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 ringgit Malaysia drop , how to I change my RM to USD

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cherroy
post Aug 4 2015, 02:05 PM

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QUOTE(cybermaster98 @ Aug 4 2015, 01:48 PM)
The dilemma im facing is do I invest the money that I have in ASB which gives me a return of about 8% or do I convert to USD / SGD as a hedge.
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The hedge will be good only if RM plunges 8% every year from now on.

Mind that USD/SGD carries virtually no interest currently.


cherroy
post Aug 4 2015, 02:42 PM

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QUOTE(cybermaster98 @ Aug 4 2015, 02:19 PM)
I did a comparative assessment investing RM100K in ASB vs converting to USD at the current rate over a 6 month period. I would need the USD to appreciate to 4.005 for me to break even with the interest garnered thru ASB.
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Provided you get it right that RM continue to drop to 4.005, which only mean you get breakeven.
If wrong, you lose.

Summarise.
You have 50% of getting it right (the movement of RM to the downside further)
Yet you don't win even you get it right the 50%, you need more than Rm4.005.

So you chance of "winning" actually less than 50%.

Good deal?
Up to one to judge then.

Hedging against RM depreciation, not necessary must through direct conversion of cash money.
There are listed companies that will benefit from the RM depreciation, typically like glove company, whereby we see their share price appreciated more than 10~20% due to RM movement to downside. Same with investing in foreign denominated currency ETF etc.

There are plenty of options and alternative to hedge upon, not solely must direct through cash conversion.
cherroy
post Aug 6 2015, 08:02 AM

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The surprise better than expected export, and better trade surplus may cushion the weak RM.

Nevertheless, RM still being seen weak for near term.
cherroy
post Aug 8 2015, 12:28 PM

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BNM foreign currency reserves stood at USD96.7 bil as at end of July.
cherroy
post Aug 9 2015, 03:44 PM

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QUOTE(Hansel @ Aug 9 2015, 02:30 PM)
What happens if the nationl reserves frops to a threshold low ??? What is the threshold low ?
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When the foreign currency reserves is not enough to cater for short term debt and import, then the country may need to seek for aid for it typically from IMF.

As import bill and capital outflow, you need to pay in USD.


cherroy
post Aug 9 2015, 03:48 PM

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QUOTE(drake88 @ Aug 9 2015, 02:30 PM)
i heard they will stop supporting when reserve reach USD90 Bil
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Even without supporting the RM, the foreign currency reserves will keep on shrinking if the capital outflow is not reversing.

Whenever someone want to exchange RM to USD in Malaysia,
BNM needs to use the USD in the foreign currency reserves to pay for it.

Capital outflow, investors take RM exchange to USD before remit to overseas.

That's why it is important to have trade surplus, current account surplus, and FDI.
Export > import, potential more USD being exchanged to RM.
More investment money come in, investors bring USD to BNM to exchange to RM before invest into local asset.
cherroy
post Aug 12 2015, 11:22 AM

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QUOTE(Showtime747 @ Aug 12 2015, 10:51 AM)
Ya, if you talk about the whole of malaysia, only the selected few lucky ones benefit from the RM depreciation.

Minister talks about tourism, which only benefit the bosses in the tourism business if more tourists visit malaysia. They don't sell stuff based on US$, but still in RM. If tourist number don't increase, they don't gain anything. We have to wait for the tourist number statistics to come out to prove lower RM actually benefits tourism

For business, yes you are right. RM depreciate but at the same time crude oil and CPO price drop also, so what benefit is there for the big companies ?

I have a business which export to china. Initially late last year beginning this year we gain on weak ringgit. Profit doubled. But the last few months, the sales really slow down and we were only gaining on the exchange rate. Sales volume has come down. Still ok, but not as good as before when china market is still good. 

I am sure there are businesses which enjoy the RM depreciation like those glove, electronics etc companies, but I feel that would be the minority.

Whereas for the average malaysian, their standard of living will be lowered. RM will buy less things in the near future. Wawasan 2020 need another 5-10 years only can achieve
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Drop in RM that prompt more earning in USD cannot be offset by drop in commodities price.
While Petronas may export oil in USD, but its capex also in USD, aka equipment, tanker rate, all quoted in USD price one.

So does some plantation company that may be hurt by USD appreciation, as there are some large plantation company borrowing are in USD denominated.
At the meantime, CPO traded in RM doesn't rise, but down, despite with RM depreciation which in term of foreign buyers pov it has become cheaper.

The one benefit the most are those MNC set up here for cheaper production cost.
Last time, hiring engineer locally pay in RM (let say RM6K, which equivalent USD2K, from MNC they view in USD), now with RM4.00 vs USD, suddenly, they only need to pay USD1500.

