always malaysia boleh. bila boleh? wimax can broadcast with very width coverage.
WIMAX topic, WIMAX Discussions Here
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 Feb 1 2007, 10:03 PM, updated 19y ago
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Feb 1 2007, 10:11 PM
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2,564 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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they're running trials now
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Feb 1 2007, 10:19 PM
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QUOTE(chooncc @ Feb 1 2007, 10:03 PM) always malaysia boleh. bila boleh? wimax can broadcast with very width coverage. The earliest that I heard is after July 2007; from Maxis. I was also invited to be do a project on developing WiMax Phone under one research grant for a local uni but didn't accept it since different field of research.  Samsung already developed WiMax Phone. Motorola coming soon. We just hope for the earliest adpotion. I also have a short conversation with one of the Ikram Electronic Engineer. He did mentioned that to cover the peninsular Malaysia with WiMax can be done using a lot less antennas compared to current coverage but since the technology is different from cell phone technology; there will be a lot of challenges will be faced.... Just hope for the best... But please don't say "Malaysia Boleh"... Dah lali sangat with the slogan sedangkan 'tarak apa2 yang dapat'... LOL |
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Feb 1 2007, 10:30 PM
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6,181 posts Joined: Oct 2004 
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Maxis? Having trial with motorola, isn't it.
Even if WiMAX is introduced, all will be used in backhaul only. Some CPE is not that consumer friendly after all. |
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Feb 1 2007, 11:07 PM
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dunno how about the wimax stability. it is same as wireless?
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Feb 1 2007, 11:10 PM
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3,039 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Laputa
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Wimax has long being on trial by iburst
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Feb 2 2007, 01:21 AM
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QUOTE(chooncc @ Feb 1 2007, 10:03 PM) wimax can broadcast with very width coverage. Not necessarily true. Take for example, the Maxis WiMAX trial -- running at 2.5GHz, its coverage footprint is going to be pretty pathetic. Don't expect anything wider than 2km radius, especially in highly urban areas like KL city.QUOTE(kons @ Feb 1 2007, 10:30 PM) Maxis? Having trial with motorola, isn't it. Well, according to the news reports, they're trialing Mobile WiMAX, which should be 802.16e. So it's not a "backhaul" (point-to-point) solution. My expectation of a "mobile" WiMAX access device would be a USB or PC Card interface at least -- no external power or battery packs required. I consider anything other than those form-factors to be inferior. I'd love to see what their access device looks like.Even if WiMAX is introduced, all will be used in backhaul only. Some CPE is not that consumer friendly after all. QUOTE(wufei @ Feb 1 2007, 11:10 PM) Wimax has long being on trial by iburst iBurst is not WiMAX. In fact, iBurst is not even OFDM-based, which WiMAX is.This post has been edited by husagi: Feb 2 2007, 01:22 AM |
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Feb 2 2007, 01:59 AM
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269 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: OHh S#%t , I'm LoSt!!!
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Trial?...I think 5 years from now , Wimax gonna reach consumer/home user... u know la Malaysia..so slow
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Feb 2 2007, 07:05 AM
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129 posts Joined: Nov 2005
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There will be a town in Malaysia that will be Wi-Fi Town. The entire town will be convered.
Just open your laptop and u can surf. Just to provide basic surfing. P2P for sure not allowed. Read the newspaper this or next month and you will see. |
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Feb 2 2007, 07:33 AM
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966 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: Malaysia
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Cost per month? Don't tell me got access fee + line rental..
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Feb 2 2007, 08:17 AM
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50 posts Joined: Nov 2006
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wimax, line rental??????, maybe got 5% government tax
u know la, Bolehland, anything possible |
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Feb 2 2007, 08:47 AM
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10,308 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Kuala Lumpur
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the gov still havent release the license for telco company, so it is hard to tell when we'll get WiMax.
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Feb 2 2007, 09:01 AM
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7,671 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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look at front page
there's a piece of introduction to wimax there |
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Feb 26 2007, 12:30 AM
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736 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Kota Damansara / Sunway
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http://www.samsung.com/PressCenter/PressRe...0213_0000321337
I just like to dream. QUOTE Mobile WiMAX Wave 1: Maximum download and upload transmission speeds: 20M/6Mbps Mobile WiMAX Wave 2: Maximum download and upload transmission speeds: 40M/12Mbps While in Malaysia, we are waiting to see who won the WiMAX tender bids here, i'm droolling at Spain's achievable WiMAX speed.  |
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Feb 26 2007, 02:48 PM
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QUOTE(IntegraTypeR @ Feb 26 2007, 12:30 AM) http://www.samsung.com/PressCenter/PressRe...0213_0000321337 let's hope digi get's the license, then we can see something good, as the backbone is ntt if i'm not mistaken...I just like to dream. While in Malaysia, we are waiting to see who won the WiMAX tender bids here, i'm droolling at Spain's achievable WiMAX speed. skali kena one stupid malaysian company how good also, backbone goes to tm die back same as lppl , no point there... |
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Feb 26 2007, 06:35 PM
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6,139 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(JinXXX @ Feb 26 2007, 02:48 PM) let's hope digi get's the license, then we can see something good, as the backbone is ntt if i'm not mistaken... digi won get the wimax as it is 61% controlled by Telenorskali kena one stupid malaysian company how good also, backbone goes to tm die back same as lppl , no point there... imagine if digi get the wimax, what will happen to the local telcos.. mati terus.. govt won allow that to happen |
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Feb 26 2007, 11:14 PM
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yalah...
We all always say: Bring on Green Packet, and DiGi... but while it is a nice dream, i don't think this "dream" would come true. Cos both green packet n digi oso owned by foreigners... Ps: Besides, our big shots oso got no share in Green Packet n DiGi. Our big shots brothers got shares in Maxis n Telekom. Of course lah they "protect" local players.... lol... |
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Feb 27 2007, 10:32 AM
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QUOTE(stan16 @ Feb 26 2007, 11:14 PM) yalah... Wait for the next malaysian revolution.We all always say: Bring on Green Packet, and DiGi... but while it is a nice dream, i don't think this "dream" would come true. Cos both green packet n digi oso owned by foreigners... Ps: Besides, our big shots oso got no share in Green Packet n DiGi. Our big shots brothers got shares in Maxis n Telekom. Of course lah they "protect" local players.... lol... Ha just kidding, most probably soon, they're testing it now. If they don't release wimax this year, I say Malaysia Boleh bla. |
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Feb 27 2007, 08:03 PM
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179 posts Joined: Jul 2006 From: Petaling Jaya
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I think TMNet will get it
 Since its the biggest player in Malaysia.  |
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Feb 27 2007, 09:58 PM
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133 posts Joined: Sep 2006
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lol. yeah. tmnut will surely get it. but not bcos they are the biggest in malaysia. but bcos the big shots got share in tmnut. lol.
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Feb 28 2007, 01:07 AM
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524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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TheEdgeDaily: Green Packet, YTL, REDTone-linked firms front-runners for WiMAX 2.3GHz
Article dated 27 Feb 2007. |
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Feb 28 2007, 09:43 AM
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QUOTE(husagi @ Feb 28 2007, 01:07 AM) TheEdgeDaily: Green Packet, YTL, REDTone-linked firms front-runners for WiMAX 2.3GHz I doubt they have the resources for nationwide rollout.Article dated 27 Feb 2007. What are our ministers thinking? |
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Feb 28 2007, 11:33 AM
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524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Got money, can lock 'n loll! Resources can be hired, as long as they have the mulah. But I'm doubtful about Redtone. They're having such a tough time right now.
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Feb 28 2007, 03:33 PM
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food for thought:
3G operators with deep pockets can't even rollout HSPDA klang valley wide. Well GP and Red have something the big mobile boys lack. Ha Ha |
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Feb 28 2007, 11:17 PM
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6,181 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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Maybe existing ISP would just stick to 2.5 Ghz band..
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Feb 28 2007, 11:54 PM
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QUOTE(theedge @ Feb 28 2007, 03:33 PM) food for thought: Haih.. Now that you've mentioned the clowns whom I was ready to forget... I guess, besides money, they need less ego and less dung slinging in the boardroom too. 3G operators with deep pockets can't even rollout HSPDA klang valley wide. Well GP and Red have something the big mobile boys lack. Ha Ha  (Pssst! I'm not talking about the existing 3G ops who have already rolled out some HSDPA infra.  ) |
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Feb 28 2007, 11:58 PM
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From the look of it, it is kinda hard for those with 3G license to be awarded the WiMax license. Plus the guys that already rolled out 3G network already feeling the pinch - costly network but no killer apps that can generate the revenue.
Now come the WiMax - market perceives the technology offers better speed and coverage with super duper cheap price. Only the big guys with deep pockets can offer such things in the firtst phase of service roll-out with considerable coverage. Those 'small fishes' just trying their lucks - get license, build some network coverage, got difficulty (flame by LYN hahaha), buyout from big guys and the directors make their profits. Malaysia boleh!  |
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Mar 2 2007, 01:07 PM
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20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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anyone can enlighten
If GP's s..Metro is the killer solution for broadband. Hmmmm Y then do they need wimax. |
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Mar 3 2007, 06:20 PM
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Metro-E is for wired solution which can hit 1Gbps speed. WiMax is for Wireless - which i dunno what's the Max means.
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Mar 3 2007, 08:15 PM
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theedge is referring to GreenPacket's SONMetro wireless solution. Not to be confused with Metro Ethernet.
Added on March 3, 2007, 8:23 pmhttp://star-techcentral.com/tech/story.asp?file=/2007/3/3/technology/20070303140657&sec=technology Bagging the WiMax licences BY next week, the Energy, Water and Communications Minister Datuk Seri Dr Lim Keng Yaik is likely to announce the winners of the Worldwide Interoperability for Microwave Access (WiMax) licences, industry players say. ... This post has been edited by husagi: Mar 3 2007, 08:23 PM |
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Mar 4 2007, 01:45 PM
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1,704 posts Joined: Jan 2007 From: sarawak
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may i ask why Government only release 4 license? cant 5 license or more? is malaysia too small, and government thinks we only need 4 license?
someone please tell me? |
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Mar 5 2007, 10:54 AM
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Because... there's only 100MHz of spectrum available for use. This 100MHz is divided into 5MHz slices. Why 5MHz, you ask? That's because a typical carrier bandwidth for a IEEE802.16e (WiMAX) system is 5MHz. So that makes 20 blocks of 5MHz spectrum available for bidding. If divided equally, then each of the 4 successful bidders will get 5 blocks. My take on this is that, each succcessful bidder will NOT get equal share, because 5 is quite an odd number for deploying a sensible radio network, especially if an operator were to use paired spectrum. Of course, whether or not a bidder chooses to use paired spectrum (FDD) is entirely up to the system they choose to deploy. Some may opt for TDD (i.e., not paired spectrum). But I think most would opt for FDD, unless they're not aware of the difference.....
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Mar 5 2007, 11:01 AM
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3,769 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Perak 
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will it kicks out tm net?
This post has been edited by serewen: Mar 5 2007, 11:02 AM |
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Mar 5 2007, 11:50 AM
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133 posts Joined: Sep 2006
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I personally take it as only 2 licenses available...
