Hi all,

This is the situation..

I rented out my nicely renovated apartment to a family in JB through an agent.
From the beginning, there was 1 month delay in the rental payment. The tenant is very arrogant when you push for the rental payments. She claims that the rental is nothing big for her. But still you have to push every month and the rental comes in after pushed by my agent. For some months, i had to block the access cards to demand rental. It worked. At the last remaining 2 months of the tenancy, the was no money coming in. The tenants attitude changed. She claims her business and husbands job is affected due to MCO, seeking sympathy. The most shocking thing happened when i received a message from TNB and SAJ claiming there is pending payment of RM 7200 and RM 400 respectively. ( My biggest mistake, i did not keep track on the utility payments ). On average, the monthly electric bill was RM 900. The tenant told that they will settle all the pending utility payments. They are currently waiting for claims from KWSP ( dont know if its true). After continuous demand, they cleared only the water bill payment.TNB have terminated the power supply due to payment overdue. I requested the Management Office to block them from moving out with their belongings. Now, they are staying at their relatives house (dont know where). Since the past last week , they dont reply my messages or pick up my calls. TNB is sending demand letters to me to make the payment asap.
My agent did a detail search about them, from word of mouth, they are a family with money but always cheats people..

Now...

There is pending amount around RM 11k that i need to receive from the tenant. This is excluding the damage that they have caused to the house. (They have turned the house to a rat hole. I manage to see the house once when they requested for some piping repairs.) Minus the rental deposits, will have 7k pending.

So..

Anyone here have been in this situation?
Please advise...what should i do?

P/s : I did some research online and disappointed to know how unprotected landlords are. The laws are more favourable for the tenant.

In a contract like the TA, if a party defaults, the recourse for the aggrieved party is to go to court to recover the outstanding money plus damages.

If the judgement is in the aggrieved party favour, whether the defaulted party pays is another matter.

If the aggrieved fails to receive the money, then he has to initiate another court action to recover the money and if that also fails, another action to commence bankruptcy action.

All in, is a tiring process to use good money to recover bad money and many landlords will once awhile experience such tenants and is painful esp for first timers.

I wouldnt agree that the 'law' favours the tenant as in any other commercial contracts similar to selling and buying, if the buyer refuse to pays after receiving the goods, the recourse for seller is through legal action.

Similarly, if a seller cannot deliver the goods after payment and also decline to refund, the buyer recourse is to initiate legal action.

You can also engage a legal debt collector agency to recover your due. Dont deal with illegal ones as they may not pass you the money after collection.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: May 28 2021, 05:57 AM

Wow... i tot tnb would've disconnected power much earlier on top of sending multiple sms and phone reminders

TNB SOP during covid will not disconnect supply but allow to pay by instalment.

Better u evict the tenant and pay TNB in instalments unless u have the time and money to sue the tenant in court and make her a bankrupt.

I think TS has mentioned the tenants have moved out. Now TS is figuring out how to get the owed money from tenant to pay the TNB bill and other outstanding charges.

This is an owner's worst nightmare.

Cost and time involved to recover may put you off.
First off, court will only grant judgement in default if the summon is received by the defendant, yet now you do not know where they stay. Even if you know, recipient may say no such person staying there...then what you gonna do...
But if you are determined, there is possibility to recover something.

Blocking tenant's access during their tenancy, unless provided in your tenancy agreement, may be illegal. Check that you are not in default or else tenant have reason to fight your breach, if they want to.

Can consider changing TNB bill to tenant's name before renting out next.
Then tenant will be responsible for paying the bills directly to TNB and for arrears thereof.
If not mistaken landlord can apply online via TNB online.

When time to disconnect, you know I know la

Thats why its wise to change to tenants name, nowadays you never know

You can monitor via tnb app if under your name, and you should check monthly and remind the tenant if even late by a week, thats what we do, sorry to say, its also partially your fault

This post has been edited by cablesguy: May 28 2021, 12:52 PM

Nothing much you can. If you have time and energy... then engage a lawyer to do all of that. But mind you, the lawyer cost, time and etc... in the end, you may not get back much of your RM7000.

If the TNB account is registered with tenant .....

As long the property address has an outstanding, no reconnection will happen if is not settle. And tenant cannot open new account with the next rented house.

If owner wants to rent again, then the landlord has to clear the debt and recover the money from the previous tenant.

Whether is head or tail, TNB wins.

This is not true. I have changed name before. TNB will supply if the property is changed to a new person. The accountability is on the person not the property. I have helped my relatives transfer TNB account when they buy new property - where previous owner has thousands of ringgit in areas - no issue with transfering. Whole thing done online in a week.

