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 How to identify Fake/Counterfeit KF94 mask?

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mushigen
post Aug 28 2021, 08:40 PM

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QUOTE(mochicake @ Aug 28 2021, 05:40 PM)
Yeah thanks to this thread did some research and seems like Neutrovis kf94 is not yet in the MDA database. So far only been wearing it in the car commuting or open window to talk to policeman at roadblock. It's too bad as just made a big order and now have a bunch of masks. Now decided get some Respack someone mentioned upthread as it's in the MDA database at least.

Though will stick to 3m for real protection when going out. I was stocking up on the kf94 cause the earloops & was cheaper to throw away daily. The 3m one with earloop (9501?) is awfully uncomfortable & pinches the ear down even after 5 minutes. The new-ish 9513 has earloops but super expensive at $4-5 each but that's probably the way to go for me then. Will keep an eye on this thread to try out actual korean kf94s but tbh i rather buy from 3M official than some random store.
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I bought a box of 3M kn95 9501+. The earloops are not suitable for me too, as they're too tight. And unlike its predecessor (?) 9501, the 9501+ doesn't have the piece of foam at the nose area, causing minor leakage despite its tight earloops.
However, 3M is definitely easier to breathe as it does not have many layers (uses electrostatic charged material to capture particles).

mushigen
post Aug 28 2021, 11:35 PM

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QUOTE(mochicake @ Aug 28 2021, 09:48 PM)
I watch this guy on youtube and he does comprehensive reviews & tests of various masks - https://www.youtube.com/user/coll0412

But all the brands he try are super expensive cause even though from HK or Asia as their pricing is for Americans/western world. I tried an order at Masklab with MYR pricing and it end up almost RM16 for 1 kf94 mask because shipping doubles the cost. Even then RM8 per mask better buy 3M N95 from official store.

Also follow the subreddit Masks4all but again they talk about these masks that might not be available here - or i can't find them but tbh haven't exactly looked hard yet. Someone did mention this "Good Manner" mask so bought a few today to test - https://shopee.com.my/Good-Manner-KF94-face...3063.9737186425 - anyone tried before?
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When you said you bought to test, what sort of tests are you looking at? The thing with coronavirus is, unlike the haze where you can smell it, we cannot tell whether the respirator is indeed filtering the virus. Just have to trust the manufacturers.
mushigen
post Aug 29 2021, 08:58 AM

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QUOTE(yourinfohere @ Aug 28 2021, 11:46 PM)
Hello, mochicake, mushigen and others,

Do you do a water test of 3M kn95 9501? Will drop like below?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FPBx7L0Vco0
Respack 4ply KN95 vs KF94 Review
Timestamp 1:55

If you open/not open and take a 3M kn95 9501 hide the light, can you see the translucent lines and dots there?

Thank you.
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I'll try the water test when I'm about to throw one away. As for light test, what lines and dots are you referring to, and "hide the light"?
mushigen
post Aug 29 2021, 03:44 PM

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QUOTE(yourinfohere @ Aug 29 2021, 02:57 PM)
Take a KN 95 put under the lamp light, can you see translucent lines and dots(mask pattern)?

This KN 95 or N95 only for 8 hours? If you using less than 8 hours, you will reuse again and again?

You wash/store 1 month of the KN 95/N 95, then when you wear 3 ply mask, you will take it over a 3 ply mask?
This is mean reuse KN 95/N 95 instead fabric cloth mask.
I think old KN 95/N 95 still more tie, not really effective but their material maybe better than fabric cloth mask, eco, save money and convenience. Do you think reuse KN 95/N 95 over a 3 ply mask(Outside can see 3 ply mask edges) is a good idea?

I worry do a fool thing, hope you and others can give some advise.
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I'm sorry, I don't understand what pattern or lines you're referring to. I tried googling but all I got is light (as in candle fire) test where you try to blow it off.

I avoid reusing N95 after visiting high risk places, and I certainly will never wash N95 respirators, especially 3M respirators that use electrostatic material to trap particulates.

As for whether it's safe to reuse, nobody can tell you yes or no. Imo, the most basic thing to be aware is whether the inner side is contaminated when you remove or store the respirator, hence always remove the mask after sanitizing your hands and sanitize the hands after removing the mask. There's no way to know whether the outer side is contaminated, so to reuse or not is personal decision.

Also, kf94, kn95 and n95 are not supposed to be used together with another mask.

mushigen
post Aug 29 2021, 07:25 PM

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QUOTE(mochicake @ Aug 29 2021, 05:09 PM)
True make no sense to wash the mask then test. As washing you changing that composition of what's coming from the factory. Tbh since buy from 3M i don't bother testing. Once come home i throw away in a bin outside the door. Even want to handle cut to open check layers don't really want. For now just buy from reputable sources then don't need try test at home.

