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 LYN Christian Fellowship V10 (Group)

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De_Luffy
post Jan 20 2016, 09:43 AM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 09:06 AM)
I know nobody is perfect but the church should at least bring forth the message of fellowship is also important. But its now too overfocus on serving in ministries and expanding kingdom. The church policy is, once you start serving, the blessing will come. I mean, what they trying to fool us with this message? This is like labour exploitation, man.

Correct me if I am wrong, the blessing as expoused by Paul means the feeling of self satisfaction and self fulfillingness. But the congregation gets fooled into thinking if they serve, then their need for something in their life will be fulfilled. Eg, if a person is feeling depressed or suicidal, he or she, by serving probably would  feel the emptiness be filled by Jesus but they don't feel that their problem is being addressed on why they feel that way in the first place? Praying is one way, but its only limited to altar call, the church does not prepare counselling services. Nor do they have proper bible study to strengthen the consumption of bread knowledge among brethren for equippng.

For me, its like feeling a belonging to the church, like a family. I mean if the church did try to put in an effort to foster fellowship but did not go down well with the congregation, I would understand. But there's no message, zilch, naada on fellowship and importance of feeling belonging to the church. All they just bother is to work the member till he is so dry and burn out. The church have multiplied cell groups until some of the them are the size of 3. The days when I used to go to church and cg was 20 and over, we used to have diversity, sit down during supper and talk about this n that, it was so exciting then. Now its like we go supper just the 3 or 4 of us. I go to church I feel like a stranger.
*
Do you understand what is the GREAT COMMISSION is?
shaniandras2787
post Jan 20 2016, 10:28 AM

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QUOTE(de1929 @ Jan 19 2016, 02:18 PM)
don't overlook cessasionism n continualism issues. take a look at your writings i put in bold. How do you know Holy spirit voice / advice / guidance ?

I give you case: I need to bribe to save a kid in the jungle. question: from Holy Spirit ? or from devil ?
*
I did not overlook both the theories, in fact, these theories did not come into consideration for me at all. It was you who brought up the theories with hopes to persuade me in that i shouldn't be bothered in how my tithes are being utilized (when the fact is obvious, it could be abused). I don't remember that i dragged the Holy Spirit into consideration as well but since you mentioned Continualism then I might as well talk in the same context as you so that you can understand better where I am coming from.

I'll never know whether it was the Holy Spirit talking to me or not, in fact, I don't think even think the Pope could swear in the name of God that the voices he hears in his head is the Holy Spirit or the Devil that is talking to him, he just needs to have faith that it was the Holy Spirit and hope for the best. The Holy Spirit is not a being, it's a manifestation hence it does not possess the likeness of men, it's an intuition, a feeling, a "hunch". It signals you when something is not right.

Have your pastor ever suggested to you that whenever you are in doubt, pray and eventually an answer will come to you? If you do not have an inner peace then do not proceed.

I'm sure you have been through this experience before and do you hear voices in your head which you are sure it's the Holy Spirit or you just suddenly feel that it's right to do what you have in mind? It's a feeling of "you know it's right". That's the Holy Spirit, it's a manifestation, something intangible, something cannot be seen. You require "faith" to believe in the Holy Spirit. Believing in the things unseen.

Do not give in because you fear because fear comes from the Devil. That I can assure you.

With that in mind, I can now answer your question.

1) how can I be sure that it was not the Devil that is asking me to stop tithing?
- very simple and you don't require 50 days of silent meditation to get an answer. when the facts are presented to you right in your face telling you that the tithes is now subject to the question of being abuse for certain particular individual gains and you feel uneasy. do you think it's the Devil who tells you to stop and start looking for another "shepard"? if that is your understanding then your idea of the Devil isn't all that bad.

- if we already feel uneasy during tithing and we are compelled to continue because we fear we may anger God then i need to confirm with you if we are referring to the same God. My God doesn't care if i tithe or not and He still stood by my side during my lowest point of life and lifted me up. My blessing is not a consequence of the monetary contribution I make to the church.

