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 Income Tax on Foreign Salary Income?, Work in Home in Malaysia.

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Hansel
post Nov 17 2021, 08:34 PM

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QUOTE(MUM @ Nov 17 2021, 08:20 PM)
bear with me abit longer,...

regarding your this input,...."I was just focussed on what activities were incurred to generate the income.
Factors as in :
where were the activities generated,
who were involved in the activities,
what resources used and the like.

If the factors here have NOTHING at all to do with Msia, then,..... that income generated does NOT berpunca dari Msia."

i read this article,...
https://www.theedgemarkets.com/article/delo...xation-malaysia

"As for the impact on individuals, Deloitte Malaysia said one common situation involves rental income earned by a Malaysian tax resident from a real property located outside of Malaysia.

Citing a rental income from Singapore as an example, Deloitte Malaysia said, this income is an FSI and would not be taxed in Malaysia presently, but from Jan 1 next year, the income remitted to Malaysia would be taxed.

“In this case, both countries have the right to tax.
To avoid double taxation on the same rental, Malaysia, being the country of residence, would grant foreign tax credit based on a prescribed formula that takes into account the taxes paid in Singapore against the Malaysian tax payable,” it said.
However, it noted, the Malaysian resident landlord would still need to pay the net tax to the Malaysian government."

from the above example in that article,...
Factors as in :
where were the activities generated, ....Spore
who were involved in the activities, Rental income in Spore
what resources used and the like. Properties. in Spore..

Thus the factors here have NOTHING at all to do with Msia, and,..... that income generated does NOT berpunca dari Msia."......but according to that article,...the income remitted to Malaysia would be taxed.  rclxub.gif
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You are right in what you wrote in the above, Mum,... absolutely right.

Well,... what Deloitte wrote was before what came out this evening in The Malay Mail. What came out this evening in The Malay Mail contradicts with what were announced by the IRB earlier (hence, I asked the question : what happened to remitted back to Msia ?), and Delloitte's comments above were based on what were written earlier.

If you look closely at the different comments by the different accounting firms, they started to use the same terms after we used them here in this forum, as in the different taxation systems, etc,... looks like our discussions here are front-running their articles.
Hansel
post Nov 17 2021, 08:38 PM

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QUOTE(Ramjade @ Nov 17 2021, 08:24 PM)
I think should make it simple. Any money remitted back to Malaysia if not from investment should be taxed while investment remain tax free. Unlikely my voice will be heard. Oh well.
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What was written this evening in The Malay Mail implies that IRB wants to assess AND TAX ALL incomes generated from resources in Msia regardless of whether you remit the monies back to Msia or not !

The message is totally different from what were disseminated earlier,...

There is no more mention of the expression : remitted back to Msia !

This is bad !!
Hansel
post Nov 18 2021, 12:02 AM

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QUOTE(MUM @ Nov 17 2021, 08:48 PM)
found that article,..

Implications on Malaysian Investment Funds
Malaysian funds that invest abroad will also be disadvantaged, as the foreign income remitted by the funds is now taxable.
Investors may then invest through foreign funds or foreign vehicles, instead of Malaysian funds, as the additional tax cost will reduce the investment returns.
Ultimately, this would result in movement of funds abroad to invest in foreign funds.
The proposal introduced in Budget 2022 exempts non-residents from income tax on foreign income remitted into Malaysia.
https://www.theedgemarkets.com/article/look...nsourced-income

found this new one too....more detailed,,,
Budget 2022: Impact on investment management

excerpt,
The repeal of this exemption could have significant implications on the post-tax returns of investment vehicles in Malaysia that have built up a portfolio in non-Malaysian securities and instruments.

Where these investments currently provided tax exempt income in the form of foreign interest, coupon, and dividends; moving forward, this income would be taxable at 24% effective from Jan 1, 2022.

