The way I see it, fans nowadays are looking to be entertained, just like the American's and their suggestion to increase the size of the goal, to see more goals in a match. The EPL is arguably the fastest league around and players don't get that much time on the ball. The Arsenal team of 2004/2005 took an average of 12 seconds to bring up the ball from their half and have a shot on goal, when on the counter attach. I dare say not many teams can match this. From the days of old, teams that have adopted the pass and move approach have garnered much success (i.e. Liverpool of the 70's/80's & Man Utd of the 90's to current). Players are encouraged not to spend too much time on the ball and to keep it moving. In training sessions, coaches would dish out punishment to anyone that kept the ball for more than 5 seconds. This meant that the game was played at a higher tempo.

You seldom see fans today appreciate the technical side of the game, all they want is to see a good pace to the game, and players with good individual flair and ability. This is why when teams adopt a more technical approach, they are deemed to be boring, just because they don't play at a high tempo. This is the reason I feel many EPL fans do not appreciate the Serie A. A huge majority of fans today only recognise players that score a truck load of goals or can do a million stepovers in under 10 seconds. They fail to recognise players with strong fundamentals that make the game look easy with their anticipation and reading of the game. They'd much prefer player that dive into tackles with such force, sending the ball into row Z. I repeat, most fans today (especially younger ones) look to be entertained, and a game played at a high tempo is arguable, more entertaining.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: May 25 2007, 11:06 AM

Yeah well judging by how insightful his post was, I think it's best not to honour it with a response.

In truth, I used to watch a fair share of Serie A matches back in the day. I have no favourite team but I did use to follow Inter back in the day of Mattheus, Brehme and Klinnmans. It was back when Napoli was still in the reckoning with Maradona and Careca in their fold.

The quality of a league has little relevance to the quality of it's international side. Why? Have you seen the number of foreign players these days? If the quality of the league reflected the quality of the international side, France would not have gotten to the World Cup Finals.

Spot on, the quality of commentators is crucial. You can say the same of other sports such as the F1, tennis, badminton... actually just about any other sport in the world. Have you tried watching a European game on local TV? It's really painful and I would not recommend it to my worst enemy. The South American leagues have pretty good commentators. Well I can't understand what's being said but they get really excited and it rubs of. I can still hear one of them going "Goallllll... go.. go...go...go...go... goaaallllll!!!!".

I believe it's like this. Against Brazil, David Beckham's pictures were on every major paper and they were talking about how he conquered Brazil, but who has MOM again? That's right, Steven Gerrard, but I bet a good portion of people thought it was Beckham, am I wrong? You can see how publicity can sometimes distort the truth and I believe this is what the category of people are you referring to mean.

A good portion fans only watch the EPL and of that portion, there is a sizeable amount that only watch their teams. How then are they supposed to determine which league is best when they've never seen a La Liga or Serie A match?

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Added on June 7, 2007, 12:43 pmYou're beginning to sound like a broken record mate.

Firstly, Italy being crowned world champions does not reflect the quality of the league. As many of us have mentioned earlier, teams consist of many foreigners these days. Your best player is Brazilian and so is your best rightback, your somewhat chubby forward and no.1 keeper. Need I mention Leonardo and Rivaldo? Last I checked, Seedorf was Dutch.

Secondly, you said it yourself, 3 English teams made the semi's, that not enough? In the past 3 seasons, English teams have made the finals. Look at the bigger picture mate and not just focus on one season. While I will not begin a debate on which league is better, the EPL is certainly on the ascendancy.

This post has been edited by Duke Red: Jun 7 2007, 12:44 PM

It's arguable which is the better league but the EPL is certainly the most popular. We don't always have to support the best league, just like we don't all support the best teams. If you want to lend support to the best league, look to South America. I just watched a game between Boca Juniors and (can't remember who) and the atmosphere was electric, so was the game. In recent years, Europe's best have come up against Brazilian opposition in the finals of the FIFA World Club Cup, and have been found wanting. Liverpool were beaten by Sao Paulo in 2005 while Barcelona was beaten by Internacional in 2006. That's twice in 2 years Europe's best teams were beaten by South America's best.

People support the EPL because it's the most popular, not because it's the best.

But you aren't looking at the number of players that have adapted. Just because they can't adapt to the EPL doesn't mean it's a better league, it just means it's a different league.

That's one thing I like about the EPL, bone crunching tackles! This is a game for men, not fairies! I've always liked the physical element of the EPL. So what if the players are less graceful, this isn't freaking ballet.

