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 Retrenchment or Release from Position by Company, Retrenchment or Release (Protection)

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TShennoiyatsu
post May 5 2016, 02:26 PM, updated 8y ago

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Dear All Forumer,

As a worker for 10 years in varies company and knowing how the retrenchment or release process works. I am here to share a real case senario so that we all can discuss how we can protect ourself if the company does not treat the employee fairly when come to retrenchment. I know there are alot of company that are good and providing fair amount for their employee retrenchment, there again will have some company that treat the employee unfairly.

(I will not disclose the company name and some details but will disclose enough information in the scenario so that we forumer can understand and find a good way to protect yourself when come to such cases.)

Below are the details of what i have been through and what i have done to protect myself:

Number of staff in the department: 1 (i am the only one in the department)

Years of Serving: 3YR

Position: Senior Executive

Salary: >RM3000

Scenario: At 7-Apr-2016, APAC manager approach me and bring up the news on i being release from my position starting on 7-Apr-2016. I was shocked and asked is this an planned processed by the management and what is the reason of my release. The answer from him is "Management have decided to cut down head count and reorganize the organization structure. And also because there are not much job/project to handle in this region." For this reason i have no choice to accept the facts that really there are not much progress for the company pass 2 years, so i think is ok to accept it. After that i asked "what is the term for my release?" and he say "you will serve a notice of 8 weeks and performing the handover to out source staff." Then i asked him "how about the "compensation" of my release?". He just say "you need to talk to HR department for this". Then by now i only have an verbally informed that i am release and serving 8 weeks notice. For the "Compensation" will need to discuss with HR department.

The next day i meet up with the HR manager who is coming visit from Singapore and discuss with him. Starting point of the conversation i requested that i need to receive a "Letter of Release" and "Final Salary Statement". HR say they will provide in one week time, for this i am unsure and unsecured as the HR does not disclose how the calculation of the my last date and also what i receive as "Compensation". With the sound from my APAC manager and HR, their meaning now you can start to find your new job. I was puzzled which if go for any interview from other company my leave will not deduced? I asked again to HR manager and he say if you go for interview your leave will sure be deduced. One hand HR say they will contrast all Annual Leave i have and then now tell me if i go interview or absent for a day the Annual Leave will deduced. I feel liked being play.

From there i keep pushing HR to give me the letter to sign ASAP and he keep delay it, time passed already 4-May-2016. There are no sign of the official letter yet and also unknown on weather i am getting any "Compensation" or not. I am in a stress and uncertain situation, so i go to Labor office to consult the Labor office officer. Below are the conversation between me and the officer:

Me: officer i need your help, i have been retrenched by my company starting last month 7-Apr-2016. i have not receive any official written letter and only receive the information through verbally. i like to know what i can do to protect myself.

Officer: how much is your salary?

me: >RM3000

Officer: for this you are not covered under the rules (Akta), for this the company can release you from your position anytime. This is their rights even the reason seem not acceptable.

me: even they say they are cutting head count on me and Hire a manager level foreigner?

Officer: Yes.

me: for this i feel unfair. cos until now there are no information about any "compensation" will be given by the company or not.

Officer: for this you need to refer to your appointment letter that you sign and what it is stated in site the letter. if in the letter there is a statement that say when the company terminate you and you will receive a compensation then you will entitled to. if they are not paying you anything then from there we can file the case and proceed with the process. for now there are not yet any indication or the case is not happen yet so there are little things we can do here. you need to wait until the official letter and also the information is given to you. then from there will need to see what can we do.

Officer: with current information we still not able to get a strong case against your company. so if you still feel that the company treat you unfairly you will need to wait for all documents or official letter given and received, then you can come back here or go direct to Industrial Relation department to do the filing of case on "Unfair Treatment" by the company.

me: many thanks i understand now

up to today 5-May-2016, i am still waiting for the official letter and feel uncertain about my situation.

From Here anyone know how to moved on from here? cos really not much can be done from my side but "Waiting"

hope to hear some info from your forumer.

Lets share............
pangch
post May 5 2016, 02:44 PM

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just wait for the official letter and see what they compensate you ....
Vervain
post May 5 2016, 02:52 PM

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Yup. Verbal is not a formal confirmation. What the officer said is right. I've checked and there's a pay scale grade below which are protected by the akta pekerja. For you case, your salary has exceed. Company is not bounded to give extra based on the number of years you've served them.

My advise, continue to work but find work at the same time. when the official letter comes, make sure the date of termination is the date you receive or covers till the day you should serve and they have to pay accordingly, pro-rated or etc. Just kira everything lah.
TShennoiyatsu
post May 5 2016, 05:49 PM

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QUOTE(Vervain @ May 5 2016, 02:52 PM)
Yup. Verbal is not a formal confirmation. What the officer said is right. I've checked and there's a pay scale grade below which are protected by the akta pekerja. For you case, your salary has exceed. Company is not bounded to give extra based on the number of years you've served them.

