Guys, some questions about Black Morass. Since it's a straight DPS fight, I'm wondering about a few things :

- Has anyone gone in with one caster (mage/lock) and 2 melee DPS? Excluding the tank and healer. How was the fight?

- How does a Destro Lock compare to an Affliction spec Lock compare to one another for adds and Rift Lords?

- As tanks will have taunting problems with the bosses, how would the gameplay be for mages and locks who have both high crits and white damage? Temperous being the main problem.

- For the casters, in general, should they avoid talents that give them more crit? Since more crit will make the tank's job a lot harder to hold aggro.

- Is there such a thing as too much crit talent/gear? This is for casters.

- Can Locks solo the adds well? Reason being is that the mage may have to do deep drinking between adds.

- i did BM with 2 rogues (me and another one) over 10+ times because ive gotten everything i needed and only went there for rep (exalted now anyways) so i dont mind an extra rogue, so long he can keep up and not left in the dust by my dps.

dps definately is a lot faster and better. and didnt have a problem.

- destro may work better for adds because of burst dps able to quickly take down fragile whelps/single target small dragons, while afflict may work better on the lords because longer health = dots gets to be ultilized on their duration.

that said, either spec works fine on either ways so long the lock doesnt suck.

- tanks dont have taunting problems on temporous. so long the mage/lock dont do retarded stuff like AP+trinket+cooldowns before the tank even lay over 3-4 sunders, aggro is not a problem. and if anything, both mage, lock, rogue have aggro wipes every 5mins now equally.

for temporous, you will need a dispeler, or purger, or warlock felpup, but for best effect, get a mage, to spellsteal and maintain detect magic on temp.

- as mentioned above, crit is NOT an issue to aggro, its the tank, or the caster being stupid blasting 100% before the tank can even lay over 3-4 sunders. beyond 3-4 sunders, aggro is usually solid unless you get back2back crits, which is unlikely to happen and even if it does, you can always aggro wipe. an alternative to look for is have a hunter, to misdirect aggro boost ur tank, problem solve. if ur tank still lose aggro, tell him to /delete and look into another class.

- again, as mentioned above, its absurd, but to answer ur question, no such thing as too much crit.

- yes, locks of ANY spec can solo adds very well, the same goes for mages. and no, mages dont need to do any deep drinking. if the said mage of equal skill plays a lock instead, he will still have to deep drink/spam life tapping (which in turn hurts ur healers), no difference. just player skill being poor or good.

- Has anyone gone in with one caster (mage/lock) and 2 melee DPS? Excluding the tank and healer. How was the fight?

yea. caster on adds, cat druid n a rogue.
pretty ez with prayer mending,cum both of them have high dps n kno when to left out bandage n innervate. priest > PALLY !


- As tanks will have taunting problems with the bosses, how would the gameplay be for mages and locks who have both high crits and white damage? Temperous being the main problem.

1. that is tank problem. change a tank.
2. ktm threat meter.


- For the casters, in general, should they avoid talents that give them more crit? Since more crit will make the tank's job a lot harder to hold aggro.

unless 1 crit 10k pyro, again, taunt revenge shouldn have a problem if the caster aware their threat in ktm.


- Is there such a thing as too much crit talent/gear? This is for casters.

shadow priest go for all crit gear is funny since blzz neft em @ previous patch..

- Can Locks solo the adds well? Reason being is that the mage may have to do deep drinking between adds.

[/quote]
fine lock can always solo adds well, dot n fear near npc. rarely need support from healer.
but the other day a frost mage impress me. warr aoe taunt, the mage aoe down adds n dmg on MINI boss atst. not boss fight


h.bm only up to 4th wave n we all run for our liferepair bill.. lol

This post has been edited by Gladys: Apr 5 2007, 12:19 PM

1. I went to BM with 2 rogues (I'm a hunter) and we did fine.

2. Don't know. Haven't played a lock before.

3. If people are pulling aggro, that means the tank is not doing his job well. Get a better tank. I usually go all out and don't have problem with aggro. But I'm a hunter hence I have FD. But still, I went to BM with a Pally tanking and we have no problem.

4. Erm, dunno. But since its a DPS fight more crit is good IMHO.

5. If a mage is in the group, he will usually handle the adds and they usually don't have mana issues. Have someone else in the group to help DPS the adds. As a hunter, I also handle the adds with no problem as long as the healer heals my pet so I have time to help DPS the boss too. If my pet dies, it made my job harder but not impossible.

Tips:

a. Try to save the beacons for the 13-17 portal elites. Drop the beacon on the elites.

b. Ignore the adds when u fight the first 2 bosses. You can clear them AFTER the boss is dead. Ignore Medivh when he's shouting for help. He's a sissy.

c. But for the second boss, it may take longer to down him so just drop a beacon near medivh if there are too many adds on him.

