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> Military Thread V18

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thpace
post Sep 16 2015, 07:36 PM

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QUOTE(Frozen_Sun @ Sep 16 2015, 07:26 PM)
Maybe it will have gun stabilization mechanism like on tanks that works up to specific sea state
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Doubt so on that size


thpace
post Sep 19 2015, 09:39 AM

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QUOTE(James831 @ Sep 19 2015, 01:23 AM)
maybe ATM didnt  purchase any SPH yet is a good thing, have more option to choose from.
the bold part would be work really well for ATM. brows.gif
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There a good chance we will opt for tracked instead of wheeled spg


thpace
post Sep 19 2015, 03:12 PM

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QUOTE(James831 @ Sep 19 2015, 02:19 PM)
U mean the K9 SPH combo with K2 MBT?☺
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K9 possible

K2 mbt impossible. It expensive like shit and weight like an elephant.


thpace
post Sep 19 2015, 03:47 PM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 19 2015, 03:38 PM)
ya, K9 heavy too, can't carry by A400M, unless Army no require to carry by A400m,
but surprising SG Primus can make it to 30 tons, maybe material strong is different.
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To tell the truth.. hardly any army transport via planes

It expensive and limited numbers
thpace
post Sep 19 2015, 11:34 PM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 19 2015, 11:15 PM)
got may amour transport via planes.
anyway back to new support ship.
but actually base on my study our Navy should get USD180m joint high speed vessel (JHSV) as support role. off couse we still need JSS for open sea/deap sea like SCS support. so 2 JHSV + 1 JSS will be perfect. 
JHSV only 1500 tons can carry 600 tons cargo and personal and just about 100 meter long, so can send MBT/8x8/future SPH easily from Penisular and sabah/sarawak.
also our navy base or port in Sarawak so small hard to park more than 150meter ship (except Sepanggar), and JHSV Draft only 3.8 meter, perfect suite to our navy base mostly in side small river like in Kuching, Semporna, Sandakan,
our Peninsular Kuantan to Sarawak/ Sabah is about 800km & 1400km from sea.
so due to JHSV can carry 600 tons include carry MBT tank and speed up to 4x knot, it can reach Sarawak in 11-12 hrs, and Sabah in 22-24hrs.
this equal to 20x time 2 way fly of A400M to carry same amount tons. yet it can't carry MBT.  it means more time taken by A400M to carry same amount tons.
JHSV still can travel at 20-30 knot to save fuel, but still double speed of traditional transport ship which travel at speed 12-15 knot.
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one at a time bro.. mpss pun belum dapat already want to next level

mpss is suppose to also resolve/elevate some of the logistic issues between east and west malaysia. Docking issue most likely will require dock upgrade but i dont see why we cant dock at commercial ports for stop gap solution. The transportation from a commercial dock is better also compared to a naval port which located far from any transportation hub

iinm the requirement was 2 mpss previously, one on duty while another on maintenance
thpace
post Sep 19 2015, 11:51 PM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 19 2015, 11:46 PM)
i understand, just free chat
bcos mpss also long and seems also costly to built 1 expected usd300m each, maybe can consider cheaper solution JHSV first, smaller version also have cost less than usd 100m
well, some cargo is need high security like ammunition or missile, if can direct docking to navy base will be best solution. dock in commercial port need transport cargo and troops again to base, much more not efficient,  not also sure need pay docking fees in commercial port or not.
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well, long term solution would better plus the mpss will not play only transportation role. There already a few roles we want it to play once we get it

normally, ammunition and missiles is by planes for urgent needs.

BTW, if u dont make a big huha no one will know what you are transporting whistling.gif whistling.gif
Eg no one will know not there a missile inside a container unless u write there big big "Missile inside, Please Be Careful"


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post Sep 20 2015, 12:04 AM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 20 2015, 12:00 AM)
agree, MPSS still need for more role, i means we need suitable small transport ship can send lot cargo direct to all our big/small navy base west/east MY.
so reduce logistic issue and time with speed if needed.
also those JHSV, have speed so can reach location in humanitarian rescue mission area more faster compare to navy warship.
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i think those amphibious ships with well dock will be good enough.. for those smal small transportation
thpace
post Sep 20 2015, 01:14 AM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 20 2015, 01:01 AM)
our RMN Third Generation Frigate (TGF) (6000 tons AAW frigate) project in 2023, will have High Energy Laser (HEL) defense system on board.  biggrin.gif
but in year 2023, price may go up to USD 1 bllion each unit.
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mana dapat weed ni?
thpace
post Sep 20 2015, 01:25 AM

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QUOTE(MrUbikeledek @ Sep 20 2015, 01:24 AM)
We can buy Galicia class which is within the RMN required tonnage. Or we can get Makassar class which is cheaper.
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the mpss is in the back burner until at least gowind is ready whistling.gif so post 2020 or more




thpace
post Sep 20 2015, 01:35 AM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 20 2015, 01:26 AM)
just in concept study, possible type 26 or Fremm upgrade version.

2003 1 Gen -kedah class 1600 tons
2013 2 Gen -Gowind class 3000 tons
2023 3 Gen -New AAW Frigate  6000 tons.
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6000tons can very much a destroyer class already laugh.gif which is beyond the realm of reality/ imagination

it more believable that we go for a improved gowind with AAW capabilities armed with sg formidable class weapon



QUOTE(KLboy92 @ Sep 20 2015, 01:29 AM)
I think we pulled out of Type 26 already. At least so the UK side seems to think. But if we can it would be a really nice platform... singas would really crap pants.