My advise, continue to work but find work at the same time. when the official letter comes, make sure the date of termination is the date you receive or covers till the day you should serve and they have to pay accordingly, pro-rated or etc. Just kira everything lah.
*
Thanks for the info ^^ will see when the HR give me the information.
RicheHo
post May 5 2016, 06:24 PM

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Hey guys, just to share with you on my experience.

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Since I started to use the new resume, I get more opportunities for interview invitation. Maybe you guys can have a look at the page.

kslian
post May 5 2016, 06:58 PM

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QUOTE(hennoiyatsu @ May 5 2016, 02:26 PM)
Dear All Forumer,

As a worker for 10 years in varies company and knowing how the retrenchment or release process works. I am here to share a real case senario so that we all can discuss how we can protect ourself if the company does not treat the employee fairly when come to retrenchment. I know there are alot of company that are good and providing fair amount for their employee retrenchment, there again will have some company that treat the employee unfairly.

(I will not disclose the company name and some details but will disclose enough information in the scenario so that we forumer can understand and find a good way to protect yourself when come to such cases.)

Below are the details of what i have been through and what i have done to protect myself:

Number of staff in the department: 1 (i am the only one in the department)

Years of Serving: 3YR

Position: Senior Executive

Salary: >RM3000

Scenario: At 7-Apr-2016, APAC manager approach me and bring up the news on i being release from my position starting on 7-Apr-2016. I was shocked and asked is this an planned processed by the management and what is the reason of my release. The answer from him is "Management have decided to cut down head count and reorganize the organization structure. And also because there are not much job/project to handle in this region." For this reason i have no choice to accept the facts that really there are not much progress for the company pass 2 years, so i think is ok to accept it. After that i asked "what is the term for my release?" and he say "you will serve a notice of 8 weeks and performing the handover to out source staff." Then i asked him "how about the "compensation" of my release?". He just say "you need to talk to HR department for this". Then by now i only have an verbally informed that i am release and serving 8 weeks notice. For the "Compensation" will need to discuss with HR department.

The next day i meet up with the HR manager who is coming visit from Singapore and discuss with him. Starting point of the conversation i requested that i need to receive a "Letter of Release" and "Final Salary Statement". HR say they will provide in one week time, for this i am unsure and unsecured as the HR does not disclose how the calculation of the my last date and also what i receive as "Compensation". With the sound from my APAC manager and HR, their meaning now you can start to find your new job. I was puzzled which if go for any interview from other company my leave will not deduced? I asked again to HR manager and he say if you go for interview your leave will sure be deduced. One hand HR say they will contrast all Annual Leave i have and then now tell me if i go interview or absent for a day the Annual Leave will deduced. I feel liked being play.

From there i keep pushing HR to give me the letter to sign ASAP and he keep delay it, time passed already 4-May-2016. There are no sign of the official letter yet and also unknown on weather i am getting any "Compensation" or not. I am in a stress and uncertain situation, so i go to Labor office to consult the Labor office officer. Below are the conversation between me and the officer:

Me: officer i need your help, i have been retrenched by my company starting last month 7-Apr-2016. i have not receive any official written letter and only receive the information through verbally. i like to know what i can do to protect myself.

Officer: how much is your salary?

me: >RM3000

Officer: for this you are not covered under the rules (Akta), for this the company can release you from your position anytime. This is their rights even the reason seem not acceptable.

me: even they say they are cutting head count on me and Hire a manager level foreigner?

Officer: Yes.

me: for this i feel unfair. cos until now there are no information about any "compensation" will be given by the company or not.

Officer: for this you need to refer to your appointment letter that you sign and what it is stated in site the letter. if in the letter there is a statement that say when the company terminate you and you will receive a compensation then you will entitled to. if they are not paying you anything then from there we can file the case and proceed with the process. for now there are not yet any indication or the case is not happen yet so there are little things we can do here. you need to wait until the official letter and also the information is given to you. then from there will need to see what can we do.

Officer: with current information we still not able to get a strong case against your company. so if you still feel that the company treat you unfairly you will need to wait for all documents or official letter given and received, then you can come back here or go direct to Industrial Relation department to do the filing of case on "Unfair Treatment" by the company.

me: many thanks i understand now

up to today 5-May-2016, i am still waiting for the official letter and feel uncertain about my situation.

From Here anyone know how to moved on from here? cos really not much can be done from my side but "Waiting"

hope to hear some info from your forumer.

Lets share............
*
Sorry to hear about your situation TS. Yes, times are bad.

The information given to you by the officer is correct. If you earn above RM2k per month, you are not covered under the Employment Act.

Under the EA, it list down the applicable notice period to be provided to you ie less than 2 yrs employment or less = 4 weeks, 2-5yrs = 6 weeks, >5yrs 8 weeks etc.
It also list down the retrenchment compensation, ie <2yrs 10days wages per year of service, 2-5yrs 15days wages per year and >5yrs 20days wages a year.
And so on.

If you are not under the EA, your employment contract is usually applicable. Meaning per what the officer said, they can choose not to compensate you if it is not stated in the contract.

