement, no need to worry too much about it.

I wouldn't bother with KLCI Index - Index investing doesn't mean you buy anything that says it's an index or an ETF. You buy VWRA/VT because its a representation of the broad market that it covers the broad market that in general trend up.

KLCI as a whole has been trading sideways or down for the last decade, you couldn't even beat inflation even if there was an index for it.

Keep it simple. Stay with broad market indexes, don't overthink it and end up with diworsification.
*
Agree! That's why didn't even bother with the index. Besides, so heavily invested in Malaysia via ETF already. So my focus now is on shoveling more foreign funds.

Admittedly, I find it hard NOT to time the market sometimes. I usually invest right after I get my salary, but I'm thinking - Maybe I should invest when VT / VTI is lower. And then I hesitate, and then weeks pass and so on lol.

About VOO etc, I watched a recent video by Ziet that made me more assured that it's okay to invest in VT for now until I amassed too much and I can buy Ireland domiciled funds to make it worth it. Just search on Youtube "The Best & Cheapest Way to Invest in the S&P 500 Index | VOO vs CSPX" (sorry can't include links right now) .

My next mission is to find a PRS fund (global) to replace my current one which is Malaysian based. Just want to have more foreign funds. Eyeing Manulife Shariah PRS-Global REIT Fund or AIA PAM – Global Islamic Growth Fund. Must do homework on them first. Once the PRS tax benefit is taken away I'll stop putting into this fund.
Davidtcf
post Jun 3 2022, 12:42 PM

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QUOTE(Davidtcf @ Jun 3 2022, 10:24 AM)
not true, your returns from VOO will be lower than that of VUAA/CSPX due to the 30% tax on dividends. For VUAA/CSPX it will be 15% tax on the accumulated dividends which is lower. Short term you do not see much difference in the % gained, but long term wise after many years it will be apparent. For countries with tax treaty with US or US citizens, they will able to claim back part of those dividend tax or offset them.. for us, EU and Singaporeans investors that has no tax treaty with US, it will be an extra 15% loss for us each time when dividends are paid out.

This is even more apparent for ETFs like VOO as they are distributing the dividends. Every time you receive dividends it already has an extra 15% tax charged to it.

Better stick to Irish domiciled types like VUAA/CSPX. Currently no way to buy them via brokers in Malaysia, so have to use brokers like IBKR to do so.
The part we will be charged higher is the transfer fees from Malaysia to US. Even using Wise to IBKR has some fees, but most people prefer transfer from Wise to CIMB SG, then to IBKR pay USD2 per conversion to USD (spot rate). For long term investing then it is worth it.
*
also if you buy VOO via our local brokers like Rakuten, will end up paying more also due to their high FX spread. Rakuten also requires every buy and sell be converted back and forth to MYR. You'll lose 2 times via currency exchange if buy via them. Other brokers I'm not sure.. but so far don't hear any good stories about them also.

So in the end IBKR still cheaper. Can watch more youtube videos on why they are the best now. Check "Ziet Invest" videos on this also.. he also got explain why Irish domiciled is better.

Then lastly another method is via robo advisors. They will charge management fees of around 0.7-1% a year. They will buy US ETFs only due to larger market cap, lower broker fees, and faster execution. This 0.7-1% will add up as years go by.

This post has been edited by Davidtcf: Jun 3 2022, 12:45 PM
Medufsaid
post Jun 3 2022, 12:49 PM

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QUOTE(Hoshiyuu @ Jun 3 2022, 11:17 AM)
Well, part of the Bogleheads modus operandi is to invest at fixed intervals and don't time the market anyway, so it's surprisingly a smaller deal than it is. For broad market index, it's really hard to profit or loss from the movement, no need to worry too much about it.
*
it depends on what bogleheads is to you. is it a strict religion with the death penalty for apostasy, or is it the foundation of your final investment strategy.

e.g., you have regular DCA intervals (HODL) and some warchest funds to topup in case of a dip