It's probably dumb but the best test for me is if i can't smell anything at all, then the mask is good enough for me. Put on once step out of house then don't take off until at front door at home.

For now since n95 and kn95 are plentiful for healthcare workers plus public, no need reuse. Whenever go grocery shopping for example, I wear one then throw. My husband unfortunately has a huge head so he finds them all uncomfortable & hates the double band behind head (plus stubborn) ... so when he go work he only wears a 4-ply medicos surgical mask. I did force him to wear a 3M n95 9010 when he go to PPV but it was tough going lol That's why I keep hunting for new masks as want him to have more protection daily. But it needs to be comfy and easy so lots of 'testing' i.e. buy and try. That's why the kf94s are appealing. Top runners are kf94s and the new 3m advanced filtering/9513 with hook but still trying convince him. So keep the kf94 recommendations coming ...
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Your husband reminds me of my MIL. Bought a face shield for her after asking if she's willing to wear, but she complains it makes her feel stuffy. I don't know where the stuffiness comes from, it's not as if she is wearing full chemical suit with breathing apparatus.

As for tight masks, you can try stretching the headloops especially if it's 3M respirators. It helps to make it more comfortable. Unless he has abnormal head size, I don't understand why 3M respirators don't suit him. One basic characteristic of PPE is it is never designed to make wearers feel comfortable at the expense of protection.

mushigen
post Aug 29 2021, 07:43 PM

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QUOTE(anakMY @ Aug 29 2021, 07:37 PM)
It can be reused if u know how to handle it, mainly bcz our hands and the outer surface of the mask is contaminated.

If u wanna reuse, make sure
- do not touch the inner surface
- keep it inside a safety box
- wash ur hands and disinfect ur phones, wallets,  keys. And go take a bath.
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It all depends on one's risk appetite. If you assume that the loops are also contaminated, storing it inside a safety box - whatever that is - may introduce virus to the inner surface if the loops touch the surface. This is after taking the steps I described before.

And when wearing it, one needs to assume both his hands are contaminated and need to be sanitized.
mushigen
post Aug 29 2021, 07:58 PM

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QUOTE(anakMY @ Aug 29 2021, 07:56 PM)
Yep its quite technique sensitive. For normal person better just don't reuse. Reuse only for those who have enuf knowledge and are very careful with handling masks.
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Exactly. That's why I advise my older folks back home to discard after every use. Whether they listen to me or not is another matter. You know lah...
mushigen
post Sep 2 2021, 09:48 AM

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QUOTE(Tachikoma @ Sep 1 2021, 10:42 PM)
You know... at some point its going to be cheaper to just get an elastomeric respirator.

https://shopee.com.my/3M-6200-RESPIRATOR-3M...9305&position=3

The benefit is that you don't even need to change the filters very often (stuff that gets stuck on the outer layer will just stay there), just wash the inner plastic part.

https://intjem.biomedcentral.com/articles/1...245-020-00296-8
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This is not advisable if you have not undergone fit test conducted by qualified trainer. The respirator has sizes and you need to know your size before using it.
mushigen
post Sep 2 2021, 02:22 PM

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QUOTE(imbibug @ Sep 2 2021, 01:12 PM)
Do you know if the 3M 8210 mask filter is strictly a single use item only because its filter media relies more electrostatic charge?
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Imo the issue is with hygiene and virus. Surface contamination issue aside, there is no way for end users to determine if the filter layer is saturated with virus or has lost its electrostatic properties.

In usage during haze time (or dusty environment), users can smell the haze or dust if the respirator stops performing optimally, or will suffer breathing difficulty if the filter layer is saturated with dust. Both of these serve as indicator of the time to change respirator. With virus, one cannot tell if either of the above has happened.

Besides, a dirty respirator used in dusty environment can be easily spotted. Not so a respirator "dirtied" by virus.

So, to reuse or not strictly depends on user's risk tolerance. Just my 2 sen.
mushigen
post Sep 2 2021, 02:27 PM

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QUOTE(imbibug @ Sep 2 2021, 02:08 PM)
What I want to know if is if the filter media on the 8210 is less dense compared to KN95/KF94 and relies more on electrostatic charge to trap particles.
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This is somewhat true for 3M 9501+ (kn95). There are a total of 3 layers, compared to 4/5 layers for non-3M type. The middle layer doesn't look like melt blown plastic, more like the 3M aircon filter insert that we can buy to put on our home aircon.

Let me check my 3M 9105 vflex (N95) once I have the opportunity.

