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 Insurance Talk V7!, Your one stop Insurance Discussion

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Rinth
post Sep 15 2022, 12:06 PM

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Hi guys quick question, my insurance is all under GE, and i have the access to login into their GE-Connect.

There is a column mentioning as below :-

Potential Lapse Date
-

Non-Lapsed Indicator
Active

No Lapse Guarantee (NLG) eligibility will be invalidate due to either one of the reasons listed below:
Partial Withdrawal
Reduction of GSR ( applicable to Smart Protect Max Plans only)
NLG period is over
Premium was not paid within the grace period



If lets say i didnt missed any premium and pay accordingly, does it means the insurance will keep on running till i'm gone? and what is GSR?

And also for my life insurance / CI, coverage end date are untill 2080 (90 yo), so what happened to the policy? i get the whatever ILP money leftover and policy ended?

This post has been edited by Rinth: Sep 15 2022, 12:13 PM
Rinth
post Sep 4 2023, 09:26 AM

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QUOTE(B u B u @ Sep 2 2023, 11:14 PM)
I'm 33 this year, no past heath issue, non smoker
Thinking to buy life insurance that covers next 20 year. How much roughly for 1m policy?
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QUOTE(lifebalance @ Sep 2 2023, 11:16 PM)
Depends, ranges 100 to 300/m
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RM 100-300? how come so cheap? my ILP 250k life 250k CI edi cost RM 300++ per month... is the 1 u mention standalone policy? untill what years old?



Rinth
post Sep 4 2023, 11:38 AM

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QUOTE(Ramjade @ Sep 4 2023, 11:36 AM)
Depends on age you buy, amount of coverage you choose and until what age. Say if you cover until 100 Vs you cover until 60, very big difference in premium.

Also need to see your insurance increasing in price as you age or fixed. Yes nlike medical insurance which increase as you age, there are these kind of insurance that the premium are fixed for life.
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same age as the guy mentioned above, 33 yo. my coverage not mistaken 80 or 90..... cannot remember....that why i ask lifebalance need more detail.

Rinth
post Sep 4 2023, 11:44 AM

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QUOTE(Ramjade @ Sep 4 2023, 11:40 AM)
Also need to see what insurance company. Like medical insurance, need to shop around.
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mine is GE.....interesting, i thought insurance premium need to follow the insurance fee set up by governement (something like that).....so difference insurance company offering similar coverage, will the price really different so much? just like car insurance with similar sum insured, the price wont differ too much right?

Or maybe some insurance company give "more discount" that why its cheaper abit?
Rinth
post Sep 8 2023, 10:06 AM

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Hi Guys, anyone can explain the below picture?

user posted image
user posted image
user posted image


3.8k pa = Life & CI
3k = Medical
1.9k = son medical

Why is the insurance charges for medical is so much higher then Life insurance? is it normal? which means that agent & insurance earn more thru medical policy?

and why is seems doesnt tally... example monthly RM 160, RM 121.6 into investment (24.32+97.28) , insurance & policy charges RM 74.21 (1.22+4.78+13.93+54.28), total more then monthly RM 160

This post has been edited by Rinth: Sep 8 2023, 10:12 AM
Rinth
post Sep 8 2023, 10:35 AM

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QUOTE(Holocene @ Sep 8 2023, 10:18 AM)
Yes, medical cost are expensive. Normally CI and Medical cost of insurance will be higher than life/TPD.

Based on your example, it means the cost has now exceeded premium paid, this is where they will deduct cash value to keep the policy inforce.
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erm that is my son medical policy, he just 5 yo this year, and i bought 2-3 months after he born...bought on 2019

How come the cost exceed the premium paid? is it because example its expensive for age 0-9 , then cheap 10-30, then gradually increase again?
Rinth
post Sep 8 2023, 10:44 AM

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QUOTE(lifebalance @ Sep 8 2023, 10:35 AM)
The higher your coverage, the higher the charges. Medical benefits are normally high. Your life or critical illness cost will also be high if you opt for a very high coverage.

