Welcome Guest ( Log In | Register )

Outline · [ Standard ] · Linear+

 Ubb CASH TRUST 3 years nett 6-8% pa anyone?, UBB Amanah Bhd

views
     
kok_pun
post Aug 16 2021, 12:55 PM

Mortgage Expert
*****
Senior Member
854 posts

Joined: Oct 2009
QUOTE(Buyalotforgaming @ Jul 15 2021, 06:17 PM)
Is anyone able to confirm this? Thank you.
*
I have signed up in 2020 and your Q has me relooked at my Trust Deed. and there is no "distribution" pertaining to the investment part. It was worded as "projected profit share".

another clause wrote deed dissolution is upon full disbursement of Trust Capital in accordance with the T&C. So I guess Capital is unaffected.

so I think it is Legit la cos I have gotten the % of profit already last month

This post has been edited by kok_pun: Aug 16 2021, 12:55 PM
kok_pun
post Aug 17 2021, 10:43 AM

Mortgage Expert
*****
Senior Member
854 posts

Joined: Oct 2009
QUOTE(Buyalotforgaming @ Aug 16 2021, 10:01 PM)
I have friends who have invested in these sort of Trusts for a few years already. They say they've been getting their projected returns as well.

If I had one question, I wonder how these Trusts are able to maintain such distributions/payouts given the current economic climate.
*
My guess is lending.

kok_pun
post Aug 19 2021, 07:09 PM

Mortgage Expert
*****
Senior Member
854 posts

Joined: Oct 2009
QUOTE(Buyalotforgaming @ Aug 17 2021, 11:40 PM)
Exactly. In some sense, if it were as risk free as it sounds, I might as well take a loan and put it here  laugh.gif  but I also must admit my knowledge on the matter is extremely limited. Could be entirely wrong.
When you signed up for it, isn't there a prospectus? Or at least some sort of detail on how they generate their returns etc?

If they are involved in lending, I would assume that their clients could be those that are unable to obtain loans from your normal banks. Having said that, there is a high likelihood that borrowers may be even worse off in the current climate.
*
No wor. But I understand la. Since they are not governed by SC and I was told it’s conflict of interest if they market it as an investment tool

But it got something like “fixed income securities, bond etc” in the trust deed
kok_pun
post Aug 21 2021, 03:33 PM

Mortgage Expert
*****
Senior Member
854 posts

Joined: Oct 2009
QUOTE(ASF1984 @ Aug 21 2021, 07:43 AM)
Planworth and Ikhitar generally charge a 2% upfront fee for lending, plus around 1% per month until the invoice has been settled.
They lend between 80-90% of invoice value.  The invoice is "sold" by the contractor to the factoring company, meaning that the government pays directly to the factoring company.
They take out what they are owed, and remit the balance to the contractor.

Contractors use these factoring companies due to their fast approval times to enable them to pay immediate obligations such as payroll and minimal collateral requirements.
 
Contractors have very few options, as these factoring companies can provide capital within 4 working days where as commercial banks may take 1-6 months for approval as well as requiring heavy collateral.

The products offered by commercial banks are far less suited to these objectives when compared to those companies that focus solely on providing cashflow to companies with government related contracts. 

I do not know much about Kenaga Factoring, but do note that they make an effort to avoid mentioning rates on their website.

Hence, I don't see UBB being a scam, but rather they have found a niche in a particular market that can absorb a lot of capital.
I don't know who else is filling this void?

That said, an investment in UBB is not risk free.

There are potential collection issues is a contractor is bankrupted or wound up or any other situation where their accounts are frozen.

Contractors can be terminated or heavily penalized by the government for poor performance.  It would be possible for a factoring company to lend more to a contractor than what they are paid (say a contractor invoices for RM100,000.  Factoring company will lend 85% or RM85,000.  Government imposes a poor performance penalty of 30%.  Factoring company gets paid RM70,000 but has already lent RM85,000).  Though this can be mitigated by having a minimum duration of factored invoices (say if it for a cleaning contract that has a monthly invoice, the factotring company can have a minimum of 12 invoice factored concurrently.

There is a potential for the government to tighten up their procurement process and only award contracts to companies with substantial cash reserves, essentially eliminating the need for factoring, and trapping UBB with excess funds that they are unable to loan.

Do your home work and know your risks.
*
Thank you for the insights. I like analyses backed with facts and figures.

Do you mind helping me out to decipher one line in my contract? I might be interpreting it wrongly. I just want to be assured that it is capital guaranteed. Investment return is secondary.