But I'd settle for actually getting Gowind in mass production.
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the type 26 faced various design delays in fact during gowind tender, the type 26 was not more a concept on paper while the gowind already have a basic design
thpace
post Sep 20 2015, 02:07 AM

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QUOTE(KLboy92 @ Sep 20 2015, 01:42 AM)
Yup, and Type 26 is *still* on paper only. And our Gowind has also been compared favourably with the notorious LCS. So I'm quite proud. Only problem is building the things.... sigh.

You think this theoretical AAW Gowind can get Aster?
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anything is possible with $$$$ whistling.gif
thpace
post Sep 20 2015, 12:04 PM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 20 2015, 10:28 AM)
well in euro trend now newest frigate already go to 6000 tons level after long experience and study.
cost ship/hull not much different from 4000 --> 6000 tons, just 5-7% increasing in cost, 
but improve space for crew, more store for food and ammunition, more weapon can fit, add multi-role mission bay, even quarantine bay
most importance, bigger ship have more power for system, for future more and more system, electronic , sensor, radar,  weapon requirement huge power.
AAW Gowind or SG formidable only suite past and current requirement, but future thread after 2020 is different, also power supply in Gowind is limited.
we must have more bigger ambition in navy strength。
remember we in SCS facing bigger thread at Spratly issue. before 2010 spratly issue not that hot.
well UK already begin construct first 3 unit Type 26, fund already approval early this year.
suppliier start make component, and hull section start assembly begin 2017 at shipyard. 
depend what type radar use in AAW Gowind, some radar support Aster some not.
in euro have 2 type radar, 1 is support US weapon/missile, 2 type is support euro weapon and missile.
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Cakap kencang but duit tak ada

More economical to just the existing gowind and upgrade it

thpace
post Sep 20 2015, 12:29 PM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 20 2015, 12:24 PM)
just boring, fun chat  biggrin.gif
have to wait 5 year later, until that time only know 。。。。
i still thinking/imagination how MY in year 2020 。。。
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Back to indonesia era

Here outdated equipment while they have better one
thpace
post Sep 20 2015, 01:28 PM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 20 2015, 12:52 PM)
i still thinking our political leader lack of formidable to develop strong defense capability。
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One lack the political will to beef up defence

While another have no will to even have a defence force

Either one our defence is screwed
thpace
post Sep 20 2015, 03:18 PM

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QUOTE(MrUbikeledek @ Sep 20 2015, 03:09 PM)
De Zeven Provincien and Alvario De Bazan already exceed 6000 ton and both classified as frigate. And SG Formidable class is not that much more advance than the Gowind that we get. I might be mistaken, but i heard that the NSM has a precision strike capability against target on land.
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Excocet block 3 also got some ground strike capability. Not that uncommon anymore

We might be seing a multirole missles similarly how we are seeing multi role planes and ships

What set the formidable apart it its a ability for area defence on such a small vessel. Previously, it limited to destroyer class only. This is particularly usefully for fleet protection or convoy. What it lack it just it asw and anti surface suite which our gowind is more suited for that role.

Therefore, it more a logical steps to armed the next batch of gowind with aster system and area defence capability.
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post Sep 21 2015, 10:38 PM

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QUOTE(keown83 @ Sep 21 2015, 07:30 PM)
Su-30SM is the Su-30MKI/MKM for Russian Air-Force

even Ruskies are impressed with Su-30MKI/MKM significance capabilities over Su-30MK that they had from Knaapo plant..& now they also switch to IAPO to get this awesome Su-30SM
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the mki by irkut was originally a trainer version (two seater) of the the su-30 family before they irkut take the initiate to upgrade it continuously bring in the first MKI for india

they also fare well because they have experience in interoperation of various electronic suite onto the su30 such as our mkm and india's mki while the knaapo is all rusian parts

it was during testing that russian see potential of the export MKI and MKM in their inventory as they are the most advance version of the su-30 family tree they ever build that time.
thpace
post Sep 22 2015, 09:31 PM

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QUOTE(DDG_Ross @ Sep 22 2015, 05:47 PM)
got french + russia + s.africa parts in it, and current conflicts wont allow joint production anymore
the other only choice is su-30sm which is an evolution of the mki/mkm but then it has some israeli parts in it..
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there a way to by-pass the so call restriction which similar to what india do

Buy the kit and assemble in Malaysia laugh.gif
Not a full production line but more of a hanger for assembly works


QUOTE(IReallyNeed Answers @ Sep 22 2015, 09:07 PM)
anyone playing World of Warships?

let's form a division and fight as /k division
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only world of tanks sweat.gif
thpace
post Sep 22 2015, 09:50 PM

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QUOTE(KLboy92 @ Sep 22 2015, 09:06 PM)
Sememangnya dream. Type 26 kah? Just to fill up 1 ship you know what all thosr missiles will cost right? biggrin.gif
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rather go for PAAMS with integrated SMART-L

closely similar to type 45
thpace
post Sep 22 2015, 10:03 PM

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QUOTE(waja2000 @ Sep 22 2015, 09:57 PM)
Gowind is too small to fit in PAAMS + SMART-L,
the size radar is huge for 3000 tons frigate, at lease 6000 tons level.
also power requirement is huge.
also SMART-L going to un-popular it will be replace with newest 4 fix panel AESA radar. 
Thales I-Mast is best for 3000 tons level balancing size and capability.
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if that the case.. Herakles would better, plus there a an updated version soon laugh.gif

Back to back we are looking at similar formidable class just on a diff hull
thpace
post Sep 22 2015, 10:11 PM

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QUOTE(KLboy92 @ Sep 22 2015, 10:07 PM)
Thats pre-songlap price. Gowind already RM1.6bn each how much do you think this will 'cost'?

Wasn't Aster 15 and ESSM already turned down in favour of MICA VL?
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fire control radar issue

basically limit wat missle we can fire

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