2) the bribery question
- your hypothetical question does not make sense and it's a bad example because it's requires you to question your morality rather than anything else. your moral obligation suggest that you should/must bribe to save the kid. there's nothing religious here. The decision is in your hands, the Holy Spirit or the Devil doesn't care whether the boy lives or die or what decision you choose. You make that decision based on your conscience and eventually you will choose to bribe because you fear the social repercussion against you if you didn't not.

The problem with many Christians nowadays is because they do what the general public think it's right but the biggest compelling force is fear. Pastors occasionally inflict fear subconsciously into the minds of people telling that if they don't tithe then prepare to go to hell when they die. People generally is afraid of death and the unknown so to many 10% is not a big amount so they rather pay that 10% than risk facing the unknown, they got "nothing to lose" and they have in mind, "if the tithe is abused, it's the pastor to answer, not me" but little that they know, they are the ones contributing to the abuse.

Tithes must come willingly, if it's given with so many qualifications, it's not a tithe, it's an obligation.

How do you think the City Havest scandal come about?

If we have the duty to spread the goods news then aren't we also have the duty to make sure that we don't feed the wrong shepard.

Let me make a daring assumption, can i say that the pastor you go see every Sunday morning is in fact the Devil himself? You won't know, you just believed that he's not because he's in a church. You don't hear voices in your head telling you "your pastor is not the Devil" but you have the feeling in you that you know he just isn't.

That's my point.

QUOTE(unknown warrior @ Jan 19 2016, 02:35 PM)
Erm...Shan, going to church is not something that needs some sort of calling from God, it's a given by God.

Hebrews 10:25 (KJV) - Not forsaking the assembling of ourselves together, as the manner of some is; but exhorting one another: and so much the more, as ye see the day approaching

But yeah I understand you're stalling because you're looking for the right Church. We all have to accept the fact there is no perfect Church that exist. There's always challenges in every Church, just that it varies from one church to another.

My advise is; just go to a nearby church, one that's near your home, as long as the Church is a Bible base Church and is not some weird cult, it's okay already. Who knows you may find another calling to serve there?
*
It's an obligation for a Christian to go church, this as much I know.

I also know that there's no perfect church, I just want to find a church with the less hypocrites possible because the previous ones I have been to is just waaaay to much to handle. No rush though. I just want a church in which I can find peace going to.
unknown warrior
post Jan 20 2016, 10:40 AM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 09:06 AM)
I know nobody is perfect but the church should at least bring forth the message of fellowship is also important. But its now too overfocus on serving in ministries and expanding kingdom. The church policy is, once you start serving, the blessing will come. I mean, what they trying to fool us with this message? This is like labour exploitation, man.

Correct me if I am wrong, the blessing as expoused by Paul means the feeling of self satisfaction and self fulfillingness. But the congregation gets fooled into thinking if they serve, then their need for something in their life will be fulfilled. Eg, if a person is feeling depressed or suicidal, he or she, by serving probably would  feel the emptiness be filled by Jesus but they don't feel that their problem is being addressed on why they feel that way in the first place? Praying is one way, but its only limited to altar call, the church does not prepare counselling services. Nor do they have proper bible study to strengthen the consumption of bread knowledge among brethren for equippng.

For me, its like feeling a belonging to the church, like a family. I mean if the church did try to put in an effort to foster fellowship but did not go down well with the congregation, I would understand. But there's no message, zilch, naada on fellowship and importance of feeling belonging to the church. All they just bother is to work the member till he is so dry and burn out. The church have multiplied cell groups until some of the them are the size of 3. The days when I used to go to church and cg was 20 and over, we used to have diversity, sit down during supper and talk about this n that, it was so exciting then. Now its like we go supper just the 3 or 4 of us. I go to church I feel like a stranger.
*
The Bible never specify that God's reward is one of self satisfaction and self fulfilling for working for Him. It is open Heaven to meet all of our needs. All means All.