The line reads like this:

“The deed shall be determined and dissolved upon the full disbursement of the Trust Capital in accordance with the TnC of this deed”

I know there is TnC, if I fulfilled everything, then I should be getting all the capital back right?
kok_pun
post Aug 21 2021, 05:26 PM

Mortgage Expert
*****
Senior Member
854 posts

Joined: Oct 2009
QUOTE(ASF1984 @ Aug 21 2021, 04:25 PM)
The line above basically states that upon the agreed duration of the deed, they will distribute the capital as per their T&C.

Possible to post a full copy of that?
*
Can post? I am not sure If I am allowed to post the contents in a trust deed publicly. Offline bagi you ok or not? Got my name on it.
kok_pun
post Aug 24 2021, 07:54 PM

Mortgage Expert
*****
Senior Member
854 posts

Joined: Oct 2009
QUOTE(mmweric @ Jun 15 2020, 12:44 PM)
I am just giving you examples on the many ways how it is possible to commit fraud.  It's easy to forge documents, a website and a office.  A lot of times in fraud the agent or the company committing the fraud will claim linkages to a proper company.  Like recently Vincent Tan just lodge a police report as there have been a lot of people claiming he is backing some cryptocurrency investment.

You have to check things for yourself but currently with the low FD rates any commited return of 5% and above most probably has a chance of partial capital lost.
*
This one i can contribute a bit. someone ran the ssm search and sent me a copy, eventually quite healthy wor. I am not speaking on behalf of UBB, but as a small fry trust deed holder
kok_pun
post Aug 25 2021, 05:47 PM

Mortgage Expert
*****
Senior Member
854 posts

Joined: Oct 2009
QUOTE(ASF1984 @ Aug 25 2021, 10:41 AM)
Being around since 1988 and their past performance helps create trust.

Delivering what people expect is in their best interest, but  I've run through a copy of their latest "Trust Proposal Form".

These are the clauses that stand out to me:

1.1 I/We hereby grant the mandate for the Trustee to manage and administer the Trust Capital as instructed by me/us from time to time and/or as provided in Clause 2.1 of this Instrument of which the Trustee shall have all the powers over and in respect of the Trust Capital and the Trustee could exercise as if the Trustee is the owner of the Trust Capital to invest, in part or in whole, in one or more Authorised Investment, provided always, the Authorised Investment is safeguarded with asset of equal value and accumulatively, the Authorised Investments are projected to provide returns of an average between seven percent (7%) to nine percent (9%) per annum of the Trust Capital.

COMMENT:
"Safeguarded with an asset of equal value".  The assets in which they invest must be MYR cash based and not exposed to fluctuation.
3.2 At the expiry of the Tenure of Trust, this Instrument shall be determined and Trustee shall release the Trust Capital
and/or any accumulated income derived from the Trust Capital minus all liabilities to me/us.

Notwithstanding anything herein, the Trust Capital may be subjected to costs and expenses, directly and indirectly, incurred in connection to the establishment, management, operation and execution of the Trust including but not limited to any payment of any and all tax liabilities and Trustee Remunerations (as defined hereinafter in Clause 6 of this Instrument), charges or assessments whatsoever, any stamp duties, statutory tax or any other Governmental taxes or changes payable by the Trustee for which the Trustee may be liable in respect of such distributions.

COMMENTS:
Liabilities is a strong word. 
These two Clauses mean that your initial capital is not guaranteed to be returned in full.

All else is quite straightforward and standard.
*
"initial capital is not guaranteed to be returned in full"

Is this because of the early termination penalty 20%?

kok_pun
post Aug 27 2021, 12:31 PM

Mortgage Expert
*****
Senior Member
854 posts

Joined: Oct 2009
QUOTE(negayem @ Aug 27 2021, 08:36 AM)
I am also a UBB Trust Deed holder. To me, the above statement is very accurate. If you are able to take risk with your capital, then this may be suitable but never be over greedy. I have less than 5% of my investable money with UBB.
*
mega rich... minimum ticket was rm30,000 and say it's 5% then u have rm600,000 free money... now u say it's less than 5% that means u have more than that....

kok_pun
post Aug 29 2021, 01:53 PM

Mortgage Expert
*****
Senior Member
854 posts

Joined: Oct 2009
QUOTE(edwin1002 @ Aug 28 2021, 06:53 PM)
where to buy this? any fund fact sheet?
*
Current offering ends in 3 days. I got the materials.

 

Change to:
| Lo-Fi Version
0.3429sec    0.62    7 queries    GZIP Disabled
Time is now: 29th November 2025 - 05:50 PM