Prob those who are interested should starts to look @ foreign funds. In malaysia 20-30% return pa is consider very good or perhaps one of the best funds already. In US or Hong Kong, good funds that generate 20-30% return is consider sap sap sui. In US, good funds generate more than 100% p.a and HK, one of the best funds generate over 800% in 5 years. So, widen ur horizon... the grass is REALLY greener on the other side. Cheers .

hie, may we know which fund does that? Do u know the fund company? does it have any website? I'm sure many would like to invest too, if the returns are promising Thanks

Sure, just name one or two funds that have generated over 100% p.a....

So same problem as in SG, need to shop around... I understnad as my colleague 2 months ago invested some 50K each (husband and wife) in the same UT that I had. However, the strange thing was, they both pay 5% charges to this company which I recently found out was in fact, the parent of the company I invested in.. I only pay 1.5-2%.. they pay 5%... strange.. maybe they are rcich.. .that's why... ha..ha..

in fact, I know of 2 sources that charges 1% provided you invest a minimum sum or existing invested capital investment with them has already exceeded that amount... they give extra discount.

Actually, over the years, there are funds that had generated more than 100% within 1 yr.. Its not mere saying, its listed in fun facts and published every now and then.. I had seen it too.. In fact, the top performing funds immediately after the recession in SG was OCBC Thailand (150+%), india, Korea, DBS SG (just above 100%) in 1 yr. I used to own Thai India and Korea.. Of course, those days, I just started and wasn't sure of their capability and sold way before 1 yr... in fact, I can just go to my online trader and look at the chart and tell you how much the fund has performed over the past 3-5 yrs.... I mean how much it has appreciated... Just an example... I can't remember which fund, but I do remember buy it few yrs ago at below $1, not its bid price is $3+. My best performing fund for 1 yr was DWS SG small cap->60%, Indonesia >50<60%.... best still China fund within 2 mths 26%

So its really not surprising.. if you can do on your own rather than with insurcance link type... if you really don't mind.. try doing it yourself. but Sorry guys,l I am only speaking from how I do it in SG, I don't know MY climate like..

This post has been edited by bbmars: Dec 8 2007, 12:07 AM

lol... im not here to feed u guys. Internet contains huge amount of information. Go read up.

I do agree with you, there are tonnes of informatio.. Even business news in SG, reported and commented that SG sales charges is high not comparable to those in EU.. probably due to smaller amount of investment by local.. that's why the rate is higher and also... most fund actually bought into feed funds of some other countries, which it can't be compared to... making 800% in say 5 yrs? That I don't know, but certain, its much higher than even say 150% in 1 y is poosible too...

I know because I used to and am still looking at those so call funds that had appreciated more than 300 - 500% gain for the past 3 yrs... like I just recalled, an India fund I bought ~70c then it now worth ~$3.60 now. ~5 yrs time frame

i think,the one you so call after 6 year no more charge you,is you aia investlink front charge,for the unit trust you buy under the invest link,as long as you continue top up,they will still charge you the unit trust's unit service charge each time.i think Zarth can give a better explanation if he is here.

another thing is,i thing we can do all transcation online for ing's fund(note,i am not mean ing investlink)however,the service charge is not cheaper than you do with agent.

This post has been edited by athlon 11: Dec 8 2007, 01:42 AM

i normally wont encourage ppl to do investment and insurance together. Seperate it, buy pure life insurance + investment in unit trust. That way, you get the best of 'both world'. Besides, if u know how much is the commission for insurance agent for the first 6 years, u will be disgusted like me.

This post has been edited by bafukie: Dec 8 2007, 11:03 AM

Same here....always advise newbies to split the 2.
But anyway, 1 question I hope you don't mind answering. Usually for foreign investment, i.e. if you go through the net; would there still be "service charges/transaction charges"?
Hope bbmars can answer also in regards to Singapore's fund.

yeap... definitely, but it varies according to companies. So i cant generalize the charges (unlike malaysia 3-6% 'service charge' )

In SG, all UT for investment comes with typical sales charge. 1 time off like my trader offering online charge of 1.5% for most funds.. else it will be 2.5% and some 2% depending on who is selling the funds. I bought my UT from my stock broker, who is actually the middle man and there are easily hundreds of funds that I can buy. After the sales, all bid prices reflected will factored all charges into it, charges like expenditure, roadshow, advertisement, commision, etc... Whatever the bid price, for the day will be the price if you sell... there is nothing else to it..

In fact, such traders usually contains pages on their website about "how to" and "know about" on UT.. almost everything you want to know about UT before investing.. You can even call them up for advise, which I had never done so.. because you can learn all about UT on the internet yourself.. no need anyone to teach you. SG regulation included compulsary clause that when you buy/sell, you are liable to whatver happen to your buy/sell... be it profit or lost... because its a rule that you are your own liability should you not seek advise from your trader... else they will be liable for not providing advise and yet charge the sales charge, part of service, you should sue them for losses incurred. This is also mandatary requirement for insurance link invested product like those of AIA... You need to declare that you are aware of what you are investing into... because, in time past, some people were conned into buying...