Hebrews 6:10 (NIV) - God is not unjust; he will not forget your work and the love you have shown him as you have helped his people and continue to help them.

So what you're saying is that the people in the Church, they don't connect to you in a more personal level. Is it because you complain and argued with them once too often?
unknown warrior
post Jan 20 2016, 10:42 AM

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QUOTE(shaniandras2787 @ Jan 20 2016, 10:28 AM)
It's an obligation for a Christian to go church, this as much I know.

I also know that there's no perfect church, I just want to find a church with the less hypocrites possible because the previous ones I have been to is just waaaay to much to handle. No rush though. I just want a church in which I can find peace going to.
*
Why don't you see it this way, you go to Church to be of encouragement to others?
de1929
post Jan 20 2016, 11:22 AM

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QUOTE(shaniandras2787 @ Jan 20 2016, 10:28 AM)
I did not overlook both the theories, in fact, these theories did not come into consideration for me at all. It was you who brought up the theories with hopes to persuade me in that i shouldn't be bothered in how my tithes are being utilized (when the fact is obvious, it could be abused). I don't remember that i dragged the Holy Spirit into consideration as well but since you mentioned Continualism then I might as well talk in the same context as you so that you can understand better where I am coming from.

I'll never know whether it was the Holy Spirit talking to me or not, in fact, I don't think even think the Pope could swear in the name of God that the voices he hears in his head is the Holy Spirit or the Devil that is talking to him, he just needs to have faith that it was the Holy Spirit and hope for the best. The Holy Spirit is not a being, it's a manifestation hence it does not possess the likeness of men, it's an intuition, a feeling, a "hunch". It signals you when something is not right.

Have your pastor ever suggested to you that whenever you are in doubt, pray and eventually an answer will come to you? If you do not have an inner peace then do not proceed.

I'm sure you have been through this experience before and do you hear voices in your head which you are sure it's the Holy Spirit or you just suddenly feel that it's right to do what you have in mind? It's a feeling of "you know it's right". That's the Holy Spirit, it's a manifestation, something intangible, something cannot be seen. You require "faith" to believe in the Holy Spirit. Believing in the things unseen.

Do not give in because you fear because fear comes from the Devil. That I can assure you.

With that in mind, I can now answer your question.

1) how can I be sure that it was not the Devil that is asking me to stop tithing?
- very simple and you don't require 50 days of silent meditation to get an answer. when the facts are presented to you right in your face telling you that the tithes is now subject to the question of being abuse for certain particular individual gains and you feel uneasy. do you think it's the Devil who tells you to stop and start looking for another "shepard"? if that is your understanding then your idea of the Devil isn't all that bad.

- if we already feel uneasy during tithing and we are compelled to continue because we fear we may anger God then i need to confirm with you if we are referring to the same God. My God doesn't care if i tithe or not and He still stood by my side during my lowest point of life and lifted me up. My blessing is not a consequence of the monetary contribution I make to the church.

2) the bribery question
- your hypothetical question does not make sense and it's a bad example because it's requires you to question your morality rather than anything else. your moral obligation suggest that you should/must bribe to save the kid. there's nothing religious here. The decision is in your hands, the Holy Spirit or the Devil doesn't care whether the boy lives or die or what decision you choose. You make that decision based on your conscience and eventually you will choose to bribe because you fear the social repercussion against you if you didn't not.

The problem with many Christians nowadays is because they do what the general public think it's right but the biggest compelling force is fear. Pastors occasionally inflict fear subconsciously into the minds of people telling that if they don't tithe then prepare to go to hell when they die. People generally is afraid of death and the unknown so to many 10% is not a big amount so they rather pay that 10% than risk facing the unknown, they got "nothing to lose" and they have in mind, "if the tithe is abused, it's the pastor to answer, not me" but little that they know, they are the ones contributing to the abuse.