No worries mate, I'm a pretty patient bloke when it comes to my club. I've been waiting 17 years for a league titles, what's waiting another couple of years for the Champions League?

Heard about the cop that got killed by Catania fans in Italy? English hooligans are not as notorious as they used to be. Rarely do you see and incidents these days in the EPL or the whole of England for that matter. What about the Ultra's? Football violence is a global issue, not an England one. What does this have to do with the quality of the league anyway?

I do agree that English fans are some of the most passionate and there's rivalry at almost every corner, dating back decades, even centuries. There is a lot of history in English football.

I have however seen the same degree of passion in other leagues, though perhaps not as widespread. Fans of clubs in smaller leagues like Olympiacos, Besiktas, Torino and the Sicilian clubs are just as fanatical and passionate as anyone else.

English fans getting stabbed in Turkey? Italian cope murdered in Italy? Deportivo fan killed?

Don't kid yourself, football violence exists everywhere
http://www.ex.ac.uk/~watupman/undergrad/ro...anismeurope.htm

Please try not to be so ignorant in the future.

And when you say this "Kops fan kill 39 Italian", you are asking for trouble aren't you? Liverpool supporters (kops fan???) were pelted by missiles and charged at the chicken wire fence separating both fans. Italian supporters then tried climbing over the retaining wall that collapsed due to age. It's not like they pulled out AK-47's and gunned them down. Please show some respect to those that passed and not make it look like they were assassinated. I hope the 21 at the end of your nick does not indicate your IQ.

A bit OT but there's a really good book on English Hooliganism which provides great insight into the minds of these fanatics. Anyone know where I can get my hands on a copy? I don't mean Amazon lah, I mean like has anyone seen it in a bookstore here? Wait a minute, does anyone even read here?

I agree with the decline in passion but I disagree it's a problem limited to the EPL. Footballers in Spain and Italy get paid just as much.

Incidentally, here's a list of the worlds richest clubs:

This is interesting though, there are 8 English clubs in the top 20. If they're so rich, how come West Ham and City were fighting relegation? Now we know why Roeder left because with the money they have, he has underperformed as manager. The Spanish giants still lead the way though.



If I read your comments correctly, they are centred around 1 particular club and not the whole of the EPL. Some of us have yet to splurge insurmountable amounts of money on players. Some of us still play in 45,000 seater stadiums. Most of your observations can be descriptive of almost any league, not just the EPL. You just read about it more because of the exposure received by the EPL.

I fail however to see the relevance between the no. of English players in Europe and the level of interest in the EPL. If we talking about tennis, it would be like saying Wimbledon is a boring, substandard tournament because very seldom do Englishmen make the finals.

In the end it's subjective. It's just like how some people prefer Paella over Pasta or Fish & Chips.

There is a hypocrite in our midst I see. He seems to have missed the point that people don't always have a preference for the most successful league. If we all did, won't that make us glory hunters?

The EPL is indeed a very physical league and this is one reason why I like it. As far am I'm concerned the physical nature of the game is what makes it competitive. You run someone off the pitch and they'll be gunning for revenge. This is what makes it a man's game. I hate pansies that go down at the slightest hint of contact and whines to the ref like little school girls that had their lollipops taken away by the school bully.

I have read a couple of comments stating that the EPL is too technical and there is less skill on display. Are you sure you aren't confusing yourself with the England national team? If you look at the top sides, how many English players are in the starting 11? The vast majority of these teams consist of foreign players. Is the league really technical? I doubt so. The game is often played at a really high tempo at both ends of the pitch. How is this technical? In fact, the Serie A is more technical in my opinion with the ball often played on the deck, with teams stroking the ball about looking for openings. If anything, the EPL is more direct.

The EPL is probably one of the least corrupted leagues around given how well paid the players are. Leagues in South America are much worse off. A little closer to home, just look at what happened to the Chinese league a couple of years back. What about the scandals involving certain Italian clubs?

Out of all the points, I think this is the most poignant.

I think you can go even further back the the days when we were an English colony Liverpool does have one of the earliest fan bases, same as Spurs and even Arsenal during the days of Lukic, Dixon, Adams, Winterburn, Bould, Smith, Wright, etc.

You're right about the commentary though. They used to have this machine sounding commentator during Serie A highlights but I think he's since moved to Spain. Commentary enhances the experience by quite a bit man.