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English Clubs Liverpool Kop Talk 2014, Liv 0-2 Chel | Keep Going - YNWA

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cherroy
post Apr 28 2014, 10:04 AM

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Since last few months, Liv always involved in nail biting matches.
Now with end of season last 2 matches, also need to nail biting to know the final outcome of the league position. sweat.gif

10 fingers also no enough...

Even had 11 win consecutively, many also nail biting, even against Norwich 3-2, previously Mancity 3-2, Swansea 4-3, 6-3 against Cardiff etc.
Liv needs to learn how to win 1-0, 2-0, instead of always 3-2, 4-3 type of score, especially next year involving in CL, you can't expect to win 3-2, 4-3 against the like Barca, RM, Bayern etc.

Yesterday match, was tactical win by JM. Bad mistake done, lack of cutting edge to slice open the bus, end of story. Look for next match.
No point put blaming game, why GK rush out, through leg, why defender so far out etc.

When first half cannot score, already fear the worst (I taught going to be 0-0, but wait, Liv hardly can get clean sheet since beginning of the season), as normally you need to score early or in the first half so that there is no bus aka forcing opponent to come out and play.

Just focus on next 2 games and 6 points that available, the rest (league position) let it sort it itself.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Apr 28 2014, 10:04 AM
cherroy
post Apr 28 2014, 10:13 AM

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QUOTE(twtang @ Apr 28 2014, 09:36 AM)
I was wondering, is it normally for goalie to charge out? How about standing in front of goal post to wait like saving a penalty, would it be higher chance to save?
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The striker can score more easily like that. Bad option.

Charging out, make striker under more pressure, reduce angle of shot, which can reduce the chance of goal scored.
That's why striker need to go through the leg of GK, while in between leg, there is chance the ball hitting the leg, as long as GK leg doesn't open too wide.

Also, some non-prolific striker may make mistake when under pressure as well, so shooting wide, fumble etc mistake when GK rushing out also quite often.

So it is the basic GK, nothing wrong with charging out, when in 1 v 1 situation.

cherroy
post Apr 28 2014, 10:21 AM

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QUOTE(Duke Red @ Apr 28 2014, 10:08 AM)
Chelsea came to Anfield with a game plan and executed it to perfection. Jose is one of the best in the world when it comes to negative football, frustrating his opposition into submission. Not pleasing on the eye but in the end, it's the 3 points that matter. Brendan was quoted as saying Mourinho parked 2 busses but it isn't the first time and it certainly won't be the last. English football fans have been accustomed to seeing Chelsea eke out 1-0 wins and Barca got a taste of how the Chelsea manager can choke the life out of teams by deploying suffocating tactics.

I don't take issue with his negative tactics because it was to be expected but I am never a fan of deploying strategies that toe the line of being unsportsmanlike. This is in reference to the obvious time wasting. Yes, Suarez does dive and make a meal of challenges but it's different when the manager instructs his players to do so.

I've also read comment that Rodgers was tactically naive and should have played more cautiously. Hindsight is 20-20 isn't it? We've been obliterating teams by playing football that's more than easy on the eye so why abandon that? Rafa was faulted for tinkering too much and now Rodgers is criticised for the opposite. You can't please everyone. We were at Anfield and we went for the jugular. If Stevie had not given the ball away we would be lamenting having not scored despite having over 70% possession of the ball, instead of having conceded.

Chelsea did to us what we did to Barca almost a decade ago. Ugly but effective.
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I don't think it was a wrong move by trying to play positive football.
If BR had played cautious football, and match finish 0-0, while fail to get 6 points from the remaining match, and Mancity win the league afterwards, many may blame BR not try to win against Chelsea afterwards as well.
It is home match, you go for win for every home match, disregard who is the opponent.

Yesterday match or whatever mistake was done and dusted, nothing can be changed anymore.

Look forward is the only option, not blaming game.
cherroy
post Apr 28 2014, 02:49 PM

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QUOTE(dillonyong @ Apr 28 2014, 02:23 PM)
Let's focus on this weekend!
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This weekend Liv has no match, Monday instead.
cherroy
post Apr 28 2014, 04:18 PM

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It is a perfect tactical deployed, and justified too.

Prior the match, Liv was on red hot form, winning 11 on the string, always outscoring opponent to win matches, and the match was at Anfield, as opponent manager, what is your choice?
Park the bus or buses and hit on the break, score through set piece, corner, penalty, mistake done by opponent.

