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> Kena con during interview, how to escape?, Jumped ship but wrong move

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TSmanpower4x4
post Jun 14 2021, 12:34 PM

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QUOTE(malleus @ Jun 14 2021, 07:45 AM)
1) if they can still hire, then they have not exhausted all cost cutting measures yet
2) if it's cost cutting for survival, then there's no need for them to force you to sign the letter

hence because of that they're likely to be lying about the legal approval from the related government authorities. try requesting to see the approval that they have received, saying that you wish to validate with the same authorities they have gotten such approvals from
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They sent me a snippet this morning after I refused to believe it. Really got Miti stamp, sign and that relevant industry approval on cost reduction imposed to staff salaries. I dunno how they got it but got.
malleus
post Jun 14 2021, 01:12 PM

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QUOTE(manpower4x4 @ Jun 14 2021, 12:34 PM)
They sent me a snippet this morning after I refused to believe it. Really got Miti stamp, sign and that relevant industry approval on cost reduction imposed to staff salaries. I dunno how they got it but got.
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very good then smile.gif now you can call up MITI to verify, and tell them that they're still hiring, and thus, have the company really exhausted all cost cutting measures before going into salary reductions.

and at the same time you can check with MITI too if what they're doing is legal or not. explain the entire thing, and see what MITI says to you.

And this can also be your immediate reply to them too. That you're checking with MITI independently on this issue, and will get back to them on it.

This post has been edited by malleus: Jun 14 2021, 01:15 PM
ZZMsia
post Jun 14 2021, 03:26 PM

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QUOTE(manpower4x4 @ Jun 14 2021, 12:56 AM)
Well not that I want to join, the hr is using the offer letter I signed against me. He kinda gangster on me saying I should know what I have signed and what powers they hold....

And yes, the HR guy has written me a wonderful email:

Dear Mr. XXX,

As per our Tele-conversation, I have gone through the whole process with the hiring manager and the department director. It seems that the department director is not allowing such irresponsible act and would therefore require you to reimburse all hiring costs related to this position up to 12th June 2021. The vacancy is now deemed urgent as the resigning person is leaving on 18th June 2021. It is a formality that our team allows you to sign a consent form on the salary adjustment and redesignation to Managerial level. We have obtained legal approval from related government authorities on the salary adjustment as this was declared as a restructuring for survival. As such, the amount that will be claimed against your good self will be a total of 1 months salary in lieu without any deductions or adjustments. Should you continue to refrain signing the redesignation letter, a legal notice from our lawyer will be issued to you.

Regards,
Mr YYY
ZZZ Company Sdn Bhd
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please Do NOT join them. It has gone to this. Just be silent and walk away!!
GentlemanTroll
post Jun 14 2021, 03:37 PM

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QUOTE(manpower4x4 @ Jun 14 2021, 12:56 AM)
Well not that I want to join, the hr is using the offer letter I signed against me. He kinda gangster on me saying I should know what I have signed and what powers they hold....

And yes, the HR guy has written me a wonderful email:

Dear Mr. XXX,

As per our Tele-conversation, I have gone through the whole process with the hiring manager and the department director. It seems that the department director is not allowing such irresponsible act and would therefore require you to reimburse all hiring costs related to this position up to 12th June 2021. The vacancy is now deemed urgent as the resigning person is leaving on 18th June 2021. It is a formality that our team allows you to sign a consent form on the salary adjustment and redesignation to Managerial level. We have obtained legal approval from related government authorities on the salary adjustment as this was declared as a restructuring for survival. As such, the amount that will be claimed against your good self will be a total of 1 months salary in lieu without any deductions or adjustments. Should you continue to refrain signing the redesignation letter, a legal notice from our lawyer will be issued to you.

Regards,
Mr YYY
ZZZ Company Sdn Bhd
*
Don't be too worried.. I think you have very good reasons not to join that company, after what they've done.
So, you can just politely mention that you are intending to seek assistance of Department of Labour to resolve this issue.
You can mention that any payments in-lieu, if necessary, will only be made after consulting with Department of Labour.
Try to strongman them into backing off. If they insist, then do email the Department of Labour and see how they can assist you.