This post has been edited by Medufsaid: Jun 3 2022, 12:55 PM
Cubalagi
post Jun 3 2022, 03:37 PM

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This is how I sort my portfolio:

I have a big category called Financial Assets. Under that there is:

1. Everyday banking: this is the savings account where celery comes in and go out.

2. Emergency Fund. I prefer to dump mine into a Mortgage Flexi Account.

3. EPF: this is the mandatory and can't be adjusted, but I'm in the category of eligible to withdraw. If a really bad bear market comes, I will withdraw and put in 4 (below). But otherwise, I don't touch this.

4. Investment portfolio: This is where the rest is. Stocks, ETF, Bonds, MMF, Funds, Asx, PRS, cash balance in the brokerage account.

It is No 4 that I actively manage and adjust allocation. Meaning if I say I'm 100% equities, it would mean all of 4 is in equities (practically impossible).

Oh..and I also don't have FD and any investment linked insurance.

This post has been edited by Cubalagi: Jun 3 2022, 03:38 PM
sgh
post Jun 3 2022, 04:24 PM

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QUOTE(Cubalagi @ Jun 3 2022, 03:37 PM)
This is how I sort my portfolio:

I have a big category called Financial Assets. Under that there is:

1. Everyday banking: this is the savings account where celery comes in and go out.

2. Emergency Fund. I prefer to dump mine into a Mortgage Flexi Account.

3. EPF: this is the mandatory and can't be adjusted, but I'm in the category of eligible to withdraw. If a really bad bear market comes, I will withdraw and put in 4 (below). But otherwise, I don't touch this.

4. Investment portfolio: This is where the rest is. Stocks, ETF, Bonds, MMF, Funds, Asx, PRS, cash balance in the brokerage account.

It is No 4 that I actively manage and adjust allocation. Meaning if I say I'm 100% equities, it would mean all of 4 is in equities (practically impossible).

Oh..and I also don't have FD and any investment linked insurance.
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That is quite good very similar to mine except I have Point 5 FD and endowment insurance. Next would be what is your percentage allocation for each point 1 to 4? Point 4 will be higher percentage since you do not have Point 5 of FD, insurance correct?

To be frank my Point 5 is way higher than my Point 4 haha. That is why for Point 4 in all my posts for any new investment instrument I keep asking what is the minimum capital to enter as I allocate little. I only slowly increase once I get profitable based on my minimum capital and comfortable with the investment instrument. My strategy is like soccer. I have defenders, defensive midfielders as backbone and assign 1-2 out and out strikers to score goals. Boring I know but I don't hope for big wins. Sneak in a goal or draw is enough.
Cubalagi
post Jun 3 2022, 06:03 PM

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QUOTE(sgh @ Jun 3 2022, 04:24 PM)
That is quite good very similar to mine except I have Point 5 FD and endowment insurance. Next would be what is your percentage allocation for each point 1 to 4? Point 4 will be higher percentage since you do not have Point 5 of FD, insurance correct?

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Points 1 and 2 are quite small less than 5%. I don't even consider them as investments.

Point 3 I have no control over the investment. Point 4, I try to beat Point 3 performance by a few % points annualized.

QUOTE(sgh @ Jun 3 2022, 04:24 PM)

To be frank my Point 5 is way higher than my Point 4 haha. That is why for Point 4 in all my posts for any new investment instrument I keep asking what is the minimum capital to enter as I allocate little. I only slowly increase once I get profitable based on my minimum capital and comfortable with the investment instrument. My strategy is like soccer. I have defenders, defensive midfielders as backbone and assign 1-2 out and out strikers to score goals. Boring I know but I don't hope for big wins. Sneak in a goal or draw is enough.
*
My defenders are in Point 4. I'm a market timer of sorts..some time go offence, and sometime on defence and can make big moves in the portfolio. The main objective of defence is to preserve gains. Many investors made big gains in last 2 years but were not able to preserve those gains.


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