- Has anyone gone in with one caster (mage/lock) and 2 melee DPS? Excluding the tank and healer. How was the fight?
had a shaman and a rogue. the dps was high all the time. no problems for that run

- How does a Destro Lock compare to an Affliction spec Lock compare to one another for adds and Rift Lords?
its the same imo

- As tanks will have taunting problems with the bosses, how would the gameplay be for mages and locks who have both high crits and white damage? Temperous being the main problem.
Both of the classes can skill to reduce threat tell them to use it. Also, your tank shouldn't lose aggro .

- For the casters, in general, should they avoid talents that give them more crit? Since more crit will make the tank's job a lot harder to hold aggro.
crit doesn't do addictional hate to the mob

- Is there such a thing as too much crit talent/gear? This is for casters.
no. since their main job is to top damage meters?

- Can Locks solo the adds well? Reason being is that the mage may have to do deep drinking between adds.
yes, since they have SoC now and i think they can 2 shot those non elite mobs.

another tip, DO NOT USE UR BEACONS AT ALL.

save them for last boss, and use all 5 on last boss for shitz n giggles

my record of killing aeonus (last boss) is around 20seconds, 5 beacons and i have 3k AP buffed (2 shamans and 1 with unleashed rage)

everyone lol'ed.

(btw only applies forlast boss, cuz he have a bug that is sploitable)

I think they changed it liao lei last week we try he dispell all of them at once.

doesnt matter.. the last boss is the sissy one like shattereh hall..

hehe, yes you can do that too. I had 5 beacons on the last boss and shaman unleashed rage and the boss went poof in 15-20 seconds.

But that is when I'm grouping with the best of the best in my guild. If you're doing a PUG you might have trouble DPSing down the elites .

Anyways, the bosses can now despawn the dragons hence its not a good idea using beacons on the boss unless u pop more than 1 of course. But still, don't waste their DPS and use it on the elites.

nope still sploitable

thanx for the input guys. i actually like black morass, even though there are a lot of wipes. it seems to be the only lvl70 run that i can actually make money and the blues dropped a lot.

as usual, Q put something interesting up. The felhunter. That was one thing that we should have put on Temporus.

we held onto the beacons even past the 2nd boss. However, because the mage was on add duty, he didn't spellsteal the haste from Temporus.

and because of the above and there was a resto druid healing, the tank was kiting temporus in a circle to wait for debuffs to wear off. resto druid does not have the dispel spells that a priest or pally has. think the tank probably had the full 10 stacks of debuffs on him. painful healing, even with my highest HT/HoTs.

one other thing we did try was everyone to go full out on temporus while one person put their beacon at the start and then later, at the end of the fight. only problem with this one is that the shield will go down so we'd have to be sure that it's not too far down that if we wipe at 3rd boss, we can still take him out. usually, it was still 1 mage on adds duty while the lock helped out on Temporus.

and the 10K pyro crit? yes it happened. lol! full destro lock. was funny to see to see the KTM meter jump up by 10K for him.

as for beacons on the last boss, how far did u put it away from him? we put one near him and he despawn it. then again, it was only 1, not 5.

as for being a better tank, it's not necessarily their fault. just the group composition. besides, how can they be better tanks if we don't help them out abit?

Perfect group setup for BM- 1 tank, 1 healer, 3 x pew pew

I don't think it makes that much of a difference having run it in so many different group setups getting people attuned to karazhan. What's important is that you don't get a group with slackers and at least 1 person who knows how to handle the adds.

2nd boss is no different from any other non tauntable boss in the game. If your dpser pew pews too much than he can tank . Just make sure the haste buff is dispelled or stolen by the mage. Have your tank keep thunderclap and shield block up and and everyone else just pew pew omg lazorz on the mob and you should have him down before the healing debuff gets too much. If your group is relatively inexperienced with controlling threat then KTM is your friend.

Too much crit for casters is never a problem, the problem is knowing when to hold back when you've done too much unexpected damage.

this guy have the best answer imo, what you need is more pew pew less QQ.

myremi: 10k threat is about 12-13k soulfire crit lol, sure or not? it could be just streak spells eg: immo conflag shadowburn.
and KTM takes bout 0.5-1sec intervals to update btw, if it updates in realtime, i think everyone that have ktm installed need a dual core at least with at least 1gb ram. not to mention the server load/connection load etc from synchronization data transfers in between.

hmm...come to think about it, how does a warrior tank a non-tauntable boss ingame?

as a feral druid tanker, i used to spam maul whenever it came up. lacerates didn't generate as much aggro but because of the low rage usage, i used lacerates to build up rage rather than spam maul all the time.

what's the button smashing sequence for a warrior then? prot warrior that is.

