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> Honda 1.5T enjin, Kena kenching?

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Aloha31TEC
post Nov 7 2019, 08:20 AM

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QUOTE(System Error Message @ Nov 7 2019, 02:07 AM)
planned obscelence and economics work differently. If economics are bad people cant buy a new car so keep to older one. You cant force people to buy a new car as they'll just switch brands. So new cars have to be better than older ones and they have many ways of doing it. Basically if you care about new tech or comfort or luxury you'd buy a new car. If you want to get around cheaply without creature comforts you'd buy an older car or keep your older car. If your current car serves your purpose that a new car doesnt seem to do so better, than new cars arent marketed towards you.

The germans have planned obscelence by the part, the americans make the whole car junk for planned obscelence. Different brands, different directions. Just to give you an example, american brands use planned obscelence by experimentation. Different car gen, different tech such as different suspensions, different engine properties (like shutting off half the cylinders when not needed) and other things. Since they only plan the car to last 70Mm or 3 years, not a problem for them  to make sure the tech last, they can roll it out for people to buy. The germans know how to make very good cars, so good that they can engineer specific faults so thats why they are expensive to maintain because if you dont change the part according to manual you'll get a huge repair bill not covered by warranty for failure to follow the manual that is considered reasonable by law despite the high cost. Profiteering isnt illegal and its a way they get huge profit.

However the brands here are all japanese and you could say that toyota has been a bit less reliable lately but that usually happens when they have to come out with new tech. It takes 2-3 years for them to fix issues just like it took proton years to fix the problems with campro that we see cars with campro 5 years from when it was introduced still driving around today compared to the earlier version like the waja 1.5 campro compared to a 2013 proton saga with 1.5L campro.
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They need time to retune
wkc5657
post Nov 7 2019, 02:23 PM

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QUOTE(Aloha31TEC @ Nov 6 2019, 10:49 PM)
Actually people expect car last for how long?

In engineering point of view, there must be a life of car in required spec before design a car.

Come to the part selection stages, engineers will select the most suitable one based on cost and part performance.

Maybe Japanese car with a life spec target of 15 years but conti cars for 10 years.
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This one hard to say, but look indirectly through financing structures and other vehicular related regulations. What i'm saying here is purely my opinion, but i don't think i'm shitting nonsense either :

For western brands, quite a big portion of drivers don't buy cars, they lease them (for whatever reason). And leasing terms usually range around 3 to 4 years. The "coincidental" thing is that, facelifts also within this period of time, coincidence right? icon_idea.gif These cars also minimally serviced (seriously minimal, some even don't give a damn about changing the engine oil. Why give a shit when not the owner of the car right?). Driving in such condition, first 3-4 years, hardly will show much problem. Ex fleet/lease buyers, buy at own risk and hope the previous owner not so lazy.

So since majority of drive their car in such a manner, no point over engineer it too much. Ball park guestimate, 5 years/150,000km for trouble free driving generally.

For japanese, there's some sort of environmental/government regulation relating to car age, that it gets more and more expensive as the cars ages. So usually by year 5, this "penalty" starts to get uneconomical to keep the current car, so dispose. Japanese cars being quite a work horse, 3rd world countries prefer them as get to still use them reliably (or to suckers like us that prize their 2nd hand recon cars). But due to japanese ethics and their slightly different perspective in engineering their craft, even their so-so level of quality is quite above average generally. But due to the 08/09 great recession and some bad influence from their western counterparts (or 1st tier contractors), some of the hardball cost cutting starts showing up.


Aloha31TEC
post Nov 8 2019, 03:17 PM

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QUOTE(wkc5657 @ Nov 7 2019, 02:23 PM)
This one hard to say, but look indirectly through financing structures and other vehicular related regulations. What i'm saying here is purely my opinion, but i don't think i'm shitting nonsense either :

For western brands, quite a big portion of drivers don't buy cars, they lease them (for whatever reason). And leasing terms usually range around 3 to 4 years. The "coincidental" thing is that, facelifts also within this period of time, coincidence right?  icon_idea.gif These cars also minimally serviced (seriously minimal, some even don't give a damn about changing the engine oil. Why give a shit when not the owner of the car right?). Driving in such condition, first 3-4 years, hardly will show much problem. Ex fleet/lease buyers, buy at own risk and hope the previous owner not so lazy.

So since majority of drive their car in such a manner, no point over engineer it too much. Ball park guestimate, 5 years/150,000km for trouble free driving generally.