When you don't pay enough premium to maintain such high coverage then sooner or later, your policy will lapsed due to unable to sustain the policy cost.
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this is the coverage for my son medical

user posted image

i think its those pretty standard coverage, bed RM 150, annual 90k etc etc. So i dun think the coverage is high. unless it was like i mentoned in previous post that age 0-9 example is more expensive and age 10-30 cheaper then gradually increase again.

QUOTE(JIUHWEI @ Sep 8 2023, 10:37 AM)
I'm just curious, is your objective to ensure your financial security or to ensure that agent and insurance company earn less?
Which would help you sleep better at night?

In order to understand these charts, we need to first understand the process flow of all your premiums paid.

So every ringgit you pay in premiums follows this flow:
100% of your premiums paid goes directly into your investment account, less any commissions paid to the agent.
After that, when the company charges for COI, it'll then charge to your investment account, which is where you see the units being deducted accordingly to their unit price.

And since, from the example given, the portion going into your investment account is at that level, my guess is that your policy is rather new?
My guess mungkin salah ya but it's my best guess la
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my objective is to understand my policy better and for financial security. how do i ensure my agent or insurance company earn less? dun buy then they dun earn lo lol..

because all my insurance policy i bought is before i stumble to this post... and frankly said i dun really understand how it work previously and just buy and hope that whatever bad things happen it can cover for me & my family. I'm those that agent say "just need to pay to certain age then the policy will run itself untill end tenure/i died" , but after reading here it not the case, the policy might need top up anytime or have to continue paying untill end tenure to ensure the policy doesnt lapse...

and for that particular example, its my son medical policy bought year 2019 when he just 2-3 months old, is this policy considered new?
Rinth
post Sep 8 2023, 11:32 AM

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QUOTE(JIUHWEI @ Sep 8 2023, 11:13 AM)
Okay bro, chill sikit. Here we memang will tekan a bit.
Just food for thought ya

No worries, it's good that you have something started.  thumbsup.gif

I am new father, I can understand where you coming from. At least from my narrow perspective.
So if I were you, this is what I will flip through the policy contract to look for:

1. Maturity - at what age does the policy mature/expire?
Why this is important leh?
Because let's say I want to save some money, I choose a lower age of maturity, say age 70. Premium lower, of course I happy.
And what that means is that at age 70, the policy ends. Should there be extra funds in the policy, I may have the option to let the coverage continue until the funds in the policy runs out, but I cannot continue to pay premiums into it, sebab the contractual term dah tamat.

2. Account value projection - look for a chart with the non-guaranteed account value, with scenario 1 and scenario 2.
Why this is important leh?
It's important to you because your objective is clearly for some level of security.
SO if the projection levels at age 70 is just a "-", what I would do is to put up more money into the regular premiums.
Personal preference: I would much rather put up small tickets along the way, rather than be given a big surprise in my golden years.

In what scenario would you need to cough up more money, aka, top-up?
How insurance started is based on the guiding principle of mutual assurance. The same guiding principle is still well and alive today, just that it also developed with the times into all the different selections that we see today. No right no wrong, it just caters to different market segments. So to each, its own.
With that in mind, comes my first point: we are sharing into this medical insurance pool with all the customers of your respective insurance company. Should the claims experience be above and beyond what was projected, everybody that shares into the pool would naturally have to pull more weight.
Secondly, we also need to understand the nature of an investment linked policy.
When interest rates are up, naturally it demands less money from us to sustain the policy.
When interest rates are down, naturally it demands more money from us to sustain the policy.
Of course there are going to be exceptional cases. And the example I illustrated above is just a general guide to understand it.

So with this in mind, we can actually have a proactive role with our policy (hence the importance of reviewing regularly).
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No issue, recently alot hoo haa about agent thingy, so no problem. definitely will double check all my policy when free.

Something interested you mention in bold, do you mean when the tenure end at age 70, suppose it should lapse and surrender all the values back to us owner, but we can choose to continue/extend the policy let say to age 80, using the values to run the extension untill age 80?