---

Added on April 5, 2007, 2:01 pmit was funny when the lock stole aggro off temporus. on KTM, it was showing 5K threat generated by the tank and suddenly lock got aggro and KTM showed the lock with a whopping 11K threat. LOL!

in the end, last nite's encounter was just crazy because of the bad connections some folks here. there were times we were fighting with 3-4 ppl only. and surprisingly, no problem with streamyx for once.


This post has been edited by myremi: Apr 5 2007, 02:01 PM

they just aggro?

sequence/minor guide is on the other thread, about dealing with kargath in shattered halls

BTW Quazacolt, where did you get your Antec p180 case from? Just built a pc but i had to settle for a lian li in the end because i couldn't find the Antec in lowyat

To Myremi, i tend to front load my threat, Blood rage, HS/Shield Slam, revenge/sunder/devastate and button spammage based on global cooldown and heroic strike spam when possible. It really depends on the encounter at the end of the day on whether you want to mitigate damage or maximise threat.

edit:

For non tauntable bosses, it's really important to just let the tank get a head start on the boss before commencing nuking. On Temporus it's still tank and spank. At least you don't have to worry about doing things like stance dancing or tank switching.

Temporus is unique in a way because you want to ignore the adds to burn him down asap and therefore you need to maximise threat but at the same time you want to slow his attacks down by applying thunderclap ad keep shield block up as much as possible to avoid the healing debuff.

This post has been edited by Kidicarus: Apr 5 2007, 02:37 PM

see my successful trade list

jy14 if ur lazy

and my advice for now, is wait for p190, now i also a bit regret cuz few days ago farking antec released p182 revision

/castrandom shield slam,revenge,devestate

ur gay thx

It's still a classic design though. Pretty good cooling as well i hear.

yes it happend.. but it doesnt come that 'often' so i mean dw abt the crit. my fren fire mage pop once b4 coe ap dadada 10k..

as a priest, i nvr dispell the healing debuff, <can dispell?? > warr kite it when he got 6/+ , the rest of them nvr bother spell steal or wateva just full out..leave the adds clear later or drop 1 dragon.. time break after boss fight is just too long..

imo a warr if can understand the class balance, kno when to taunt(do t b4 it happen) n sheild , its pretty good already..

bah bah black moras.. tell me more abt GL... mt17k hp healer still fail to keep him up with high king

wrong thread?

EDIT : bleargh. didn't read properly. mebad.

This post has been edited by myremi: Apr 5 2007, 02:56 PM

It's not the tank you're dispelling, it's the haste buff on temporus! takes a lot of the healing pressure of the healer.

lazy to dispell... i only dispell the robot go enrage @ mec..



no pressure, let the tank die only



This post has been edited by Gladys: Apr 5 2007, 03:02 PM

For Blackmorass
ideal group is

1 mage who can spellsteal the 2nd boss if ur tank suck so bad lah and also to handle adds
1 priest
2 DPS
1 Tank

most important task in the game is handling the adds
warlocks and mage are the ideal class to handle the adds alone
as far as my experience ..
i have a mage or warlock .. they can handle the adds themselves .. where by 2 dps and tank on those lord rift and i heal the 2 dps n tank .. where else the adds handler will handle himself at one corner ..

fastest run was 23mins

@ gladys : LOL!

you're evil

did it with 2 healers 1 rogue 1 warlock 1 warrior tank.

---

Added on April 5, 2007, 8:53 pmif the lock is on the adds then affliction lock. 3 dots, fear = dead. siphon life on single adds and elites will easily recover the hp u use for tapping. dragonlings shuold be clapped, double seeded and ignored.

taunt should never be an issue unless the mobs have aggro wipe.

no, more crit is a must. more crit from talent = less focus of crit on gears = more spell hit. The game of the new expansion is "TO HIT". 20% for rogues and 15% for casters (taken from nihilum's site).

no such thing as too much crit, more crit allows u to socket hit gems.

mage and locks can both solo the adds well. only benefit is that locks can keep dots on both adds and elites. if its a mage, ask the mage to jsut stand where medivh is standing and kill the adds as they come. every time he kills an add he will be out of battle.

