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> Block on content usage from Paultan.org

se7en
post Feb 10 2015, 11:43 AM, updated 4y ago

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We have just been told off in a somewhat abrupt manner that the F&F section is using stolen content from Paultan.org. As such, we will no longer be allowing content and links from the said site to be posted across the forum to avoid any legal action from the owners.

user posted image
Quazacolt
post Feb 10 2015, 12:03 PM

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well, it's a pity that this happens.
however we can't fault on his statement and considering is stand point and at the end of the day his site is his income.

just wish he could have put it in a better manner or something.

=edit =
Typo

This post has been edited by Quazacolt: Feb 10 2015, 12:33 PM
xin
post Feb 10 2015, 12:05 PM

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Would it not be better to block off url linking from Paul Tan's site instead.
mystvearn
post Feb 10 2015, 12:20 PM

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QUOTE(xin @ Feb 10 2015, 12:05 PM)
Would it not be better to block off url linking from Paul Tan's site instead.
*
Can moderators do this? Se7ven can do this? Put code in forum to automatically detect paultan's website and prohibit from posting? This is the best solution because, even if this topic is pinned, people will still put paultan's link in the forums regardless forgetful or just no source left.

After doing a search for "paultan", here is what I found:
https://forum.lowyat.net/index.php?act=Sear...ighlite=paultan


1. Most F&F articles refer to Paultan's website. Very rare to find a citation outherwise. Meaning links all go back to <link removed>
2. Hotlinking to images happen. Mostly put the full link linking back to Paultan's site. Very rare to find image/item taken without link back.
3. However, since people already copy paste the entire article, there is no need to go to Paultan regardless of having link. I can see this happening too.
4. Defaming Paultan happens. For some reason, is happening a lot recently. Especially in Kopitiam forums. Very rare to find it previously.


I can understand why he wants content removed. I pun sakit hati if someone hotlink to my site, then badmouth me in another forum. At the end of the day, ads = money. If you discuss paultan stuff in lowyat. Put link once, then continue discussion/disagreement, then LYN will get income, since people forget the Paultan link and discuss here. You have some people who don't agree with their view, then bash them here.

I can see a slight decrees in <link removed> traffic from lyn topics. Mind you, some discussions are held in F&F and some in Kopitiam section.

EDIT: Fantastic job to admin! The <link removed> were only just mentioning p aultan. org

This post has been edited by mystvearn: Feb 10 2015, 12:22 PM
se7en
post Feb 10 2015, 12:26 PM

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The automatic removal applies to hot linked images. Without the proper link, the images won't appear, so no issue on it being 'stolen' or used without permission.

We will also be removing any content taken from there, regardless of whether its has a link back or not.

We take these kind of allegations very seriously, and if the content owner feels that the content should not be reproduce elsewhere, then we will ensure it isn't.
fantasy1989
post Feb 10 2015, 12:59 PM

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so now cannot copy content of paultan even attach with sos?
xin
post Feb 10 2015, 01:18 PM

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QUOTE(fantasy1989 @ Feb 10 2015, 12:59 PM)
so now cannot copy content of paultan even attach with sos?
*
i guess that's what Paul Tan is trying to imply in his rather impulsive post. Wonder why not Paultan's website just disable to rightclick function, that would cut down the tremendous hot linking of urls and images.
fantasy1989
post Feb 10 2015, 01:27 PM

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QUOTE(xin @ Feb 10 2015, 01:18 PM)
i guess that's what Paul Tan is trying to imply in his rather impulsive post. Wonder why not Paultan's website just disable to rightclick function, that would cut down the tremendous hot linking of urls and images.
*
nod.gif nod.gif nod.gif
chemistry101
post Feb 10 2015, 03:08 PM

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I browse Paultan blog only for obtaining first hand information such as specs and prices. I don't heed his personal comment.

Vios 4AT is proven reliable. Sad but true. Hahahahaaaa...
alanyuppie
post Feb 10 2015, 03:18 PM

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QUOTE(mystvearn @ Feb 10 2015, 01:20 PM)
4. Defaming Paultan happens. For some reason, is happening a lot recently. Especially in Kopitiam forums. Very rare to find it previously.