In the short term, this means a 24% haircut on the investment returns of these vehicles will be borne by the investors when the profits are distributed.

https://www.thestar.com.my/business/busines...ment-management
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24% haircut shocking.gif sad.gif ,... hmm,... all these years when I KEPT ADVOCATING Msians to open foreign accounts, bank and brokerage, etc,... is RIGHT !
Hansel
post Nov 18 2021, 12:06 AM

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QUOTE(dwRK @ Nov 17 2021, 09:00 PM)
eh... this thread suddenly hot n heavy... smile.gif

no. if you expat/tax residence outside... and say got rental income in Malaysia... quite sure a lot of ppl don't disclose, lari tax n send money out... we're supposed to pay non-residence flat rate tax... des why they talk about punca di Malaysia and penalties...

this is different from some of the other discussion here... separate topic from foreign sourced income...
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Bro,.. to this topic we are talking here,... it's hard to write. We're going in separate directions. Anyway,...

To ur second paragraph,.. I know very well what yu are talking abt,... many pals in Aus doing this,...but I can't understand how you relate this to punca di Malaysia,...

To ur third paragraph, you are right. It's quite a different matter,... but you can relate too,.. why, because, you were the one who said this earlier,... what abt the money we sent out earlier and then bring back in 2022 and beyond ? Why shld we be taxed for our own money here, right ?
Hansel
post Nov 18 2021, 03:48 PM

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QUOTE(dwRK @ Nov 18 2021, 01:27 PM)
but the other big question is... what the heck are these?
and this...
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Bro,...

Think I'll reply to your curiosity here first. After reading that article a few times and discussing with my pals today,... that article is meant more for companies that derive foreign income from their overseas customers and clients. The goods and services 'sold' to those overseas customers were 'produced' in Msia.

But when payment is made,... the funds were 'parked' in overseas accounts,... biggrin.gif

IRB going after these companies now.
Hansel
post Nov 18 2021, 03:54 PM

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Wanting to thank Tehoice here for the good updates shared with us from his seminar,....

Bros,... I think IRB has a lot of work to do after this. I honestly doubt the tax officer will chk all our documents to justify whether to grant exemption or not.
Hansel
post Nov 18 2021, 04:10 PM

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QUOTE(Vector88 @ Nov 18 2021, 03:54 PM)
Thanks @tehoice, a little clearer now.

1) Capital gain not taxable
2) dividend taxable
3) If both forever not remitted back to MY, then not taxable, correct ar ?
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Emm,... based on the latest article of subject published in Malay Mail yesterday, if the income of the company concerned 'berpunca dari Msia', you have to report it. But there is NO mention that you must remit it back to Msia.

The above income will be assessed accordingly, in good faith between Jan to July 2022, and with additional assessment and penalty after that, but again, there is no mention whether the company is compelled to transmit back the funds to Msia.

Assessment will prepare the amt that needed toi be taxed,... BUT the issue here is the point of taxation is ONLY upon remittance back to Msia. Assessing and actually collecting tax are two different things.

So,.. in principle, your No 3) statement is right !
Hansel
post Nov 19 2021, 05:10 PM

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QUOTE(dwRK @ Nov 19 2021, 09:45 AM)
thanks bro... I slept on this a while, I came up with similar answer smile.gif
when IRB uses the term permastautin, they usually refers to individual residents, not companies...so your friends slightly off here...

1st para example, they can ask USA, give them all W8Ben on Malaysian and any income taxes paid, maybe even bank account number and values... but for countries that you have no tax, financial or banking presence, it will be almost impossible for IRB to check

2nd para ties in with below...
the 3% doesn't cover local source income parked offshore for ya2021 onwards... current law is you need to include in your filing and pay your individual tax rate anyways because it's locally sourced... just in case some smart ass try to be funny, IRB put this extra warning to ppl...the "belum dilaporkan" from 2nd para refers to the filing...

anyways gonna chill n wait for faq...

cheers
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Tq first, bro,....

It's hard to write and debate ilke this,... that's why sometimes, when discussions become complicated, I'd rather drop-off,... we can't talk face-to-face anyway.

I was earlier referring to that article three days ago in The Malay Mail, which was published at 10.30pm that night. THat article was solely in English. That article,... like I mentioned,... is more targetted for companies, not individuals.

In your texts above, you are using the word : pemastautin, a Malay word. This word came up from a different article, which was not discussed with my pals. My pals wouldn't
t be wrong then if they were only commenting on the English article from The Malay Mail. That's all,... anyway,.. I'm not here to defend my friends, bro,... lame activity here,...

