Hey Everyone,

Not sure whether did i post on the right thread, sorry for any inconvenience if i really did - please direct me to the right thread. thanks in advance.

Lately i come across on my company that there were on something called PIP - Performance Improvement Plan ?

Does anyone know how it works ... please do share some of your advice and experience. ( Any company with such PIP ? )

Thanks In Advance.

PIP means u r not performing...so they want u to do all outlined in PIP to make sure u r not shown the door.

Thanks for reply appreciate a lot.

Noted @ alternative tools to knock off / terminate indirectly - (management strategies ) ?

How does PIP work any example ? Base on company target or ( Individual target -> ( incentive ) / or Company/Individual target consider as one ?

What's the wise and proper way before starting with this PIP monitoring ?

Thanks

PIP is initiated by the management or probably by your supervisor. It is a very structured monitoring process of under performed employee.
Reason is depend pretty much on the mercy of your employer or how much that troublesome employee is willing to commit to do all the necessary action item within a time frame, usually 3 months.

After 3 months the result would be reviewed, and to decide whether to terminate the employee, extend PIP or deactivate the program.

Stood.

Isn't that will be better if there monitor p.a ? before enroll with PIP monitoring ?

Scenario 1 :- Receive order from your hod and claim that who ever does met your individual target will be given coaching / warning letter / termination or relocate & etc.

Company A Target : No idea.

Individual target : Example in Teir-ring ( per month) = (Incentive Base / No Bonus ) as followed

Tier 1 - $300k
Tier 2 - $500k
Tier 3 - $700k

Say you have done your best and end up manage to gather $299k for 2-4 months down the road.

Here come your company A : compliment us with a coaching form / warning letter ending filtering us out.

Ridiculous path : what's related to our individual target / PIP. ( Incentive base) - Achieve ( extra income for the month if doesn't met got nothing )

Does any company enforce or amend any new ruling via verbal message from hod without any official email / letter from HR ?

Target maybe reset any time - verbal also.

It actually demotivate and sound like indirectly layering to trim staff away.

Being figuring ways to consult my team.

This post has been edited by Qwister8: Sep 17 2015, 10:36 PM

Yes, PIP sounds very demotivating at first and most of the affected employee would just opt for plan B which is to nego separation scheme (resign with dignity and a bit of compensation) with HR rather than doing the PIP, if applicable.
But if your people have all the semangat juang and confident they can achieve target as per the PIP, by all means do it.
In the end depends on the company culture, whether you believe in the system and think PIP is fair for you to fix that employee. Read all the horror stories in the internet with a pinch of salt.

If the management agree to put an employee in PIP they must agree to provide necessary tool/counseling/coaching within the time frame of the PIP, not after.
Employee must also be proactive to keep everything as record, all log books, emails, verbal communication, everything just to be sure.

I would not default your statement if i'm a-line with management (self sanctification) end up losing all my men.

Nothing will benefit the company if all demotivated and end up - turn over high.

Hardly for them to keep record, everything was by verbal communication. - Non official emails / letter given.

I'll totally agree with you " semangat juang if you ever in sales line "

But once you step into " collection " similar to sales strategies. but on cash term only consider our point.

Any broken promise made doesn't count as their effort.

Some of it, base on luck - probably might get redemption / bankruptcy / deceased. - free token.

Probably is not their effort but sometimes company politic - chain of relationship.

I feel not fair to those who in real effort, rather than waiting for free token ( chain of relationship) to feed them.

If we really wanna determine or judge a person. My opinion must be fair to others. - to be done equally and fair in order to show others that the ending if chances given.

I've gone through that path and i understand their feelings well.

Target change very subjective 3 month / which sales probably encounter once a year. probably slight 1 -2 % increase.

Is it wise to set their individual target as company target ? as there were incentive base ? No bonus.

Hard task & dunno how to decide haha.