*
But then again... his blog /website contains alot of no-holds barred zero-value comments /one-liners and some potentially misleading and defamatory as well.




paultantk
post Feb 10 2015, 03:31 PM

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Hi

I am very sorry if this offends anyone in the F&F forum, not intentional.

What I actually meant in my Facebook post by "that forum" is the kopitiam forum, not F&F

The context of my comment is a thread in kopitiam where multiple defamatory messages were posted about our editorial team.


This post has been edited by paultantk: Feb 10 2015, 03:55 PM
Quazacolt
post Feb 10 2015, 04:16 PM

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QUOTE(paultantk @ Feb 10 2015, 03:31 PM)
Hi

I am very sorry if this offends anyone in the F&F forum, not intentional.

What I actually meant in my Facebook post by "that forum" is the kopitiam forum, not F&F

The context of my comment is a thread in kopitiam where multiple defamatory messages were posted about our editorial team.
*
Thanks for clarifying Mr Paul thumbup.gif

and yes i do agree that the kopitiam section and burn for all i care.
it has degenerated into a cesspool that's been the headache of LYN (especially the mods/staffs) for a long time now.
mystvearn
post Feb 10 2015, 05:06 PM

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QUOTE(alanyuppie @ Feb 10 2015, 03:18 PM)
But then again... his blog /website contains alot of no-holds barred zero-value comments /one-liners and some potentially misleading and defamatory as well.
*
Can you give example of the defamatory and misleading part? The website is too popular and they have to take extra caution when trying to write stuff. Any big review site really. A blog yes.

Any good website/blog will tell you the pro/cons about the item reviewed but will not coerce you to buy the product. Scoring a product is optional, though I find not scoring better because then people will go find scores and match them. With PC parts or tech scoring is fine because its not so much a big deal. TG scores cars, but I do not like the idea that much. Also, paultan makes aware if an advert is shown by putting "AD" there. Don't like to see that, don't click. I have paultan and autoworld malaysia on my feedly. I can freely compare both reviews.

Here are common problems about car review sites which people are not aware of:

The car is loaned to them either short/long time.
Some manufactures are confident, bring them on a roadtrip. Some are so scared that they will give you the product to be reviewed months after coming out or sometimes just give short test on a road 5 km long or just some car park. The problem with car reviewers is that they need to form an opinion in a very short time, then write about it quickly, then move to the next car. Hopefully they don't forget important stuff along the way. Us normal beings who own/buy the car they review will form some difference in opinion because we can review the car leisurely. If we love the car too much, then whatever criticism towards the car is dealt with severe displeasure. Happens a lot. The moment the topic says Proton/Perodua you see those people.

Review sites need money
A successful car review sites needs to be self-sustainable. That is why you get those BHP/Petronas/Celcom commercials in the driven series. Alexa rank shows paultan within top 100. 120+k unique visitors with repetition in visits up to 5 times per visitor. Even Top Gear needs money. It needs £1 million just to produce one episode of Top Gear with its 30+ mobile crew. People like TG because they can bash cars and don't care. Well, aside from TG, no one else can do that. TG has a huge brand outside the TG TV and magazine. From toys to cakes. Fifth Gear is diplomatic. Carbuyer is diploamatic. Paultan too has to be diplomatic. If they are being "misleading and defamatory", I doubt the car makers will allow them to review their cars in future. Due to small differences, people go mad. No idea what this what the world has come to.

Petrolheads stop commenting at very popular sites because it drains them
Well, most shy away. I rarely comment at paultan now. I find F&F easier. Good thing they have that "like" feature. I just do a ctrl+s for the term "well-loved" and read that aside from the reviewers response. I think recently with the Ron95 vs 97 article. Most people who know about cars know that if your engine cannot take advantage of Ron97, you are wasting money. I like that article a lot as it covers both car and petrol from a single brand. No use covering petrol from different brands. I think Paultan would love to do a Ron95 for all petrols in malaysia, but not sure if they can pull it off yet. Imagine this topic alone will be "defamatory and misleading". Not sure if they want to attract that kind of attention. Not only paultan. Got that research group few years back put petrol as A, B, C, D, E without mentioning the brand.