This post has been edited by bbmars: Dec 8 2007, 11:15 PM

Agree...to me, a 'complete' financial will have to include 'protection' section for myself/family. Just in case (touchwood), anything happened to me, there is still money from insurance to help out the situation and reduce the burden of my family. WOrst if in situation where u cant go to heaven nor hell... ...like critical diseases...then the insurance can help to cover a bit.

So, besides all the savings & investment...we oso should be looking about insurance as a mean of protection as well

__________________________________

Singapore UT industry is very very different in Malaysia. I guess it has develop to such a stage where everyone are well aware of UT and can do their own decision. Kiosk for buy/sell UT are available everywhere in Singapore...agents service are not really needed in this situation, hence the lower service charge...my 2 cents

This post has been edited by kingkong81: Dec 9 2007, 01:21 AM

Sadly to say, Malaysia UT doesn't improve a lot. Back 10 to 20 years ago, gov always encourage people to invest in UT so that less people are being burned in the market by blindly invest or only invest in 'goreng' stuff (not invest anyway, should be speculate for better word).
But having said that, there is no move by authority to improve the attractiveness of UT, still the 5% service charge remains the same while UT industry still remain the old way. Now we are talking about online banking in almost every banks, still UT still in a old shape. Also, there is no transparency in UT, you don't know what they are using your money to invest at all, no disclosure of their portfolio either. As a UT holders, we should be at least informed what the fund is investing, at least tell us your top holding position, where it is? Just like yo invest in global/regional fund, you don't actually know where the money has been invested, in US? Europe? what industry?
I don't know how Singapore UT situation, may be bbmars or some other forumers can give more information for comparison or other countries one as well.

Public don't demand the fund to disclose every details about it, as portfoilio can be changing throughout due to market situation so might troublesome to do it as well, just at least annually or half annually disclose simple and brief about the fund situation also enough. Instead, now we only monitor the NAV published daily while the rest we are left virutally blank about it. We also don't know what is the reason of it increases or decreases, somehow when market is up generally, but the fund you invested is down (because of their portfolio surely, just we don't know which one or why).

UT shouldn't charge 5-6.5% initial charge if they sincere about expand this industry and promote its popoularity among public. I know it is always possible to get 2-3.x% if you invested in larger sum like 50K or 100K, but still in lower sum, no discount at all.
Also, still there are plenty of investors here are not aware the risk of nature of UT, they treat it like FD that can give better rate, but not aware their money is actually put into work in equities market. Often you see agents tell people this xyz fund can earn 15% one based on historical performance, you should invest in it, then the investors perceive this can earn 15% in the future and take his/her FD to invest in it.
They also not aware the 5% charges as well in previous UT qouting system.

Still UT industry (including public investors) here is far from maturing even though it is more thean several decades. How sad it is.

It is a well protected industry, and banks and fund houses are earning guaranteed profit from it. The only way to improve it that I can see is improve the competitiveness by allowing more foreign fund house to sell. Just like broadband situation, when it is well protected, no improvement or price competitiveness for consumers, only when the market is opened up, we saw price reduction and better service for the consumers.
The protected industry generally doesn't improve itself.
But I highly doubt gov will do that as it may means severe guaranteed profit deteoriation for local banks and fund houses.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Dec 9 2007, 10:10 AM

Hwang DBS have a monthly newsletter to highlight about their funds like the top few most percentage shares held by the funds. I do get their newsletter every month. Not sure whether others have such thing.

Actaully, there are many local in SG equally blur about UT investment, those who can, whould avoid UT because to them, tis too slow, which I agree, however, beacuse of CPF ruling, only certain % of CPF can be invested in stock to minimised risks.. Therefore... not choice... at least still better than kepping inside CPF and getting that much lesser interest as compared to investing in UT. That's why MAS (Monetary Authority of SG) insisted on certain ruling. Still remember, AIA was fined and forced to pay back something which MAS declared misleading public due to their selling and information shared not consistent and without declaring certain risk and position about their investment among their agents. Soon after that, all insurance companies were forced to declare and made known some basic things about innvesting, and buyer have to signed and acknowledged.

All my UT investment, the information are provided under the fund manager porfolio, like the top 10 stocks holding under that particular fund.. I can easily get this online anytime. I used to buy into this OCBC SG balance fund and I am actually using the top 10 holdings to monitor online live the fund performance daily, which is.. not reaally necessary. However, I just used it as a referencee.