I don't understand why so many criticism on Chelsea parking bus. Even before the match start, everyone already predict bus being parked there.

You need to have cutting edge to slice open the bus if want to be champion.

So the better team in term of strategy and tactic deployed won last night, end of story.

Weaken team, is just another mind game on top of the tactic already planned.
Let opponent off guard, while justify the "ugly" defensive approach.




cherroy
post Apr 28 2014, 05:42 PM

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QUOTE(reehdus @ Apr 28 2014, 05:15 PM)
I think the word play here is wrongly used. Good defensive play involves an intention to keep the ball away from the opponent. Not get a goal and pack your half. 27% possession hardly seems to warrant the word 'play'
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Football is about score goal, and prevent opponent score goal, not about possession.

See last year vs this year Liv difference.

Last year, lot of possession football, result not good, league position not good.
This year, electric pace, fast counter attack, hit opponent quick, win a lot of matches, while having about half or just more than half of possession generally, league position good.

Chelsea came to Anfield primary intention is to stop Liv playing, they don't scare Liv having lion share of possession.
Possession doesn't give you any point, nor must lead to a goal score.

"Play" is not about having possession.
See during vs Norwich (edited), the 3rd goal Sterling scored one, Suarez never touch the ball, but his running dragged defender away, enable Sterling to have empty space to dribble forward and scored.
The "play" by Suarez is the one crucial important factor that enable the goal scored. There are plenty of off the ball contribution, which many may not appreciated by viewer, but it is very important aspect that can enable a team to win a match.

GK, defenders can hardly "play" as well, just a save, a tackle which may a vital point that give the team 3 points as well.

So Chelsea, good 'play" was parking the bus and Liv has no clue or cannot penetrate the 18 yards box, which was successful done/played.

This post has been edited by cherroy: Apr 28 2014, 05:51 PM
cherroy
post Apr 29 2014, 09:58 AM

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QUOTE(Mikeshashimi @ Apr 29 2014, 09:37 AM)
Yes, I did find the time-wasting technique a little shameful and if Liverpool ever did something like that, time-wasting in the 1st minute with delaying throw-ins, I'd be ashamed.

But do not take away their defensive disciplin. Kalas and Ivanovic were rock-solid.
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It is a mind game and may be as well an instruction given by manager, aka to frustrated opponent.
The manager knew Liv would be eager to have early quick start, first half goal, to settle the match "tension", so deploying such tactic to frustrate the players and make the players lose focus and patient. Once patient lose out, highly you won't able to play as norm already.

Chelsea defensive record is indeed very good, only 26 goals conceded since the season start, the best in the table.

cherroy
post Apr 30 2014, 02:56 PM

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The time wasting strategy is not purely time wasting alone,
but as Gary said in the analyst, is to slow down the game tempo, make the Liv attack lose momentum, make the players frustrated, when player frustrated, it may lead to lose of cool head, patient in build up, that any attack is easily nullify when you lose the cool head to pass around, create space, only cross cross cross, shooting from long range.


cherroy
post May 1 2014, 02:55 PM

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The difference is AM players were patient, and probing with passes, run behind defenders. 2 similar goals scored due to run behind defender.

While Liv players clearly were frustrated and lose patient and cool head by time wasting and slow down tempo act, hence make Chelsea defenders had an easy game of defending.

If the bus parking tactic is a blueprint how to play against Liv or an on form attacking opponent, then AM display is a blueprint how to slice open the parked bus.

cherroy
post May 2 2014, 10:08 AM

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There is needless to bother about Chelsea bus, whether Chelsea win or defeat, it doesn't relate to Liv at all.

Match lost because can't slice open the bus, a loss is a loss, aka simple means not good enough, if you can't score a goal, because of bus, then should look at yourself, not constantly complaining about the bus.

Look forward, no point talk about buses anymore or other teams.
cherroy
post May 2 2014, 10:57 AM

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QUOTE(farisq @ May 2 2014, 10:38 AM)
I think the point that we tried to stress on our defeat is that, there is no "masterclass tactic" whatsoever involved.

Just one team lucky to get a win and another unlucky not to get a draw.
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The defeat is because Liv cannot slice open the bus.

