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 CFA or MBA ?, to go into investment banking

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Topace111
post May 25 2014, 03:21 PM

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QUOTE(ohemmgee @ May 21 2014, 06:48 PM)
Currently I am in my first year undergraduate majoring in IT and would like to go into investment banking for my career. I understand that investment banking accept all sort of majors but should I take up either CFA or MBA to score a better chance of going into IB ?

Should I take CFA Level 1 exam in my final year to have a higher chance of going into investment banking upon graduation ?
Or should I focus completely on my undergraduate studies (e.g. : CGPA & Co-curricular activities) ?
Or should I work for a few years upon graduation and then go for MBA after that ?

My main goal is to go into investment banking once I graduate but am afraid IT graduate would have a lower chance.

Thank you in advance for your advice.
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Focus on getting high grades and curricular activities.
Cfa without working experience doesn't add much value especially recruitment.
Only when you have extensive number if practical experience + technical knowledge from cfa, yes it will be.

MBA depends which school you enter. If you are talking about FT100 yes it will make a difference. For example CEO of Goldman Sachs is MBA background. Difference is MBA requirement for entry is much harder than cfa especially the prestigious ones.

Btw, isn't there good career prospect for our background? Oracle expert engineers in mys also can earn 20-30k per month after 10 years experience.
acgerlok7
post May 25 2014, 07:02 PM

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QUOTE(tishaban @ May 22 2014, 05:21 AM)
You need to finish your bachelor's first. Taking an MBA without work experience is bullshit IMO.

If you're doing your degree in Malaysia then your chances of getting into IB is slim, but as someone already mentioned networking can do wonders.

With a few years of real work experience under your belt, you can apply and get accepted to a top b-school and increase your chances of getting an IB significantly. I personally know several people who went to Harvard, INSEAD, Columbia, Oxford b-schools straight from Malaysia. A top b-school is where their career services help you get a job. IB recruiters come and recruit on campus etc.

I also know people who went straight into IB soon after graduating their undergrad but far fewer of them.

Good luck and work hard biggrin.gif
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Dude, isit possible to enter top b-school from as a "non" famous uni grad? Ie. Must u be a undergrad grad from top unis to break into top b school?
TSohemmgee
post May 25 2014, 09:09 PM

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QUOTE(Topace111 @ May 25 2014, 03:21 PM)
Focus on getting high grades and curricular activities.
Cfa without working experience doesn't add much value especially recruitment.
Only when you have extensive number if practical experience + technical knowledge from cfa, yes it will be.

MBA depends which school you enter. If you are talking about FT100 yes it will make a difference. For example CEO of Goldman Sachs is MBA background. Difference is MBA requirement for entry is much harder than cfa especially the prestigious ones.

Btw, isn't there good career prospect for our background? Oracle expert engineers in mys also can earn 20-30k per month after 10 years experience.
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What about doing CFA Level 1 in final year ? For example, I can state it in my resume as CFA Level 1 candidate. Do you think I stand a higher chance ?

Somehow my interests have been shifted to IB the corporate finance side.
tishaban
post May 25 2014, 11:22 PM

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QUOTE(acgerlok7 @ May 25 2014, 07:02 PM)
Dude, isit possible to enter top b-school from as a "non" famous uni grad? Ie. Must u be a undergrad grad from top unis to break into top b school?
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Yep definitely possible. They look more at the few years of work you did before rather than your undergraduate degree which is why that 3-8 years of work experience is crucial


SUSalaskanbunny
post May 26 2014, 08:33 AM

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QUOTE(acgerlok7 @ May 25 2014, 07:02 PM)
Dude, isit possible to enter top b-school from as a "non" famous uni grad? Ie. Must u be a undergrad grad from top unis to break into top b school?
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get extremely well gmat scores ^^
Fiona Chin
post May 26 2014, 11:52 AM

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QUOTE(ohemmgee @ May 22 2014, 12:34 PM)
But you have a business degree. Does IT graduate stand an equal chance as business graduate to get into IB ? If it doesn't, should I take CFA Level 1 during my final year to cover up my disadvantages as an IT graduate ?
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Business or not I think it doesn't matter, you need to go through a training course anyway if you got hired. Ask the boss below. I did not take the job.