Umm, i'm not sure on the details of your case since i'm not from the sales department.
But i do think the basic of the PIP is the same. Been here, done that. fought well and i survived for now...but i wont put up my hopes too high especially with the restructuring around the corner.
Your employee can always keep a personal daily record of their work if no emails/letter given. They have the right to meet the managers daily/weekly to discuss about their progress. Please record them all. The manager would feel leceh to keep up with them, but that is the way of the PIP. Both manager and employee must be proactive to fix the problem, otherwise it will backfire the manager.
This is one of the way to see which employee puts a real effort to survive...just dont give up! The manager probably will feel ashamed of himself if the employee can prove he's been doing his job & can meet his target within the time frame. Sometimes it's just only communication problem within the manager & employee. It is sad when the employee gets demotivated, no means of channeling his concerns to the management, manager sees only the weakness of the employees and BAM, marked as poor performer.

U work in UOB?

I was once put on a pip for about three months eventually I had to resign after a show cause letter finally issued to me
pIP is not a good thing to be on

Yes, that's another path manager & employee - must be efficient toward management and also own task.

Nothing much to comment - "either just don't give up and continue the journey or just hop to another boat." the only choice as employee. Unless for union won't be harm.

Thing happen if everything was not systematic enough. - Kelam kabut.

When come to systematic - too much procedure. (waste of time) -> management layering.

End up appear alot Manager, AM, sectary. ( like dynasty pyramid) - dramatic.

Happening because when the hod wanna hide and to shown that there did well - avoid caught from auditor.

What ever which been done will appear on the spot.

Life .. haha - either killing each another to met own satisfaction or be king maker haha.

Btw nice talking to you, which field were you from ? how come your have pip since you're not dealing with numbering ?

Yes, i can feel that.

In my opinion best monitoring 1 year's + 3 months.

If within a year you must at least score your kRA 50% then should be fair enough, if you're really in your effort. 50% should be okay ler.

Question to yourself :- Challenge yourself rather than others - Gain Victory. - ( i been through this and it works but really will turn you crazy) - stress. - not recommended haha.

Incentive base is solely base on your hardworking not free.

But company insist with pip - indirect filtering than is fate la.

Question : Have you done the best ? If yes, that's still the decision given. fate.

Try others & skill and knowledge always with you.

Find a place where there treasure you.

It wont be good for them if turn around to high. - Gods know


It may happen in may point of view.

* May be related to as what speedfamgirl mention " between manager & employee
* System of the company :- accurate ?
* Turn around time " efficient ? done within a day ?
* procedure ?
* empowerment to all your staff, cut of the time.
* to be equally divide if so call free token.
* team work and helping each another is the key.
* without your manager support & trustee will cause all good to bad.

Before pip was done to employee will the upper level being serve the same ? - major answer "no" .

Sometimes i feel weird as there keep stressing their staff and why not questioning their hod whether are there fit to be there ?

Or there were set there because of education ? degree and so. where he only good on manipulating the management part,

Question / Answer from upper path direct to your staff to solve.

If that's so, not bad considering to be a manager which 9-5 on time.

Only by instructing his staff to be frontier - fighting day and night.

Which field were you from in your past ?

Nope why ?

It's a long story, and it's a unique one just because i am different species in this industry which mostly dominated by men.
I had a fair share of harassment but i cant say a word just because he's a manager (very skillfull but asshole attitude).
Been transferred to different department, i was happy for a while and the cycle repeats again. I once was assigned working night shift for almost a year without any competent person. I was by myself doing all of the reports and making a lot of mistakes. But when i raised my concern nobody gives a fuck. I feel demoralized and sad, and became defensive with everyone. My latest manager not sure how to approach me & straight gives me PIP due to my last year poor review. I knew it will eventually leading to this, i dont know what to do at first. but then maybe this is the right time to prove myself that i am worthy, it's just communication breakdown. The good thing is during the 3 months i am entitled to use all the counseling benefit and travel for courses. I have to work hard both during my shift & attending courses during my off days. and of course keeping reports. No doubt the program changes me to a new person though. Well i dont really care if i made it or not in the end, at least i close the gap and they see me as trying to improve myself. Once you're out of this, this is the biggest takeaway you can do for yourself.