This post has been edited by sets84: Apr 5 2007, 08:53 PM

kidicarus: the cable management of the p182 is awesome dude :/
and 2 drilled holes for future watercooling... sigh regret lol

i think my fastest run was 21-24 mins, i was wearing 1-2 greens and rest blues only 1 epic ring (from terokkar using spirit shards)

imo, the ideal group setup is what you said, but replace priest with either pally or shaman, preferably shaman. healing was never really an issue in BM, so the extra healing/PW:S/PW:F capabilities of a priest is not really needed. where else if say you get a shaman, providing str + WF or agi to rogue and warrior, warrior automatically gets extra threat, enabling earlier frontload of dps and ensures aggro solidity, and rogue having extra dps is never a bad thing.

besides, RARARARAARRARARARR BLOOOODDDLUSSSTTTT lawl.
seriously, some 20 ish seconds... dual shaman so agi + wf and stoneskin + str(1 with unleashed rage), 3 beacon (we didnt knew bout the sploit, just did it for fun cuz we never use) and tada!
TWO FIRE ELEMENTALS LOL!

first time stop aeonus is already at 20-30% ish lmao

sets85: mage can still pew pew elites so long he 2-3 shot the bigger one and 1-2 shot the whelps. they take some time to respawn haha

myremi was talking about mage drinking issues. thus my suggestion to stand where medivh is and dps from there. compared to aff locks who doesn't even need a single heal or drink for the whole trip.

and ive explained that the mage needs more pew pew less QQ

more dps and less complains? sorry i dont get what that has got to do with drinking issues.

you fail at understanding wow terminologies lol

and u fail at making sense. or maybe u score at making 0 sense.

oh its there, you dont understand it doesnt mean it isnt there

oh then please by all means correct me

/me gets gladys to do sexy dance

-Has anyone gone in with one caster (mage/lock) and 2 melee DPS? Excluding the tank and healer. How was the fight?

Did with 2 melee DPS Rogue and Melee shammy, twas fine..

- For the casters, in general, should they avoid talents that give them more crit? Since more crit will make the tank's job a lot harder to hold aggro.

Hell no.. Go all out.. No one can predict when u crit.. U can have 7% crit chance and do 4 crits at the start of a fight.. Occasionally, u might aggro yes it happens, just hold off a few secs and let the tank grab aggro.. And don't go bustin in when 1 sunder.. Usually 3 sunders can hold atleast 4 3k crits from a frosbolt (tested)..

- Is there such a thing as too much crit talent/gear? This is for casters.

Honestly, not really.. For mages, maybe however warlocks i think more have to focus on spell hit and spelldamage rather than crits..

- Can Locks solo the adds well? Reason being is that the mage may have to do deep drinking between adds.

Doable but not that easy la. But more of a backup rather than main add controller..

This post has been edited by Aesthetica: Apr 6 2007, 01:20 PM

i previously explained on answering myremi's q&a's that good mages dont really need to keep drinking, so long they perform well and/or manage their mana better

quote:


so for the "more pew pew less QQ" part, it would literally meant the mage has to do more/better and less sucking.

with that said, im sure you yourself also played with good mages, with mage armor (if you sac some few % crit from molten) and ~10k mana and 2-4k frost bolts or 3-5k fireball crits (fire add in ignite ticks too), adds dont really get to last long and the said mage only spend like what... 200-300 mana? out of his 10k mana pool? lol

if say same mage, do stupid shits like spamming blizzard on THREE WHELPS where they dont even usually group up together for blizz and/or theres another add controler for example hunter, possibly pulling whelps out of ur blizz, or say the mage just retardedly spam AE, obviously, you give him 20k mana he also have to spam drink lol.

aesthetica: good mages makes anything look easy. (not even joking, yes, anything, lol)

/dance for me , i'll /nod for u.









21-24mins full run??????????? hell no way ..

my fastest run was like 35min... u kill wave fast doesnt mean the next wave spawn ealier isnt ? it's still remain as their timing.. just the matter on ur drinking time more or less only

we always got plantly of tme to drink yet the next wave doesnt seem come out ealier .........

ahh ic
so by definition of good mages, the mage has to be decked out in cool epix with 1k spell dmg and the ability to 2 shot adds. right, i'll be sure to tell the next mage who just reached 70 attempting to finish up his kara questline, that he needs to pew pew more and QQ less if he has mana problems cos he can't OMGWTF 4k crit adds.

the moment you kill the rift guy, the next spawns aproximately 10 secs later. its the boss segments that are on a set timer. not the rift guys.

hmmm...i feel tension here.

relax guys. both of you are correct. let's see it at that before it gets worst.

else, i'm going to hand out water pistols . person who is more wet, is the one that pewpews the most.

only need some 600ish spell power to be a "good mage" in bm, if anything, you only need 1 more bolt lol.