The bus was tactic deployed, and time wasting tactic was used to frustrated the players, when Suarez clapped hand when Chelsea GK slow to take the kick, was a signal player frustration of the time wasting.
You cannot deny the tactic effectiveness that influence on the match, subsequently Liv players performance. Cross cross cross (while there was no target man inside sweat.gif ), just a blind hopeful cross.

The loss is past history, learn from the shortcoming, summarise the bus or any masterclass tactic worked well against Liv, but backfire against AM.
That's all.

Move forward.

This post has been edited by cherroy: May 2 2014, 10:58 AM
cherroy
post May 2 2014, 01:43 PM

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QUOTE(farisq @ May 2 2014, 11:32 AM)
Correct me if I'm wrong  nod.gif  but your statement implies that we will still lose even if the SG8 slip didn't happen  hmm.gif
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In real life, there is no if.

It is a defeat, that's all, move forward.

There is no if when look back.
If Liv was good enough, Liv can slice open the bus like AM, AM also trailing 0-1 first before winning 3-1.

If Kolo didn't miss pass the ball, Liv should get 3 points against WBA.
If Sterling's goal didn't be ruled offside against Mancity (at Etihad), Liv should ahead 2-0, possibly win 3 points.

So there is no such thing of "if this" "if that".
What happened had already done and dusted. smile.gif
No point blame bus, blame opponent manager hypocrite or whatever.

Always look forward. icon_rolleyes.gif
cherroy
post May 4 2014, 05:38 PM

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Mancity last 2 match is at home, so unlikely Mancity drop points, lot of teams being "blowed away" easily at Etihad.

Having said that, Liv needs also get maximum points from last 2 matches, at least send league standing down to the wire.
Against Crystal palace under Pulis is not a push over. A win is not easy task, somemore, hope players mentality is not affected by the last match defeat.

No matter how the outcome, Liv already had a good season.
With CL next season, and good league standing, at least reduce possibility for star player particularly Suarez to move on to another PL club, and may able attract some star and good players to join next season.

Some may wet dream of winning last 2 match by 11 or 12 goals margin... laugh.gif

cherroy
post May 4 2014, 05:47 PM

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QUOTE(jimbet1337 @ May 4 2014, 05:30 PM)
Can't solely blame Toure & Gerrard for their funny mistakes during West Brom & Chelsea match respectively. Right? We had all seasons & slipped once in a while. The whole squad had their fair share on the mistakes done.  We've been also conceding crazily throughout the season & all of it accumulated until this stage where we're beaten on the goal difference.

No denying that we have improved compared to the past few years but consistency is still a problem. Well, two matches remaining, it's now either miracle or just bitter reality that need to be swallowed.
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I had mentioned many time, the important missing key is always defence, you can't expect to win all the matches by outscoring opponent, keeping tight, clean sheet is always an integral part of a title winning team.
The team needs to learn how to win comfortably like 2-0, 1-0, instead nail biting each match, especially for the last few match that Liv hardly win comfortably, even against Cardiff, Norwich, Swansea etc.

Gerrard had provided plenty of assist that gain important points throughout the season, without the assist, we may talk about 4th place currently.
Mistakes are part of parcel of the football match.
If not mistake by Kompany, Liv also won't win against City, and City may already win the title now.
cherroy
post May 5 2014, 11:30 AM

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Liv needs to win big to put the nerve back to Mancity into last match of the season.

I missed the commentator said, "how many you want" during Liv vs Arsenal match, when Liv was 4-0 up just inside of first 20 minutes.
cherroy
post May 5 2014, 04:30 PM

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http://www.espnfc.com/news/story/_/id/1810...rs-says?cc=4716
QUOTE
Rodgers: LFC can win on goal difference


Wow, very ambitious...

"How many you want..."

Realistically, Palace only conceded 22 goals since Pulis took over last Nov.
cherroy
post May 5 2014, 04:37 PM

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QUOTE(coolmast3r @ May 5 2014, 04:35 PM)
I think he's more thinking of a big win against Newcastle, one of the most leaky defences in the Premier League.
They are currently joint 4th in the Goals Conceded ranking, alongside Sunderland with 57 goals conceded in 37 games (although Sunderland only played 36 games to date). wink.gif
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9 goals difference, if city won the last 2 match with single goal margin, there will be 11 goals difference to chase, aka Liv needs to win by 11 goals margin in the last 2 matches.

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