She was unfortunate enough to meet the fake ones rather than the real thing.

Similarly, I think most of the so-called Heavenly deities like Guan Gong, Mazu, and many other historical figures in Chinese history or stories were worshipped after their death. Aren't they ghosts too, then?

They are celestial beings, not monstrous creatures of darkness and shadow like the Hell deities.

They have attained divinity via a different route.

A good number of them never actually physically died, in that they attained immortality and ascended straight to paradise.

Others who did, died natural deaths rather than violent ones, and had already cultivated themselves to high levels of spiritual enlightenment prior.

Lord Guan is an exception, but as the story goes, his ghost embraced the Dharma after death and became godly after loyally serving as a Dharma protector for untold centuries.

The Hell deities, on the other hand, were mostly victims of violent or gruesome deaths who were appointed their roles after descending to the Netherworld like any other deceased soul.

While largely upright men in life, they were not saints.

In death, they remain rough-and-ready dudes not beyond baser conduct, such as telling raucous jokes, smoking, partaking of opium and liquor, et cetera.

And a lot of them have never seen Heaven, let alone ventured there.

They are quite content to stay where they are and continue working their roles indefinitely.

They take a certain pride in their grotesqueness, in being the 'angels with dirty faces'.

Someone has to do these jobs.

Hi, thanks for being awesome. You should really write a book for all us banana interested in this. Go find Asiapac publisher.


I have a few questions:
If this is the case, wouldn't it be more awesome if we able to approach IGP? They have more power and resource, and they can settle your things faster.

IE: Might as well I just worship Jade Emperor. All he can settle for me. No need so hard to find who is specific for which problem.



2nd Question:
Does anyone worship Sun Wukong? What does he preside over? Is he really so powerful that Jade Emperor also cannot subdue him?

3rd Question:
Does anyone worship Piggy? If so, for what purpose?

Please don't angry... I just really really curious.....

1. The Jade Emperor is traditionally depicted as an aloof, distant monarch, disinterested in mortal affairs. I think it's safe to say you won't get much luck with him.

Generally speaking, the higher up the food chain you go, the less involved with us humans the deities get. Oftentimes, higher ranking deities are merely present in a temple or shrine in order to supervise the lower ranking ones who possess mediums during trances, and provide them with the necessary authority to solve devotees' problems.



2. The Monkey King is very widely worshiped. He is a warrior and Dharma protector who can be called on to dispel evil spirits. Also, he is a master of guan xi - the art of interpersonal relationships and diplomacy, as evidenced by his always knowing whom to approach whenever he required help with solving a problem that was beyond his scope or ability. It would not be unreasonable to approach him if you are having trouble with workplace politics.

Regarding him being powerful, most of the difficulties that the Heavenly armies encountered when they battled him back in the day stemmed from the fact that they had absolutely no idea what they were dealing with - at the time, they had yet to battle an foe of his type. He is tough, but not unbeatable. For instance, Lord Er Lang adapted very quickly to the Monkey King's tactics and was able to fight him to a draw. A rematch between the two of them might very well result in a tipped scale.





3. Piggy's job scope as Cleanser of the Altar is to clean up after major ceremonies to the gods - he's a glorified janitor, essentially. We commonly see him being worshiped OUTSIDE of this job scope, however, in that he is most widely prayed to by bar-girls, prostitutes, strippers and other women of easy virtue, for protection while performing their jobs (against disagreeable clients, violent pimps, diseases, etc). Although he took his Buddhist vows, that doesn't stop him from looking after the class of girl he is so fond of.

Aiyo.

I thought Sun Wukong very very powerful. I thought nobody can fuck wit him. He da boss. 大鬧天宮 is not an easy feat!



I have a question about suicide in Sintuaism.

If someone commit suicide, what is the sin calculation? Debit or credit?
If it is a bad sin to suicide, why Xie Bi'an and Zhong Kui can suicide and be an official in hell?

Can I be an official in heaven or hell too? Can I be deified?

What are some modern deities? I heard John Rabe is one such example for his actions in WW2.

1. In Chinese folk religion, the context of an action is ALWAYS taken into consideration when judgement is passed in the next world. This includes suicide, which, in itself, is not necessarily regarded as sinful, unlike in Abrahamic religions. For example, a terminally ill man who commits suicide because he does not wish to burden his children with medical bills will be viewed sympathetically, while the serial killer who commits suicide rather than be caught by the police who are banging on his door is going to get it nicely.

2. Most sintua deities are deified human beings who achieved divine status after accumulating merits as mortals. The take home message is that anybody can become a god if he or she is virtuous enough. So don't stop believing.