However, in general practise, most companies will usually follow the EA, some even exceed the EA's requirements.

Per what other forumers have mentioned, you need to receive the written letters from your company to really see what are the terms and conditions attached. Technically, they should not be backdating the letter. IE, if you receive the letter today, it should be dated today and the notice period starts today. Then you can decide your next steps.

Good luck TS.


TShennoiyatsu
post May 5 2016, 08:02 PM

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QUOTE(kslian @ May 5 2016, 06:58 PM)
Sorry to hear about your situation TS. Yes, times are bad.

The information given to you by the officer is correct. If you earn above RM2k per month, you are not covered under the Employment Act.

Under the EA, it list down the applicable notice period to be provided to you ie less than 2 yrs employment or less = 4 weeks, 2-5yrs = 6 weeks, >5yrs 8 weeks etc.
It also list down the retrenchment compensation, ie <2yrs 10days wages per year of service, 2-5yrs 15days wages per year and >5yrs 20days wages a year.
And so on.

If you are not under the EA, your employment contract is usually applicable. Meaning per what the officer said, they can choose not to compensate you if it is not stated in the contract.

However, in general practise, most companies will usually follow the EA, some even exceed the EA's requirements.

Per what other forumers have mentioned, you need to receive the written letters from your company to really see what are the terms and conditions attached. Technically, they should not be backdating the letter. IE, if you receive the letter today, it should be dated today and the notice period starts today. Then you can decide your next steps.

Good luck TS.
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Noted kslian Many many thanks^^
Vervain
post May 6 2016, 06:45 AM

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Btw TS. Make sure the HR does clearly state the reason of termination. Ensure its not pertaining to your performance but rather the company's decision to down size.
TShennoiyatsu
post May 6 2016, 09:53 AM

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QUOTE(Vervain @ May 6 2016, 06:45 AM)
Btw TS. Make sure the HR does clearly state the reason of termination. Ensure its not pertaining to your performance but rather the company's decision to down size.
*
HR have make clear that they are downsizing the company organization. i am confident if they say other word i can hit them heavy.
tehoice
post May 6 2016, 10:38 AM

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QUOTE(hennoiyatsu @ May 6 2016, 09:53 AM)
HR have make clear that they are downsizing the company organization. i am confident if they say other word i can hit them heavy.
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it is for the own good, for your future explanation to your next potential employer.

TShennoiyatsu
post May 6 2016, 11:31 AM

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QUOTE(tehoice @ May 6 2016, 10:38 AM)
it is for the own good, for your future explanation to your next potential employer.
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Hi tehoice many thanks and yes need to see how the letter of release written and if they change the statement to other then they say will need to make sure they know that i have the evident on their email corresponding and also verbal conversation. As in the discussion i have get their consign on me recording. so at lease i am in the safe side.

thanks thumbsup.gif
tehoice
post May 6 2016, 11:32 AM

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QUOTE(hennoiyatsu @ May 6 2016, 11:31 AM)
Hi tehoice many thanks and yes need to see how the letter of release written and if they change the statement to other then they say will need to make sure they know that i have the evident on their email corresponding and also verbal conversation. As in the discussion i have get their consign on me recording. so at lease i am in the safe side.

thanks  thumbsup.gif
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glad to hear, it's been about 8 weeks soon. so what actions have both you and the HR taken?
TShennoiyatsu
post May 6 2016, 11:42 AM

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QUOTE(tehoice @ May 6 2016, 11:32 AM)
glad to hear, it's been about 8 weeks soon. so what actions have both you and the HR taken?
*
my side i have done what i can to protect myself. just waiting for the HR to give the letter, pushing HR to give me by next monday.

like you say 8 weeks almost up nothing come from HR yet, so need only can wait until the official letter is on hand.
tehoice
post May 6 2016, 02:46 PM

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QUOTE(hennoiyatsu @ May 6 2016, 11:42 AM)
my side i have done what i can to protect myself. just waiting for the HR to give the letter, pushing HR to give me by next monday.

like you say 8 weeks almost up nothing come from HR yet, so need only can wait until the official letter is on hand.
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trust they will do what is necessary.
Bussybody
post May 6 2016, 04:10 PM

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Make is so bad now.

Hope my company could sustain and I would be safe not kena retrench
ZZMsia
post May 6 2016, 04:56 PM

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How come you not written long email to your management (CC the top bosses on thismatter)?

Need more proof for yourself
Babizz
post May 6 2016, 07:24 PM

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u should NOT leave the company until u serve yr notice period upon receipt of the letter with the correct date(maybe minus 1-3 days for approval).


TShennoiyatsu
post May 10 2016, 11:10 AM

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Thanks guys i will close this post but remain it in the forum as a reference. Hr Have approach me and provided the letter of release and also the "compensation" discussion.

As described by the IR(Industrial Relation) department the company need to follow the calculation of repayment stated in the IR, because the appointment letter have state retrenchment benefit.

From the calculation although is not much as i expected but is enough to survive for another 4month while looking for new environment or come up own business plan.

Thanks to all advice and experience share here. ^^

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