Another 2 has been booked for Maxis n Telekom. Reasons: 1) "Protect the local players" 2) Sudah got share in those 2 |
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Mar 5 2007, 11:53 AM
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total=4 license
2 license release first.other 2 lter ytle and green packet will get both license......that y their share go up This post has been edited by k8118k: Mar 5 2007, 11:54 AM |
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Mar 5 2007, 04:19 PM
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check out this article
http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/nst/Sun...04083122/Articl e/index_html Look like there is an alt network for broadband. All the hype bout "why max" and there is already a broadband solution with reach. btw, which service provider offer this? |
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Mar 5 2007, 04:19 PM
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6,181 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 5 2007, 10:54 AM) Because... there's only 100MHz of spectrum available for use. This 100MHz is divided into 5MHz slices. Why 5MHz, you ask? That's because a typical carrier bandwidth for a IEEE802.16e (WiMAX) system is 5MHz. So that makes 20 blocks of 5MHz spectrum available for bidding. If divided equally, then each of the 4 successful bidders will get 5 blocks. My take on this is that, each succcessful bidder will NOT get equal share, because 5 is quite an odd number for deploying a sensible radio network, especially if an operator were to use paired spectrum. Of course, whether or not a bidder chooses to use paired spectrum (FDD) is entirely up to the system they choose to deploy. Some may opt for TDD (i.e., not paired spectrum). But I think most would opt for FDD, unless they're not aware of the difference..... Some spectrum would be wasted providing bigger guard band in FDD..QUOTE(k8118k @ Mar 5 2007, 11:53 AM) total=4 license GPacket just dropped to 4.68 just now... from almighty 6.7...2 license release first.other 2 lter ytle and green packet will get both license......that y their share go up What did you just say? |
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Mar 5 2007, 10:45 PM
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QUOTE(theedge @ Mar 5 2007, 04:19 PM) check out this article Im Wirefree, apparently.http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/nst/Sun...icle/index_html Look like there is an alt network for broadband. All the hype bout "why max" and there is already a broadband solution with reach. btw, which service provider offer this? QUOTE(kons @ Mar 5 2007, 04:19 PM) Some spectrum would be wasted providing bigger guard band in FDD.. Really? IIRC, OFDM doesn't need inter-carrier guardband regardless of whether it's FDD or TDD. If it does, it's quite a small slice and the 5MHz bandwidth is inclusive of the guardband. Likewise, inter-operator guardband shouldn't be a concern, unless the adjacent operator(s) are not using OFDM-based technology.This post has been edited by husagi: Mar 5 2007, 10:46 PM |
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Mar 6 2007, 10:48 AM
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QUOTE Im Wirefree, apparently. Im Wirefree look promising, but no coverage map  What the difference between Wimax and Im then? both OFDM, so must be wimax then. Did a bit of checking. Other than Korea, no other country uses 2.3G for Wimax. Singapore and Indonesia are going with 2.5G. The 3G's telco must be on to something since all running 2.5G trial. |
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Mar 6 2007, 10:54 AM
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QUOTE(theedge @ Mar 6 2007, 10:48 AM) Did a bit of checking. Interesting point. Probably have something to do with quantity and price of CPE.Other than Korea, no other country uses 2.3G for Wimax. Singapore and Indonesia are going with 2.5G. The 3G's telco must be on to something since all running 2.5G trial. But using 2.5GHz is no better than 2.3GHz though, in terms of coverage footprint. |
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Mar 6 2007, 02:33 PM
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a little bird from korea mention " WiBro still pilot"
QUOTE Interesting point. Probably have something to do with quantity and price of CPE. when license is issued, no modem. prob cost a bomb if there is. look like Wimax just going to be another hype like 3G broadband Anyone tested the Im service? |
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Mar 7 2007, 10:00 AM
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133 posts Joined: Sep 2006
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As usual...
Malaysia = slow implementation... When was the last time we see a "big" project implemented succesfully on time? "Aiyah... Malaysian time mah..." |
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Mar 7 2007, 11:52 AM
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51 posts Joined: Jan 2007
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i'd like to hope that tmnet will not get the licence, they cannot even handle streamyx right now..
olso would be nice if this coming wimax makes tmnet to push up its speed at least a little, its been like this forever, when the rest of the world is having digiTVs and pushing 50mbit connections... |
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Mar 7 2007, 01:24 PM
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6,181 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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Those who don't get the license can always chuck in at 2.5 Ghz
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Mar 7 2007, 01:53 PM
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285 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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it seems that airzed already have wimax running in malaysia?
and btw, for Streamyx wireless, isit wimax? |
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Mar 8 2007, 10:35 AM
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20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE it seems that airzed already have wimax running in malaysia? AirZ, Maxis, Telekom, Time already have the spectrum to operate Wimax. So if they r serious bout wimax (if wimax eqpt is available), ........ think about it. it like waiting for the ultimate pc. |
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Mar 9 2007, 10:07 AM
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1,575 posts Joined: Dec 2006 From: Singapore, Chicago, Appleton WI, Bangkok, KL
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end of the week already....no announcement?
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Mar 9 2007, 01:09 PM
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6,181 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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End of this month probably...
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Mar 9 2007, 01:42 PM
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524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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WiMAX will save the day, so they thought
But alas, February has come to nought We wait and we wait, for Unker Lim to speak Industry pundits say this week! This week! He shall squeak! But squeaketh, he yet has Redtone! YTL! Green Packet! The "experts" betted We too, can place our bets, for 'tis not too late Come one, come all, let's choose your WiMAX mate! For all men, Malaysian time awaits Unker Lim, some of us may hate When he drops the WiMAX bomb Oh, what farce we make aplomb |
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Mar 9 2007, 10:16 PM
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20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 9 2007, 01:42 PM) WiMAX will save the day, so they thought cheeky, witty and nuttyBut alas, February has come to nought We wait and we wait, for Unker Lim to speak Industry pundits say this week! This week! He shall squeak! But squeaketh, he yet has Redtone! YTL! Green Packet! The "experts" betted We too, can place our bets, for 'tis not too late Come one, come all, let's choose your WiMAX mate! For all men, Malaysian time awaits Unker Lim, some of us may hate When he drops the WiMAX bomb Oh, what farce we make aplomb wonder if he think it funny Wimax may spark a broadband race alas the race may blow up in the winner face the race may give the ppl hope I think is just false hope like 3G and all doom to trip and fall |
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Mar 9 2007, 11:37 PM
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133 posts Joined: Sep 2006
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Bring on Green Packet....
F*** off Maxis and TM Nut... |
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Mar 10 2007, 12:24 AM
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524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(theedge @ Mar 6 2007, 02:33 PM) a little bird from korea mention " WiBro still pilot" Quite different from what I heard today. Apparently, take-up rate of WiBro is very slow there because of limited availability of the access device. So the Korean operators have resorted to 3.5G......QUOTE(ihawk98 @ Mar 9 2007, 10:07 AM) end of the week already....no announcement? I knew it! They lied! They lied!!  |
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Mar 12 2007, 01:31 PM
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QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 10 2007, 12:24 AM) Quite different from what I heard today. Apparently, take-up rate of WiBro is very slow there because of limited availability of the access device. So the Korean operators have resorted to 3.5G.....  Chk out the service coverage. Can see whyservice coverage will be a problem n no Operator find it viable persue Wibro. |
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Mar 13 2007, 02:24 PM
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another bullsH1t from malaysia...haha our uncle lim very old ady maybe need time kua..like the astro saying.."i got time" or maybe alzheimer struck him....hehe i dunno.i dun cured but jus say only..dun quote me. uncle lim i dunno la when..ady finish last week..now is next week ady la.haiyo. wan me buy new clock for u? got calender or not ah?
damn la...if wimax roll out damn gud la. let tmnut suffer!!!!!! stil hope stil remain as hope....n become bullsh1t wahaha |
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Mar 13 2007, 02:47 PM
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783 posts Joined: Apr 2005
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WiMaX is Worldwide Interoperability for Microwave Access One thing i am sure, it will only kick start if its price is above RM 150 below or pay for use package. Otherwise if we have coverage in our area also no use because nobody is going to use. |
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Mar 13 2007, 05:18 PM
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Malaysia is really really out of date and out of step with the rest of the world. If you google for WiMax you will find that countries like India, China, Brazil, etc has already deployed wimax. Whereas the locals companies will declare that wimax is not stable so wait and see. Even Russia is giving wifi access on a 120km bus ride....
IEEE 802.16m specs will be completed in 2009 and it hopes to implement 1Gb WiMax! Some of the already WiMax certified equipment:- http://www.wimax.com/education/equipment-guide/overview/ so why people telling us no equipment is certified yet? Just their excuse not to implement WiMax. http://www.unstrung.com/document.asp?doc_id=118299 Beceem will be supplying Mobile WiMAX silicon to Samsung for use in fixed and mobile WiMax applications |
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Mar 13 2007, 05:52 PM
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1,140 posts Joined: Dec 2004
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Malaysian politician as always has little credibility !!! Sigh.....
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Mar 13 2007, 07:54 PM
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570 posts Joined: Mar 2005 From: The land that practices "democrazy"
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I just really wish that somone could be transparent and actually tell which party is making all the excuses and delays for wimax, and other stuff in our country too.
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Mar 13 2007, 08:36 PM
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774 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Prontera's Inn
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Just wait n wait n wait till 2010. Coz we r slow anyway
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Mar 14 2007, 02:46 PM
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524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(theedge @ Mar 12 2007, 01:31 PM) Chk out the service coverage. Can see whyservice coverage will be a problem n no Operator find it viable persue Wibro. On a relevant note, TheEdgeDaily announced today that WiMAX tender results could be announced as early as tomorrow, since it's being tabled today at the Cabinet meeting. We shall see..... http://www.theedgedaily.com/cms/content.js...ce0000-566753e4 |
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Mar 14 2007, 04:40 PM
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1,485 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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so shall i wait for this WiMAX ? or get the maxis wireeless broadband?
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Mar 15 2007, 12:23 AM
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524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Never wait for the cows to come home. I remember a conversation I overheard about 2 years ago, when Telekom came to my Taman -- new residential area -- to sign up new users for phone line & Streamyx. This neighbor of mine said to his wife, "Don't bother with Streamyx. Let's wait for [name of some wireless broadband company]." Well... that particular wireless broadband service never reached my neighborhood. Ever. And now, Streamyx ports in my area is full. I wonder if this neighbor ever got his broadband fix.
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Mar 15 2007, 01:05 AM
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774 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Prontera's Inn
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QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 15 2007, 12:23 AM) Never wait for the cows to come home. I remember a conversation I overheard about 2 years ago, when Telekom came to my Taman -- new residential area -- to sign up new users for phone line & Streamyx. This neighbor of mine said to his wife, "Don't bother with Streamyx. Let's wait for [name of some wireless broadband company]." Well... that particular wireless broadband service never reached my neighborhood. Ever. And now, Streamyx ports in my area is full. I wonder if this neighbor ever got his broadband fix. Got, i am ur neighbour........dun talk behind ppl back....ok jokin... |
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Mar 15 2007, 11:28 AM
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20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 15 2007, 12:23 AM) Never wait for the cows to come home. iBurst in coming to town. Maybe shld wait otherwise stuck for 2 yrs of lousy broadband service. First Wirefree, Now iBurstWonder if Wimax will ever land on our shore. |
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Mar 15 2007, 11:46 AM
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524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(archonixm @ Mar 15 2007, 01:05 AM) Got, i am ur neighbour........dun talk behind ppl back....ok jokin... You not my neighbor la. Absolutely positively sure. Added on March 15, 2007, 11:52 am QUOTE(theedge @ Mar 15 2007, 11:28 AM) iBurst in coming to town. Wait? Who's willing to wait? 2 years of zero versus lousy broadband service? Which one is better?Maybe shld wait otherwise stuck for 2 yrs of lousy broadband service. Now, at least, you got other alternatives to WiMAX besides HSDPA or 3G. Good thing, no? This post has been edited by husagi: Mar 15 2007, 11:52 AM |
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Mar 15 2007, 12:55 PM
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Junior Member
147 posts Joined: Oct 2006
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since now ady afternoon..i think now goverment ppl only want to start work after minum pagi...but its near lunch ady....haha..makan dulu!!
so actuali its work time is after lunch rite? fuh..til now also no news bout wimax..waste time waiting ma after tat hv to wait they implement all the operation..damn slow.take few months.but i heard like jaring or sumthing had set up some antenna in KL but got stoped by gov..so i dunna la. we c by tonight wat happen meeting also so long.... |
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Mar 15 2007, 01:33 PM
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Moderator
6,181 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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It's good what..
WiMAX making somebody shares going up. |
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Mar 15 2007, 07:09 PM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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http://www.bernama.com/bernama/v3/news_bus...s.php?id=251377
"Govt To Announce WiMax Licence Recipients Tomorrow" |
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Mar 16 2007, 12:38 PM
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Senior Member
783 posts Joined: Apr 2005
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WIMAX WINNER ANNOUNCED ON MAIN PAGE SO IN PENINSULAR MALAYSIA we have 3 service provider. How its going to effect us ? STAY TUNED.  |
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Mar 16 2007, 12:57 PM
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Junior Member
20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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Interesting, Can the wimax CPE interwork between different operator?