Tithes must come willingly, if it's given with so many qualifications, it's not a tithe, it's an obligation.

How do you think the City Havest scandal come about?

If we have the duty to spread the goods news then aren't we also have the duty to make sure that we don't feed the wrong shepard.

Let me make a daring assumption, can i say that the pastor you go see every Sunday morning is in fact the Devil himself? You won't know, you just believed that he's not because he's in a church. You don't hear voices in your head telling you "your pastor is not the Devil" but you have the feeling in you that you know he just isn't.

That's my point.
*
The whole writings is based on inner peace concept, which is good.
However inner peace is depends on your knowledge and understanding.
You will never have inner peace with things you don't understand.

you will never have inner peace with bribing, if you don't have bigger picture biggrin.gif... i give you how big a picture should be. Just watch from minute 53:00 to 55:00 and tell me bribing is right / wrong... then bill willson got peace or not biggrin.gif
De_Luffy
post Jan 20 2016, 06:01 PM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 02:31 PM)
If you really want to pursue the great commission, then you shouldn't be too afraid to share the gospel with the malays?

Did Jesus carried on his work even though his disciples may be suffering? No. When he say Peter's mother laid down there sick, he stopped all his work and healed her. Great commission without kindness = zero commission.

If missionaries miss out the genuine factor, then the people they are preaching to, will view them as fake.
*
Not to say, we don't want to preach to the malay but we're forbidden by law to do so.........

I think you have not grasped the reality of Great Commission, Great Commission true aims is to preach to all the world until Jesus came. Look at China, during the great revolutions, how many Chinese Christians were persecuted? How many goes underground?

Also please read what Jesus told the Apostles what would happened before His return back to earth.

1 thing just remain love one another, open your heart to other. Just because you don't feel it that way doesn't mean everyone must be the same.

You are not suited for big church, you should aim for smaller church
de1929
post Jan 20 2016, 06:40 PM

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QUOTE(De_Luffy @ Jan 20 2016, 06:01 PM)
Not to say, we don't want to preach to the malay but we're forbidden by law to do so.........

I think you have not grasped the reality of Great Commission, Great Commission true aims is to preach to all the world until Jesus came. Look at China, during the great revolutions, how many Chinese Christians were persecuted? How many goes underground?

Also please read what Jesus told the Apostles what would happened before His return back to earth.

1 thing just remain love one another, open your heart to other. Just because you don't feel it that way doesn't mean everyone must be the same.

You are not suited for big church, you should aim for smaller church
*
he blocked me, so whatever i write ended up whitescreen in his laptop.

if you wanna help him, just ask him first, how about breaking the law ? you shouldn't be too afraid to share the gospel with the malays?

This post has been edited by de1929: Jan 20 2016, 06:40 PM
De_Luffy
post Jan 20 2016, 07:08 PM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 06:33 PM)
You yourself answer the basic tenet, love one another. If church not emphasis on love one another, then how to have an effective Great Commission?

Everybody is following the DUMC formula for expansion, small or big, so what is the difference of moving to a smaller church which also want to focus on expansion rather than caring for one another.

No accountability at all, I once witnessed a cg member, he failed his subject, yet the cg not even bother to be accountable and help him back to his studies. Is this the kind of sample we want to tell to the rest out there? We see our brethren down but we don't care about him?
*
Not everyone is perfect, and Great Commission goals is not archived in just over night, it take years to complete or to say maybe a millennium the same applied to churches and cg's.
It require some time to change not to change in just few weeks it may take months to change.

Talking about missionaries, take example from Jesus, do you know how many years does He spend before He started His ministry? It take year and effort to blend in with the communities and how does their behaviors work, how to reach to them in the right way. just think about it. Everything need time to change.
unknown warrior
post Jan 20 2016, 08:41 PM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 06:43 PM)
You got my meaning wrong. I am saying church is telling members if they serve, all their self fulfillness and satisfaction will be covered. They do this by saying when you bless others, you will in turn be blessed. This is not right. No wonder so many get burn out. Its not a genuine message. Why can't church tell us, at least this is more honest, that we serve out of love and care for the people out there. We serve for we are God's people of love. Not because we want to get blessed as what the church is fooling us.