You are refering to subsale property ... yes. Default seller cannot open new account and will be blacklisted.

Not for rental. Otherwise many owners will sign fake TA and escape paying tnb bill.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: May 28 2021, 03:47 PM

Nope again not true. Contract law is very clear - you can only hold people accountable if they have a contract with you. There is no such thing if a electricity bill is on some other name that suddenly the owner becomes liable for it.

Hi Thanks for your advise. Legal debt collector is something new..I will check on it..

They moved out but their belongings are still there. Not sure if i can break in and remove/sell off their stuffs only with police report.. without court order..

Changing the TNB account holder name throughout the tenancy period is an expensive lesson that i have learnt. Crying out loud..

The CONTRACT LAW is very clear that the parties to contract is fully responsible to all the terms.

And I DIDNT say that the Landlord is responsible for Tenant arrears/contract.

TNB WILL continue to recover the arrears from the tenant through whatever means.

What I said is that IF the Landlord wants a reconnection, he needs to settle the arrears on behalf and recover the arrears from the Tenant. Otherwise, just leave the property vacant until the arrears are settle.

The Landlord has given FULL AUTHORITY to the Tenant to apply electricity supply to TNB via the Tenancy Agreement (CONTRACT LAW)

When the Tenant opens an account with TNB, the previous contract between the Landlord and TNB is AUTOMATICALLY terminated.

If Landlord is NOT the CONTRACTED user, how can he then has the legal authority to instruct TNB to disconnect electricity or close account or reconnection, albeit he is the owner ? (CONTRACT LAW)

Just telling TNB that Tenant breached TA or abandoned the property is NOT a good reason for a reconnection. TNB wouldnt know the problem between Landlord and Tenant. All they know is an arrear of payment on the property.

If at all TNB does a new connection, it is done on humantarian/personal/political reason, but I doubt it will unless with higher up instruction.

Residential arrears is just small arrears. What about commercial and industrial ? It can run to hundreds of thousands to millions. One is only seeing a minor part of the overall debts of TNB for the country.

If what you said is correct, TNB can never be able to sustain operations as a going concern. No company can survive another day without collecting their debts and continue to provide service.

Landlord cannot continue to profit at the expense of TNB.

In TNB Faqs, TNB will adivise Landlord to let Tenant open account and be responsible for the arrears. BUT they didnt mention about new connnection if the arrears are not paid by the Tenant.

THOSE WHO COME TO COURT TO SEEK JUSTICE MUST COME WITH CLEAN HAND.

Talking about CONTRACT LAW......

And ... Landlord can be a party to the scam !

A question for you ....

Why do local authority sealed the moveable property of the occupant (tenant) if outstanding assessment is not paid. Isnt the CONTRACT LAW is between the owner and local authority ?



I welcome any rebuttal but please dont just quote CONTRACT LAW. The topic is so wide ranging from offer to acceptance, misrepresentation, void and voidable contracts, capacity to contract, consideration, certainty, fraud, etc.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: May 29 2021, 08:24 AM

Well explained.

Notwithstanding Utility Account under tenant and contract law, has TNB ever or any possibility they still seek payment for outstanding bill from the landlord? Big corporation is also a business seeking profit afterall and sometimes a bully also.

I checked the landlord insurance, it covers damage by tenant, rental default/loss, legal fees but unfortunately not utility bill payment. Unless it can be custom written.

As long there is no connection, tnb will pursue the arrears through reminders and court actions from tenant.

In most cases, landlord will pay up unwillingly as a vacant property is a loss of income.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: May 29 2021, 08:44 AM

If the tenant has left, it's a simple process to just change the name back to you and move on. Regardless of what the arrears are.

If the tenant has not left, then you need to follow the full legal means of getting the tenant out. Thta's an eviction process - regardless of whose name the account is on. Nett nett - change the bill to your tenant.

If the tenant has left, it's a simple process to just change the name back to you and move on. Regardless of what the arrears are.

If the tenant has not left, then you need to follow the full legal means of getting the tenant out. Thta's an eviction process - regardless of whose name the account is on. Nett nett - change the bill to your tenant.

Need to change meter every time change name?

If meter always in landlord's name, taking meter reading (on same meter) upon moving in/out would be clear cut on bill split.

Which reminds me, i had seen rental properties with submeters within 1 apartment, as they rent room by room. any comment on that?

Since you have ONLY experience in subsale transfer, I rest my case as I accept that my dead cow aint coming back to life even if I call the vet.