3. One example of a (relatively) modern deity is the German girl whose spirit is worshiped at a shrine on Singaore's Pulau Ubin called the Berlin Heiligtum. As the legend goes, she was the teenage daughter of a German plantation owner who lived on Pulau Ubin, and died from a fall off a cliff in 1914 while attempting to escape the British authorities, who were detaining all German nationals within British territory following the outbreak of the First World War. Her soul subsequently made its presence felt to Ubin residents, performing several minor miracles; she was subsequently enshrined and revered ever since, represented by a meticulously made-up doll on the shrine's altar and provided with offerings of cosmetics and other feminine items.

Another question. If a ghost harmed me and I die, can I take revenge?

For example, the ghost in Ju-On movie is a very unreasonable one. If I were to encounter a ghost like that, and she killed me. When I die and become a ghost, can I exert revenge against her ?
For example rape and kill her and hang her ghost head for all other evil ghost to see so that they will know what comes to them if they fuck wit mortal beings?

Then I become like Punisher, lawful neutral. Ghost bounty hunter vigilante and kill all evil ghost but at the same time, avoiding hell official from catching me.

Is this possible?
I am not joking, I entertain these kind of thought when I read about Chinese religion. I cannot find someone else to answer my question seriously.

The ghost from Ju On has a great deal of power, built up over a long duration.

A freshly dead soul like you would not last a minute against her.

Contrary to what most people think, becoming a ghost does not grant you any special abilities, at least not immediately.

These have to be developed, which takes considerable effort and time.

To become a hypothetical 'ghost vigilante', you will probably require centuries of cultivation.

The Hell deities do not take kindly to vigilantism, at any rate.

And you don't want to deal with them when they mean business.

hi nachsider,

Informative and it helps that you articulate the concepts well. I'm not a believer in this but the thread (and the whole folk religion) is interesting.

I'd like to know what the view is among sintua's adherent regarding the universality of the deities/ghost when it comes to the dead from other parts of the world.

I've read a few pages back regarding the medium who channeled and spoke in some ancient form of Chinese and did trigger this question that I have.

Pleasant evening.

Hi Wong, much obliged for your compliments. I hope to keep this thread informative and entertaining.

In a nutshell, sintua states that everybody goes to the same afterlife, regardless of country, creed and colour, and that people of different cultures may perceive the same gods slightly differently.

Let me give you a fr'instance.

Where death gods are concerned, Chinese folk religion has the Black and White Brothers (me in the picture, by the way ).



Haitian Vodou has Baron Samedi.



Celtic mythology has Ankou.



Korean mythology has the Jeosung Saja.



Why is it that these death gods, each of whom come from very disparate cultures seperated by thousands of miles, are all grim dudes who wear dark clothing and hats?

Who are the Dragon Kings?

The Long Wang/龙王 or Dragon Kings are reptilian deities who are commonly associated with the watery element and dwell in bodies of water such as oceans, rivers and lakes - each such locale is said to have a Dragon King residing within, along with his retinue of soldiers and officials, all of whom correspond to marine animals (crab troopers, turtle courtiers, prawn guardsmen, crocodile generals, fish footmen and so on).

They are said to control the weather (particularly rainfall) and the tides, and are therefore petitioned by farmers during times of drought, by fishermen during times of coastal storms, and so on.

Four major Dragon Kings (the Dragon Kings of the Eastern, Western, Northern and Southern Oceans) are considered the 'kings among kings' of their society, and rule over all the rest.

Here are photos of a Dragon King in statue form and being channeled by a medium...





... plus photos of some of his minions.







Interestingly, the ancient Aztec people worshiped an aquatic reptilian deity called Tlaloc, who also controlled rainfall.

Compare the Chinese Dragon King and Tlaloc; the similarities are VERY striking.

Wow! All the while i thought he exist in the movie only...

Some character is just add in. But who knows even add in character they might exist too.

The Monkey King was being prayed to LONG before Wu Cheng En wrote Journey to the West.

You meant Hanuman? Can you do a write up on Sun Wukong and Piggy? Can help clear up our misunderstanding of them all this time due to TVB Drama.

I meant the piggy

Only Sandy the 3rd brother & the dragon turn to horse is not real but who knows.

Hanuman and the Chinese Monkey King are not the same monkey.

A write-up on the Monkey King will be very long and I'm not sure if I have the time to do that, at least not now.

Ask specific questions about specific issues and I will give you specific answers.

All of them are real, after a fashion.

And none of them.