If Hebrews 6:10 applies then explain to me, why I have two christian elderly sisters who are still struggling in have their prayers answered? THe elder sister who have served for over 25 years for the church, praying everyday for her sister who is have mental problems from her depression. This sister is now 68 years old, have been taking the burden of caring her mentally unstable sister who is 60 years old, for almost all her life. She has actively served. Has she received the help to have her sister healed? Nope.

In actual fact, if you observe her sister, she looks normal, just that from her young adult days, she was afflicted with severe depression that caused her to loose her ability to function socially. She used to work in a bank, but since then, she has many mental flips and had to take medication periodically.

So the reward is not in this world we live in, am I right to say? Its in the eternal life.

But the church DUMC is still sending the wrong message, they are telling us that if we serve, our needs will be fulfilled. Such as single guys who yearn to start their own families, men n women who yearn to have a satisfactory career,  people who are afflicted with sickness...they think by serving their needs be fulfilled.

If I don't complain and argue, it still be the same situation. People are people, they won't acknowledge or give me credit for my ideas. But when I speak up, somehow they will go to people's subconscious mind and make them take up my ideas. Already New Creation Church have come out with Prosperity Blessing, because they notice how burn out people are from serving with this type of "Channel" of churches.
*
No the reward is also for the here and now. I have the scripture verse to prove that but I'm lazy to search for it now. It's there, trust me.

Otherwise why would Jesus says, ask and you shall receive?

What is the point of receiving in Heaven when it's already Heaven and there are no fallen world attributes there?

There are some factors as to why people don't receive their prayers. One of the reason is because you have an enemy resisting you and do not want your prayers answered.
skydrake
post Jan 20 2016, 09:12 PM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 07:18 PM)
You know there was a time the Great Commission was going in the wrong direction. Do you recall when the King of Spain colonized South America and tried to christianized the whole continent? Ended up the local population was brutalized, persecuted and their own kingdoms destroyed (Inca and Mayan empire), ravaged by disease brought by Europeans and have their local resources plundered.

And what about the Spanish Inquisition? Jews were brutally murdered and tortured because they stuck to their own faith. Was this how to win the hearts and minds of unbelievers and win them over to Christ?

Everything needs time, but if the car is moving the wrong direction, then whatever time is needed is all going to waste.

So in the same sense, if churches stop focusing on caring, kindness and fellowship to one another, we will lose sight of the Great Commission. What good use, if we have the heart to win more souls but we damn our own brethren as if they are strangers?

I am not expecting perfection, of course, at times the church may not have people who are following 100% of what they preach, but at least move in the right direction.
*
Hi brother Kron_ka, I have read quite few replies of your but I did not getting the full information u trying to tell. Perhaps I'm a lousy reader rclxub.gif
If I was not mistaken u guys a debating churches problem? or your own problem? Pls don't be offended first, this is a question and it means I do not knows what happen in all your replies which some I had read some I might missed. Most of them is pointed to the churches, peoples, environment, teaching methods faults? Am I right? Please advice again if you don't mind? I just wants to be clearer before joining in the conversation. biggrin.gif
unknown warrior
post Jan 20 2016, 10:42 PM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 10:38 PM)
I don't think so. How can an enemy be resisting and not answering the prayers of those people I see who so committed to the church?