---

Added on April 6, 2007, 7:10 pmOH OH OH ME ME ME

pew pew pew pew pew pew

---

Added on April 6, 2007, 7:14 pmgladys: to clarify anyways, it has 2 rules, either you reach the time limit (lets say its 3mins) and another is (lets say 10 secs, im not sure of exact time, could be 5 sec or 15 sec) you just kill the rift guy.

then the whole encounter, is segmented to 3 segments, 1st boss/2nd boss/3rd boss
as usual, the set rules, time limit, or early killing. once boss dies, you get to rest for the remainding time of the said segment, OR, a maximum rest time, so people that clear it very fast, dont have to wait forever.

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Apr 6 2007, 07:14 PM

600 spell power doesn't get u 4k crits on ice bolts or 5k on firebolts. on top of being a heal burden to aoes just to probably 1 bolt in between adds, i dont see the point of your more pew pew and less qq.

read what i said lmao... not really hard to cast one more bolt. and sides, you still didnt get the terminology after my explanation?

have u even tried managing the adds? as far as i know rogues only need to spam 3-4 keys on the elite, then move on to another. u mentioned to complain less and dps more, but maybe u have it the easy way unlike others. Not everybody spends hours farming easy instances before goin on to BM. and as far as i know, the only 4k icebolt i have ever seen is on a video by curse fighting hydross the unstable, the mage was fully buffed with elixirs and flasks.

5k-6k firebolts was done by nihilum's mage with 2.2k fire power.

do not put ppl down telling how the instance is easy and how they should l2p more, just to stroke ur e-peen (which in my eyes are small). BM is a joke to me now but i don't see a point on telling ppl they should pew pew more and whine less. give some constructive comments and do not over exagerate.

This post has been edited by sets84: Apr 7 2007, 12:42 AM

i have managed adds from time to time when im in a VERY lousy pug group, i either do it or the run is impossible. and what does that prove? nothing imo. still a simple kill and move on ordeal.

and have you read my quote at all? lmao. dont see how anywhere in the initial reply, (hell there isnt any further replying on the mage subject cept to you) is putting down anyone. advice? scroll up, cool your head, read clearly. (cuz apparently, you still fail at comprehension)

seriously my fastest was 23mins with good setup and not t4 gears people yet
i believe if i get 2 mage with 1.1K +dmg and 1 priest / shaman in healing and 1 solid tank with t4 and shadowpriest with 1k+ dmg also

confirm below 20mins
no joke

but like quatz said he is wearing greens .. .and a rogue ... if he dun have uber dps .. abit hard to believe

then again maybe the other 4members of his is good


oh yeah 1 more thing is that a DPS Hybird warrior can tank too .. as long as u can spellsteal
its gonna be a GAME



and for sets84 .. drinking is not really a problem for mage thou but if u have shadowpriest .. lol ... u can imagine oh ....

1-2 greens doesnt make me poorly geared
even with me epic'ing my char and getting quite a few kara gear, i just recently replaced my blue neck with a green... its a lvl69 bandit
so ill still be wearing ONE green (downgrade my color status lmao) till i can get a better neck ^^

im still that run's top dps charting around 490ish dps, dual shaman totems + unleashed rage and the occassion bloodlust, and shaman is dpsing elite with me(DW enh) while the other healing, and 1 mage solo adds without needing any heal or backup.

=edit=
forgot to mention... 2 bloodlust... RARARARARRARARARARRA
now with dual epic daggers my dps is between 500-600++ with flask can hit ~650 or close to 700 consistantly.

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Apr 7 2007, 08:54 AM

Eeks am I the only one seeing the double entendre here?

the way you responded just demonstrated how "clean" your mind was.

I never claimed otherwise ^^

maiden punished me for thinking dirty... true story ooh~*

yes and the statement of pew pew more qq less isn't offensive ot others? it's like you're trying to tell some1 to l2p their character which you have no experience off whatsoever. learn to think before you post imo, the one who doesn't get the point here is you. BM is a practical joke to me, i can do it with 4 melees, or 4 man it now... point is i dont boast shit like that. People are having a hard time and they do not need
stupid crappy comments.

mana was a problem pre nerf to mages in bm, and still to some post nerf... not every group can get a shadow priest.

kid: i swear u're encouraging him.

qua : u are incorigible. sigh. and still aggravating everyone and everything in sight. like i said before, glorified badass. ever thought of toning down the arrogance bit?

sets84 : i kinda gave up getting angry on these forums. although i did wrangle an apology from him once. or twice. ><

myremi : i just dont like some1 with no credibility at all putting others down. When he posted how awesome his 5 set assasination and mutilate crits were, i was laughing inside at how pathetic he is. always remember that there's some out there better than you are. and to post even more ridiculous theories just because u think you have better gear than almost everyone here? pffft....

fair enough. i wasn't saying that you shouldn't post what you did. i was just sharing how i dealt with forums here.

in a way, i'm more about looking for info or tips that aren't around on the WoW forums or in any other sources. whether it was useful or not, i won't know until i try it out, since i'm not on any of the servers that u guys are around.

