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 REIT, real estate investment...

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htt
post Oct 30 2008, 08:42 AM

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QUOTE(skiddtrader @ Oct 30 2008, 02:10 AM)
Question:

The NAV stated is based on the evaluation of the properties when purchased or is it evaluated annually?

My concern is the initial evaluation during peak property prices will not reflect the true value of the REIT when property prices slump. I'm not saying it is false advertising, as the NAV is based on accounting figures.
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Individual REIT might have their own policy on property valuation, they whether use historical cost (unlikely) or fixed interval re-valuation. Most of them doing that for interval of 1 or 2 years, some 3. NAV going up and down with the valuation, whether or not the NAV is correct vary depending on the point of valuation. And true, that's just accounting figure and doesn't mean anything when they have to liquidate the asset during extraordinary time (I like the word 'extraordinary', that can mean anything tongue.gif ).
htt
post Nov 7 2008, 06:42 AM

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QUOTE(espree @ Nov 6 2008, 11:22 PM)
I see. so if by reading this page:

Entitlements (Notice of Book Closure)

GUINNESS ANCHOR BERHAD
Stock Name
GUINESS
Date Announced
03/11/2008
EX-date
27/11/2008
Entitlement date
01/12/2008
Entitlement time
05:00:00 PM
Entitlement subject
Final Dividend
Entitlement description
Final dividend of 14 sen per 50 sen stock unit tax exempt and 17 sen gross per 50 sen stock unit less Malaysian income tax at 25%.
Period of interest payment to
Financial Year End
30/06/2008
Share transfer book & register of members will be
to closed from (both dates inclusive) for the purpose of determining the entitlements

Payment date
22/12/2008
a.
Securities transferred into the Depositor's Securities Account before 4:00 pm in respect of transfers
01/12/2008
b.
Securities deposited into the Depositor's Securities Account before 12:30 pm in respect of securities exempted from mandatory deposit
27/11/2008
c.
Securities bought on the Exchange on a cum entitlement basis according to the Rules of the Exchange.

Number of new shares/securities issued (units) (If applicable)
Entitlement indicator
RM
Entitlement in RM (RM)
0.31

Remarks :
Payment of the proposed Final Dividend is subject to the Stockholders' approval to be obtained at the forthcoming 44th Annual General Meeting of the Company scheduled for 26 November 2008.
© 2008, Bursa Malaysia Berhad. All Rights Reserved.
does it mean i will get 0.31 cent or less??
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Less 25% tax deducted at source (17 sen * 0.75 + 14 sen). Can claim back when you submit your tax return (providing your tax bracket lower than 25%, which most of us did).

miss out some words. tongue.gif

This post has been edited by htt: Nov 7 2008, 08:20 AM
htt
post Nov 7 2008, 08:22 AM

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QUOTE(darkknight81 @ Nov 7 2008, 07:53 AM)
Final dividend of 14 sen per 50 sen stock unit tax exempt and 17 sen gross per 50 sen stock unit less Malaysian income tax at 25%.

So that means 14 sen is tax exempted that means RM 140 NETT YOU GET

Whereas for the 17sen it will be taxed 25% thats means you will get RM127.50

So you will get RM 267.50 nett...
For the tax part you cannot claim back as stated on our new budget by our Ex finance minister
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Really cannot claim back? That's not standard practices for other parts of the world leh. Maybe I too long away from our bolehland liao blink.gif

But the budget 2008 said:
Companies with credit balance of section 108 account which do not elect to switch over to the single tier system are allowed to use the credit balance for purpose of dividend distribution during the transitional period of 6 years until 31 December 2013. The mechanism and conditions to utilise the credit are as follows:
i. the credit balance of section 108 account allowed for the purposes of dividend distribution to the shareholders is the balance as at 31 December 2007;
ii. the credit balance of section 108 account will be adjusted only for tax reductions;
iii. company that has fully utilised the credit balance of section 108 account at any time during the transitional period will automatically move to the single tier tax system;
iv. all companies will automatically move to the single tier tax system on 1 January 2014 even though they still have credit balance of section 108 account as at 31 December 2013;
v. maintaining the current provision of disallowing companies which take over other companies to acquire the credit balance of section 108 account;
vi. companies are only be allowed to pay cash dividend; and
vii. for small and medium companies, tax on dividend paid to shareholders is deducted from the credit balance of section 108 account based on the highest current tax rate.
Conditions for shareholders to claim tax crediti.
i. Only direct expenses related to dividend income are allowed to be deducted in arriving at adjusted dividend income;
ii. The claim for tax credit is only allowed for shares held continuosly for 90 days or more from the date of purchase of shares (excluding public listed companies);
iii. Only dividend distributed from ordinary shares are eligible for tax credit; and
iv. Dividend income of shareholders of a company which is not from business source is not allowed to be aggregated with other income in the computation of chargeable income. This condition is not applicable to entities other than a company.

This post has been edited by htt: Nov 7 2008, 08:54 AM
htt
post Nov 7 2008, 10:42 AM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Nov 7 2008, 10:30 AM)
In the future, it cannot be claimed back under single tier system.
Now, we are in transition period of changing the tax system. So there might be some confusion around.
So if those company doesn't use the previous tax credit to offset the tax then all tax credit will be voided after 2012.

So whenever you see the dividend is declared under single tier, then no claim back.