Understand - It's either we accept the challenge or we leave. (employee choice)

To accept :- * Any task given just do / dunno then ask (but to the right channel) / don't rely on others but do help each another if you're in team.
* With all this daily practice and task - by time to time, your skill & knowledge will brush up. (No one can take away from you)

Well, I was mainly from the hard way - Skill & knowledge base. (SPM)
Knowledge in several field.. but end up on finance.
There were all similar no matter which field you are,just different task - unless for specialize -: ACCA & etc.

I was lucky and given an opportunity to join banking which everyone claim " Wow " Banking Line - must be high salary for sure.
Actually it depend on which department you are and whether you and manager relationship good and your teams.

Eventually i'm doing same task as degree holder,
Imagine no matter how hardworking you are at the end still depends on your superior / manager to determine your faith.
Chances to be promote for degree holder is slightly higher. - Overall depends how you polish and wax work. / Chain & network.
As long there are happy you're next to be promoted although less performing.

When you question them why i'm not promoted ? As i did better p.a without failed / compare to someone met 8-9 mth targets.
Answer : Oh, that's management decision ( an excuse to keep you away)

Management will only determine your faith base on your performance, yet not overall of your knowledge and trouble solving skill and etc. (Reality)

* Polish and wax skilled * - doesn't suit me. " used to be in team or solo - tackling & solve any matter at my empowerment.

Beside that i also notice that major hirer rely on their education level, yet for skilled and knowledge wise.
There rather hire fresh graduate than a skilled person. Eventually you're making lose daily and spend time training instead.
Yet for me i would rather consider person that skilled - lower pay - yet there are skilled and knowledge base.
By time to time, if you hire a skilled person you may upgrade them by sending them for training or self studies. (Further enhancement)
Treasure your employee as employee will treasure employer - less turn over.
Ending up everyone happy working & lesser company politic.

Sorry for any inconvenience cause - if my word hurt anyone.

That's just piece of my own opinion base on reality of life which is now happening.

Eventually i'm bit piss off with my current job.
Looking for better opportunity and with a new start.

Nice, part time courses. - which uni ?

I'm considering part time degree in OUM.
But i notice that there were few non-related subject which dragged the duration longer.
:- Bahasa Malaysia / Tamadun etc.

Same time i was told that distance studies more straight to the point. (Oversea College/Uni) Self studies with study material provided ?
I would prefer mainly study straight to the point instead of wasting of time on unnecessary subject. - base on case study.

Any recommend ?

Recently, I kena PIP from my supervisor. All the reasons given was mainly false accusation and miscommunication. I concluded that my manager wants me out for whatever personal reasons.

Very clear, I have to leave the job. Question is should I send my resignation now and be jobless. Or continue with this PIP while confirming job elsewhere. I have mouths to feed at home. Worst case scenario, after the PIP they still want me out, what can they do? Will they fire me or extend PIP?

Same here,

Nope just continue and while waiting for your confirmation.
It will be much easier to get a job while you're still working than you're jobless. Yet you still need the monthly fund to survive

Yet the management have no right to terminate you according to the labour law but there are able to transfer you around. Any department which there's slot.

Before that there is certain stages, if not mistaken there were 4-5 stages.

We seems like having the same situation haha, which field were you from mate?

No point arguing, rarely there will listen.
Companies politic, either you follow or against.
That's the rules of game.

Usually follower will gain reward and protection.

Haha, no point being under such head which is type of buyer.
Faith if happen to be and you have done your best.

I'm also seeking for new job but market nowadays seem bit slow.hopefully that i able to found one.

The PIP is ridiculous even if I do all they will still fail me. What is the next course of action will they take? If they fire me that will be very difficult to find next job is it? Reason for leaving previous company kena fired. Or they will not mentioned if my new employer called HR? Or if I join company under different department will there be problemin future

Or should I resign before they fire? Need to know how long I have to find a job?

PS there is no signature whether I agree or disagree to this PIP or I have no say

Performance improvement plan, or personal improvement plan are nothing good to begin with.
Once a person enter this shit, when a particular company want to restructure manpower, he/she will be the first to go.
By right, for a person to enter this, he/she must be really cannot perform and always have problem with the boss. But sometimes is more on because the PLP skills are not good.