Of course assuming that all the 3 licencee rollout. Will the user interest be protected. Since there is no standard body in Malaysia that check CPE interoperatability with different operator. Wimax being an open system, may not so open at this stage. Hope we wont be short change with prototype equipment. |
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Mar 16 2007, 01:07 PM
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Senior Member
1,399 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Destiny Island
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Mar 16 2007, 03:52 PM
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Senior Member
752 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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Good luck to the winner!!! Who's going to bet which company will kaput first?
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Mar 16 2007, 04:21 PM
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Junior Member
142 posts Joined: Mar 2007 From: malacca
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http://www.cmc.gov.my/Admin/WhatIsNew/2074...60307_final.pdf
wimax winner Added on March 16, 2007, 4:24 pm QUOTE(asiatrader98 @ Mar 14 2007, 04:40 PM) so shall i wait for this WiMAX ? or get the maxis wireeless broadband? i thing you dont thing too expect too high lah , malaysia do thing is all 'bad'ter then other ppl de , korea wimax can reach 5mbps leh , did you thing malaysia can do it or not ? This post has been edited by oc_yee: Mar 16 2007, 04:24 PM |
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Mar 16 2007, 06:08 PM
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Senior Member
8,913 posts Joined: Mar 2005
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QUOTE(oc_yee @ Mar 16 2007, 04:21 PM) http://www.cmc.gov.my/Admin/WhatIsNew/2074...60307_final.pdf Can... 256kbps... wimax winner Added on March 16, 2007, 4:24 pm i thing you dont thing too expect too high lah , malaysia do thing is all 'bad'ter then other ppl de , korea wimax can reach 5mbps leh , did you thing malaysia can do it or not ?  |
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Mar 16 2007, 06:25 PM
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Senior Member
1,485 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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QUOTE(Joshua_0718 @ Mar 16 2007, 06:08 PM) Can... 256kbps... again,digi did not get the WiMAX licences , so cheaper & good service for broadband is unlikely souce: The Edge http://www.theedgedaily.com/cms/content.js...8ff900-883830f9 |
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Mar 16 2007, 10:45 PM
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Senior Member
6,904 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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who the hell is asiaspace dotcom ??? never heard of 'em ???? huh fishy
 most likely all the wimax provider will trottle the pakets since they want to improve their QoS ..... juz pray that it will be cheaper & better then ehem2 This post has been edited by cruzzmz: Mar 16 2007, 10:50 PM |
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Mar 16 2007, 11:45 PM
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Senior Member
752 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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Only YTL-E has deep pockets compared to the rest. Wish them luck. muahaha. Redtone currently in not-so good financial situation and they are the sole provider in Sabah and Sarawak. Bet those ppl in Bario, Kinabalu can enjoy better internet access in the future thanks to Redtone. Malaysia Boleh!
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Mar 16 2007, 11:48 PM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(theedge @ Mar 16 2007, 12:57 PM) Interesting, Can the wimax CPE interwork between different operator? Interoperability? Last I heard, Green Packet's SONMetro is not even WiMAX... Wonder if that's what they're using to roll out their "WiMAX" network.QUOTE(cruzzmz @ Mar 16 2007, 10:45 PM) who the hell is asiaspace dotcom ??? never heard of 'em ???? huh fishy Asiaspace has been around in the telco biz for quite a while already. They've been renting out towers and telco infra to the telcos, I believe. In terms of the number of sites that they already own, they probably won't have much problem with their roll outs. Compare that to the other 3 players who will have to spend several months acquiring sites for their transmitters! most likely all the wimax provider will trottle the pakets since they want to improve their QoS ..... juz pray that it will be cheaper & better then ehem2 BTW, guys... read the second last paragraph in MCMC's press release. QUOTE We expect winners to quickly roll out the service to 25% of the population in the area given to them by the end of this year, with a service provision of at least 1MBps at affordable rates. At the end of third year, it is expected that they will be able to roll services to at least 40% of the population in the areas given to them. So I'm thinking..... how much will it cost the end user to subscribe to a 1Mbps WiMAX service? I did some calculations. My assumption is that the bulk rate of leasing a 1Mbps Internet line per month is RM500 (dunno if it can be that cheap cuz basic 1Mbps leased line is already RM2k at least!). Then, I also assume that the Internet bandwidth oversubscription rate is 1:10. I.e., each user will share a 1Mbps line with 10 other users. In ISP terms, that's actually very oversubscribed. To get decent service, the ratio is usually 1:5 or 1:8 at most. So I came up with a basic cost of RM50 per user per month. At this point, I haven't even calculated the cost of operating the WiMAX network. Manpower can be costly. And don't forget CAPEX too! So, if the operators can offer RM80 for a 1Mbps package, they're probably breaking even! My next question: even if WiMAX can offer 5Mbps or 10Mbps or whatever... are we willing to pay thru the nose? It will definitely be more than RM100 for monthly access fees. Triple/Quad play, anyone? |
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Mar 17 2007, 05:07 AM
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Senior Member
774 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Prontera's Inn
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Ah forget wimax...coz as usual the price will be expensive and the service is below average..maybe 256kbps hahaha....and coverage is <1km from tower
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Mar 17 2007, 07:00 AM
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Elite
1,235 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: kuala lipis
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QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 16 2007, 11:48 PM) BTW, guys... read the second last paragraph in MCMC's press release. So I'm thinking..... how much will it cost the end user to subscribe to a 1Mbps WiMAX service? I did some calculations. My assumption is that the bulk rate of leasing a 1Mbps Internet line per month is RM500 (dunno if it can be that cheap cuz basic 1Mbps leased line is already RM2k at least!). Then, I also assume that the Internet bandwidth oversubscription rate is 1:10. I.e., each user will share a 1Mbps line with 10 other users. In ISP terms, that's actually very oversubscribed. To get decent service, the ratio is usually 1:5 or 1:8 at most. So I came up with a basic cost of RM50 per user per month. At this point, I haven't even calculated the cost of operating the WiMAX network. Manpower can be costly. And don't forget CAPEX too! if these services are rolled out in rural areas where internet culture is not as prevalent as the urbanites then initially it'll be more than 1:10. the ISPs wll have leverage but as the exposure catches up, the bandwidth will no longer be sufficient and the opex/capex will increase. even at 1:15 i'd believe the ISPs will have a hard time sustaining their core business. |
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Mar 17 2007, 07:16 AM
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Moderator
6,181 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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QUOTE(Christopher_LKL @ Mar 16 2007, 01:07 PM) Last time GPacket just sold SONAccess to Maxis in a one-off deal, and that's all.And you don't call that partner. |
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Mar 17 2007, 08:50 AM
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Junior Member
5 posts Joined: Feb 2005
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i dun think those Bizsurf and MIB and redtone will doing well after they get wimax licence.
we can see how the 3G licence winner performance in past year and now, soo suck after they get the 3G licence. Everything eg.3G/HSDPA, wimax are not revolution due to govt suck decision until they 100% really fair open their policies. This post has been edited by sharpdie: Mar 17 2007, 08:55 AM |
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Mar 17 2007, 09:30 AM
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Moderator
6,181 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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QUOTE(sharpdie @ Mar 17 2007, 08:50 AM) i dun think those Bizsurf and MIB and redtone will doing well after they get wimax licence. BizSurf is owned by YTLe and MIB is owned by GPacket.we can see how the 3G licence winner performance in past year and now, soo suck after they get the 3G licence. Everything eg.3G/HSDPA, wimax are not revolution due to govt suck decision until they 100% really fair open their policies. GSM deployment is more complicated than WiMAX, just in case you didn't know that. Do you know how many WiMAX vendors are there? And how many GSM equipment vendors are there? It's just not fair to compare like that. Just sit back and see how the deployment goes. |
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Mar 17 2007, 02:06 PM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Oh noes... Here's what Green Packet's CEO said to TheStar:
QUOTE He said services were expected to be rolled out before year-end and consumers could expect “higher speed of Internet services at better quality and prices,” adding that its WiMax broadband products would be targeted at enterprises. Source: http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?f...95&sec=business Sorry la... I think we common folks will have to take the back seat. Corporate customers come first. Furthermore, an analyst comment: QUOTE The downside for WiMax, however, is that compatible devices are not readily available in the country as yet. Ultimately, it will depend on which is finally accepted by end-users,” he said. Source: http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?f...21&sec=business Interoperability, huh? Operator roaming is out of the question for now. Furthermore, customers cannot easily switch service. Open standard, my foot. This post has been edited by husagi: Mar 17 2007, 02:13 PM |
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Mar 17 2007, 04:50 PM
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Senior Member
1,798 posts Joined: Sep 2004 From: Yuen Long, HK || Seremban || Kuala Lumpur
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Today oriental newspaper talk about WIMAX, Wi-Fi only can reach 54mbps, coverage 100m while WIMAX can up to 74mbps and coverage 4800m. It stated the speed should be more than 1mbps or above.
How about 3G HSDPA? If the speed compare with WIMAX? I knew that Maxis now got 3G HSDPA, can this service use in nokia N series phone? And what is the speed? Thank you! |
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Mar 17 2007, 05:32 PM
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Junior Member
327 posts Joined: Mar 2006
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They say that wimax is for data and 3g is for voice communication.
I think gov really serious about this. This is because 3g is more expensive to developed than wimax. |
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Mar 17 2007, 05:57 PM
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Senior Member
3,022 posts Joined: Oct 2005
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i dont look forward to it.
even if they promise us 1mbps I DONT THINK THEY ABLE TO PROVIDE US 24 HOURS MAX SPEEED 1 MBS UNLIMITED BANDWIDTH |
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Mar 17 2007, 06:35 PM
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Junior Member
109 posts Joined: Apr 2006
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it's the price will be RM60 for 1m or 2mb like penangfon
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Mar 17 2007, 07:33 PM
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Junior Member
111 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: 25150 
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Although Im excited to see what these companies have to offer us, im more excited to see what TMNet have to do in order to keep its customer from switching to these 4 companies. So, far from reading from the Star, only GP and YTL have a lot more monies to spent than the other 2.
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Mar 17 2007, 08:21 PM
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Senior Member
555 posts Joined: Feb 2006 From: Malaysia, UNITED STATES OF ASIA
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How's the TMnet? Did they loose the WiMAX tender?
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Mar 17 2007, 08:56 PM
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Senior Member
1,253 posts Joined: Jan 2007 From: Columbus, Ohio
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well, if the best effort basic is listed in the contract don't get your hope to high. i wonder if TMnet will try to maintain and fix their system so we don't go to other ISP.
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Mar 17 2007, 09:17 PM
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Junior Member
147 posts Joined: Oct 2006
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i dun think tat tmnet would further improving their services...they will jus say tat will keep saying tat they have a good track record n very efficent to boast la.its normal la. they ady monopolized ma.
malaysian way especially then this new wimax ppl..what they do is high price but low bandwith..cant help it coz of the high operation cost lo but hope things turn out alrite 4 these companies..n this tmnut get the biggest pinch of their life!!!hahah |
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Mar 17 2007, 10:21 PM
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Senior Member
2,867 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(john123x @ Mar 17 2007, 05:57 PM) i dont look forward to it. Have faith bro... have faith that tmnet will topple.even if they promise us 1mbps I DONT THINK THEY ABLE TO PROVIDE US 24 HOURS MAX SPEEED 1 MBS UNLIMITED BANDWIDTH |
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Mar 17 2007, 10:58 PM
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Senior Member
4,234 posts Joined: Sep 2006
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People, we do not want TmNut to topple. We want Tmnet to be subjected to competition so that they can offer better service charge cheaper. We do not want the stuck up Tmnut.
The way I see it, and from my understanding, Wimax is cheaper to implement than 3G, and perhaps ADSL broadband. The infrastructure cost is low because they only need to build transmission towers instead of doing cabling like what Tmnut is doing now. I'd wish these Wimax provider would give good service and Tmnut will surely be pressured to do better than what they are doing now. Let us all pray the WiMax provider would compete with Tmnut.....resulting in price war. In the end, it is us that are going to benefit from this. I would pray that once WiMax gets up and running ....we could see TmNut giving away 10 Mbps for Rm20 p month perhaps....hopefully that day will come, pray hard hard. This post has been edited by kaiserreich: Mar 17 2007, 11:00 PM |
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Mar 17 2007, 11:12 PM
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Junior Member
20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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Now, there are 3 Wimax operator in peninsula, in addition to Nasioncom and Airzed.