QUOTE(keelim @ May 22 2014, 02:12 PM)
You are asking a question ahead of your time. Not necessarily a bad thing if you can stay focus on your priorities. I concur with Fiona, focus on your degree first. You never know if your interests might change as you progress to your final year. For now, you can pick up some financial reading to beef up your general knowledge (i.e. business or finance sections of the newspapers; or how the Government budget affects you?)
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QUOTE(ohemmgee @ May 25 2014, 09:09 PM)
What about doing CFA Level 1 in final year ? For example, I can state it in my resume as CFA Level 1 candidate. Do you think I stand a higher chance ?

Somehow my interests have been shifted to IB the corporate finance side.
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PROVIDED you have a very good grade in your degree, whatever degree it is. If you get a bad degree, your CFA level 1 make your resume look worse. Deviate from your responsibility as a student to put in effort on what you should be doing, impression of you doing the same if you get the job. CFA level 1 is common, it won't make you stand out, a.k.a. many people are doing what you are planning to do.
bmwcaddy
post Jan 2 2020, 03:21 PM

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Sorry to necro and reviving old thread.

Any additional inputs for this topic? Currently unable to decide whether to choose CFA or MBA (currently working as junior analyst in business conglomerate in Malaysia).

I'm leaning towards being a fund manager/investment banker by having CFA, but not very sure about the availability of opportunities (attractive ones) in Malaysia yet.

Any inputs will be much appreciated.
Dogta
post Jan 2 2020, 08:10 PM

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Think you have to drill down on what you want first, AM and IB are 2 entirely different things.
Topace111
post Jan 3 2020, 04:20 PM

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QUOTE(bmwcaddy @ Jan 2 2020, 03:21 PM)
Sorry to necro and reviving old thread.

Any additional inputs for this topic? Currently unable to decide whether to choose CFA or MBA (currently working as junior analyst in business conglomerate in Malaysia).

I'm leaning towards being a fund manager/investment banker by having CFA, but not very sure about the availability of opportunities (attractive ones) in Malaysia yet.

Any inputs will be much appreciated.
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In general, CFA without experience is worse off than someone with MBA from reputable school (ivy leagues). Reason, good MBA have very high filter requirement like 7 years working experience with MNC, managerial or consultancy background, good GMAT scores and recommendation from alumni. If the MBA schools don't have these criteria, it's just a normal MBA that won't really make a huge adjustment to your career prospects.

CFA is just an exam paper so experience is more important. CFA member will be good as you have 4 year relevant experience. Finishing the exam just prove you can learn to apply, not many large company will hire you on that basis without proper experience.
bmwcaddy
post Jan 6 2020, 11:06 AM

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QUOTE(Topace111 @ Jan 3 2020, 04:20 PM)
In general, CFA without experience is worse off than someone with MBA from reputable school (ivy leagues). Reason, good MBA have very high filter requirement like 7 years working experience with MNC, managerial or consultancy background, good GMAT scores and recommendation from alumni. If the MBA schools don't have these criteria, it's just a normal MBA that won't really make a huge adjustment to your career prospects.

CFA is just an exam paper so experience is more important. CFA member will be good as you have 4 year relevant experience. Finishing the exam just prove you can learn to apply, not many large company will hire you on that basis without proper experience.
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Assume by the time i complete CFA, i will have a working experience of around 6 years. Is this usually a good time?

Separately, what are the prospects of continuing with a MBA say at the 8th working year? (assuming CFA obtained at 6th)

Thank you!
bursageek
post Jan 7 2020, 11:30 AM

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QUOTE(bmwcaddy @ Jan 6 2020, 11:06 AM)
Assume by the time i complete CFA, i will have a working experience of around 6 years. Is this usually a good time?

Separately, what are the prospects of continuing with a MBA say at the 8th working year? (assuming CFA obtained at 6th)

Thank you!
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You mention working in a conglomerate so would you acquire any experience related to corporate finance? Financial due diligence, asset pricing, portfolio optimisation are some of the use cases you face in a job from the IB / AM sector. My take is that CFA just proves you are a diligent learner, but if you have to start in the industry from scratch, few would want to assume the risk of absorbing a newcomer at the age of 28 / 29 when burnout is frequent in the industry (less so in Malaysia but general in IB)

What I just said relates only to the job seeking, but to actually pass CFA, your working experience needs to be 'relevant' as defined here: https://www.cfainstitute.org/en/membership/...work-experience. Whether or not you have worked for 6 years is irrelevant since you may have cleared the duration requirement (48 months) but not the technical requirement.