and yes, even if it's from people who aren't creditable although the creditability of the info is something i can't really check. i'm hoping that others will reply back to see what the answer would be like.

dont see how pew pew and qq is offensive, but apparently, you do, so crymorenub. you should learn to think before you reply too cuz your the one getting all uptight with mere forum posts, not me.

and quite honestly, i dont see how mana is a prob to mages in bm nerfed or not to the point they need shadow priests. maybe its just me being lucky to go with mages that dont suck, who knows?

myremi: as ive read one inspiring post from ming, about how being being a badass compared to being the righteous good guy, obviously, being the badguy is much easier. that at the same time explains why he is flaming the hell outta everyone on WoW forum, but at least he got the balls to back em up. at the end of the day, when you get someone like sets85 getting extremely riled against you, your purpose is done.

p/s: with epic daggers now my mut just reached a new height of 5.5k... much <3 to you sets85

=edit=
enjoy

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Added on April 9, 2007, 12:52 amcome to think of it... i do have a lvl60 mage alt, so yeah, i really have no clue about what mages can do. in fact, his existance is because of pre 2.0 and pre-bc rogues being crappy. now he remains 60 because rogues doesnt suck and at some point being overpowered.

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Apr 9 2007, 12:52 AM

My favourite word of all time...incorrigible...sigh..reminds me of the good old high school days /reminisce

Shhh... I really am....

These forums exist purely for my amusement!

Gief popcorn

dramammammaammamaammaammaamaaamaaa

I'm of the belief that there is no righteous good guy in this world. As long as there is a different view to an opinion, it stands to reason that the original person may not be right or good. I'm pretty sure I ticked people off too.

I never claim that what you stated didn't have an ounce of truth in it. Most of the time, I'm not in a position to say otherwise, whether to you or anyone else.

Glorified badass? Yep, somehow it suits you, and even more after you posted that link. You enjoy being the badboy, don't you?

As for the arrogance bit, it still might be a good idea to tone it down. I can understand when reading something can make people shake their heads but being overconfident can lead to one making mistakes/saying something that you might regret later (big if I'm sure). Whether to you or sets84. Especially when the name-calling starts. Aiya.

____________________________________________________

Anyway, back to Black Morass. Pug a hunter and a prot tank warrior yesterday. Hmm...the hunter seemed to spend more time healing his pet than actual DPS. And reading about heartfang's post, does a hunter's DPS come from his range weapon or from his pet? I was under the assumption that a hunter's DPS is mostly contributed by his weapon, rather than the pet and that it's the same for locks and mages.

Another thing, feign death. *shudder* Is it just me or do hunters like to do that to switch aggro to their pet? Because most of the time when they do that, the casters and healer gets aggro instead. Grrr... Not to mention not being able to drink.

Last few rifts. We noticed that the adds now suddenly change aggro from medievh to us, even when we're not taking them down. Not sure whether this is something new or not. They're running to Medievh and suddenly just turn around and start whacking us. Different compared to earlier rifts compared to rift 12.

Comments anyone?

damn straight. pass me some will ya?

kid, xiaonsin : sigh. u 2 ah. ok, one buy coach, another one buy popcorn. then we all sit together and watch.

very very very very slow day at work....nothing to do at all


oh yea something to add, i went bm yesterday the second boss does wing buffet thats why your tank lost aggro ^^

feign death is usually used to clear aggro and get out of combat to drink/swap gear.

pet dps er... not really sure

adds dont usually aggro unless you go hit them

or not concentrating. could be that too.

for hunter yes. but if all aggro is on the caster instead, gg. no time to drink even.

same here. somehow, we're still getting them. i wonder whether it's something to do with the beacon. if beacon expires and the adds are still up, then adds run back to us with aggro. aiyaya.

i never claim you didnt believe me or whatever, nor do i really care
dont worry bout it too much

for the arrogance part, it will be up to others to decide for me, the more shit they have with me, the more shit ill toss back. its all 'lolinternetz' in play right here, nothing serious, if they take it too seriously, its their call, their loss.

and no, i dont usually resort to name callings, if you meant this: <3
its actually a heart sign
although for general asian mmo's its the middle finger instead. so misunderstanding could occur but i believe if you've played WoW for some time you would know.

the hunter should be ultilizing misdirections occassionaly on the mt and have him soak some add dmg, either that or aggro ping pong with pet/himself. healer's healing does help but usually not too much are needed, just general hots or a quick flash or gheal when its really low. if the hunter spends too much time to heal pet, he loses his dps, and his purpose in the group is dps'ing.

while it is true that a hunter's dps comes from the hunter itself and the pet is just a support, it may not be the case if said hunter is BM spec.

for the adds not going to medivh part, it could be something that generates strong global aggro, like the fire elemental from shamans for example.(not sure why or how, but even when the elemental isnt hitting the adds, the adds still go for the shaman) things like say mass dispel, demo shout, or aoe effects that tags the adds could contribute in this too.