Let c who going to fire the first slavo and provide affordable Broadband. Tmnut might end up being the winner here |
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Mar 17 2007, 11:45 PM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(ihsan @ Mar 17 2007, 07:00 AM) if these services are rolled out in rural areas where internet culture is not as prevalent as the urbanites then initially it'll be more than 1:10. the ISPs wll have leverage but as the exposure catches up, the bandwidth will no longer be sufficient and the opex/capex will increase. even at 1:15 i'd believe the ISPs will have a hard time sustaining their core business. Very well said and to the point. We "urbanites" shouldn't underestimate the rural folks, though. They got more spending power than us urbanites, and I'm sure they already know about P2P and YouTube. With less financial commitments than the city folks and plenty of free time, they can afford broadband for all we know. Just give them broadband and they'll surely catch up sooner than we'd expect. |
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Mar 18 2007, 12:35 AM
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Moderator
6,181 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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QUOTE(rstusa @ Mar 17 2007, 04:50 PM) Today oriental newspaper talk about WIMAX, Wi-Fi only can reach 54mbps, coverage 100m while WIMAX can up to 74mbps and coverage 4800m. It stated the speed should be more than 1mbps or above. HSDPA is not 3G, it's 3.5GHow about 3G HSDPA? If the speed compare with WIMAX? I knew that Maxis now got 3G HSDPA, can this service use in nokia N series phone? And what is the speed? Thank you! Which N series phone? QUOTE(ShamAN234 @ Mar 17 2007, 07:33 PM) Although Im excited to see what these companies have to offer us, im more excited to see what TMNet have to do in order to keep its customer from switching to these 4 companies. So, far from reading from the Star, only GP and YTL have a lot more monies to spent than the other 2. TMNet already happily operating in 2.5 Ghz, the penetration rate is more or less the same as 2.3. |
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Mar 18 2007, 01:01 AM
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Senior Member
3,385 posts Joined: Aug 2006 From: Sao Paolo, Brazil
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I think they r just gonna f**k this one up like everything else...the bottom line is money....nobody gives a damn...
Grab all they can and go...nothing has started they already talking about penetration....counting profit already. |
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Mar 18 2007, 01:27 AM
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Senior Member
752 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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How come asiaspace got the licence? If they are the tower leasing operator then they should be a neutral party by offering tower leasing only. How they can be fair to other operator that want to put WiMax eqpt at their towers? Fishy ehh....
I've mentioned it earlier regarding the financial capabilities of these companies. Roll sub-par service first, if got problem then ask someone to bail them out. The big 3 telco always willing to help due to the spectrum allocations. Ka chingg... Which company going to bungkus first? I'm betting on Redtone. |
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Mar 18 2007, 01:01 PM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(nocar @ Mar 18 2007, 01:27 AM) Which company going to bungkus first? I'm betting on Redtone. Too early to tell, and lack of info on which vendor they've opted for. So far, we only know that Green Packet is providing the technology for MIB Comm and it's not even WiMAX standard....Unker Lim also said: QUOTE Asked if penalties would be imposed if they failed to roll out services as scheduled, Dr Lim said: “If they have a reason for not being able to roll out the service, we will find other ways to ensure that they achieve the objective.” Source: http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...1118&sec=nationSo I guess even if these companies bungkus early, they won't be penalized. Nice huh? This post has been edited by husagi: Mar 18 2007, 01:02 PM |
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Mar 18 2007, 04:34 PM
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Senior Member
2,330 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: 192.168.1.2
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Affordable Internet service with WiMax
By YEOW POOI LING and LEONG HUNG YEE PETALING JAYA: Two of the four winners of the WiMax (Worldwide Interoperability for Microwave Access) licence, which was announced yesterday, are all set to roll out high-speed wireless Internet services at affordable prices. The four winners are REDTone-CNX Broadband Sdn Bhd, Packet One Networks (M) Sdn Bhd (formerly known as MIB Comm Sdn Bhd), Asiaspace Dotcom Sdn Bhd and Bizsurf (M) Sdn Bhd (a unit of YTL-e Solutions Bhd). REDTone International Bhd group managing director Wei Chuan Beng told StarBiz that the 2.3GHz WiMax spectrum for Sabah and Sarawak would complement the group's nationwide Internet rollout plan. Puan Chan Cheong "We are very happy and thankful to MCMC (Malaysian Communications and Multimedia Commission) and the Government for entrusting us with the 2.3GHz," he said, adding that REDTone would be announcing its nationwide Internet rollout plan with its partner in the next two weeks. Wei said the RM300mil in capital expenditure (capex) for WiMax would be funded via equity and bond issues. "Our plan is very comprehensive. High-speed mobile Internet will have a major impact on businesses and individuals in terms of communication and their way of life. "Imagine individuals having the leisure of watching their favourite RTM programmes on their mobile phones while they are overseas," he added. Meanwhile, Puan Chan Cheong, chief executive officer of Green Packet Bhd, which owns Packet One, said winning the licence would put the company on an "equal playing field" with the big telecommunication players. "We are happy and excited as the WiMax licence complements our existing wireless broadband services. We have the funds in place already," he said. He said services were expected to be rolled out before year-end and consumers could expect "higher speed of Internet services at better quality and prices," adding that its WiMax broadband products would be targeted at enterprises. There are many possibilities with WiMax, such as using Skype - a free voice over Internet Protocol (VoiP) solution - on mobile phones, which helps to reduce cost. "Of course, we will only see that in two years' time." Green Packet is currently installing in the Klang Valley its SONmetro infrastructure that can deploy broadband services using fourth-generation (4G) technology and long-range WiFi coverage. Wei Chuan Beng The other two recipients, Bizsurf and Asiaspace, were unavailable for comment. YTL e-Solutions, which owns 50% of Bizsurf, is expected to release a statement today. YTL e-Solutions provides incubation services, including developing and incubating technology companies and Internet content. Asiaspace, a telecommunications and broadcast infrastructure company, was awarded the right to build 50 cellular base stations in 2003. Added on March 18, 2007, 4:34 pm  Added on March 18, 2007, 4:35 pmMalaysians will soon enjoy greater mobility when accessing the Internet - no need to be tied to modems, a WiFi hotspot or a cybercafe. WiMAX, a technology that enables wireless broadband access, is close to being implemented nationwide after the Government awarded four companies yesterday with licences to operate such networks. Bizsurf (M) Sdn Bhd, MIB Comm Sdn Bhd, Asiaspace Dotcom Sdn Bhd and Redtone-CNX Broadband Sdn Bhd were given licences to operate WiMAX (Worldwide Interoperability for Microwave Access) networks. Bizsurf, MIB Comm and Asiaspace Dotcom will cover peninsular Malaysia while Redtone-CNX Broadband will serve Sabah and Sarawak. Once these are in operation, Malaysians will be able to surf the Internet at ultra-high speeds from any point in the country, as well as enjoy new or improved Web-based services. The four beat 13 other companies including telecommunications heavyweights DiGi.Com Bhd, Maxis Communications Bhd and TM Bhd. The Malaysian Communications and Multimedia Commission (MCMC), the telecommunications sector regulator, made the announcement yesterday via a press release. MCMC expects the winners to roll out their WiMAX services to 25% of the population in the areas given to them by year-end. Also, it expects the Internet access speed to be no less than 1Mbps (megabit per second), which is equivalent to 1,000 kilobits per second. In comparison, Internet access via dial-up service is 56 kilobits per second. MCMC also stipulated that the wireless 1Mbps service should be at "an affordable price." At the end of third year, the companies are expected to roll out the services to at least 40% of the population in the areas they control. MCMC also wants each company to invest between RM250mil and RM300mil during the first three years of WiMAX implementation. A poll of Internet users in the Klang Valley shows that they expect better online access at cheaper rates from the four WiMAX licencees, JO TIMBUONG reports. They are also excited about being able to access the Internet from wherever they are. Civil servant Hezrul Ali, 31, said having the Internet so readily available would encourage more Malaysians to surf for information and entertainment. "This would help bridge the so-called digital divide," he said. A 32-year-old banker, who did not want to be named, said the increased connectivity would be welcome and hoped that the licencees would live up to their responsibilities. "I am expecting really fast data-transfer speeds and a super stable connection; not like what I have to put up with now," he said. REDTone International Bhd group managing director Wei Chuan Beng said the 2.3GHz licence (for Sabah & Sarawak) would provide REDTone an opportunity to play a meaningful role in helping the Government realise its aim of greater broadband penetration, SUSAN TAM reports. Green Packet Bhd chief executive officer Puan Chan Cheong thanked the commission and the Government for allowing the company to play a part and help the country to achieve its national broadband plan. Added on March 18, 2007, 4:39 pmPETALING JAYA: With 3G rollout in the country barely off the ground, spectrum licences for WiMax were announced yesterday and DiGi.Com Bhd has again been left out of the game. Arguably competing technologies, WiMax is considered superior with higher Internet speeds of 70 megabits per second versus 3G's High-Speed Downlink Packet Access speed of 15 megabits per second. The 3G, on the other hand, is superior to WiMax in voice communications. On the winners' list, an OSK Investment Bank telecommunications sector analyst said: "It is clear that the Government feels that communications spectrum is a scarce resource and would rather give it to local providers. "The idea of releasing the WiMax licences so soon after the new 3G licences is to accelerate competition in the broadband space." The Government was keen to improve the penetration of Internet broadband services in the country, he said, adding that with only about 500,000 3G users in the country, the service had definitely not taken off. "The move is very negative for DiGi. With all four spectrum blocks announced in one day, there is no guarantee that the Government will make further spectrum allocations in the future," he said. A telco analyst at HLG Research said with the 3G rollout, cost had been a major barrier. WiMax had a much lower cost of deployment of about RM300mil compared with 3G's RM1.2bil to RM1.3bil, said a TA Securities report. However, the HLG Research analyst said: "With the low global 3G penetration rate, such as in the US at only 10%, it is hard to really say if the service has taken off or not in Malaysia." The Malaysian Communications and Multi-media Commission was probably not too happy about the take-up rate, which was why WiMax licences had been given to content providers instead, with the hope of improving broadband penetration in the country, he added. The downside for WiMax, however, is that compatible devices are not readily available in the country as yet. Ultimately, it will depend on which is finally accepted by end-users," he said. TA Securities said on the broader scale, the Wimax service remained a longer-term prospect and would not have any impact on its "neutral" call on the sector. On the move not to include DiGi, it said: "This would be rather perplexing and disappointing given the earlier fiasco over the 3G licence, not to mention the financial strength and commitment by DiGi if they were successful. "We believe that these two technologies will co-exist, given the superiority of 3G in voice and WiMax will only carve a niche within the broadband wireless platform of the operators." This post has been edited by Suk: Mar 18 2007, 04:40 PM |
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Mar 18 2007, 05:19 PM
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Junior Member
142 posts Joined: Mar 2007 From: malacca
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QUOTE(Muhammad Nur Hanief @ Mar 17 2007, 08:21 PM) How's the TMnet? Did they loose the WiMAX tender? the will change to sell penut loh call tm nut  Added on March 18, 2007, 5:22 pm QUOTE(kons @ Mar 18 2007, 12:35 AM) HSDPA is not 3G, it's 3.5G digi kesian lah , 3G lisen also cannot get , that is gov bodohWhich N series phone? TMNet already happily operating in 2.5 Ghz, the penetration rate is more or less the same as 2.3. Added on March 18, 2007, 5:27 pmabout the wimax 1 question we have to thing , cos got 4 company then if company A cover malacca company B cover kl then i register under company A when i go kl cannot use already loh , like you take LRT in kl you want change train from putra to MOnorail you have to jalan far far , not like s'pore make ppl convenian malaysia always make ppl susah company senang punya This post has been edited by oc_yee: Mar 18 2007, 05:27 PM |
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Mar 18 2007, 08:10 PM
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Senior Member
752 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 18 2007, 01:01 PM) Unker Lim also said:Source: http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=...1118&sec=nation So I guess even if these companies bungkus early, they won't be penalized. Nice huh? And for those that keep calling TMnet as tmnut - you might wanna think of something for these 4 companies pet names. Think hard  |
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Mar 19 2007, 12:41 AM
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Senior Member
6,904 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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well now is only speculation only ...