Email for your reference: jtksm[at]mohr[dot]gov[dot]my
chickenshit36
post Jun 14 2021, 07:21 PM

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QUOTE(manpower4x4 @ Jun 14 2021, 12:56 AM)
Well not that I want to join, the hr is using the offer letter I signed against me. He kinda gangster on me saying I should know what I have signed and what powers they hold....

And yes, the HR guy has written me a wonderful email:

Dear Mr. XXX,

As per our Tele-conversation, I have gone through the whole process with the hiring manager and the department director. It seems that the department director is not allowing such irresponsible act and would therefore require you to reimburse all hiring costs related to this position up to 12th June 2021. The vacancy is now deemed urgent as the resigning person is leaving on 18th June 2021. It is a formality that our team allows you to sign a consent form on the salary adjustment and redesignation to Managerial level. We have obtained legal approval from related government authorities on the salary adjustment as this was declared as a restructuring for survival. As such, the amount that will be claimed against your good self will be a total of 1 months salary in lieu without any deductions or adjustments. Should you continue to refrain signing the redesignation letter, a legal notice from our lawyer will be issued to you.

Regards,
Mr YYY
ZZZ Company Sdn Bhd
*
Ignore. They void the contract and now trying to scare u. Which is foolish. If u cheat and lie to people to come work for u, how long do u think they will last before resigning?

Put it this way la. I agree to buy x item from you for rm100 and agree cod place. We meet and then I say I don’t have money can only pay rm70. Then say I came all the way already and u should reimburse me for my travel cost. Sounds stupid right?
Just reply as polite as u can, and mention if they are not happy they are welcome to file a complain to industrial relations court.
Meanwhile, make sure u sort things out with your current company to ensure u can stay.

Screw these unethical companies.
klch87
post Jun 14 2021, 07:31 PM

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QUOTE(manpower4x4 @ Jun 14 2021, 12:56 AM)
Well not that I want to join, the hr is using the offer letter I signed against me. He kinda gangster on me saying I should know what I have signed and what powers they hold....

And yes, the HR guy has written me a wonderful email:

Dear Mr. XXX,

As per our Tele-conversation, I have gone through the whole process with the hiring manager and the department director. It seems that the department director is not allowing such irresponsible act and would therefore require you to reimburse all hiring costs related to this position up to 12th June 2021. The vacancy is now deemed urgent as the resigning person is leaving on 18th June 2021. It is a formality that our team allows you to sign a consent form on the salary adjustment and redesignation to Managerial level. We have obtained legal approval from related government authorities on the salary adjustment as this was declared as a restructuring for survival. As such, the amount that will be claimed against your good self will be a total of 1 months salary in lieu without any deductions or adjustments. Should you continue to refrain signing the redesignation letter, a legal notice from our lawyer will be issued to you.

Regards,
Mr YYY
ZZZ Company Sdn Bhd
*
Is the hiring cost and redesignation letter in event of pulling out from employment stated in the offer letter? If yes, then it is legally possible they will issue a legal notice to you.
This is possible if your salary is high.
ZZMsia
post Jun 14 2021, 08:15 PM

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QUOTE(chickenshit36 @ Jun 14 2021, 07:21 PM)
Ignore. They void the contract and now trying to scare u. Which is foolish. If u cheat and lie to people to come work for u, how long do u think they will last before resigning?

Put it this way la. I agree to buy x item from you for rm100 and agree cod place. We meet and then I say I don’t have money can only pay rm70. Then say I came all the way already and u should reimburse me for my travel cost. Sounds stupid right?
Just reply as polite as u can, and mention if they are not happy they are welcome to file a complain to industrial relations court.
Meanwhile, make sure u sort things out with your current company to ensure u can stay.

Screw these unethical companies.
*
Agreeing with his point. please walk away asap

TSmanpower4x4
post Jun 14 2021, 10:58 PM

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QUOTE(klch87 @ Jun 14 2021, 07:31 PM)
Is the hiring cost and redesignation letter in event of pulling out from employment stated in the offer letter? If yes, then it is legally possible they will issue a legal notice to you.
This is possible if your salary is high.
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They said it's not in the offer letter but in the handbook...
TSmanpower4x4
post Jun 14 2021, 10:59 PM

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QUOTE(ZZMsia @ Jun 14 2021, 08:15 PM)
Agreeing with his point. please walk away asap
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I already am. My current company is ok to let me stay on one condition, the new place doesn't come kacau the current company.
klch87
post Jun 14 2021, 11:01 PM

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QUOTE(manpower4x4 @ Jun 14 2021, 10:58 PM)
They said it's not in the offer letter but in the handbook...
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So by any chance you signed off the handbook and acknowledge the content inside it?