While MNC import semi-processed goods (eg, chips) to produce into finished goods and export(eg, processor etc), all in USD, no impact at all.

For MNCs, goods in and out no effect from the RM, but massive saving in cost related here.

cherroy
post Aug 12 2015, 01:40 PM

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QUOTE(eric84cool @ Aug 12 2015, 12:19 PM)
Am I right to say that if bank outside Malaysia is selling Ringgit cheap due to supply more than demand, our BNM needs to use US dollar from reserve fund to buy back the ringgit in order not to drop further?

Is there any rules mentioning that each country at least need to keep how much USD in their reserve? Or by percentage based on the country GDP?
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Since 1998 capital control, RM is not easily tenable outside Malaysia, so basically there is not much RM trading directly at overseas.

There is no rule how much USD needed.
It is about paying your import bill that majority in USD denominated.

Eg.
When an company/importer here import an Iphone, the importer here needs to pay the supplier in USD.
Where the importer can get USD?
From BNM.
That's why BNM must have enough USD in the coffer when the importer come to the bank with RM and want to exchange to USD.

While for the like US, they do not need much foreign currency reserves, as all major export import are traded in USD, and they have the ability to print their own USD. So don't need other currency reserves?
Not enough USD?
Print it. biggrin.gif

Internationally, mostly view foreign currency reserves that able to pay at least 3 months plus import is considered a "healthy" level.

cherroy
post Aug 12 2015, 03:54 PM

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QUOTE(Showtime747 @ Aug 12 2015, 03:41 PM)
CNY down, MYR follows down too  tongue.gif Not much net effect between the two

I don't think BNM has the bullet to intervene anymore. They are helpless
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It is best interest for BNM not to intervene too much, especially in this kind of sold down across Asian region currency due to Yuan depreciating.

Try to intervene to counter the market force, wasting the precious foreign currency reserves only.
Even Sgd also goes down against USD.
cherroy
post Aug 12 2015, 10:26 PM

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QUOTE(Showtime747 @ Aug 12 2015, 06:55 PM)
Ya, free market is most efficient.

But they wasted >$10b reserve and yet ringgit drop from 3.80 to 4.00. The $10b could have solved 1MDB's problem (j/k  tongue.gif )

If they allow ringgit to move freely, they should not intervene in the first place. And saved $10b

I think when the reserve dropped to $96b, they knew their reserve is not enough to fight the market forces, so they stopped. If the reserve touches $90b or $80b, the RM sell off will be even worse

So, as much as they want to stabilize their currency, they run out of bullet and surrender
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To be fair, BNM also cannot do nothing if speculators start to pile up against your currency.
Need to give "warning" to market, "don't play too far".

We do not know how much exactly was used to "defend" the RM at Rm3.80.

With capital flight from stock market and bond market, the foreign currency reserves surely will go down, as those capital when remit out, they will drain the the BNM foreign currency reserves.
Investors sell off share or bond, take RM in cash, go to bank to exchange to USD, then BNM needs to use the USD in foreign currency reserves to pay them.

cherroy
post Aug 13 2015, 09:56 AM

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This morning up and back to Rm4 level.
cherroy
post Aug 14 2015, 08:21 AM

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QUOTE(Hansel @ Aug 13 2015, 08:22 PM)
Convert into the SGD, buy some SG REITs. Never go wrong.
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But reit may have difficult time ahead at least for near term due to US raising rate, and potential slowdown in property sector.
Also, Singapore property has been softening lately.

So for near term, reit outlook is not that good.

Longer term, yes may be.
cherroy
post Aug 14 2015, 11:14 AM

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QUOTE(AVFAN @ Aug 14 2015, 10:57 AM)
errr...

>4.10.

panic selling...?  shocking.gif
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Market goes wild... sweat.gif

4.12!
cherroy
post Aug 15 2015, 11:07 AM

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QUOTE(icemanfx @ Aug 14 2015, 10:38 PM)
Crude could fall to $10 a barrel as the Organization of Petroleum Exporting Countries engages in a "price war'' with rival producers, testing who will cut output first, Gary Shilling, president of A. Gary Shilling Co., said in an interview on Bloomberg Television on Friday.

"OPEC is basically saying we're not going to cut production, we're going to see who can stand lower prices longest,'' Shilling said. "Oil is headed for $10 to $20 a barrel.''

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/201...where-near-done

Guess myr still have way to depreciate further. If oil drop below $20/barrel, us$1 to myr 5 or 6?
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At $10 per barrel, oil is cheaper than mineral water already... whistling.gif

If oil price continue to go lower, it is a supply destruction factor already, which serves as cushion at the downside.