QUOTE(paultantk @ Feb 10 2015, 03:31 PM)
Hi

I am very sorry if this offends anyone in the F&F forum, not intentional.

What I actually meant in my Facebook post by "that forum" is the kopitiam forum, not F&F

The context of my comment is a thread in kopitiam where multiple defamatory messages were posted about our editorial team.
*
I don't think people in F&F section is offended. I saw few post started attacking people in Kopitiam section which was why I put the search feature in the previous post. I also think that there is a small group which is purposely attacking paultan. Green with jealousy?

LYN moderators need to find a way to monitor/ban the term in the Kopitiam section. Even F&F regulars don't go there to discuss about cars. Can discuss, but it does not work. Can easily take out of context. Kopitiam has gotten out of hand that there is a "Serious Kopitiam" section just for sanity. If you notice the car club section. Almost all have a paultan link in the first few post showing reference to the car. It will be slightly problematic for the TS to just find new links for something that is already "V23" few years down the road.

F&F too sometimes get out of hand with serial offenders, however these are easily spotted.

Disagreement will exists because we are human however not to the point of degrading a person. When degrading a person starts, meaning whatever which is said (how painful that can be) is true and that the offending party has no idea how to rebuttal the comment and the only way to rebut the comment is to attack the personality of a person. That is how I see it anyway.

This post has been edited by mystvearn: Feb 10 2015, 05:07 PM
paultantk
post Feb 10 2015, 06:00 PM

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QUOTE(mystvearn @ Feb 10 2015, 05:06 PM)
I don't think people in F&F section is offended. I saw few post started attacking people in Kopitiam section which was why I put the search feature in the previous post. I also think that there is a small group which is purposely attacking paultan. Green with jealousy?

LYN moderators need to find a way to monitor/ban the term in the Kopitiam section. Even F&F regulars don't go there to discuss about cars. Can discuss, but it does not work. Can easily take out of context. Kopitiam has gotten out of hand that there is a "Serious Kopitiam" section just for sanity. If you notice the car club section. Almost all have a paultan link in the first few post showing reference to the car. It will be slightly problematic for the TS to just find new links for something that is already "V23" few years down the road.

F&F too sometimes get out of hand with serial offenders, however these are easily spotted.

Disagreement will exists because we are human however not to the point of degrading a person. When degrading a person starts, meaning whatever which is said (how painful that can be) is true and that the offending party has no idea how to rebuttal the comment and the only way to rebut the comment is to attack the personality of a person. That is how I see it anyway.
*
I apologise for the inconvenience that my Facebook comment has caused for F&F users when it comes to the links you mentioned. The context of the comment I made was kopitiam, I am sorry that that F&F users have become 'collateral damage' in this aspect.

Bear in mind this was a comment made on my own private Facebook wall, and the post was set to Friends Only. It was not a public notice. The comment was made in the context of kopitiam - links posted in the various threads in F&F are usually just used to support an existing discussion, not to anchor an entire thread.

There was a thread on Kopitiam where many defamatory statements were posted about our website and editorial team. Whom I will anytime stand up for and defend. And so I did.

Among the various statements that were posted were that we were so corrupt that we would rate a trishaw better than an F1 car, and that we would sell our mothers if we were paid enough money.

We reported these posts to the moderation team and some but not all were removed. We were not satisfied with the decision of the moderation team leaving so many defamatory posts online. We thought since they were not removed, the moderation team must somehow agree with those posts and thought they were OK?

It was then that in my frustration I brought up the fact that the kopitiam forum has so many threads that were opened with the first post simply having 100% our text and a selection of images, hotlinked from our site. Hotlinked means we pay for the bandwidth hosting the images. Imagine that - kopitiam threads using our content and bandwidth, and yet threads that are opened purely to slander us were left online without a satisfactory response to reports. That's not fair, right?