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Added on April 9, 2007, 11:20 amthen yes, its the beacon, the adds are tagged and you guys will get aggro.

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Apr 9 2007, 11:20 AM

one thing that i did notice that after getting out of aggro, if i cast HoT on someone, i drink, he goes and kills some other adds, and then i stop drinking.

only happens when i'm standing next to him though. is that normal? bleargh.

dont need to stand next to him, if you hot a person engaging add ur added into aggro list. its healing global aggro

heh, not always. in certain instances only. not all.

80% of my working time is spent surfing around websites... usually i have nothing to do unless the engineers call me

ok, your turn to entertain us. say something.

This post has been edited by myremi: Apr 9 2007, 02:19 PM

what do you want me to say

lol btw quat .. if u have a mage n u go play a rogue ur dumb .. lol
the most less demand and useless class for now ...

sap = not always work
get hit = pain in ass
cant kite cause no range
high dmg ? maybe one point for it lol

any instance that i start .. usually wont have a rogue .. unless that instance is a joke .. like non heroic instances ...
heroics usually hard with rogue cause thier cc is not so CC at all ..
well if u dont mind wiping 4-5times before u get to last boss then its okay heh


i usually expect clean run ..

I know this is not directed at me but that's a bit condescending don't you think?

I've played a hunter and mage to 60, priest which i'm levelling as an alt now to 66 and the warrior i have to 70 which is the character i have been playing for the last year and a half. Of all the other ezmode classes, I've stuck with my warrior which has been hit with a nerfbat almost continuously since our love patch ages ago - and you know why? Because I enjoy the gameplay.

Your attitude sucks because you'd rather suggest someone reroll instead of learning to play (and i mean this in a good way). I party with a rogue quite often and most of the time my instances go well, because we know how to play.

Rogues get some loving in the next patch and we'll see what happens then.

So LOL Nub to you

end rant

if you tell me this pre 2.0 or pre TBC, i will FULLY agree with you. however, post 2.0 especially post TBC, rogues are definately a lot better in doing anything. hell, even pre TBC/2.0, rogues are pretty much "fine" in pve, its pvp in general that they are getting their ass handed.

Sap right now "always work" in pvp, in pve, it always worked, nothing has been change. just need the rogue to actually land the sap. chances of the rogue missing the sap is low unless his +hit is low (if thats the case his dmg will be low anyways and he would be mostly useless)

and theres many methods to prevent getting hit, be it stuns, eva, clos. if anything, an incoming patch will reduce damage taken by melee dps by simply reducing the aoe dmg done to melee, nerfing cleaving attacks etc etc. so not really much of an issue. and if the rogue is specced ass, he got QR, 20% additional heals are always welcomed by any healers. (priests with around 1.4-1.6k +heals can gheal crit me for over 10k++)

for kiting, you WILL be surprised, deadly throw and crippling poisons = lol.
should've seen me solo gay kiting elites to oblivion with perfect health (those said elites need 2-3 ppl to fight and definately need healer)

and at the end of the day, till this end, pre/post 2.0 or tbc, we are still the highest dmg'ing class in game in terms of pve/consistant/endurance fights.

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Added on April 9, 2007, 5:27 pmrogues already got enough loving, im already surprised we arent being nerfbatted to be honest

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Apr 9 2007, 05:27 PM

TBC is just harsh on players who are not able to play their class.

although these days, i seldom see rogues actually. i mostly meet other classes. not sure if that's a good sign or not.

not to say rogue no good<at least i nvr win a GOOD rogue n duel>.. but if i form a team to heroic, with limited 5 man, a tank a healer a mage cc, warlock ss hs, as 1 left to choose on melee im preferable druid.. off heal + innervate.. wel they doing no bad damage as well .. off healer off tanker cum brez. aww aww aww

This post has been edited by Gladys: Apr 9 2007, 06:10 PM

QFT.

Rogues especially because they tend to be fragile and have to close with those mega AOE, 360deg cleaving bosses to actually do any real DPS. Numbers of rogues dropped dramatically on my server - my own guild currently has 2 raiding rogues from 8 pre-TBC but those two were our best anyway and were always way ahead on the damage meters from way back to before TBC. The rest of them retired or switched to other classes.

heh there were too many rogues around anyway, and TBC just caused the not so-skilled to fade away. I was an average-skill rogue pre-TBC but now i find I completely suck in instances and have semi-retired my rogue to go back to my original warrior toon.