Finally, doing an MBA would be an icing on the cake once you have already landed a job in the industry. But if you are not intending to start a venture yourself, IMO there is much less value in it (since your goal is to enter the industry, which should have been be achieved by CFA alone).

Ultimately you have to weigh the pros and cons of either program (CFA requires longer time investment, but can start immediately; while good MBA schools might not admit you with your current credentials), as well as your career goals (seems a bit over the place tbh).
bmwcaddy
post Jan 7 2020, 12:40 PM

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QUOTE(bursageek @ Jan 7 2020, 11:30 AM)
You mention working in a conglomerate so would you acquire any experience related to corporate finance? Financial due diligence, asset pricing, portfolio optimisation are some of the use cases you face in a job from the IB / AM sector. My take is that CFA just proves you are a diligent learner, but if you have to start in the industry from scratch, few would want to assume the risk of absorbing a newcomer at the age of 28 / 29 when burnout is frequent in the industry (less so in Malaysia but general in IB)

What I just said relates only to the job seeking, but to actually pass CFA, your working experience needs to be 'relevant' as defined here: https://www.cfainstitute.org/en/membership/...work-experience. Whether or not you have worked for 6 years is irrelevant since you may have cleared the duration requirement (48 months) but not the technical requirement.

Finally, doing an MBA would be an icing on the cake once you have already landed a job in the industry. But if you are not intending to start a venture yourself, IMO there is much less value in it (since your goal is to enter the industry, which should have been be achieved by CFA alone).

Ultimately you have to weigh the pros and cons of either program (CFA requires longer time investment, but can start immediately; while good MBA schools might not admit you with your current credentials), as well as your career goals (seems a bit over the place tbh).
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Hi bursageek, thank you for your reply which I find it very detail and informative!

To answer your question (hopefully to also open up new/further opinions if you may have), my current jobscope does involve the nature of investment holding business, i.e. Financial due diligence, project financing, asset pricing/valuation, return analysis (not so much of portfolio optimisation/managing).

You are pretty spot on with your deduction, I do wish to land in the Investment Banking industry (did thought of venturing overseas but this may be over-ambitious at current point of discussion), or along the line of stock brokerage/managing fund.

Any takes on this? Or perhaps I should look for other professional papers/masters apart from CFA and MBA?

Thank you in advance!
bursageek
post Jan 8 2020, 09:02 AM

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QUOTE(bmwcaddy @ Jan 7 2020, 12:40 PM)
Hi bursageek, thank you for your reply which I find it very detail and informative!

To answer your question (hopefully to also open up new/further opinions if you may have), my current jobscope does involve the nature of investment holding business, i.e. Financial due diligence, project financing, asset pricing/valuation, return analysis (not so much of portfolio optimisation/managing).

You are pretty spot on with your deduction, I do wish to land in the Investment Banking industry (did thought of venturing overseas but this may be over-ambitious at current point of discussion), or along the line of stock brokerage/managing fund.

Any takes on this? Or perhaps I should look for other professional papers/masters apart from CFA and MBA?

Thank you in advance!
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Hello, I’m also just a young professional working in the finance industry so do refer to other sources haha.

From my friends’ experiences (we all graduated from a top 3 UK uni), CFA requires tremendous time investment – many online would suggest dedicating 300 hours per level, i.e. averaging 1 hour a day of study. At a minimum, I figure even a smart learner has to put down half an hour everyday to it, which can be a solitary process if you don’t have friends doing it together. Many started it because of peer pressure, and end up completing it because of the sunk cost, which made me question CFA’s value whose payoff is uncertain (AFAIK no workplaces have introduced bonus associated with completing CFA) and is only a soft barrier of entry for IBs (on the other hand, you still have to take PKMC exams before trading professionally).

I have lots of interest in investment, but don’t see it as more of a career beyond a personal hobby (I am invested in equities in NA, EU and MYS and would have to give up these holdings if I work as traders). Between CFA and MBA I would have chosen the latter since I value the business connections from a good school (think Ivy League / top business schools in the UK) and have plans to launch own businesses in the future, but at the moment I’m not keen of pausing my career to further study.


 

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