So yes, that's how I came to write that Friends-only comment on my personal FB wall. But the issue is really not the content but the defamatory discussions. Sorry it caused an inconvenience for you guys.

This post has been edited by paultantk: Feb 10 2015, 06:11 PM
Quazacolt
post Feb 10 2015, 06:22 PM

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QUOTE(paultantk @ Feb 10 2015, 06:00 PM)
I apologise for the inconvenience that my Facebook comment has caused for F&F users when it comes to the links you mentioned. The context of the comment I made was kopitiam, I am sorry that that F&F users have become 'collateral damage' in this aspect.

Bear in mind this was a comment made on my own private Facebook wall, and the post was set to Friends Only. It was not a public notice. The comment was made in the context of kopitiam - links posted in the various threads in F&F are usually just used to support an existing discussion, not to anchor an entire thread.

There was a thread on Kopitiam where many defamatory statements were posted about our website and editorial team. Whom I will anytime stand up for and defend. And so I did.

Among the various statements that were posted were that we were so corrupt that we would rate a trishaw better than an F1 car, and that we would sell our mothers if we were paid enough money.

We reported these posts to the moderation team and some but not all were removed. We were not satisfied with the decision of the moderation team leaving so many defamatory posts online. We thought since they were not removed, the moderation team must somehow agree with those posts and thought they were OK?

It was then that in my frustration I brought up the fact that the kopitiam forum has so many threads that were opened with the first post simply having 100% our text and a selection of images, hotlinked from our site. Hotlinked means we pay for the bandwidth hosting the images. Imagine that - kopitiam threads using our content and bandwidth, and yet threads that are opened purely to slander us were left online without a satisfactory response to reports. That's not fair, right?


So yes, that's how I came to write that Friends-only comment on my personal FB wall. But the issue is really not the content but the defamatory discussions. Sorry it caused an inconvenience for you guys.
*
that pretty much explains everything.

personally, i would just ignore/take it with a pinch of salt from ANYTHING that come out of kopitiam. (maybe an exception if it is from serious kopitiam, but hey.)
lucifah
post Feb 10 2015, 07:14 PM

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OK, one local website removed from my fav list

this is no way to treat your readers

"A forum full of defamatory clowns"

"They are all anonymous cowards on a forum"

"Retards..."



paultantk
post Feb 10 2015, 07:48 PM

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QUOTE(lucifah @ Feb 10 2015, 07:14 PM)
OK, one local website removed from my fav list

this is no way to treat your readers

"A forum full of defamatory clowns"

"They are all anonymous cowards on a forum"

"Retards..."
*
hi.

firstly thank you to the mod team for removing the offending thread. once i found this out i removed my fb post immediately.

i just want to clarify that the comments above were taken out of context.

my original FB post said "Lost patience. Time to bring out the legal guns."

i was referring to going after the people who were posting the defamatory messages.

the first message was actually a response to my friend Afnan who asked me:

"To whom?? Not me right? Lol"

to which i replied: "A forum full of defamatory clowns."

i was referring to the posters in the offending thread.

second message was a response to my friend Daniel who asked me:

"Do I know any of them ?"

to which i replied: "They are all anonymous cowards on a forum." (the posters in the offending thread to which we were considering legal action against)

And then the third message, my friend Shahrul said:

"/k are full of retards bro. lol"

to which i replied: "Retards can be charged in a court of law too."

In no way were I making those statements in reference to our readers and LYN forumers in general or LYN management, i am sorry if i let anyone to believe otherwise

This post has been edited by paultantk: Feb 10 2015, 08:01 PM
Human10
post Feb 10 2015, 07:50 PM

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This thread worth a share to Kopitiam.
Quazacolt
post Feb 10 2015, 07:52 PM

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QUOTE(Human10 @ Feb 10 2015, 07:50 PM)
This thread worth a share to Kopitiam.
*
no.
paultantk
post Feb 10 2015, 08:08 PM

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i think i've stepped enough toes on this matter. all we wanted was for the defamatory statements to be removed. sorry once again for the trouble.

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