Better talk abt : pemastautin. YES - you are right, when this word in used, it normally refers to an individual person,... but,.... emm,.... if you look at some documents in the IRB website, could be referring to companies and businesses too.
Hansel
post Nov 19 2021, 05:14 PM

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Bros - CRS or whatever similar instruments,... not so canggih to dig-out everything-lar,... you know how much work involved ? You think foreign fella wants to do so easily ar ?

Unless, they zoom down to your name,... then I don't know-lar,...

Eg,.... When you write your TIN in some borang, write a stupid number,... nobody cares.

OKay,... above are jibes,... gibberish writings,... you can ignore if you wished to.
Hansel
post Nov 19 2021, 05:25 PM

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QUOTE(TOS @ Nov 18 2021, 06:33 PM)
You guys may want to look at this too:

https://www.hasil.gov.my/bt_goindex.php?bt_...=5000&bt_sequ=2

Scope of Taxation

An individual who is resident in Malaysia is taxable on all income accruing in or derived from Malaysia and on [b]income received from outside Malaysia. The scope of taxation of an individual depends on his resident status.[/B]

I should read it as "income received from outside Malaysia" upon remittance?
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QUOTE(MUM @ Nov 18 2021, 06:39 PM)
i read as by refering to the way the sentence are framed....YES.
if not yet remit from outside, then means not yet received in M'sia
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I can't open that article,... my computer here blocking,....

Concerning those two stetements under that title : 'Scope of Taxation' in that article,... thwn I will do this : things are out of my hands. I will not remit back, and I will not report nor declare. If indeed there is a tax on income received from outside Msia,... and the sentence stops like that, then tax authority must do a process called T.A.S.. They must do,.... not I do anymore.

If, on the other hand, I remit back, then I will declare whatever I remit back, and perform as required under the new Finance Bill.

Looks like things keep changing everyday,... like I said earlier,... what happened to the expression : upon remittence ? This expression is not mentioned anywhere anymore in recent public articles. This is very dodgy,....
Hansel
post Nov 19 2021, 06:06 PM

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QUOTE(dwRK @ Nov 19 2021, 05:51 PM)
thanks for replying bro... no worries lah, yum cha easy to talk... ding dong here troublesome ... I just gonna chill out lah... weekend already... got better things to do man than talk tax... smile.gif
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Yes bro,... you are right,.... thumbup.gif thumbup.gif biggrin.gif
Hansel
post Dec 16 2021, 02:57 PM

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I believe the focus will be on corporations and companies first before they turn to individuals.

"Collect from the larger cashcows first".
Hansel
post Dec 17 2021, 09:29 PM

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QUOTE(Ramjade @ Dec 17 2021, 12:04 AM)
Nah I think they try to squeeze everybody. Theres a an article somewhere in this forum mentioned people working in sg who remit money back will be tax.
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I'll counter you first. Wanna squeeze everybody also need to take turns,... They don't have an unlimited workforce,.. they also need to take turns to squeeze one by one.

So,... in the grand scheme of things,... whoever stands out will be squeezed first, right ?
Hansel
post Dec 17 2021, 09:42 PM

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QUOTE(TOS @ Dec 16 2021, 11:30 AM)
If you receive "income" from HK, that is taxable starting from 2022 in Malaysia (you still need to file for taxes in HK). So you need to file for foreign income tax beginning next year in Malaysia, apart from HK. Don't worry about double taxation as tax treaties will come into play. https://phl.hasil.gov.my/pdf/pdfam/HKDTA_25042018.pdf
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No, bro,... pls don't misinterpret. You do not need to file for foreign income tax in Msia BECAUSE Msia does not practise a Residential Taxation System.

Msia will start practising a Hybrid Taxation System from YA2022, which is a form of Territorial Taxation System.

You only need to declare what you remit in,... AND in the process, you need to justify why that amt may not be taxed. That's all.