as long as i know that wimax oso dont have much company that offer end to end solutions ... to name a few siemens, alcatel ... & sad to say that alcatel one cannot work wz siemens one ... so if u r thinking of a mobile wimax then it will b out of the question for the time bieng .... oso intel havent come out wz a 16e wimax adaptor yet ... cos 4 sure the batt of the laptop will drain like our petrol oso remember that u can forget bout mobility .... as in which comp will bungkus 1st juz have to wait & see since maintaining a wireless infra is hard work & hard RM .... |
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Mar 19 2007, 08:21 AM
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Junior Member
50 posts Joined: Nov 2006
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i think WiMax will ,maybe, fail to prevail as people still obsessed with the Nutz
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Mar 19 2007, 09:22 AM
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Junior Member
242 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(ddddashhhh @ Mar 19 2007, 08:21 AM) i think WiMax will ,maybe, fail to prevail as people still obsessed with the Nutz Are you nutz? |
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Mar 19 2007, 09:30 AM
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Senior Member
5,369 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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just make it simple, previously digi did not get but maxis and telekom got for the favour of 3G, now WIMAX..wut they do..favour the little kids which i doubt can change the telco perspective... so..
what is the problem..? MCMC <--- this i doubt is a good commisioner...or more to be a crooked one sitting in that doesnt have the vision for malaysia telco sector. |
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Mar 19 2007, 11:27 AM
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Junior Member
20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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Are we enduser being dup with the publicity hype.
news report coverage up to 70 km, but supplier spec. state 5 km for rural areas? news report capacity up to 70 Mbps but supplier spec. state 3M dl/ 1M ul? news report wimax is mobile but supplier spec. state. is optional? news report wimax is open system but supplier state. no due to proprietary network features? score public 0 - tmnut 1 |
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Mar 19 2007, 12:08 PM
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Junior Member
50 posts Joined: Nov 2006
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QUOTE(lee_sing @ Mar 19 2007, 09:22 AM) Are you nutz? nope im not nutz. LOL!! and will never gonna use Nutz service anymore. now just using deconnexion wifi. so are u?? This post has been edited by ddddashhhh: Mar 19 2007, 12:10 PM |
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Mar 19 2007, 12:26 PM
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Junior Member
401 posts Joined: Nov 2004
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dont blame everything on MCMC...whatever they do must allign with gov (or ministries?) policy...
What will be good is if the 3 company in Peninsular combine fund and make it interoperable...but i doubt that... |
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Mar 19 2007, 01:25 PM
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Senior Member
6,904 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(theedge @ Mar 19 2007, 11:27 AM) Are we enduser being dup with the publicity hype. well news report coverage up to 70 km, but supplier spec. state 5 km for rural areas? 1. news report capacity up to 70 Mbps but supplier spec. state 3M dl/ 1M ul? 2. news report wimax is mobile but supplier spec. state. is optional? 3. news report wimax is open system but supplier state. no due to proprietary network features? score public 0 - tmnut 1 1. yup cos the backhaul will cost them a bomb ... so no big pipe 2. long way to go mobile since they wont be any interoperating (look at 3G now) 3. No wimax do not use an open system yet ... all r using either siemens, alcatel etc ... |
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Mar 19 2007, 02:48 PM
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Junior Member
50 posts Joined: Nov 2006
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ya, tats y im not eager about the WiMAx thing, maybe after few years of operations when everything is stable...well, who knows by then, another great thing will be discovered...LOL. Looking at the situation now, we don even have a decent Broadband and WiMax come to the picture.....just imagining...LOL
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Mar 19 2007, 04:57 PM
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Junior Member
258 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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All this new crap and new broadband talk is useless. If our BT traffic is shaped like 5kbps, do you think owning a 100mbps connection would mean anything?
My friend work in Green Packet now, all their backbone still on TM. Infact everything is TM now since their bought over TIME.Net. So, dream on guys. You all gonna get this all these new tech for browsing net and checking mails only. |
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Mar 19 2007, 05:01 PM
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Senior Member
692 posts Joined: Dec 2004 From: Johor Bahru
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Less downtime, speed constantly will be good then. The more important thing is price.
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Mar 19 2007, 05:17 PM
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Junior Member
221 posts Joined: Nov 2005
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still kenot jump for joy yet since the service not yet available.. but abit fortunate that none of the big company win the tender as this will "slightly" break their monopoly and open up the competition.
70mbps? nah, i dont ask that much.. 5 - 10mbps minus the traffic shaping would be enough... nway, by end of this year.. i'm sure we have a new tech support to yell/curse on.. hehe |
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Mar 19 2007, 10:23 PM
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Senior Member
6,904 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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hope for the best ....
all the back bone including Metro E & international link will still be control by u know who |
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Mar 19 2007, 10:31 PM
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Junior Member
473 posts Joined: Jul 2006
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QUOTE(yeehs18 @ Mar 19 2007, 04:57 PM) All this new crap and new broadband talk is useless. If our BT traffic is shaped like 5kbps, do you think owning a 100mbps connection would mean anything? eh?? TM bought over TIME.net?? Is that true??? I thought TM/Celcom bought over Time Cellular (don't know to spell,sorry) , the previous company that owns 017. Last I saw in the newspaper was TM have plans to buy TIME.net but was it successfully??My friend work in Green Packet now, all their backbone still on TM. Infact everything is TM now since their bought over TIME.Net. So, dream on guys. You all gonna get this all these new tech for browsing net and checking mails only. |
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Mar 20 2007, 02:48 AM
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Senior Member
736 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Kota Damansara / Sunway
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Hopefully the speed will be much better compared to Screamyx. I want 8mBit.
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Mar 20 2007, 03:02 AM
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Senior Member
774 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Prontera's Inn
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800kbps got, 8mbit in ur dream only lol
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Mar 20 2007, 03:12 AM
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Senior Member
1,022 posts Joined: Jul 2005 From: Neverland
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Not in this generation we or our kids will enjoy high speed internet more than 2M in malaysia. tats for sure. stamped n chopped. Stop wasting ur times guys
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Mar 20 2007, 10:56 AM
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Senior Member
796 posts Joined: Nov 2004 From: kuala lumpur
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my fren i spore told me that
whole of spore island has wifi..cz using wimax protocol those with a/b/g stil can use but onli at lower speeds.. how wants wimax have to pay..but its quite cheap over there lo |
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Mar 20 2007, 12:12 PM
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Senior Member
1,704 posts Joined: Jan 2007 From: sarawak
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QUOTE(rockstar teddy @ Mar 20 2007, 10:56 AM) my fren i spore told me that in Singapore National Library they have FREE wifi ah!whole of spore island has wifi..cz using wimax protocol those with a/b/g stil can use but onli at lower speeds.. how wants wimax have to pay..but its quite cheap over there lo |
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Mar 20 2007, 12:35 PM
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Senior Member
736 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: Kota Damansara / Sunway
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QUOTE(jong52yuara @ Mar 20 2007, 12:12 PM) in Singapore National Library they have FREE wifi ah! LOL, we have free WiFi @ Starbucks !! I wonder how many broadcasting towers they need in Singapore for nationwide coverage. Their cable/ADSL broadband is so fast already, somemore got WiMAX now ? Jealous siot.  |
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Mar 20 2007, 03:10 PM
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Elite
1,428 posts Joined: Oct 2004
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QUOTE(jong52yuara @ Mar 20 2007, 12:12 PM) in Singapore National Library they have FREE wifi ah! Not just at the library, in most highly-trafficed public areas.http://www.ida.gov.sg/Programmes/20061027174147.aspx 900 hotspots when the programme started at the end of 2006, planning on 5000 by the end of next year. But yes, we do have free wifi at Starbucks. And it does seem like there are 5000 Starbucks in KL. |
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Mar 20 2007, 03:11 PM
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Junior Member
10 posts Joined: Mar 2007
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where to subscribe wimax in malaysia ar? have anybody here used wimax already?
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Mar 20 2007, 03:41 PM
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Junior Member
50 posts Joined: Nov 2006
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bE PATIENT, when the time come, those WimaX ISP will tell u even u don wanna hear
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Mar 20 2007, 06:42 PM
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Senior Member
6,904 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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singapore is only a dot in the world map 692.7 sq km as 4 us is 329,750 sq km ... so no need so many BTS lor ... as for us in Malaysia ... wait & see 4 sure backbone & international link will b shared like today .... speed well they will put ratio on the radio vs user ... so for sure gonna b best effort
This post has been edited by cruzzmz: Mar 20 2007, 06:48 PM |
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Mar 20 2007, 10:06 PM
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Senior Member
752 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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QUOTE(IntegraTypeR @ Mar 20 2007, 12:35 PM) LOL, we have free WiFi @ Starbucks !! Coffee Beans also offer free wifi. Your dumb neighbour also provides free wifi. Alot free wifi in Malaysia already. So, if these companies wanna charge for Wimax - ppl will think twice to subscribe. Unless those ppl don't have wired broadband at all or think wireless broadband such as Wimax is far superior than wired one. Or for those that not static at all - love to roam everyday as if they don't have a home to live. I wonder how many broadcasting towers they need in Singapore for nationwide coverage. Their cable/ADSL broadband is so fast already, somemore got WiMAX now ? Jealous siot. So, these 4 companies have tough job to convince consumers to subscribe. They have even more headache If wired broadband providers such as tmnet and penangfon slash their price or provide higher speed for the same price. Those with solid financial backings and stamina will survive - if not then ready to sell the license to the Big 3 or sell to foreign operators which may irk the gomen. Good money selling license.. |
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Mar 21 2007, 09:38 AM
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Senior Member
796 posts Joined: Nov 2004 From: kuala lumpur
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they give free up to certain speeds..but wen u wan2use Wimax full speeds den you have to pay ma..
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Mar 21 2007, 09:53 AM
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Junior Member
9 posts Joined: Mar 2006
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PLs, when is Wifi at Starbucks ever free? It costs you a cuppa unless you are freeloading using some Wifi extender
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Mar 21 2007, 09:59 AM
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Senior Member
1,485 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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QUOTE(ManoWar @ Mar 20 2007, 03:11 PM) where to subscribe wimax in malaysia ar? have anybody here used wimax already? yeah, already have this service  try to visit here for more info http://www.airzed.com/wimax/wm_plans.aspx but too expensive RM188 per month  |
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Mar 21 2007, 10:59 AM
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Junior Member
109 posts Joined: Apr 2006
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get in down the price, get the license want to kill all malaysian. want profit, no good...
the price should be RM60. This post has been edited by chooncc: Mar 21 2007, 11:00 AM |
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Mar 21 2007, 11:00 AM
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Senior Member
796 posts Joined: Nov 2004 From: kuala lumpur
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haih..so much debate but no news yet..wat2do..poor us consumer..