Another one of my online trader does not provide breakdown. However, the quarterly statement should reflect what funds you have bought into... But again, may not reflect what it actually buy into. Anyway, I don't think its difficult to find detail information on the internet. Or you can ask the agent about it as they are obligated to do so, failure to which, you can complain to MAS or CASE. In fact, for insurance agenies in SG, they must take tests and pass certain modules in order to be able to sell certain things.. not all each agent can sell provided they fulfil the requirement by MAS



This post has been edited by bbmars: Dec 10 2007, 12:20 AM

About the transparency issue, I think interim and annual report of each fund will cater the information of the portfolio of the fund. So far I know Public Mutual and OSKUOB have. Public Mutual also publish the portfolio of each fund every month, just most of the investors are not aware of it. Please always request this from your agent.

About the service charge and fee, yes, 6.5% is a bit high, so in fact, most of the unit trust companies now are trying to reduce the service charge. Anyway, Spore UT industry is different from Msia, as Msia still need some time to achieve the current state of Spore UT industry. I believe eventually, Msia UT industry will be same as Spore, using online facility to trade UT and minimize the need of agent service.

About foreign funds, yes, some of the funds really did well in these 3 years, cause of the China booming market. In Msia, there is no fund specialize on China region until recently, but in HK, the China fund there has been launched for more than 3 years. They experience the total booming of China market, but Msia funds only experience it recently. This is due to the different investment strategies, and the China market is booming. Another thing I realize, foreign fund is almost impossible for small investors, where I found there is 1 HK fund minimum initial investment is USD5000, which is more than RM15,000.

I don't require too much detail on each fund mostly because I don't understand the details. I suspect the majority of investors are in the same boat. What I do require are top level details like asset class, market segments, weighting eg up to 70% growth equities in Greater China region, plus say the top-5 holdings. And I expect/require these things (%, top-5) to change too, ie the Fund manager to do some trading depending on conditions to maximise the returns. Otherwise, I could just buy the shares of those companies and sit on them myself. These top level details are usually available from the Fund Fact sheets.

As for the Service charge, I am unclear how much value the agents actually contribute. They can do some risk profiling and that's it. Here's hoping online facilities happen soon. All it needs is for one fund manager to set something up, and the others would quickly follow.

There are a number of reasons why foreign funds are difficult. Apart from minimum investment, most websites have information and requirements for local residents only - they don't say what happens when you are not local. Besides, I am not comfortable transferring not-small-amount of funds to an overseas based organisation that I have never dealt with before.

Likewise, some funds in SG is also out of commoners reach because of the minimum amount investment needed. Often you have to call them up in order to place investment order.. I also read that some funds are only meant for hedge fund investor.. over here, few years back, hedge fund investment is usually in $MILLION, but last time, it has dropped to 500K minimum.. But their return is indeed very good. ... as they are beend tracked.

The MY situation, seems more like what SG used to face, uuntill the market mature and more going online, charges is not going to drop. The same sentiment that drove the online trading... and reduces the cost of charging.

Over in SG, from fund performance tracking and analysts report, China's UT had only came to life last year.. I bought into one of the chinese best performing fund 3 yrs ago and switch out as I had better performing funds generating more profit... then switch back into this chinese fund again.. to maximise gain...

OSK-UOB Smart Income Fund

The OSK-UOB Smart Income Fund is an open-ended income fund in the category of bond, SMART aims to provide investors with higher than average income returns compared to fixed deposits over the medium to long term period by investing up to 70% in bond and up to 30% in equity.

This Fund is suitable to investors who are conservative and seek a steady income stream as it has a low to moderate risk tolerance with a medium to long term investment horizon.

URL: http://www.maybank2u.com.my/consumer/inves...k_uob_sif.shtml

I suspect, I am not sure how its done in MY. But in SG, regulation comes into play. MAS impose a minimum $$$ in the funds. If the fund falls below the limit, they and becomes likely unpopular, they will have to closed down hte fund and money refunded. That's what happen even to big player like AIG, the parent company of AIA in SG. they are not the only ones, others too. The rational was to have better returns funds available rather than having so many funds with lower returns.

I invested mostly in oveseas fuunds and going through middle man trading companies in SG with reputation... kind... I mean its well known in SG UT industry and stock... and many of this funds are actually a feed funds of hte bigger large ones in EU and US, which not easily available to ordinary folk at lower bid prices.

I may have have really understood what you mean, but my histroy record reads like:

Aberdeen indonesia (Aberdeen asset mgt)
DWS China - (Deutch banker)
HSBC EU prty fund (HSBC)
Legg Mason SEA spc. Asset
Lion SG Bal fund (subsidy of OCBC)
AIG Acorns of Asia (AIG)
1st State Bridge (1st State, not sure from where, but DBS SG is selling them too)
1st State India
HSBC BRIC (invest in Brazil, Russia, India, China)
Lion Korea
Fidelity S. America
etc................

All these holdings were bought from the 2 online traders whichever offers best charges... All buy & sell its through them... of course, I can transfer my UT holding any of traders so long as I am a member... All this are sanctioned by MAS and link to CPF and even your bank account.

This post has been edited by bbmars: Dec 10 2007, 11:16 PM