For japanese, there's some sort of environmental/government regulation relating to car age, that it gets more and more expensive as the cars ages. So usually by year 5, this "penalty" starts to get uneconomical to keep the current car, so dispose. Japanese cars being quite a work horse, 3rd world countries prefer them as get to still use them reliably (or to suckers like us that prize their 2nd hand recon cars). But due to japanese ethics and their slightly different perspective in engineering their craft, even their so-so level of quality is quite above average generally. But due to the 08/09 great recession and some bad influence from their western counterparts (or 1st tier contractors), some of the hardball cost cutting starts showing up.
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Now those japanese MNC are falling....
So I think cost really matters to them now.
I know Japanese well, their company now don't really earn much....
ckk125
post Nov 8 2019, 03:36 PM

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QUOTE(Boy96 @ Nov 5 2019, 04:49)

we have FC civics here with more than 150k km already in malaysia. Our civic suffers from fuel pump issues instead of oil dilution
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Fuel pump failures are wayyyy more problematic and dangerous than oil dilution problem
Thrust
post Nov 8 2019, 04:04 PM

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QUOTE(ckk125 @ Nov 8 2019, 03:36 PM)
Fuel pump failures are wayyyy more problematic and dangerous than oil dilution problem
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I think the worst case for fuel pump failure is causes inconvenience to driver. Need to tow to workshop for replacement but won't cause severe engine damage.

Oil dillution issue on the other hand will cause internal engine parts to wear prematurely.
System Error Message
post Nov 8 2019, 11:10 PM

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QUOTE(Thrust @ Nov 8 2019, 04:04 PM)
I think the worst case for fuel pump failure is causes inconvenience to driver. Need to tow to workshop for replacement but won't cause severe engine damage.

Oil dillution issue on the other hand will cause internal engine parts to wear prematurely.
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however oil dilation wear can be mitigated by changing the oil more often. Fuel pump problem happens suddenly or gives you a lack of power and leaves you stranded while oil dilation doesnt. So you can still drive your car and get an oil change but you cant do so to change the pump when it goes.
littlefire
post Nov 8 2019, 11:44 PM

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https://www.consumerreports.org/car-recalls...-turbo-engines/

Some consumers have reported that their engines stalled or that the vehicles experienced a sudden loss of power, raising safety concerns. Honda said last year that the turbo engine problems were mainly in extreme cold weather. But Consumer Reports has heard from CR-V owners experiencing difficulties in summer months and in California, Texas, and other warm-weather states.

There will be small percentage of those people will notice (Most malaysian only see warning light in dash panic, but oil dilution usually no warning) Malaysia is lucky due to its hot weather and majority people around 6~7k already start going back SC for service. So the problem mostly can contain to a minimal % and most people will not complain until very bad fuel smell or check engine lights up. The only way is to sent to lab test to test the oil dilution percentage during oil change, but i dont think most owner will do that.


Karenalvin
post Nov 9 2019, 09:07 AM

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QUOTE(unitron @ Nov 5 2019, 01:49 PM)
Reliable but require more maintenance ?  That's opposite right.

Reliable means it needs less maintenance... anything that needs more maintenance is not reliable. Regardless old / new
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I think reliability and maintenance are not mutually exclusive. Something can have low maintenance and be unreliable. and some things can be reliable and yet not durable

Reliability pertains to giving expected performance when needed. So each time you want something to work it would work.

take for example, you can have a pacemaker that requires yearly maintenance with 99.999% reliability in a given year but will only be able to maintain 70% reliability from the 3rd year onwards
versus one that offers maintenance schedule of five years with 90% reliability, but is only able to achieve reliability of only 95% even if we increase maintenance to yearly schedule. assuming all cost being even, most people will probably pick the 99.999% reliability over the one with lower maintenance.

tyres are also a pretty good example, typically you can expect softer compound tyres to perform reliability in both wet and dry, stopping on a dime even in the wet. the price for such reliability is higher cost of maintenance. alternatively you can get hard compound that is not too bothered by a few PSI difference in operating pressure but you best pray you don't have to emergency brake in the rain.

so there are things that are

1. reliable without maintenance: a hammer
2. reliable with maintenance: a fire extinguisher
3. unreliable even with maintenance: perhaps the VW DSG fiasco
4. unreliable without maintenance: most tools fall in this category

This post has been edited by Karenalvin: Nov 9 2019, 09:12 AM
ckk125
post Nov 10 2019, 01:16 PM

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QUOTE(Thrust @ Nov 8 2019, 04:04 PM)
I think the worst case for fuel pump failure is causes inconvenience to driver. Need to tow to workshop for replacement but won't cause severe engine damage.

Oil dillution issue on the other hand will cause internal engine parts to wear prematurely.
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Fuel pump is way way worst.. imagine if drive on highway, outstation with 4 family members on raya holidays, stop at r&r to use the washroom, just for the fuel pump to not start, that will be your worst nightmare.