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Mar 21 2007, 11:45 AM
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Senior Member
1,485 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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QUOTE(chooncc @ Mar 21 2007, 10:59 AM) get in down the price, get the license want to kill all malaysian. want profit, no good... unlikely, if the price is RM60, then tm's streamyx is going to............. the price should be RM60.  |
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Mar 21 2007, 01:19 PM
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Newbie
2 posts Joined: May 2006
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QUOTE(killerdawg @ Mar 21 2007, 09:53 AM) PLs, when is Wifi at Starbucks ever free? It costs you a cuppa unless you are freeloading using some Wifi extender this not true wimax, my company use it... airzed using antenna and install into your premis... their transmitter at menara meraih ss19 pj..... true wimax using wifi card a/b/g....looooo...! p/s: airzed control bandwith using packeteer packetshaper.....p2p very damme slow...! |
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Mar 21 2007, 01:46 PM
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Junior Member
133 posts Joined: Sep 2006
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QUOTE(asiatrader98 @ Mar 21 2007, 11:45 AM) unlikely, if the price is RM60, then tm's streamyx is going to............. but...that's what WE ALL wants right??? (hope no tmnut agents are viewing this) This post has been edited by stan16: Mar 21 2007, 01:46 PM |
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Mar 21 2007, 03:12 PM
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Senior Member
1,485 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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QUOTE(stan16 @ Mar 21 2007, 01:46 PM) but... that's what WE ALL wants right??? (hope no tmnut agents are viewing this)  another wimax company http://www.packet-1.com/technology/products.htm |
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Mar 21 2007, 03:16 PM
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Senior Member
2,466 posts Joined: Nov 2004
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Mar 21 2007, 03:17 PM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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QUOTE(emkay_sun @ Mar 21 2007, 01:19 PM) this not true wimax, my company use it... airzed using antenna and install into your premis... their transmitter at menara meraih ss19 pj..... true wimax using wifi card a/b/g....looooo...! True wimax is not compatible with WiFi, dont give out wrong msgp/s: airzed control bandwith using packeteer packetshaper.....p2p very damme slow...! |
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Mar 21 2007, 03:25 PM
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Junior Member
48 posts Joined: Dec 2004
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QUOTE(aneip @ Mar 21 2007, 03:16 PM) Hmm a bring back to earth article written by internet Father of Malaysia. Quite intrested on JARING's to bounce back with WiMAX together with SOMA? ( http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=117293 ).BTW, I include the article for the reading below : Towards WiMax At last the government finally announced the "winners" of the so called WiMax spectrum tender on 16 Mar 2007. Three companies are given 30 MHz each of the 2.3 GHz spectrum. The other one is given with only 25 MHz to operate in Sabah and Sarawak as the spectrum is limited to 100 MHz only. There are not enough channels for four operators to operate at the same place without radio signal interferences. The four now join the other companies who have been allocated 2.5 GHz spectrum which can also be used for WiMax. For 2.5 GHz spectrum, the total available frequency is 184 MHz which enables six operators to be allocated with 30 MHz each. With this latest development, we may eventually have ten (10) WiMax operators in Malaysia. There will be plenty of choices for customers. This reminds me of the old mobile days when there were about ten mobile phone companies trying to start the service and get their market shares. At the end of the day only three survived. Are we going to see similar situation with WiMax operators? It may or may not happen. Only time will tell. Any radio signal, including WiMax is subject to the same law of physics. It will get absorbed by water (in leaves of trees) and walls. It will be reflected by certain surfaces such as concrete wall. It suffers energy loss as it passes through the air or reflected by some objects in its path - lowering capacity with distance. There are so many factors to consider, which will affect the overall performance. Every geographic locality will be different. Hence, radio frequency analysis has to be made at every location. The advantage of WiMax compared to WiFi is that it can transmit higher power signal (due to licence spectrum) and can reach longer distance. As the distance increases, the required number of BTS will be reduced (for the same size of coverage area) and the cost of providing backhaul bandwidth gets lower. However, there is always a trade off between capacity and coverage. Till these days, hype on WiMax is never ending. I still see media reports promising 50 Mbps bandwidth for up to 70 km radius of coverage. Such performance may be possible only if there is only one user using a WiMax base station which is going to be a very expensive proposition! WiMax cannot solve all broadband problems. There are limits of what it can do. If we can get to share 20 Mbps within up to two km radius, we should be ecstatic. With such performance, to provide 20% of coverage for the whole of Malaysia (with a total land area of 330,000 sq km) it would require at least 5,000 base transmission stations (BTS). If a BTS only manages to provide good coverage within one km radius, the figure would increase to a staggering 20,000 BTS. Assuming 10,000 BTS are required and each one would cost RM 250,000, the total investment would be RM 2.5 bil (excluding the end-user devices and civil works)! With a possibility of 2 mil subscribers, the cost per subscriber would be RM 1,250. But the margin of error in the number of BTS could be as high as 100%. [Note: The above figures are for illustration only.]. Does this make sense? I leave it to the readers to ponder. Is there any certified WiMax product today? There are actually two types of WiMax. For fixed broadband (based on IEEE 802.16d-2004 standard) and for mobile broadband (based on IEEE 802.16e-2005 standard). So far only 12 manufactures with 28 fixed WiMax products have been certified by WiMax Forum. All of them are using 3.5 GHz spectrum. According to WiMax Forum, the mobile WiMax products are expected to get certification by mid-2007. Hence, no one has any certified mobile WiMax products today although some people claim to have pre-WiMax or Wi-Max-ready products. Whatever it is, WiMax interoperability tests are still on-going. I understand that some products have successfully been tested. As for JARING, we do have 2.5 GHz spectrum which is currently being used for our wireless broadband services (JARING Flite Wireless) in Klang Valley. We believe it is the biggest such live service in Malaysia today. This system will be upgraded to mobile WiMax as soon as the product is certified. It will then be expanded and can be rolled out anywhere in the country. We look forward to serve the real WiMax to our subscribers. ---mal Dr Mohamed b. Awang Lah (mal@jaring.my) Chief Executive Officer JARING Communications Sdn Bhd 19 March 2007 |
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Mar 21 2007, 03:51 PM
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Senior Member
783 posts Joined: Apr 2005
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Damn ! Twist story here and there. Theoriticaly and Reality crap. Hate it. So what RM2.5 billion to cover entire country, go ahead. Last time goverment talk about 2 line railway from KL to Ipoh that cost RM 13 billion. Which one cheaper ? 2 line railway or WIMAX ? ITs internet more important or 2 line Railway important ? Crap..
Internet can push business to max but Ipoh-KL Double Railway only can be used to save time from KL-Ipoh by train. And how many got car to go by them self ? Do people from Sabah or Sarawak benifits from that RM 13 billion project ? Only Central citizen will used this train & again who didnt have their own transport. Crap again.. Sorry guys being emotional, the figures doesnt make sense. Added on March 21, 2007, 3:56 pm QUOTE(hanky93 @ Mar 21 2007, 03:25 PM) Hmm a bring back to earth article written by internet Father of Malaysia. Quite intrested on JARING's to bounce back with WiMAX together with SOMA? ( http://www.lightreading.com/document.asp?doc_id=117293 ). Crap ...crap...crap... BTW, I include the article for the reading below : Towards WiMax Till these days, hype on WiMax is never ending. I still see media reports promising 50 Mbps bandwidth for up to 70 km radius of coverage. Such performance may be possible only if there is only one user using a WiMax base station which is going to be a very expensive proposition! WiMax cannot solve all broadband problems. There are limits of what it can do. If we can get to share 20 Mbps within up to two km radius, we should be ecstatic. With such performance, to provide 20% of coverage for the whole of Malaysia (with a total land area of 330,000 sq km) it would require at least 5,000 base transmission stations (BTS). If a BTS only manages to provide good coverage within one km radius, the figure would increase to a staggering 20,000 BTS. Assuming 10,000 BTS are required and each one would cost RM 250,000, the total investment would be RM 2.5 bil (excluding the end-user devices and civil works)! With a possibility of 2 mil subscribers, the cost per subscriber would be RM 1,250. But the margin of error in the number of BTS could be as high as 100%. [Note: The above figures are for illustration only.]. Does this make sense? I leave it to the readers to ponder. ---mal Dr Mohamed b. Awang Lah (mal@jaring.my) Chief Executive Officer JARING Communications Sdn Bhd 19 March 2007 This post has been edited by NaGeNaZ: Mar 21 2007, 03:56 PM |
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Mar 21 2007, 04:09 PM
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Junior Member
48 posts Joined: Dec 2004
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Well to be fair on him he did cite that it was illustrated figures only. But I think he just want to make a point there that WIMAX is not a fairy tale technology to solve our broadband problem.
Anyway, as he involving with this ISP business longer than anyone here I pressume, his credibility on writing that article still holds for me. QUOTE(NaGeNaZ @ Mar 21 2007, 03:51 PM) Damn ! Twist story here and there. Theoriticaly and Reality crap. Hate it. So what RM2.5 billion to cover entire country, go ahead. Last time goverment talk about 2 line railway from KL to Ipoh that cost RM 13 billion. Which one cheaper ? 2 line railway or WIMAX ? ITs internet more important or 2 line Railway important ? Crap.. Internet can push business to max but Ipoh-KL Double Railway only can be used to save time from KL-Ipoh by train. And how many got car to go by them self ? Do people from Sabah or Sarawak benifits from that RM 13 billion project ? Only Central citizen will used this train & again who didnt have their own transport. Crap again.. Sorry guys being emotional, the figures doesnt make sense. Added on March 21, 2007, 3:56 pm Crap ...crap...crap... |
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Mar 21 2007, 05:31 PM
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Senior Member
6,381 posts Joined: Jun 2005 From: meow meow
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I'm still doubting whether these things...will be successful, or just another bluff talk
 ..with only certain areas covered |
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Mar 21 2007, 06:36 PM
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Junior Member
149 posts Joined: Jan 2007 From: 天堂
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in the end..we've been fooled by them.....
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Mar 21 2007, 07:46 PM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(NaGeNaZ @ Mar 21 2007, 03:51 PM) Damn ! Twist story here and there. Theoriticaly and Reality crap. Hate it. So what RM2.5 billion to cover entire country, go ahead. Last time goverment talk about 2 line railway from KL to Ipoh that cost RM 13 billion. Which one cheaper ? 2 line railway or WIMAX ? ITs internet more important or 2 line Railway important ? Crap.. I wouldn't go to the extent of saying that MAL's essay was all crap. In fact, he's right to a certain degree, BUT I'd read what he's written with a pinch of salt, considering that Jaring was, after all, one of the 13 bidders who failed to clench the tender. Sour grapes, one may say.Internet can push business to max but Ipoh-KL Double Railway only can be used to save time from KL-Ipoh by train. And how many got car to go by them self ? Do people from Sabah or Sarawak benifits from that RM 13 billion project ? Only Central citizen will used this train & again who didnt have their own transport. Crap again.. Sorry guys being emotional, the figures doesnt make sense. Added on March 21, 2007, 3:56 pm Crap ...crap...crap... |
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Mar 21 2007, 11:14 PM
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Senior Member
6,904 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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we all juz have to wait in where will the 4 comp will piggy ride on ???
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Mar 22 2007, 11:57 AM
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Senior Member
1,485 posts Joined: Dec 2005
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Mar 22 2007, 12:01 PM
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Senior Member
796 posts Joined: Nov 2004 From: kuala lumpur
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suddenly so many???heheh
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Mar 22 2007, 02:38 PM
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Junior Member
20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 21 2007, 07:46 PM) I wouldn't go to the extent of saying that MAL's essay was all crap. In fact, he's right to a certain degree, BUT I'd read what he's written with a pinch of salt, considering that Jaring was, after all, one of the 13 bidders who failed to clench the tender. Sour grapes, one may say. I dare say wat was written have a lot of truth to it, to a certain extent it's Jaring experience with their Soma network. After all it is operation in same spectrum as Wimax. Whether any choose to belief in law's of physics or media hype, I guess is left to the individual. |
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Mar 22 2007, 02:41 PM
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Junior Member
289 posts Joined: Jan 2007
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QUOTE(GameSky @ Mar 21 2007, 05:31 PM) I'm still doubting whether these things...will be successful, or just another bluff talk i m very sure dat tm will lose it possesion over broadband user...good news!! ..with only certain areas covered |
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Mar 22 2007, 05:59 PM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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QUOTE(chokchunynh @ Mar 22 2007, 02:41 PM) i m very sure dat tm will lose it possesion over broadband user...good news!! WiMAX wont solve all issues, at best, the ping will be around 200ms. You won't want to play games with that kind of ping. |
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Mar 22 2007, 06:26 PM
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Junior Member
221 posts Joined: Nov 2005
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wondering wat is the ping reply during the crazy raining season?
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 Mar 22 2007, 11:03 PM
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Junior Member
147 posts Joined: Oct 2006
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QUOTE(bysquashy @ Mar 22 2007, 05:59 PM) WiMAX wont solve all issues, at best, the ping will be around 200ms. You won't want to play games with that kind of ping. where is ur source to gv that comment? u built wimax izit? u so sure would be like tat?damn la...pesimistic...i didnt say its bad...im saying u are full of shit or wat but hope u show abit prove b4 gv some weird claims la....no offence alrite? i knw for the fact is wimax can bring tmnut to their knees to offer better service n cheaper price.ok..lets hope on ppl!!! |
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Mar 23 2007, 10:40 PM
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Senior Member
6,904 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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no need bashing here .... well hope for the best ... juz have to wait another 2-3 yrs for the network to mature ... ehmm have to stick wz the xziting dsl for now
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Mar 23 2007, 10:45 PM
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Senior Member
555 posts Joined: Feb 2006 From: Malaysia, UNITED STATES OF ASIA
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Does anybody knows this Wimax winner, MIB Comm Sdn Bhd website?