For eg, I know this guy who is so committed to serving the church. He spends like his whole weekends on helping the poor, needy and even serving church at various ministries. He wakes up at 4:30 am goes to church just to pray and meditate. Yet he is afflicted by skin problems, ezcema. He claims that he is completely healed from ezcema due to his strict diet of chia seeds and goes for intestine cleaning. But his skin looks gaunt and discoloured. His yearning for a wife is not answered. He is already 45 years old. He quit his social job of helping needy to go and work as internal auditor, but after 6 months, they weren't happy with his performance and didn;t confirm him. HE fell in love with a girl at church, but it took him 2 years to go after her. He realized that she wasn't for him, when she got married.

Disaster after disaster. You telling me that an enemy is resisting him? He still holds on to God and he prays fervently, he is still very positive about life despite his suffering.

I don't think he is ever going to get his prayers answered. I think the ask and you shall receive, somehow was taken out of context. Perhaps you got to check what you're asking if its in Godly intentions first. Or else, I be asking God for a lamborgini.
*
There is such a thing as the enemy resisting your prayers.

In the book of Daniel; Daniel 10:13, An angel appeared to the Prophet Daniel and explained one of the principalities resisted Him.

Lamborghini No, but Healing Yes.
tinarhian
post Jan 20 2016, 10:49 PM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 08:48 AM)
He ask that way, because he wants to find out what makes me tick. Then when I say something, then his wife will have a big debate with me, she trying to change me to their ways. I not saying she is entirely wrong but its her strong personality, she is quite strong willed. My cg leader is a very successful businesman, he is rich but he has trouble dealing with his wife at times, because she is very opiniated. But i can say she has good intentions.

Change start with me? I been doing that since day 1. Sian already. Feels like a lone wolf. Calling up fellow single chrisitan guys at church for yam cha, praying for them, in turn they just treat me like ATM, tell me off to pay the restaurant bill, what cheapskate. So much for camarderie.

Have set of problems also doesn't mean they can blast it at other people. What are they? 10 yr old? I know one cg leader, just because his gf left him, he go behave like anal all over. Go into his new car, have to bath first after cycling, this one cannot, that one cannot. Then makan with him, he go and spit the satay on the table, no table manners at all, he say its the fat he don't want to eat. I belanja him satay, ask him how many he want to order. He say lets order 15 sticks. Then he eat only 4, he say "nah the rest is yours". Blady hell, is this the kind of brotherhood spirit church is expousing these days?
*
Of course the change has to start with you since you are adamant that those church members are a bunch of assholes. Either initiate change or move out.

99% of the time people won't change you know that. So you can pretend to be nice with them, play dumb or move to another church.

I hope you are not suffering from work stress because everytime you talk about your church you tend to complaint a lot. hehe...

I don't want to beat around the bush so since its really that BAD, better get out while you still can. ohmy.gif

I hope your next church won't be as bad as this current one.


unknown warrior
post Jan 20 2016, 11:04 PM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 10:52 PM)
then why are there so many christians at my church, their prayers are not answered?

They are made to believe that they have to serve more and go for more altar calls to remove their ailments or have their needs answered.

What principality could be holding them? My auntie who is active at DUMC, dedicated her whole life to Christ. She yearns for a man in her life, but never find, she also suffers from pimple ailments, today her face is all scarred. But yet being raised by her 8 years when I was young, I never ever notice anything that's holding her back.

How is it possible that a big shot, implicated in the murder of woman and found billions in his bank account, can receive more blessings than those who serve the church so fervently?

How do you explain Stephen being stoned to death, when all he ever wanted was for people to believe his message? He faced obstacles and got stoned because of principalities resisting him?
*
Few factors.

I believe mainly it's wrong understanding of the principals of the Bible which is also a sort of Wrong type of Faith, ie believing wrong can lead to this.

another common factor; when a person still hold on to unforgiveness or grudges...gives the devil opportunity.

another one is persistent Faith, many give up after some years without realizing the enemy also resisted that many years.

Who's that big shot?

Stephen? It was timed for Him to go. Read Psalm 139:16 (NIV) - Your eyes saw my unformed body; all the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be.

What this verse means is that every person have his beginning and end. For stephen that point in time, is time for you Him to go back to the Father and that is a blessing, not to be seen as something bad.