From what i understand offer letter is a legal document prior to employment.

Handbook and other forms like NDA or ethical conducts are to be signed upon employment, which are post employment.

Say if its in the handbook which you did not acknowledge, then it is not bound to your agreement.


malleus
post Jun 14 2021, 11:25 PM

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QUOTE(manpower4x4 @ Jun 14 2021, 10:59 PM)
I already am. My current company is ok to let me stay on one condition, the new place doesn't come kacau the current company.
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So, the approval from MITI that they claim to have gotten will be subject to them demonstrating that it's crucial for survival, which also includes the condition that they must have demonstrated that all other costing measures has already failed.

From what you mentioned, they are still actively hiring right? Mention this to them, on what will MITI think of them and their approval to do salary cuts if MITI knows they're still actively hiring.

And like what others advised as well, check also with the labour department, as well as the Ministry of Human Resources too. Don't hesitate to say that you're also taking the initiative to do these checks on them with the various authorities as well.
TSmanpower4x4
post Jun 15 2021, 03:21 PM

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QUOTE(malleus @ Jun 14 2021, 11:25 PM)
So, the approval from MITI that they claim to have gotten will be subject to them demonstrating that it's crucial for survival, which also includes the condition that they must have demonstrated that all other costing measures has already failed.

From what you mentioned, they are still actively hiring right? Mention this to them, on what will MITI think of them and their approval to do salary cuts if MITI knows they're still actively hiring.

And like what others advised as well, check also with the labour department, as well as the Ministry of Human Resources too. Don't hesitate to say that you're also taking the initiative to do these checks on them with the various authorities as well.
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They were good advice. I did it today. Labour department said I am bound to pay back the hiring costs as I didn't notice there was a clause in my offer letter saying "All terms of employment are within the employment handbook to be presented on date of commencement. By agreeing to the offer, such agreement also cover terms within the handbook". I was thinking why they were so steady, now I know.
malleus
post Jun 15 2021, 04:41 PM

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QUOTE(manpower4x4 @ Jun 15 2021, 03:21 PM)
They were good advice. I did it today. Labour department said I am bound to pay back the hiring costs as I didn't notice there was a clause in my offer letter saying "All terms of employment are within the employment handbook to be presented on date of commencement. By agreeing to the offer, such agreement also cover terms within the handbook". I was thinking why they were so steady, now I know.
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ah well. this pretty much sucks then, as it does look like the only way out is for you to pay off that one month, and just take this financial hit for now. But the other thing that you can check on is, is there a ceiling amount that they can claim against you, to see if you can get the payback amount to be reduced or not.

How about MITI? do they still qualify to do cost cutting to survive if they can still hire ppl?
TSmanpower4x4
post Jun 16 2021, 01:27 AM

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QUOTE(malleus @ Jun 15 2021, 04:41 PM)
ah well. this pretty much sucks then, as it does look like the only way out is for you to pay off that one month, and just take this financial hit for now. But the other thing that you can check on is, is there a ceiling amount that they can claim against you, to see if you can get the payback amount to be reduced or not.

How about MITI? do they still qualify to do cost cutting to survive if they can still hire ppl?
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I asked a friend who has connections with Miti and the govt. He said a lot of companies applied for legit cost cutting despite them not in dire situation and were all approved. So miti knows what's going on apparently.
malleus
post Jun 16 2021, 08:32 AM

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QUOTE(manpower4x4 @ Jun 16 2021, 01:27 AM)
I asked a friend who has connections with Miti and the govt. He said a lot of companies applied for legit cost cutting despite them not in dire situation and were all approved. So miti knows what's going on apparently.
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I wonder if a complain to MITI about your case can help or not. knowing about the situation, and reacting when complaints are made can be different things after all

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