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Mar 24 2007, 11:36 PM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(bysquashy @ Mar 22 2007, 05:59 PM) WiMAX wont solve all issues, at best, the ping will be around 200ms. You won't want to play games with that kind of ping. QUOTE(cropika @ Mar 22 2007, 11:03 PM) where is ur source to gv that comment? u built wimax izit? u so sure would be like tat? Well, bysquashy isn't talking crap. Any wireless tech. will always have poorer network latency than copper wire. You can't defy the law of physics. Look at it this way: air < copper < fiber opticdamn la...pesimistic...i didnt say its bad...im saying u are full of shit or wat but hope u show abit prove b4 gv some weird claims la....no offence alrite? ~200ms is, IMO, the average latency for OFDM (i.e. WiMAX) to the next hop (i.e., base station), after considering user traffic and NLOS-ness (Non Line-of-Sight). It can be better than 200ms, but you'd have to be one of the handful number of users camping on the WiMAX base station AND be in LOS to it. Best case scenario should be about 50-100ms. BTW, network latency to the Internet is subject to the number of hops taken to its destination, so that may very well exceed 200ms on average. QUOTE(Muhammad Nur Hanief @ Mar 23 2007, 10:45 PM) Does anybody knows this Wimax winner, MIB Comm Sdn Bhd website? [URL=http://www. packet-1.com]http://www. packet-1.com[/URL](prior to the WiMAX tender, I don't think anyone has ever heard of MIB Comm... ;P) This post has been edited by husagi: Mar 24 2007, 11:50 PM |
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Mar 25 2007, 12:02 AM
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Junior Member
147 posts Joined: Oct 2006
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200ms means bad la...hop alot of comp n lines to reach the intended server u mean? ok ok....but i do think they do their best to keep it low for their gaming customer also rite? i does make sense...
about 30% msia internet user are on9 gamers i presume....i guess only. so wit tat in mind...i think they will bring it down.. so it all backs to basic...do wats needed... ok thx husagi..brighten up my knowledge abit im actually a medical student...dunno much bout techy stuff but i did hardware technical on pc b4... |
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Mar 25 2007, 12:05 AM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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QUOTE(cropika @ Mar 22 2007, 11:03 PM) where is ur source to gv that comment? u built wimax izit? u so sure would be like tat? Guess what, you are partly correct damn la...pesimistic...i didnt say its bad...im saying u are full of shit or wat but hope u show abit prove b4 gv some weird claims la....no offence alrite? i knw for the fact is wimax can bring tmnut to their knees to offer better service n cheaper price.ok..lets hope on ppl!!! QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 24 2007, 11:36 PM) Well, bysquashy isn't talking crap. Any wireless tech. will always have poorer network latency than copper wire. You can't defy the law of physics. Look at it this way: air < copper < fiber optic We tested with the current equipment, 1 AP to 1 CPE indoors, the latency is ~250ms. I'm not saying that technology won't improve, but this is my 1st hand exp.~200ms is, IMO, the average latency for OFDM (i.e. WiMAX) to the next hop (i.e., base station), after considering user traffic and NLOS-ness (Non Line-of-Sight). It can be better than 200ms, but you'd have to be one of the handful number of users camping on the WiMAX base station AND be in LOS to it. Best case scenario should be about 50-100ms. BTW, network latency to the Internet is subject to the number of hops taken to its destination, so that may very well exceed 200ms on average. [URL=http://www. packet-1.com]http://www. packet-1.com[/URL] (prior to the WiMAX tender, I don't think anyone has ever heard of MIB Comm... ;P) This post has been edited by bysquashy: Mar 25 2007, 10:30 AM |
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Mar 25 2007, 12:29 AM
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Junior Member
147 posts Joined: Oct 2006
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but im stil in the blur state...this wimax run in 2.3ghz spectrum with 802.1a/b/g rite? so our normal laptop wit wifi capability could jus detect it n connect la...if i wan to get those extra usb extension antenna thinggy...need to buy la?
since u r wimax technical ppl.... |
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Mar 25 2007, 12:55 AM
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Senior Member
1,253 posts Joined: Jan 2007 From: Columbus, Ohio
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got to improve the backbone first laa. of course the backbone are TM.
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Mar 25 2007, 02:04 AM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE(cropika @ Mar 25 2007, 12:29 AM) but im stil in the blur state...this wimax run in 2.3ghz spectrum with 802.1a/b/g rite? so our normal laptop wit wifi capability could jus detect it n connect la...if i wan to get those extra usb extension antenna thinggy...need to buy la? WiMAX is not WIFI (IEEE802.11a/b/g)since u r wimax technical ppl.... WIFI is not WIMAX For both standards to be inter-operable, you'll need dual-band access device. If you want dual-band devices, you wait la. I think the cows will come home first. Once you have dual-band devices, then you can think about making your own home-made dual antenna systems. |
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Mar 25 2007, 10:33 AM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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QUOTE(cropika @ Mar 25 2007, 12:29 AM) but im stil in the blur state...this wimax run in 2.3ghz spectrum with 802.1a/b/g rite? so our normal laptop wit wifi capability could jus detect it n connect la...if i wan to get those extra usb extension antenna thinggy...need to buy la? Yeap, you'll need a new CPE. Intel will embed WiMAX in their new system, just like Centrino for WiFi, so we'll just need to wait a bit more. IIRC, WiMAX can run on 2.3Ghz-3.5Ghz, 2.3Ghz is the spectrum offered in Malaysia. Jaring plans to use thier 2.5Ghz spectrum to operate WiMAX. Most spectrum offered in other parts of the world is 2.5GHz.since u r wimax technical ppl.... QUOTE(TheXxBestxX @ Mar 25 2007, 12:55 AM) got to improve the backbone first laa. of course the backbone are TM. True.QUOTE(husagi @ Mar 25 2007, 02:04 AM) WiMAX is not WIFI (IEEE802.11a/b/g) Wah....... that would be redundant WIFI is not WIMAX For both standards to be inter-operable, you'll need dual-band access device. If you want dual-band devices, you wait la. I think the cows will come home first. Once you have dual-band devices, then you can think about making your own home-made dual antenna systems. |
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Mar 25 2007, 11:41 AM
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Junior Member
147 posts Joined: Oct 2006
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so bysquashy, if interband connectivity is possible....then my place i put up tment n make it wifi, i could jus access my own broadband at home thru this wimax network izit? wah then the hopping will me so much greater..like 300-400ms la....ok ok
another question, the CPE u talking bout is the usb thing izit? here can buy ah? u can gv recommend? i saw it on the net but i dunno what izit called...i tot there was 1 which could excess even 3g network n wimax....u got any idea? |
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Mar 25 2007, 08:24 PM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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QUOTE(cropika @ Mar 25 2007, 11:41 AM) so bysquashy, if interband connectivity is possible....then my place i put up tment n make it wifi, i could jus access my own broadband at home thru this wimax network izit? I dont get the bolded part. wah then the hopping will me so much greater..like 300-400ms la....ok ok another question, the CPE u talking bout is the usb thing izit? here can buy ah? u can gv recommend? i saw it on the net but i dunno what izit called...i tot there was 1 which could excess even 3g network n wimax....u got any idea? I think you got something wrong, for WiMAX its like GSM, you don't own the BTSs, you only own the handphone. So in wimax's case, you'll only need to have a CPE or wimax capable laptop. For WiFi, you need AP and the wifi card. The CPE that we tested is PCMCIA for lappys, its spec can support up til 10Mbps. WiMAX technology is still at a infancy age. As we are talking, the RnD is still solving many issues and trying to live up to its name. |
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Mar 27 2007, 03:24 PM
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Junior Member
26 posts Joined: Sep 2004 From: kuala lumpur
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when it work???
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Mar 27 2007, 05:19 PM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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QUOTE(dicksonmak @ Mar 27 2007, 03:24 PM) when it work??? I'm assuming you are asking when will it be ready for the market? I would say sometime around Q4 2007 or Q1 2008 |
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Mar 28 2007, 07:18 AM
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Senior Member
1,185 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: KKinabalu
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QUOTE(hanky93 @ Mar 21 2007, 03:25 PM) Towards WiMax --- 8< --- snip --- 8< --- Till these days, hype on WiMax is never ending. I still see media reports promising 50 Mbps bandwidth for up to 70 km radius of coverage. Such performance may be possible only if there is only one user using a WiMax base station which is going to be a very expensive proposition! WiMax cannot solve all broadband problems. There are limits of what it can do. If we can get to share 20 Mbps within up to two km radius, we should be ecstatic. With such performance, to provide 20% of coverage for the whole of Malaysia (with a total land area of 330,000 sq km) it would require at least 5,000 base transmission stations (BTS). If a BTS only manages to provide good coverage within one km radius, the figure would increase to a staggering 20,000 BTS. Assuming 10,000 BTS are required and each one would cost RM 250,000, the total investment would be RM 2.5 bil (excluding the end-user devices and civil works)! With a possibility of 2 mil subscribers, the cost per subscriber would be RM 1,250. But the margin of error in the number of BTS could be as high as 100%. [Note: The above figures are for illustration only.]. Does this make sense? I leave it to the readers to ponder. --- 8< --- snip --- 8< --- Dr Mohamed b. Awang Lah (mal@jaring.my) Chief Executive Officer JARING Communications Sdn Bhd 19 March 2007 RM1250 ??? Im pondering... 10,000 BTS cost RM 250,000 per station Total investment = 10,000 x rm250,000 = RM2,500,000,000 (ie RM 2.5bil) Total possible subscriber = 2,000,000 (ie 2 mil) Cost per subscriber = RM2.5 bil / 2 mil = RM1250/- I would say the above is FLAWED CALCULATION as it ASSUME ONE TIME SUBSCRIPTION PAYMENT. But subscribers pay every month. And according to the "flawed" calculation, if the total investment can be paid back in one month period... ITS A DAMN GOOD BUSINESS as the service providers receive RM2.5 billion monthly (excluding other costs)... This post has been edited by Banzai_san: Mar 28 2007, 07:30 AM |
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Mar 28 2007, 09:28 AM
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Junior Member
401 posts Joined: Nov 2004
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err...i think he means to make we ponder how much to make the subscription cost and when ROI can be achieved based on that monthly subs fee..if RM50/month...ROI would be 25 months...would any company wanna sustain that long?