Dont forget, if fuel pump fails, it is worse than a flat battery, ur car is completely ‘kong’
TSFat & Fluffy
post Nov 10 2019, 02:43 PM

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QUOTE(ckk125 @ Nov 10 2019, 03:16 PM)
Fuel pump is way way worst.. imagine if drive on highway, outstation with 4 family members on raya holidays, stop at r&r to use the washroom, just for the fuel pump to not start, that will be your worst nightmare.

Dont forget, if fuel pump fails, it is worse than a flat battery, ur car is completely ‘kong’
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but in terms of long term damage?
Thrust
post Nov 10 2019, 04:49 PM

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QUOTE(ckk125 @ Nov 10 2019, 01:16 PM)
Fuel pump is way way worst.. imagine if drive on highway, outstation with 4 family members on raya holidays, stop at r&r to use the washroom, just for the fuel pump to not start, that will be your worst nightmare.

Dont forget, if fuel pump fails, it is worse than a flat battery, ur car is completely ‘kong’
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How about the long term damage?
dares
post Nov 11 2019, 11:02 AM

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QUOTE(ckk125 @ Nov 10 2019, 01:16 PM)
Fuel pump is way way worst.. imagine if drive on highway, outstation with 4 family members on raya holidays, stop at r&r to use the washroom, just for the fuel pump to not start, that will be your worst nightmare.

Dont forget, if fuel pump fails, it is worse than a flat battery, ur car is completely ‘kong’
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This consider OK.

Imagine going uphill then suddenly fuel pump stop working, the car just stop in the middle of the slope and won't restart.

Happened to me before when my old Waja fuel pump konked with no warning.
ckk125
post Nov 11 2019, 10:17 PM

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QUOTE(Thrust @ Nov 10 2019, 04:49 PM)
How about the long term damage?
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No idea, but a failed fuel pump is no joke, breakdown at the wrong place and wrong time, life can be damaged😂
ckk125
post Nov 11 2019, 10:18 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Nov 11 2019, 11:02 AM)
This consider OK.

Imagine going uphill then suddenly fuel pump stop working, the car just stop in the middle of the slope and won't restart.

Happened to me before when my old Waja fuel pump konked with no warning.
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Yup.. waja’s infamous fuel pump, need to kena once to remember forever
TSFat & Fluffy
post Nov 12 2019, 10:18 AM

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QUOTE(ckk125 @ Nov 12 2019, 12:17 AM)
No idea, but a failed fuel pump is no joke, breakdown at the wrong place and wrong time, life can be damaged😂
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hayar.. that's like any critical part that breaks down... as long no long term dmg is ok... things like timinig belt putus then only gg
timidandslow
post Nov 13 2019, 10:06 PM

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QUOTE(dares @ Nov 11 2019, 11:02 AM)
This consider OK.

Imagine going uphill then suddenly fuel pump stop working, the car just stop in the middle of the slope and won't restart.

Happened to me before when my old Waja fuel pump konked with no warning.
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QUOTE(ckk125 @ Nov 11 2019, 10:17 PM)
No idea, but a failed fuel pump is no joke, breakdown at the wrong place and wrong time, life can be damaged😂
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the same can be said for VW dsg mechatronic, or two tyres shredded by road debris. such occurrence will definitely render your car stranded. why single out fuel pump in particular ?
dares
post Nov 13 2019, 11:59 PM

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QUOTE(timidandslow @ Nov 13 2019, 10:06 PM)
the same can be said for VW dsg mechatronic, or two tyres shredded by road debris. such occurrence will definitely render your car stranded. why single out fuel pump in particular ?
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Because this thread is talking about Civic 1.5T and fuel pump failure is one of the issues plaguing this model in Malaysia.
wkc5657
post Nov 14 2019, 10:29 AM

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QUOTE(dares @ Nov 13 2019, 11:59 PM)
Because this thread is talking about Civic 1.5T and fuel pump failure is one of the issues plaguing this model in Malaysia.
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This is something new to me.

The dedicated civic thread mainly complaining about some bad interior fittings and some transmission jerking and vsa module clicking, no one saying anything about fuel pump. Am i missing something?
davidletterboyz
post Nov 14 2019, 10:35 AM

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QUOTE(Fat & Fluffy @ Nov 4 2019, 09:14 PM)

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Sometimes I wonder why a Youtuber like that can earn 2.8 mil subscribers. hmm.gif
dares
post Nov 14 2019, 10:59 AM

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QUOTE(wkc5657 @ Nov 14 2019, 10:29 AM)
This is something new to me.

The dedicated civic thread mainly complaining about some bad interior fittings and some transmission jerking and vsa module clicking, no one saying anything about fuel pump. Am i missing something?
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There are reports of the 1.5T (Civic and CRV) fuel pump getting clogged then fail when they use RON97 petrol from a certain brand.

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