QUOTE(lifebalance @ Sep 8 2023, 11:13 AM)
If GE have not send you any letter notice, you don't need to worry about anything.

However if you are worried, you can always get your agent to talk to you about the policy.
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Well to be frank if i just believe and get what the agent says then i wont come to this thread to get 3rd parties suggestion/explanation/guidance...

Rinth
post Sep 8 2023, 05:13 PM

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QUOTE(denion @ Sep 8 2023, 04:34 PM)
hi Rinth, reason being insurance charges for medical is much higher than life insurance is due to the claims ratio and also medical cost in Malaysia. the high insurance charges of medical card is to cover this coverage cost. in terms of whether agent/insurance companies earn more through medical policy, it will come down to very technical term to explain and very complicated. in short, because of the high insurance charges of medical card, hence higher premium. (if got chance to meet up, then only explain to you more on the agent commission part, to explain it here will be difficult and complicated). biggrin.gif

also your premium of RM160 will be used to buy funds (example here is the RM121.60) then the funds will be used to deduct all insurance cost+policy fees (RM74.21) then the balance of RM47.39 goes to cash value. smile.gif
hope the above clarify and answers your concern wink.gif
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RM 121.60 to buy funds, deduct RM 74.21 policy + insurance cost, left RM 47.39 in the funds.

But RM 160.00 - RM 121.6 = RM 38.40 Where this go?
Rinth
post Sep 15 2023, 09:24 AM

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Quick illsutration :-

Age 65, planning to buy medical cards for whatsoever reason.

2 plans, same coverage RM 500k annual limit Unlimited lifetime except Plan A no life insurance portion, Plan B RM 100k life insurance, Sustainable duration is Age 80 (means the policy end on age 80 right?)

Premium RM 6xx per month for Plan A, RM 9xx for Plan B.

Can anyone analyse on :-

1) This is ILP or standalone?
2) is there any differences if taking ILP or standalone plan? I previously heard standalone life insurance covers untill age 70 or 80 only, but with ILP can cover longer untill example 90 yo.
3) differences RM 3xx per month premium worth it or not for additional RM 100k life insurance?

My own analysis :-

1) should be ILP, so maybe will ask standalone price
2) NOt sure
3)not worth it, due to 15 years policy only and the additional RM 300 per month x 12 x 15 = RM 54k already. Arguable that there will be cash value during end of tenure but not sure whether it'll worth RM 54k or not. Only benefit is if anything happened during the 15 years, then the RM100k serve it purposes.
Rinth
post Sep 15 2023, 10:12 AM

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duplicate

This post has been edited by Rinth: Sep 15 2023, 10:15 AM
Rinth
post Sep 15 2023, 10:13 AM

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QUOTE(lifebalance @ Sep 15 2023, 09:43 AM)
The real question is,
1. Are you trying to give insurance advise to a 3rd party or by copy pasting our replies here to answer the 3rd party?

2. Are you an insurance agent?

It's not advisable to give out insurance advise if you are not an insurance agent. Instead, get this person to contact a licensed agent instead to get proper advice as your question above is speculative and general without proper context.

Whether it's "worth it" or not is always depending on the purpose of the insurance.
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1. Yes, that 3rd party is my parent.

2. no

its because i'm not insurance agent, thats why i try to get suggestion/advise from sifu here.

Like i always says, if i just contact the licensed agent and listen to his illustration & stories, then i wont come here to get suggestion.

My purpose is very simple. i just want to know normally, ppl will take plan A or plan B....because my parent doesnt have medical card now, so they've already decide to purchase, but asking whether want take Plan A or Plan B....my own suggestion like i mention in the post is take Plan A, and if the plans is ILP, is it possible to take standalone plan with cheaper premium (i'm aware the premium will increase gradually over the year). Because it doesnt make sense to take ILP at age 65, the funds dun have enough time to grow, sooner or later few years down the road the policy premium will increase for sure.