As for the 8210, I don't have it now but it's more difficult to breathe in 8210 compared to 9105 vflex.
mushigen
post Sep 9 2021, 03:46 PM

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QUOTE(KopiChia @ Sep 9 2021, 12:41 AM)
9.9 in Lazada ship directly frm Korea you can get 100x Good Manners facemask at <95

user posted image
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Bro, can share the link?
mushigen
post Sep 9 2021, 06:09 PM

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QUOTE(KopiChia @ Sep 9 2021, 04:36 PM)
https://s.lazada.com.my/s.W3cAj

Seller got other Korean brand mask too cheaper.
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TQ for the link. I noticed other sellers are selling at twice the price (rm100+ for one box). And the reviews macam suspicious.
mushigen
post Sep 9 2021, 08:38 PM

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QUOTE(N9484640 @ Sep 9 2021, 08:34 PM)
couple of months back they were selling at RM129 for 100 pieces
then the price went up to Rm169
I wrote to them but they dont reply.

Today I ordered 100 pieces. Hopefully they send me the real thing lol
If worse comes to worse, I just return it. Lazada is good in that sense
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Mask can return meh? I saw the return notice, it excludes this item.
mushigen
post Sep 9 2021, 08:53 PM

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QUOTE(N9484640 @ Sep 9 2021, 08:42 PM)
if i didnt open, sure can return gua
each mask is foil pack. the box may be sealed too
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Oh, I thought you wanted to inspect the mask (means breaking the seal).

Might still be a problem.

user posted image
mushigen
post Apr 6 2022, 04:16 AM

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QUOTE(KopiChia @ Apr 6 2022, 03:58 AM)
Just seen this in /k anyone knows how this will affect imported facemask?


user posted image
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Those overseas sellers are probably not affected unless kastam starts checking and confiscating non-Sirim ones.

Those local small online sellers probably scale down or temporarily stop operation for a while before continuing with selling non-sirim ones.

Local big dealers/pharmacies will have to comply.

Hence I expect prices to fall as suppliers clear stock, and increase again when the new rule kicks in.
Or there is most likely a U-turn when mask shortages happen.


mushigen
post Apr 6 2022, 09:33 AM

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QUOTE(LA773 @ Apr 6 2022, 06:12 AM)
Yea, i wonder wat seller gonna with their stocks right now
If sell cheap, we consumer, can buy & use after july?
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End consumers are always spared in Malaysia. Besides, enforcement on individuals is not practical. And I don't think the masks have SIRIM label on them so it makes it almost impossible to check individuals wearing them.
mushigen
post Apr 6 2022, 09:36 AM

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QUOTE(raynman @ Apr 6 2022, 06:43 AM)
How do they enforce this?

Check everyone's face mask on the streets for SIRIM logo?
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The poster says the label must be visibly placed on boxes or packaging.

Therefore it's safe to assume there won't be any label on individual masks.

mushigen
post Apr 7 2022, 10:36 AM

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QUOTE(andrekua2 @ Apr 7 2022, 10:31 AM)
Why would price fall? More like price will increase. How much would they charge for the test? For example when we are importing steel, we do a test, eligible for 250MT shipment. So if I bought 1000MT, I need to do 4x test even though same sizes whatever. Each test cost 3k++ for us. Who knows how much for the mask test since they would definitely need to buy machine for that.

Another is to introduce PCL aka product certification llcence. They will need to invite sirim personnels to visit their factory, take sample and issue PCL for their mask valid for a year. Repeat the process every year. This would be more beneficial if manufacturers want to sell to more than 1 party. One time charges that can be used multiple times a year. Also no need to wait for test queueing which would lead to storage charges.

Either way, price confirm going up imo. You can just sticker a sirim sticker later on. It really doesn't matter how u do it.
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Hence I expect prices to fall as suppliers clear stock, and increase again when the new rule kicks in.


mushigen
post Apr 7 2022, 11:06 AM

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QUOTE(andrekua2 @ Apr 7 2022, 10:55 AM)
Not sure why you think suppliers need to clear stocks though...
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Tbh, I don't know how SIRIM is going to do the certification wrt to existing stocks in the market.

Do the main distributors collect back all the stocks from pharmacies and shops? Or do they just provide sirim stickers to the pharmacies and shops?

Is it logistically cheaper to have existing stocks in retail shops certified come July, or clear existing uncertified stocks before July?
mushigen
post Apr 7 2022, 11:40 AM

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QUOTE(andrekua2 @ Apr 7 2022, 11:34 AM)
SIRIM is only applicable to manufacturers (Locally made) or importers (oversea manufacturing). SIRIM do not dictate how you do business as a resellers with ex-stocks. There are no requirements to do test on all your ex-stocks.
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I have to take your words for it as I don't have in-depth knowledge on this.

If certifying existing stocks is as easy and cheap as you said, then prices of existing stocks may not fall.

It's all my guess.

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