They will put a word single tier under the back of dividend, just like BAT does.
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Oic, I thought our bolehland can innovate and create a tax system total opposite the rest tongue.gif
The future until 2013, that's very long time for me tongue.gif
But those with Section 111 tax credits still can continue paying out imputation dividend, and their shareholder can continue to claim back 'tax difference from their highest tax bracket', until tax credits exhausted or 2013, which ever come earlier tongue.gif
htt
post Nov 7 2008, 12:18 PM

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QUOTE(ante5k @ Nov 7 2008, 12:16 PM)
meainng no need report in your income tax? smile.gif
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For one-tier dividend, no need.
htt
post Nov 8 2008, 10:34 PM

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QUOTE(ante5k @ Nov 8 2008, 06:53 PM)
money is still money . dividend you still get, where's the harm in that?
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If imputation dividend amount to RM1,000 distributed to a rich (highest tax bracket at 28%) and a middle (highest tax bracket at 10%) shareholders.
When they submitted their tax return at the year end.
Rich shareholder no need to pay tax for the dividend, and cannot get refund (or reduction) of tax paid at source because his tax bracket is 28% which appear to be higher than 26%.
Middle shareholder can claim back 16% of RM1,000 (RM160) as tax deducted at source because the tax need to be paid for him is 10% but 26% had been taxed by government. He can use the RM160 to offset his tax or get cash back if his difference between tax deducted at source and his highest tax bracket is more than what he supposed to pay.

Under One-tier tax system, they both cannot claim back. This is no harm to rich shareholder but there might be some for the middle.
Under one-tier system, company pay the final tax and dividend is 'not tax deductible' in the hand of shareholders (I think that's just to beautify the system).

Hope I make the thing clear. blush.gif
htt
post Nov 10 2008, 05:28 PM

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Axis Reit distribution 3.81 sen for last Q.
htt
post Nov 11 2008, 02:55 PM

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QUOTE(Neo18 @ Nov 11 2008, 02:34 PM)
Dear Cherroy,

Thank you for you analysis.

Let me tell u my plan. I'm using Share Margin Financing from PBank to buy REIT. They are giving me BLR - 1.75%. since BLR is 6.75%, i'm paying 5% interest.

I plan to max out my margin financing buying REIT. Now i c average 10% groos (9% nett) yield!!!

Therefore, i'm using bank money to earn money!!! hahaha.

I think i will Q for axis 1.3 la. I got alot of Atrium and i Just bought Amfirst @ 0.80 last week.

TQ. Next i want to look at tower reit. Looks attractive too
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I think you are taking high risk on that, expert are doing carry trade with cheap yen but when all rush to close their yen position, they get stuck in between. And interest will fluctuate, and REIT might night maintain the DPS if they are not getting enough cash from their tenants. Another thing you need to take into consideration is the gearing of the particular REIT, if the REIT have some gearing, please check the term of the debt (short or long, fixed rate or variable etc). Good luck on that.

Just my kehpoh 2 cents.
htt
post Nov 11 2008, 03:43 PM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Nov 11 2008, 03:30 PM)
You have valid point to make, BLR definitely won't go up in near term, it applied across the world.

As long as one realise the risk they are taking, there is not right or wrong, it is individual matter and risk management issue.

BTW, it is safe, not save.
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Sometime think I am too old to take risk. Good luck all. tongue.gif
htt
post Jan 12 2009, 11:18 AM

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QUOTE(hocklai8 @ Jan 12 2009, 09:35 AM)
Just wondering if all the REIT investors (or soon to be) here realised the other side of REIT as highlighted in theStar REIT's High Yield And Risk.

I think there's a point there for us to ponder upon where our Malaysian REIT will be few years down the road especially if all our REIT income (90%+) is being redistributed back as dividend. Besides what has been highlighted in theStar article such as high debt ratio and lack to funds set aside to service the loans made to acquire new properties, I do have some additional points... As the current properties in the REIT's portfolios are still relative new, it should be alright. But what happens say... 5-10 years later. Some properties do need to be refurbish, renovated or some major uplift of facilities in order to stay competitive in the rental market. Where are the fund managers going to get the funds besides diluting our REIT shares with new units issued? Or increasing their debt ratio?
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Debt/ Equity ratio of more than 50% might be bad, but it still down to the terms of the debt, if the debts are long term, not that serious, but short term one more dangerous.
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post Jan 12 2009, 03:51 PM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Jan 12 2009, 03:31 PM)
Hektar, I don't follow Hekar, so don't know.

Axreit, it is about 30~40% gearing before the proposed private placement, if not mistaken.

Axreit financial report is available on its website, so can calculate its debt/equity ratio easily.

Oppss, my mistake you are mentioning debt/equit, not the overall gearing.

The reit guideline is about below 50% gearing, not debt/equity.

Their debt/equity is more than 50%, as Axreit lastest Q has 200+ million borrowing and they have abuot 255 millions share issued. Total asset owned is 600+ millions, so gearing is about 30~40%.

Yes, just like you mention earlier, some dilution will occur as they are proposing 120 millions private placement. But those private placement will able to reduce the interest expenses on the borrowing, so it is not that bad. At one side EPS being diluted, while on other side, total earning might be increase due to lesser interest expenses.

It is better those private placement being or able to be placed out to reduce the borrowing.
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Gearing of 50% can allow maximum debt/equity ration of 1:1 (or 100%), if all the debts are non current. Then even 71% still within the guideline. tongue.gif

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