This post has been edited by Rinth: Sep 15 2023, 10:19 AM
Rinth
post Sep 15 2023, 11:07 AM

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QUOTE(JIUHWEI @ Sep 15 2023, 10:53 AM)
1) This is ILP or standalone?
Bro... maybe this question is for the agent who sent the proposals to you?

From the premium u as agent cannot determine? i mean from 1st glance i think you know the answer already. I'm not expert so my glance cannot tell, i only can guess.

2) is there any differences if taking ILP or standalone plan? I previously heard standalone life insurance covers untill age 70 or 80 only, but with ILP can cover longer untill example 90 yo.
I figured it would be easier for you to tell what you want, what your expectations are.

the reason i ask because if via ILP can extent to older age, then no choice will choose ILP. If there is no difference then we still have option to choose whether is standalone or ILP.

3) differences RM 3xx per month premium worth it or not for additional RM 100k life insurance?
At 65, the rates are about that level.
Worth it or not... it is so subjective.

RM 13 for mineral water... in many instances, I would rather stay thirsty.
But if I'm up on a mountain with my wife and my baby and all of us are thirsty, I'd get 2 of the same bottle for a start.
Back to your question: life insurance worth it or not... it's so subjective la bro.

And what other people usually buy... got anything to do with you or not?
What if I tell you other people usually buy without knowing anything about it, mau ikut?
If that's the case, why even check here? Just sign simply2 je lah

And your analysis...
Maybe just fork out more money for a higher sum assured, and a longer sustainability.
How high leh? Until it's worth it loh.
IYKYK
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if this policy for myself (younger age, 30++), i'll definitely take with Life insurance coverage because we still have alot loan, not much retirement funds, not much assets. But this policy is for a 65 years old, which is out of ordinary circumstances (well for our family, maybe not for insurance agent), not much outstanding loan, still working. Hence the question to get opinion. and you also mentioned, people usually buy without knowing anything, i used to be this kind of people, so i hope to get more transparent to truthful answer from here to avoid simply buy without knowing what we're buying.
Rinth
post Sep 15 2023, 11:22 AM

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QUOTE(Ramjade @ Sep 15 2023, 10:59 AM)
I worte about it in few post back about ILP Vs standalone. Anything bundle with life insurance is usually ILP.

Keep in mind that if your parents got existing condition they won't be covered eg high blood pressure, diabetes and it's complication.

You can choose to cover until whatever age you can afford. Nowadays got standalone insurance cover until 100 years old. But can you afford the premium at day 20k/year?

I alway say get standalone. Don't get sold by agents or "planners" for ILP.

Cheapest standalone until age 80 (from what I calculate Vs AIA or GE you can cover to 100 also if you want)
1. Medisavers
https://medisavers.my/medisaversvip-prime.html

Others
AIA medi flex with rider
https://www.aia.com.my/en/our-products/medi...e-mediflex.html

GE
https://www.greateasternlife.com/my/en/pers...-extender2.html

Generali
https://fiselect.my/medical/

Keep in mind some last age to onboard is 70. Expect insurance companies to ask for medical report on health before approval due to age. They can ask for it and it is their right.

For me personally I went with AIA. I had an GE insurance, exercise my cooling period due to not so good reputation of GE trying their best to delay admission or GL (not I say, so many of my friends working in private hospitals tell me).

Which one is the best?
AIA and GE can apply for outpatient GL for dialysis while others pay and claim. There is no best. All depends on budget, room and board, how long post hospitalisation follow up.

Which is the cheapest?
If you cover until 80 years old, medisavers

Which one have longest outpatient coverage after hospitalisation?
GE

Which one have not so good reputation?
GE. Others unknown (Generali and medisavers) unable to dig up info on Generali or discovers due to not many people using it. AIA usually no-issue as long as pay on time and in full. No questions asked unlike GE.

When you buy medical insurance, do not expect any cash value left. Whatever you pay, just assumed it's burned. Only way to get returns on medical insurance is to use it for admission.