Back 2000 time, it happened once (at the region of USD20), which was supply destruction, which lead to not enough supply after 5-7 years later, which prompt oil price to shoot up as high as USD140 afterwards during 2006~2007 time.

cherroy
post Aug 15 2015, 10:04 PM

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QUOTE(Hansel @ Aug 15 2015, 05:50 PM)
I thnk we need more details on this withdrawal limitation. Is it per day, per person, over-the counter only, TT or what else ? I have predicted earlier to my family that the effects from the Greek fallout could hit Malaysians in the same way. This is now coming true. Greece was Eur 60 per day per person.
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Please do not spread unfounded rumour that intend to spread fear, this is irresponsible act.

Even when 1997 crisis which was far worst than what we are experiencing now, there is no limit on withdraw from bank.
Capital control only imposed on 1998 was targeting only on money outflow to overseas, never on account withdrawal.

It makes no sense to impose withdraw limit from bank account, as it has no relationship to RM dropping nor can stem the RM dropping in forex market.
RM drop in forex market is because money outflow, not money withdrawal from account nor ATM.

If want to contain the speculative outflow of RM, a capital control is enough to stop it.

You need to understand why Greece impose withdrawal, because Greece is short of Euro mainly because they cannot print Euro on their own.

A half understanding can be worst than no understanding at all.
Do not blindly believe with "half understanding".

It is as same as previously people spread rumour that USD was going to be worthless due to trillions of debt, which urge people to rush in gold.

A "half understanding" and believe it, may dump all the USD and invest in gold, now may be suffering 30% losses, and miss the opportunity to reap current USD strength.

cherroy
post Aug 15 2015, 10:09 PM

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QUOTE(Ramjade @ Aug 14 2015, 09:47 PM)
Really so drastic until limit rm3k/withdrawal?

If I want to withdraw my matured fd, cannot la?
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No such thing.

Please read above post.
Ty.

Bank liquidity is ample.
There is no short of cash in banking system.
Klibor market tells the story about liquidity between banks.

When a country or bank imposed withdrawal limit, it is about liquidity problem, not about forex market.


cherroy
post Aug 16 2015, 12:16 AM

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QUOTE(Hansel @ Aug 15 2015, 05:50 PM)
I thnk we need more details on this withdrawal limitation. Is it per day, per person, over-the counter only, TT or what else ? I have predicted earlier to my family that the effects from the Greek fallout could hit Malaysians in the same way. This is now coming true. Greece was Eur 60 per day per person.
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QUOTE(Hansel @ Aug 15 2015, 10:33 PM)
Cherroy,

I appreciated your opinions, BUT NOT the first sentence. Read my posts in the above in my talks with AVFAN, and you can see why you are wrong in saying I spread the rumours. You know something, I wanted to let this case rest after AVFAN's final postingon this rumour subject, but since you brought up this wole issue again, I'll 'entertain' you. Well, I'll let it rest here,.. again see my postings in the above.

I know that Greece is NOT ALLOWED to, not cannot,... okay ?? They can do whatever they wish to,.. including wrangling their way around the rest of the EU trying to have their debts 'forgiven',... however, they are still tied by the rules of being inside the coalition. And one of the rulesis to abide by the rule of not printing the EUro, set by the ECB.
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If one needs to ask such a question in the first place, it just means one already "start or have some sort of degree believing such an unfounded rumour" in the first place, which further seconded by the statement of effect of "Greek fallout could hit Malaysian in the same way".

Any informed and knowledgable in financial issue will straight away treat such a rumour as nonsense when reading such an unfounded rumour, won't need to ask for further details.
There is no logic of the statement need to limit withdrawal of account, it won't help the level of RM at all.

If said about capital control or other measures to reduce speculative activities etc, ok, it makes more sense.
This is the difference.

I am not saying you are spreading the rumour, but it is worrysome to see one needs to ask such a question in the first place.
With such a word or statement made and may soon be spreaded across over the net by ill intention person.

In EU, they use single currency, any monetory issues are controlled by ECB.
Individual country cannot simply print Euro nor imposing interest rate, all under purview of ECB.

Not allowed and cannot print the Euro, what is the difference?
Both also cannot print the money. Same.
They are seeking Euro money from IMF and ECB to pay their debt due.
If they don't play the rules of EU/ECB, they will be kicked out by Euro single currency and no longer can use Euro.

When a country is running at deficit situation, fiscal and trade deficit, it just means they won't have enough money left without printing the new money.


QUOTE(Hansel @ Aug 15 2015, 10:47 PM)
Backin 1997, we still had oil money. We could peg. We don't have that now. Let's see how far will the RM drop, that will be the best indicator if we are worst now, or earlier.
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At the moment, Petronas still earning oil money ten of billion RM, it is not the like oil money is totally running out.