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Mar 28 2007, 10:19 AM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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QUOTE(Banzai_san @ Mar 28 2007, 07:18 AM) RM1250 ??? RM250K for a base station would be naive, there are a lot more cost into it. Such as upgrading the current backbone, integrating with it, etc etcIm pondering... 10,000 BTS cost RM 250,000 per station Total investment = 10,000 x rm250,000 = RM2,500,000,000 (ie RM 2.5bil) Total possible subscriber = 2,000,000 (ie 2 mil) Cost per subscriber = RM2.5 bil / 2 mil = RM1250/- I would say the above is FLAWED CALCULATION as it ASSUME ONE TIME SUBSCRIPTION PAYMENT. But subscribers pay every month. And according to the "flawed" calculation, if the total investment can be paid back in one month period... ITS A DAMN GOOD BUSINESS as the service providers receive RM2.5 billion monthly (excluding other costs)... Added on March 28, 2007, 10:20 amI have an interesting news to share QUOTE Fitch: WiMAX will be 'moderately disruptive' for telecoms mart Source ~ Business Times News is updated by Corporate Resource Library Mac 26, FITCH Ratings last week said the emergence of WiMAX services in Malaysia would be "moderately disruptive" for the telecommunications market over the longer term.Malaysia recently awarded the much sought after WiMAX spectrum to four small bidders, sidelining bids from three large telcos, namely Telekom Malaysia ™, Maxis Communications and DiGi. Fitch said while Maxis should remain relatively unaffected there would be implications for TM's fixed broadband operations as well as for DiGi's longer term competitive position in mobile communication.The four successful applicants were Bizsurf (M) Sdn Bhd, MIB Comm Sdn Bhd, Asiaspace Dotcom Sdn Bhd and Redtone CNX Broadband Sdn Bhd, with the first three each awarded 30MHz in the 2.3GHz band for provision of services in Peninsular Malaysia, while Redtone was allocated 25MHz in the same band for Sabah and Sarawak. The licence allocations are tied to stringent rollout requirements, which call for a service provision of at least 1Mbps and 40 per cent population coverage by 2009, at an estimated capital expenditure of about RM300 million for each operator over the next three years.Fitch said although WiMAX, the trade name for a group of wireless standards that encompasses both fixed-wireless and portable/mobile deployments, is still largely an unproven technology, it could prove moderately disruptive to telecom markets over the longer term. "By eliminating the need for copper or fibre last-mile installation, WiMAX offers a lower-cost replacement option for traditional broadband solutions such as digital subscriber lines (DSL) and cables."Additionally, the mobile version of WiMAX is expected to support voice and data access at high vehicular speeds," said Priya Gupta, director, corporates. This post has been edited by bysquashy: Mar 28 2007, 10:20 AM |
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Mar 28 2007, 12:27 PM
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Senior Member
1,185 posts Joined: Mar 2006 From: KKinabalu
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QUOTE(pharez @ Mar 28 2007, 09:28 AM) err...i think he means to make we ponder how much to make the subscription cost and when ROI can be achieved based on that monthly subs fee..if RM50/month...ROI would be 25 months...would any company wanna sustain that long? yup, I know that he wants us to ponder (I did quote his particular line with bold letterings)... but to even suggest or implying subscription rates be in the vicinity of that RM1250, to me, is simply ridiculous. However I do respect his other views. This post has been edited by Banzai_san: Mar 28 2007, 12:28 PM |
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Mar 28 2007, 02:55 PM
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Junior Member
147 posts Joined: Oct 2006
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true la banzai...i realize that his calculation doesnt seems realistic if v to pay rm1250 monthly...the jus say suggestion but stil he's abit OVER bout it..
he stil has the wireless broadband rite..so dun la intimidate ppl bout the high cost of wimax rite? my2 cents but he is funnyly weird showing abit of sore loser face..kaka no offence |
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Mar 28 2007, 03:24 PM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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Impleamentation of WiMAX will be a bit hard due to technical difficulties because I think its only Malaysia using the 2.3Ghz band.
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Apr 13 2007, 10:36 PM
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Elite
1,235 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: kuala lipis
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2.3 ghz band because it is the most popular. the fact is that there are many spectrun reserved for wimax, the one awarded to these smaller companies is the 2.3 ghz spectrum. most telcos in malaysia have spectrum in the range of 2.5, 3.5, 5.x and 10.x already assigned to them all the way back to circa 2000/01 that can be used for wimax so they don't really need the 2.3 ghz.
why they participated in the tender i don't know. a political stunt perhaps? the telcos are already testing wimax in certain areas using equipment designed for 2.5 and 3.5 ghz spectrums so no biggie to them. |
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Apr 16 2007, 11:48 AM
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Junior Member
20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(ihsan @ Apr 13 2007, 10:36 PM) 2.3 ghz band because it is the most popular. the fact is that there are many spectrun reserved for wimax, the one awarded to these smaller companies is the 2.3 ghz spectrum. most telcos in malaysia have spectrum in the range of 2.5, 3.5, 5.x and 10.x already assigned to them all the way back to circa 2000/01 that can be used for wimax so they don't really need the 2.3 ghz. good for their share price only.Wimax a long long way to go. |
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Apr 16 2007, 12:53 PM
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Junior Member
401 posts Joined: Nov 2004
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QUOTE(Banzai_san @ Mar 28 2007, 12:27 PM) yup, I know that he wants us to ponder (I did quote his particular line with bold letterings)... but to even suggest or implying subscription rates be in the vicinity of that RM1250, to me, is simply ridiculous. i think u have misunderstood 'subscription rates' with his 'cost per subscriber'...However I do respect his other views. |
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Apr 16 2007, 03:44 PM
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Junior Member
20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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Interesting, to get the 4 Wimax 2.3Ghz licensee to build a single network. A recepi for non starter.
Then why bother issuing 4 spectrum block then? I guess CMC haven't thought thing through b4 carrying them out. KTAK inc probably rollout wimax and then lease the network to the 4 licensee. At least thing would happen |
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Apr 16 2007, 10:10 PM
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Junior Member
178 posts Joined: Apr 2007 From: Sarawak
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Remember the recent announcement that WiMax services will be available in Msia b4 the end of the year?
Has anyone heard when the service will be launched in Sarawak? Or anywhere else for that matter. So far it seems so silent. |
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Apr 16 2007, 10:28 PM
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Senior Member
898 posts Joined: Jan 2003 From: ph/sbj/slgr
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redtone-cnx will be coverin sabah and sarawak
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Apr 19 2007, 12:18 AM
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Junior Member
190 posts Joined: Aug 2006 From: KL
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I heard ppl said tat they r using WiMax...1mghz rm128/month...
any1 heard bout this b4? |
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Apr 19 2007, 09:29 AM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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I know there is one operator providing Pre-WiMAX even before the license spectrum is tendered.
This post has been edited by bysquashy: Apr 19 2007, 09:30 AM |
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Apr 20 2007, 12:31 AM
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Newbie
45 posts Joined: Mar 2007
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QUOTE(bysquashy @ Apr 19 2007, 09:29 AM) I know there is one operator providing Pre-WiMAX even before the license spectrum is tendered. Everyone also claim they have the technology but nothing been shown... |
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Apr 24 2007, 09:47 PM
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Junior Member
20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(The Star) We will offer high-speed broadband of up to 100mbps (megabits per second) for consumers and corporate Internet service of up to 155mbps for corporate customers, and small and medium enterprises over a wider geographical area by combining both REDtone and eB Tech's base stations and network capabilities," he said Fact or Fiction Wimax at 100mbps |
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Apr 24 2007, 10:18 PM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Would be nice if you had posted the URL too. Anyway, here it is... the URL:
"REDtone, eB Tech to expand broadband" http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?f...40&sec=business |
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Apr 25 2007, 02:37 AM
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Senior Member
4,474 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Wow... 100 mbps wireless wimax broadband ? If that is half true kudos to them.
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Apr 25 2007, 11:47 AM
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Senior Member
524 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Uh... 100Mbps or 155Mbps is subject to eB not losing their 2.5GHz and 3.5GHz spectrum. Our dear regulator is "re-farming" those two spectrum bands. Meaning... they may or may not have those spectrums to operate on. Our Garment will have the last say.
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Apr 25 2007, 03:43 PM
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Senior Member
2,466 posts Joined: Nov 2004
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hmm.. why I felt those number should be 1.0 Mbps and 1.55Mbps.. well just wait n see.
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Apr 25 2007, 03:48 PM
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Senior Member
667 posts Joined: Oct 2006 From: Sarawak
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I thought even the Wimax specifications don't have 100 mbit?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wimax QUOTE A commonly held misconception is that WiMAX will deliver 70 Mbit/s, over 70 miles (112.6 kilometers) when the recipient is moving or mobile. Each of these is true individually, given ideal circumstances, but they are not simultaneously true. In practice this means that in line-of-sight environments you could deliver symmetrical speeds of 10Mbps at 10km but in urban environments it is more likely that 30% of installations may be non-line-of-sight and therefore users may only receive 10Mbps over 2km and if the recipient is on the move the bps rates drop significantly. WiMAX has some similarities to DSL in this respect, where one can either have high bandwidth or long reach, but not both simultaneously. The other feature to consider with WiMAX is that available bandwidth is shared between users in a given radio sector, so if there are many active users in a single sector, each will get reduced bandwidth. However, unlike SDSL where contention is very noticeable at a 5:1 ratio (if you are sharing your connection with a large media firm for example), WiMAX does not have this problem. Typically each cell has a whole 100Mbps backhaul so there is no contention here. In practice, many users will have a range of 2-, 4-, 6-, 8- or 10Mbps services and the bandwidth can be shared. If the network becomes busy the business model is more like GSM or UMTS than DSL. It is easy to predict capacity requirements as you add customers and additional radio cards can be added on the same sector to increase the capacity. |
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Apr 26 2007, 12:27 AM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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QUOTE(Reuben @ Apr 25 2007, 03:48 PM) Even the 70mbps is IMPOSSIBLE to achieve. |
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Apr 26 2007, 01:35 AM
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Senior Member
4,474 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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Uh.... so should we start suing for false advertisement yet o_O; ?
*stare at bysqushy avatar |
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Apr 26 2007, 11:02 PM
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Junior Member
20 posts Joined: Aug 2006
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QUOTE(Moogle Stiltzkin @ Apr 26 2007, 01:35 AM) Uh.... so should we start suing for false advertisement yet o_O; ? This ain't going to be the last one.What worrying, do this spectrum holder know what they are doing? N They are list company on the stock exchange. |
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May 4 2007, 06:39 PM
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Senior Member
667 posts Joined: Oct 2006 From: Sarawak
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QUOTE(bysquashy @ Apr 26 2007, 12:27 AM) Even the 70mbps is IMPOSSIBLE to achieve. Lol too true T_T But 100 mbit is just a silly claim unless they're not using WiMax. |
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May 14 2007, 03:46 PM
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Senior Member
4,474 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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QUOTE Operation WiMAX is underway, and carriers are spending some serious moolah on building out the networks. South Korea launched a WiBro network last year and in the U.S. Sprint and Clearwire are working on mobile WiMAX services, too. It's about time for some attention on the devices themselves, which are starting to get sold in South Korea, and in the U.S., likely some time in 2008. Here's some WiMAX goodies from Nokia, LG, Samsung, ZTE, and ZyXEL that should find their way to the market relatively soon. Source: http://gigaom.com/2007/04/17/wimax-devices-coming-soon/Nokia: Nokia said on Monday that it will sell WiMAX mobile devices in early 2008. The Nokia folks told GigaTeam that the company's Internet tablet line would get a WiMAX version. Nice. My N800 does feel like its missing something. LG: When I was at CTIA I got a chance to check out an LG WiMAX smartphone they were calling DBDM (dual band dual mode), that included 3G, WiMAX and DMB (mobile video broadcast) capabilities. Broadband overload - in a good way. The LG spokesperson at the booth said he thought Sequans was providing the WiMAX chip. The spokesperson also said the device goes on sale for around $700 in Korea "soon", and a similar device could land in the U.S. sometime next year. Samsung: Samsung announced the availability of 3 mobile WiMAX devices last week for the Korean market - a WiBro smartphone, a converged mobile PC device, and a WiBro USB dongle. Sprint has also said that Samsung will develop PC cards with WiMAX and dual EVDO/WiMAX for the U.S. market. ZTE Corporation: Sprint named ZTE as one of its suppliers of WiMAX devices including PC cards - express and USB - as well as modem products. ZyXEL Communications: Sprint also named ZyXEL as a consumer device supplier, and ZyXEL will work on modem products. Not sure when these are coming online, but likely sometime next year. Curious since wimax is coming near end of this year, or by next year. So wondering what kind of hardware we can expect. Hm... is there gonna be such a thing as a Wimax router ? |
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May 14 2007, 04:15 PM
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Senior Member
768 posts Joined: Nov 2004
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more important is the price and mobility of the product? will they have USB version so that we can use in our laptops?
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May 14 2007, 11:20 PM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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From what I tested, I've seen PCMCIA WiMAX card. Haven't seen usb though
This post has been edited by bysquashy: May 15 2007, 01:10 PM |
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May 15 2007, 12:17 AM
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Senior Member
9,707 posts Joined: Feb 2005 From: Why U wana know? Status: Meditating™
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for non laptop user, probably a USB plug will do....
any idea? |
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May 15 2007, 01:10 PM
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Senior Member
2,884 posts Joined: Sep 2006 From: Mummy
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May be it will be something like Maxis's wireless broadband modem.
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Oct 25 2009, 09:56 PM
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Senior Member
3,520 posts Joined: Jan 2003
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is P1 wimax good? o.o
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Oct 25 2009, 09:59 PM
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Junior Member
30 posts Joined: Mar 2009
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Depend on how you use
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