Hope this help your search. Keep in mind at 60+ premium is expensive yo. Sometimes at that age, best to pay out of pocket.
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Thanks for reply. So I'll ask my parent to get a quote for standalone policy with similar coverage.

Literally if able to purchase the policy before age 70, they should able to extent their medical policy above age 80, provided they can swallow the premium. I'm just afraid that due to whatever reason we want to extent, but due to the insurance doesnt allowed to extent then jialat.

Paying out of pocket most likely was their initial plan, they do have 1 medical policy, but was like those very old policy, annual limit 30k, as they didnt review their policy b4, so now kinda late already.




Rinth
post Oct 3 2023, 10:19 AM

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After all this is forum, where for me at least, is a place to gather information and chit chatty.

For this particular thread, i'm sorry to say i didnt get any useful info that i want from agents, like many have shared here that its always standard answer. Not sure whether its ethic issues or any other reason. From Ramjade although his post is long, but i personally get info that i want, but doesnt mean i had to follow his idea to totally avoid ILP products, not everyone is sophisticated or discipline enough to invest themselves..

So all in all, this thread is just a platform to gather information. Its still fall back to potential buyers needs and wants, if they feel standalone is good then go ahead, if ILP more suitable for them, then so be it.
Rinth
post Oct 3 2023, 10:36 AM

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Just a touch up, recently my son's (5YO) ILP policy get letter for increase in premium of RM 40 per month. Not sure my other policy will increase or not.

If previous me before reading here, I'll sure stomp my agent and query why this happen blah blah blah. But now i just click ok proceed for the increase in premium because now i understand better how ILP works..sooner or later we will definitely get this letter, unless the unit trust perform so well every year and able to keep up with the insurance charges, which not really possible in long run...

Be it standalone or ILP, the premium we pay at certain age stage will definitely increase over time.


Rinth
post Oct 3 2023, 10:40 AM

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QUOTE(MUM @ Oct 3 2023, 10:31 AM)
But if the place they wanted to get more info to decide ( like this thread) to decide if standalone or ilp, ..only et info and suggestion on standalone and all it goodness and all the bad of ilp.

Then the buyer could end up losing
Especially from non licensed respondents.

BTW, those that wanted to know more about standalone or ilp which is better, can always get from Google.
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If its so easy to poach that particular buyer to buy standalone products, then its equally easy to poach that particular buyer to buy ILP plans...Afterall most of the time a buyer want to purchase a plans, they still have to go thru an agent.

And if google can get the answer, then i wont be asking here previously....Maybe i'm not that good at using google afterall...
Rinth
post Oct 3 2023, 10:51 AM

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QUOTE(MUM @ Oct 3 2023, 10:44 AM)
But the answes given on standalone points to cheaper, ..
Is that a winning and legit answers?
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is cheaper always good?

Is cheaper now but ridiculously expensive in future good?

Or ILP price slightly expensive now but increase price gradually, and towards age 70 example no need to pay anymore or pay the same premium as previous year good?

Refer to the below graph which i google and get it from another lowyat post

user posted image

In the end, some may like ILP because "stable" premium over time, some may like standalone because they can stomach the humongous premium at latter age...
Rinth
post Oct 3 2023, 11:18 AM

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QUOTE(MUM @ Oct 3 2023, 11:14 AM)
Did you not notice, there are many questions asking about it here
Some just want mire info to help them to decide after getting info from the web
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i don't get it...

of course ppl come here to get info.....if not come here as keyboard warrior?
Rinth
post Oct 3 2023, 11:24 AM

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QUOTE(MUM @ Oct 3 2023, 11:20 AM)
If the info is 1 sided?
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Then so be it. what's the fuss? you expect to get all the information from here alone? If the buyer make decision just based on 1 sided info means that he cannot differentiate things.

If he has doubt he should continue look for more info, be it in forum or google or ask current agent or ask new agent....if he lazy then that's the buyer problem for making decision based on 1 sided info.

Why blame the info providers?

This post has been edited by Rinth: Oct 3 2023, 11:26 AM

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