As I'm aware:
1x bw bench = Intermediate
1.5x bw bench = Advance
2x bw bench = Elite

1.5x bw squat = Intermediate
2x bw squat = Advance

These are very standard across alot forums.

I feel "gym experience" is useless. I had a friend/workout partner who gym'ed for 8 months +. After 8 months he could not even bench press his bodyweight and didn't look like he lift. He was a tall, big boned gifted mesomorph. Once after 8+ months into "training" he asked me... "Armesh, what is calorie? Apple got calorie ah?", I will remember that question until I die.

Then there's the "abangs" in my gym including the gym owner who's been lifting like 6~8 years I not sure. Steroid user. He talks/beliefs/advocates crap like "mass untuk sizing, protein untuk cutting" and tells me to bulk on mass gainers cause then 80% of the weight gained will be muscle compared to food only 20% muscle. Then there's also this fat guys who's been training maybe like 3 years, look like shit and heir 1RM bench is ~ their bodyweight. It's a horrible broscience environment. Nobody knows what is a small surplus.

So this is why I normally use the Powerlifting standards to categorize people. The bench is pretty accurate, 2x body-weight bench is truly an elite feat, and I use relative strength cause you can't cheat relative strength, it locks you.

I exclusively very strictly take all my advice from elite natural lifters who are almost at their genetic max, cause they are truly experienced in lifting. A natural who attains a 1.5x bodyweight bench in 1 year of training is light years ahead of knowledge compared to some fat guy who run bro splits, trains for pump and get 225lbs bench after 2 years.

Err but Pacman lost while big mouth Mayweather won....

Arrogant, big ego, show off. I'm just called this cause I'm not big, like a double standard whereby a skinny guy cant give advice even if its right. I don't give dumb crap advice. If I do you can point it out.

SL is pure rubbish while ICF 5x5 is absolute trash. Please don't do either.
Do this instead: http://forum.bodybuilding.com/showthread.php?t=159678631

Doing fullbody 3x/ week in 3 years will give you equal results of doing bro-splits 4~5x/week for 5 years. Bro-splits are not optimum, progress is much slower due to frequency issue. Your chest does not take 7 fucking days to recover and doing 5 different exercises for chest will just make you improve slower on key exercises. Fullbody can direct focus on key lifts like flat bench, incline bench, weighted pullups and be godlike in 3 years.

Here is my beginner journey: https://www.facebook.com/SkinnyToBuff90day

I ran my own program that I wrote myself. I am now Intermediate lifter able to bench slightly above my body-weight.

Just don't bother la bro      Even if u said that he still gonna be arrogant skinny prick

Quit falmming lar. The standards we put on ourselfs are very personal. Especially in bodybuilding where there is no 1 universal scale. Alex from Alpha Destiny considers anyone who can't bench 225×5, squat 315×5, and deadlift 405×5 a beginner, Greg from Kinobody only considers you elite if you can incline bench 1.25*bw for 5 reps, 0.55*bw pullups for 5 reps and 0.9 x bw OHP for 5 reps. Exrx strength standards scale is also different.

That's why I even made the scale I was using clear on page 1. So as you see my "intermediate" meaning is much lower in standards compared to your meaning of "intermediate". Heck, to me you're more like an elite lifter. It's a personal thing and you can't simply insult someone when they already made clear the scale they are using, which in my case is a shitty ~132lbs bench. I never fake claimed any absurd lifts, and there's nothing to be proud of my shitty lifts.
Yet you proudly advertise yourself as an INTERMEDIATE lifter who could BENCH 1xBW. If you feel that is your own personal thing, keep it personal. When you BOASTING that to other people, these people says you are an EGOISTIC. Same goes with a 15yo girl who had sex with 3 man in a single night and boasting about it, people will call her slut. Nothing good will come from boasting.


It's like I say you're  a fake liar cause you claim yourself "intermediate" lifter cause I consider you as elite. But of course I won't say that cause to your eyes "elite" may mean a different thing.
When you call someone an elite but he's actually an intermediate, that means you have your 'athlete level' is on a low scale. That's the issue here. You boasting said you are intermediate when it's your personal thing but the majority said you are not. Just accept that and keep your low scale athlete level to yourself. And if you said ah_sunkat is elite, then who is your so called elite that you learn exclusively from? 


For me being humble is simply knowing there are people around you that might know more than you and opening/reading books, workout journals, articles of people better than you cause there is conform somethings you dunno. Even in this forum got like 3~4+ members far ahead than me.
I really think you should read and find the correct meaning of being humble.

Really curious how much your GF can lift on key lifts. Girls who train real are 1 in a million.
How do you know? How big is your network till you can say that? You have never been to a powerlifting meet, never been to a BB convention, never watched a BB events, never been to strongmen competition, never know what a 100 meter sprinter do in their training (and obviously they squat). It's a shit assumption by you and you have no data to prove it and you can say that because you are not being realistic in your life (Malay proverbs said, "tidak berpijak di bumi yang nyata).

yes, for fat-beginners, it is possible to grow muscle and lose fat and gain strength all at the same time even on a caloric deficit.
as a beginner, when you lift heavy, you will grow muscle, when you grow muscle, you will gain strength, when you gain strength, your metabolism will increase, when your metabolism increase, you will burn energy which may come from fat.

your energy and calorie needed for the protein synthesis to happen will come from your body fat (until a certain level). just eat enough protein, base on your diet, its not enough protein for a guy as large as you.

lift heavy, eat well. it will all come down together.

Dafuq is all this, I came in here to look for advice for beginner lifters/recommended programme. But what I see is all argument. 

Just asking, any link or name of the programme best suit beginner lifters(just started for like 2 months). I am skinny to begin with, and of course with belly fat like everyone does.
I can see that many people recommend SL 5x5, is there any other recommended programme? I am aiming to gain strength, and muscle as well.

Oh, thanks in advance.

My area yea. It's ALOOOT. If the guy is 70+ kg, 10% bf, 90% chance he conform take one. You can just talk to some guys and easily get it. Sometimes they'll be just talking about their use in open. My area are all ghetto gyms.

Need to have conversations and screen this guys first.

Of course can. Even 75KG 8% bodyfat also 100% can naturally. If good genetics even 80kg can.

But there's 2 ways to reach there... and majority uses the fast way, if you know what i mean.