This post has been edited by unknown warrior: Jan 21 2016, 07:49 AM
skydrake
post Jan 20 2016, 11:05 PM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 10:52 PM)
then why are there so many christians at my church, their prayers are not answered?

They are made to believe that they have to serve more and go for more altar calls to remove their ailments or have their needs answered.

What principality could be holding them? My auntie who is active at DUMC, dedicated her whole life to Christ. She yearns for a man in her life, but never find, she also suffers from pimple ailments, today her face is all scarred. But yet being raised by her 8 years when I was young, I never ever notice anything that's holding her back.

How is it possible that a big shot, implicated in the murder of woman and found billions in his bank account, can receive more blessings than those who serve the church so fervently?

How do you explain Stephen being stoned to death, when all he ever wanted was for people to believe his message? He faced obstacles and got stoned because of principalities resisting him?
*
brother, I had quote u a question but u did not reply. Is ok, for this reply here I really got something to ask.

As u had mentioned why all those prayers are not answered, I would like to ask as below;

1. Do u really knows what they had prayed? U seriously knows all the contents they had prayed in their prayers?

2. Do u really think that God answer ours prayer as in OUR desire wishes only? If it is, means God is like a fortune tree rather than a God that's care and give us the best to make us change?

I'm not debating, but asking for clearer advice. thx

This post has been edited by skydrake: Jan 21 2016, 10:01 AM
De_Luffy
post Jan 21 2016, 12:09 AM

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QUOTE(kron_ka @ Jan 20 2016, 07:18 PM)
You know there was a time the Great Commission was going in the wrong direction. Do you recall when the King of Spain colonized South America and tried to christianized the whole continent? Ended up the local population was brutalized, persecuted and their own kingdoms destroyed (Inca and Mayan empire), ravaged by disease brought by Europeans and have their local resources plundered.

And what about the Spanish Inquisition? Jews were brutally murdered and tortured because they stuck to their own faith. Was this how to win the hearts and minds of unbelievers and win them over to Christ?

Everything needs time, but if the car is moving the wrong direction, then whatever time is needed is all going to waste.

So in the same sense, if churches stop focusing on caring, kindness and fellowship to one another, we will lose sight of the Great Commission. What good use, if we have the heart to win more souls but we damn our own brethren as if they are strangers?

I am not expecting perfection, of course, at times the church may not have people who are following 100% of what they preach, but at least move in the right direction.
*
Do you read the whole the bible or do you understand the bible at all?

https://www.biblegateway.com/passage/?searc...024&version=NIV
de1929
post Jan 21 2016, 07:29 AM

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good job guys n girls... keep brushing up this kronny... save him from his stupidity...
de1929
post Jan 21 2016, 08:24 AM

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If you continue in MY word, you are MY disciples

Kan from australia quotes John 8:31
http://biblehub.com/john/8-31.htm

Who is Kan, he is a member at this forum, and below is our conversation:
http://www.worthychristianforums.com/topic...comment-2317802
TSpehkay
post Jan 21 2016, 10:39 AM

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oo;; Not sure why did you posted from the forum conversation but it seems that Kan misunderstood the word, "continuationism".

This post has been edited by pehkay: Jan 21 2016, 10:39 AM
De_Luffy
post Jan 21 2016, 10:57 AM

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QUOTE(pehkay @ Jan 21 2016, 10:39 AM)
oo;; Not sure why did you posted from the forum conversation but it seems that Kan misunderstood the word, "continuationism".
*
Hello good morning bro Pehkay, whom did you mentioned about? hmm.gif
TSpehkay
post Jan 21 2016, 11:13 AM

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QUOTE(De_Luffy @ Jan 21 2016, 10:57 AM)
Hello good morning bro Pehkay, whom did you mentioned about? hmm.gif
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Morning bro!

biggrin.gif I did not quote de1929's post before.
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