Malaysia imposed peg and capital control with just with foreign currency reserves amounted of less than USD 20 Bil. and able to survive through and resulted foreign currency reserves being replenished aftewards and keep on climbing up since the control.
I do not see why Malaysia cannot impose peg and capital control with USD 90 bil level.

If you have trade surplus with current account surplus, capital control + peg at low level can work to certain extent.

But capital control is a measure least favourable and should be treated as last resort option in a desperate time.

In term of fundamental and economy data, the state of economy at the moment is far better than 1997.
Just Malaysia needs to sort out some mess in political front, which is one of the major factor that sending negative sentiment towards RM.

cherroy
post Aug 16 2015, 09:37 AM

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QUOTE(nujikabane @ Aug 16 2015, 02:11 AM)
But any reason for Zeti to say that?
Weakening MYR would mean it'll be more costly to service loan payable in USD. Ain't that bad for the economy?
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Generally, most debt are in RM denominated, as compared to 1997 whereby a lot of debt were USD denominated.

This is the big difference.
If currently debt composition is still as last time with high percentage of debt was USD denominated, then yes, it is a big problem already.
Many had learned the lesson of 1997 the danger of using foreign currency denominated borrowing.

So watch out those listed company share with high USD denominated debt one.
It may put a big dent on their financial report for the coming financial report if USD staying at elevated level.
cherroy
post Aug 16 2015, 09:57 AM

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QUOTE(Hansel @ Aug 15 2015, 10:27 PM)
Do not be mis0construed in your comments, Showtime,... come on,... what nonsense are you talking about ? I would expect better of a forummer like you. Malaysia can print their own RM ???? Sure, theoretically,... but once this is known to the rest of the world, we are doomed, okay ? I do NOT believe blindly in everything I read,... I think it over first. It is you, instead who is believing in everything you read, including theoretical international finance, as in Msia being able to print its own RM. Sure, yes, theoretically, for not bound by any regional bank, as in the ECB. But practically,... you know better.

Please do not judge blindly.
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Every sovereign country that has its own currency can print their own money, if not where the money comes from? biggrin.gif
Just the more you print, the less value your money will be aka at the cost of inflation, which may haunt you back.

That's why central bank generally will refrain from printing money, unless necessary, as you don't create 'wealth" by printing more money.

This is a fact, not only theory.
When US underwent QE time, they create extra trillion of USD, that's why we saw USD exchange rate plummeting across the globe.
Same with Japan QE, ECB QE.

Eg.
if you print 10 bil, then there is potential 10 bil outflow aka there will be pressure of 10 bil of supply to buy USD or other foreign currency
if you print 100 bil, then there is potential 100 bil money that want to exchange to USD.

100 bil selling pressure more than 10 bil, hence price will go down.
Basic of supply demand that dictates the movement of pricing.

Yes, please do not blindly believe anything, when you think the limit of 3K withdrawal unfounded rumour, it totally has no logic at all, so easily busted. smile.gif

The news about those money changers outside may be short of USD, is due to demand on physical note, not about liquidity.
Anyone still can exchange a few or hundred of million USD with banks easily.

The only reason why banks want to impose withdrawal limit is when they are short of liquidity.

Currently, liquidity between banks is ample, if banks are short of liquidity, you will see Klibor rate shooting to the roof particularly overnight rate and 3 months rate which serves as indicator what is the situation of liquidity in the financial market.

When there is a liquidity squeeze, you see interbank rate shoot to the roof like during 2008. (Libor rate for global banking interbank lending)
cherroy
post Aug 16 2015, 11:00 AM

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QUOTE(Hansel @ Aug 16 2015, 10:20 AM)
Cherroy,...

I am aware of the effects of printing money for Msia - which is why I used the word 'doomed' if the world knows and acknowledges that we are printingmoney. I do not need to elaborate further.

I did not believe blindly in what I read - that's why I said need to investigate further,... read my posting in this thread and another one or two somewhere else,... I said to ask the banks, and after it was discovered to be only a rumour,.. then I said it was a rumour, and the best place to ask is the banks. So,.. please do not say that I believe blindly.

By the way, since you said that a person with knowledge on economics will not even start to ask if Msia will turn out to be like Greec, that would be summarising that Msia's banking system is still stable and solid. Well,... I do hope so,... BUT,... I do believe too that Dreamer has some points in his postings and comments abt the Msian banking system.
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There is no doubt household debt and public debt are at elevated level, which needs to be sort out in the near future, or in other word need to trim down the fiscal deficit situation, if not, longer term future may be following Greece path.
But at the moment to near term, the situation is not as bad or doomed already.

At this current turbulence time, there is a need to be careful about rumour flying around. smile.gif

We do not want any unfounded and illogical rumour that may send unnecessary fear to uninformed public out there, which could result someone loss their hard-earned money, as any financial decision made due to unfounded rumour may result in loss of money.

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