This post has been edited by limsk: Apr 9 2007, 06:37 PM

i tend to tell rogues in the beginning of the instance that i'm not that great a healer. so they should be forewarned to bandange themselves.

your epic dagger? wow i can only say its about time. Those daggers were being tossed around amongsts warriors in my server like they were play toys. My guild wasn't that lucky htough, only seen it dropped once like a month and a half ago. pity me. 5.5k mutilates? wow... "decent"...

and my mages need to learn how to play? hmm considering if you're the top dpser as you said... i think its' the other way around. all your dpsers need to learn how to play... unless of course.... gasp... never thought of it, ur raid experience is minimal. so sad. gluck in curator yah... with the nerf R&J hope you will enjoy it.

see what i did thar???!!

p.s : oh yah did i forget to mention my server is barthilas, considered one of the slowest in progression for oceanic realms... and u are slower? gosh.. how surprising...

This post has been edited by sets84: Apr 9 2007, 07:38 PM

Bleh... got the salty pop corn instead...

well same here, a lot of my rogue friends worn out with their rogue pre2.0/pre tbc, ive told them a lot on how it will improve, with a lot of REAL promises (especially when its being shown on youtube, PTR, etc etc) and all, but in the end, they just dont wanna take their chances anymore, re-rolling to more solid classes, like warriors (pvp) or mages/locks/hunters (pve). some few rare cases, rolled healer.(he was a good rogue friend of mine, had lotsa good duels and chats all the time) right now his rogue is pretty much dead, but at least hes successful with his priest.

gladys: disc/holy priest duel with rogue 1v1? >.>
if pre2.0/pre tbc i wont say much, but post... seriously... unless you got 9k hp at least, things can get VERY retarded. (i got people xbg rollin lvl1 alt crying at me, or asking me how the hell they "died on the cheapshot")

sets85: not sure if you've been stalking me or not, but i had them for quite some time now, welcome to last month son. and my 5.5k mut decent? cmon, thats half if not most of ur life. heck, you cant even mutilate lol... nor do ur rogue friends that fancies their old school backstabs. gg? welcome to WoW 1.2 if ur still backstabbing lmao.

based on what you said, your rogues need to l2p then, i mean cmon, any top raiding guild have their rogues on top, uh durr, ur beloved nihilum have their rogues on top most of the time... so... ur not quite making much sense here if ur saying mages should be on the top. again, till you can actually make solid claims my dpsers suck, ur just full of shit, perhaps time to stop sucking that phat meat rod and actually put some sense to your words eh?

p/s: oh yah did you even know how much asia pacific community we even have on stormscale? bet you didnt. and for us to go this far, and you comparing urself to us, i pity you. not sure if you EVEN checked our server's progression and compared it to your server's progression, because frankly, stormscale is no where being fast either. so all in all, good effort, but not quite. try again next time.

cleared it and worked out why. not enough pew pew pew. 1 prot tank, 1 kitty druid, 1 destro lock, 1 fire/arcane mage.

in the end, we put down the beacons as follows :

-1st : clearing up adds during 2nd boss fight. mage did it when he thought that the adds was getting too overwhelming for him to clear.
-2nd - 5th : put it down on top of the Rift Lords for Wave 14-17. Helps to take down the adds + Rift Lord faster. our previous mistake was thinking that the adds were the problem. it was the Rift Lords and our pew pew pew.

shield took a beating while we all drank and ate food.

mage did mention that when he was with another group, they had so much DPS power that at most times, they were 4-manning it. when DPS is strong, he has to take down 3-4 adds.

tank also started using shield block more. but he did mention that when he was kiting the boss, the debuffs came more often since he couldn't block it. so in the end, he stood still and block when he saw the debuff about to be casted.

This post has been edited by myremi: Apr 10 2007, 08:39 AM

since in majority black morass is a dps fight, might wanna slip in either a shaman for totem buff, or paladin for blessing, and pair it with a rogue or hunter. that said, both pala and sham can buff up caster dps pretty decently too. for the debuff casting thingy, a trick is to also intervene someone before its being casted, then back to boss

but if ur dps good, dont really have to care. most groups including mine just ignore the adds and rush down the boss... medivh can take some beating for all his whinings lol

it's the DPS. hunters, sigh. when they're good, they're very very good. when not, it's hard for them to take suggestions.

it was also getting to the point that i was "screaming" at guildies to get out better DPS coz it's either they do that or i let them die. simple.

if you dps hard enough for the second boss, he will stop casting the debuff one


@kidicarus salty popcorn nice lei!

he still still cast lol, just that he die faster, less debuffs being casted

He'll also deep breath less if you kite him to vael's room xD

True story.