Hansel
post Dec 17 2021, 09:44 PM

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QUOTE(MUM @ Dec 17 2021, 06:48 PM)
just read this....just out today

SOALAN LAZIM BERKAITAN PROGRAM KHAS PEREMITAN PENDAPATAN (PKPP)
KEPADA PEMASTAUTIN DI MALAYSIA YANG MEMPUNYAI PENDAPATAN YANG
DISIMPAN DI LUAR NEGARA
( Dikeluarkan pada 17 Disember 2021 )

https://phl.hasil.gov.my/pdf/pdfam/FAQ_PKPP_2.pdf

mentioned ....individual tax payer.....or others including, (this "or others including") will means anything, everything ?? sweat.gif  rclxub.gif  cry.gif
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Hmm,... this is bad, 'dan lain-lain' can mean capital gains too,....

They shld use the words : 'kecuali (etc, etc),...'
Hansel
post Dec 17 2021, 09:55 PM

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QUOTE(jack2 @ Dec 17 2021, 07:12 PM)
If brought in 100k RM, RM3000 terbang mad.gif
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QUOTE(MUM @ Dec 17 2021, 07:14 PM)
alot MORE if after 30 June 2022  cry.gif  cry.gif
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I suggest,.... better not bring anything back between Jan and Jun 2022, in order not to 'create a need for filling-up that declaration form which will make you stand-out'. If you need your foreign income to maintain your quality of life in Msia,... bring back before December 31st this year.

Starting from July 2022,.... your foreign income forms part of your local income declaration already,... then it's business as usual subsequently from the point of view of declaring taxes. If yu guys say : a lot more after 30 June 2022,... then you are already a high-income earner,...

And that 24% will kick-in to your foreign income remitted back because,... well,.... you need to use so much money in Msia, right ?

If you don't need to use so much money in Msia,... then you won't be taxed so much on what you make overseas. If you cut down on your expenses in Msia,.. and spend more overseas,...well,.... you do the maths,...

And finally,... I suspect the RM will weaken further if the BNM does not increase BLR. So,... whatever you remit back will earn you more RM for the same amt remitted previously. So,... your buying pwr will be stronger come next year onwards.

Just some suggestions,....
Hansel
post Dec 17 2021, 09:59 PM

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QUOTE(dwRK @ Dec 17 2021, 09:53 PM)
capital and profits not covered by pkpp... i read that as not subject to tax

if foreign tax has been paid...can claim tax credits
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Ok,... tq for clarifying, bro,... this means if you are bringing back capital and profits, no need to fill up the declaration form, right ?
Hansel
post Dec 17 2021, 10:07 PM

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QUOTE(dwRK @ Dec 17 2021, 10:01 PM)
correct

B3. Sekiranya pendapatan yang diremitkan adalah terbit dari laba/keuntungan modal, adakah tertakluk kepada PKPP?
Pendapatan yang disimpan di luar negara yang diremitkan ke Malaysia dan bersifat modal adalah TIDAK tertakluk kepada PKPP.
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Great news, bro,... thank you,...

I think other forummers here need to thank bro DWRK too for this critical piece of news. Well,... it's critical for me,....don't know abt you guys,... so, if I am questioned for whatever I transfer back,.. and I have the documents to prove I bought into something and then later, I sold the same thing for a profit and the amt I remit back lies within that profit range, it's capital gain !

Cool....
Hansel
post Dec 18 2021, 03:40 PM

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QUOTE(TOS @ Dec 17 2021, 11:30 PM)
Another question from me is, if I receive dividends/interests and don't plan to/have not remitted them back to Malaysia, I don't need to file for tax right?

(I know I don't need to pay anything, but what about "filing"? I was told "filing" for tax is not the same as "paying" for tax.)
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You only file what is assessable and then taxable.

If you file more than is necessary, then you are revealing more than you need to, and the assessment officer will have more than the proper work to do.
Hansel
post Dec 18 2021, 03:43 PM

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QUOTE(dwRK @ Dec 17 2021, 11:14 PM)
don't forget your dividends have been subjected to wht... you can claim credit for this... so the top up tax is not that much lah even if need to pay... and for US investors paying 30% wht... no need to pay anymore...

issue is no tax treaty with US... but i think IRB will close one eye here...
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Somehow, I feel these claims that you will be forwarding will have a hard time convincing the officer not to tax us more than what will be subjected to.

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