BTW, if new, application is done by the developers.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: May 30 2021, 11:10 AM

nowadays there are prepaid smart meter, need to pay first then only will get electricity supply but not sure how good it is.

Chinese tenant?

Again, another lowyater who only spreads rumours without validating. Please see official booklet from TNB - https://www.tnb.com.my/assets/files/TNB_VAS...ooklet_2016.pdf


Q: Is the Landlord responsible for the bill arrears that haven’t been paid
A: No. The Tenant who has left the premises has to pay the leftover amount

Q: If a new Tenant wants to apply for an electricity supply, can TNB request him/her to pay the bill arrears that has not been settled by the old Tenant?
A: TNB cannot request the new Tenant to pay for the arrears or any amount of electricity usage that was from the old Tenant.


Both questions above from the TNB booklet. As long as you can prove ownership, even if your tenant has a big amount pending - you can change to your name with no liability on the past amount. Please read - don't simply listen to rumours and talk.

At least is not my talk.

Consumers who have first hand experienced with TNB will know.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: May 31 2021, 08:52 AM

Please ensure you get the info directly from TNB. I wrote to them - and you can too - tnbcareline@tnb.com.my . I have also asked around. Nobody has had any problem with changing the name after their tenant ran away. TNB are pretty good at it even if there is a big balance.









On Tue, 1 Jun 2021, at 10:25, tnbcareline@tnb.com.my wrote:
Salam TNB


Dear Mr.

You can proceed with change of tenancy, but for the application you needs to be made at nearest Kedai Tenaga only.


Please make sure bring tenant IC copy (Front & Back Cross for TNB use only)


If you on behalf for the tenant , please bring Authorize Letter & On behalf person IC copy & tenant IC copy (Front & Back Cross for TNB use only)


We hope the above information satisfies your concern. Please do not hesitate to contact us at 1 300 88 5454 (Account & Billing) / 15454 (Outage & Street Light) if you need further assistance regarding this matter.


Stay Home, Stay Safe, Stay Healthy


Thank you for using TNB Careline.


Best Regards,
Danial.
Social Media Unit,
TNB CareLine.





Organize and pay all your TNB bills no matter where you are with the new myTNB app and portal! Experience latest features and a sleek new look that makes all your TNB transactions even faster and easier than before. Click here to learn more.




>> Original Message ...
>> From:
>> To: tnbcareline@tnb.com.my
>> Subject: Change Account Name
>> Sent: 01/06/2021 10:03
>>
>>

Hello TNB,
>>


>>
If I have a tenant who has runaway and has a balance of about RM15k in the bill on his name, can I still change the bill to the new tenant's name? The account is tied to the person, not to the property right?
>>


>>
TNB will go after the old tenant seperately. I am not accountable for the RM 15K bill as it's on his name.
>>


>>
Please clarify.
>>


>>
Thanks
>>
Suresh


********************************************************************************************
NOTIFICATION: The personal data and other information contained in this email is confidential and only for the use of the intended recipient. If you are not the intended recipient, you must not read, copy, deliver or disclose this email to anyone. If you have received this email in error, please notify the sender immediately or call 1300 80 2323 or TNB CareLine at 1300 88 5454 and permanently delete all copies of this email. TNB disclaims all liability for any error, loss or damage arising from this email being infected by computer virus or other malicious software.
********************************************************************************************

No further comment as I said I rest my case.

I am also a landlord for many many years and CS reply can be overruled by COO.

Asking around is NOT proof of validation.

I appreciate you go all out to prove me wrong and I wish I am wrong so being a landlord solve my problem.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: Jun 1 2021, 02:06 PM

I have asked TNB and they've given an answer in writing. So I find it strange how you literally quote a LYN post and assign more validity then official comms from TNB.

All I can say is I have heated argument and bang table in TNB manager's room.

If the reply is from the CEO office, it could be different then. Maybe you like to further validate your pov.

Appreciate your help.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: Jun 1 2021, 04:33 PM

Policy is only good if people follow it or implemented accordingly.
Perhaps it was generally followed save for a few cases or due to certain TNB head want to show KPI. So it may not be so straightforward.
Anyhow if it really happen then need to rotan TNB - report to Suruhanjaya Tenaga or the relevant ministry.

TnB never and cannot force landlord to pay for tenant's arrear. They will say, let us siasat with the tenant first and we get back to you.....lol.

And the landlord can wait forever.

The keyword is 'siasat'.

This post has been edited by mini orchard: Jun 1 2021, 07:01 PM