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English Clubs Liverpool Kop Talk 2014, Liv 0-2 Chel | Keep Going - YNWA

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Duke Red
post Apr 21 2014, 12:46 PM

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I'm over the moon man. Who would have thought we'd go on an 11 game winning streak?

Exceptional performance from Sterling, Skrtel (except from when he started tugging shirts again) and Joe Allen. Brilliant decision by Rodgers to have him and Coutinho rotate in that central role. He's showing a lot more maturity and composure in his game. Superb effort for the first goal. Skrtel was a monster in the air and I reckon Norwich scored because Mignolet gave him a shout but failed to punch the ball clear. Allen pressed brilliantly in defence (though he was somewhat fortuitous not to give away a freekick at the edge of the box in the 1st half) and exchanged some nice passes with Suarez in the opposition half. This is the Allen I've wanted to see i.e. one that is given the freedom to attack the opposition box instead of being the last man in a midfield triangle.

Johnson had a dour game though. His positional sense was appalling and he looked lost as Norwich players were running around him. Hardly ventured forward. I hope he has a good World Cup so we can fetch a decent price for him. Thanks Glen but we need to look forward.
Duke Red
post Apr 21 2014, 01:55 PM

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QUOTE(bearbear @ Apr 21 2014, 01:29 PM)
Skrtel" "What's your problem?"

user posted image

Imagine Skrtel doing a tattoo on dillon brows.gif

user posted image
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Nice tat on Skrtel. "I came, I saw, I conquered". Befitting of the "Colossus" tag that BR put on him. Not since Ron Yeats has any Liverpool defender been bestowed with that honour.

Speaking of which, Dillion had best start planning on where he should get his tattoo.
Duke Red
post Apr 21 2014, 03:30 PM

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Leeds United's fall from grace typifies what can happen when a club over extends itself. We were in a similar position not long ago and just days away from administration ourselves. 2 years of missing out on the UCL after taking out loans in expectation of revenue from the competition ultimately caught up with a club that was on the ascendancy. I quite enjoyed watching Leeds play back then. John Lukic was one of my favourite keepers and Lee Chapman, one of my favourite strikers. David Batty, Tony Dorigo, the list goes on. Interesting to note now that El-Hadji Diouf plays for Leeds.

Speaking of which I enjoyed watching "The Damned United" which depicted Brian Clough's 44 day reign at the club.
Duke Red
post Apr 22 2014, 11:49 AM

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Just finished watching the 30 for 30 Hillsborough edition. Emotional stuff mate. Seething with anger after hearing how they tried to cover up the incident, blaming it on "drunk" Liverpool fans. Now that the independent committee have revealed their findings, I hope it's only a matter of time before the names of our brethren are cleared and the real culprits are revealed
Duke Red
post Apr 22 2014, 02:48 PM

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It's inconceivable to believe that Everton would throw the game given what's at stake. The club may be rivals but there has always been a healthy respect especially since Hillsborough. Merseyside was united again after the Rhys Jones murder. The payout for qualification and progression in the Champions League is substantial and certainly massive for a club like Everton who have always been working on a tight budget. Imagine how much stronger they'd be next season with a couple of quality acquisitions. The last time they were this close, they were eliminated in the qualifying rounds and I do not think they'll let this opportunity slip. So yes, Everton will be going all out to do us a "favour", no doubt.
Duke Red
post Apr 23 2014, 01:07 PM

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QUOTE(reehdus @ Apr 23 2014, 12:36 PM)
Actually I believe just like Hodgson (which I shamefully admit I was against as well), Moyes didn't get all the support he needed. Noone really backed Moyes and at times it seemed like he was shouldering all the blame himself when i believe some attitudes of the supporters, players and staff worked against him. Like what Keane says in this article:

"“I think it’s a shame,” stated Keane when asked about United’s decision to dispense with the services of Moyes. “I think he should have been given more time and some of the players at Man United should be ashamed of themselves. I think they really let him down."

http://espnfc.com/news/story/_/id/1794633/...e-fault?cc=5739

I don't think our players were against Hodgson, but I think the supporters really gave him a lot of stick. In the case of Moyes, he was fighting an uphill battle ever since he arrived.
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The lack of leadership in the dressing room was a contributing factor to why the players would snigger behind his back. In my opinion, Rooney is a poor choice for captain because of the following reasons :-

1) His constant whining got him a huge contract much to the disgust of senior players like Evra, Vidic, Giggs and RVP. They thus don't have respect for him and how can you not respect your captain? I don't recall anyone having an issue with Gerrard for example. In fact, they all sing his praises.
2) How can he be expected to lead by example when he keeps wanting to leave the club whenever he gets benched or the club aren't doing well?

Rooney may be a great player but he doesn't have the same kind of leadership qualities as Vidic, Gary Neville or Bryan Robson. Robson and Neville would have put the players in their place had they spoken out against the manager as I imagine someone like Jamie Carragher would have.

Hodgson got a lot of stick for a number of reasons :-

1) He didn't act as though he was managing a big club and you could tell from his interviews.
2) He's all chummy with Fergie (this alone should be a reason not to root for him)
3) He had no clue on the pitch. We didn't look like we were even trying.
4) In an interview, he criticised the fans and demanded respect by proclaiming himself to be one of the most respected managers in Europe (a wonder he ended up in Fulham with no big European clubs looking to appoint him then isn't it?)
Duke Red
post Apr 23 2014, 01:56 PM

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I'll likely be at Legends Bar in TTDI
Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 09:53 AM

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I won't put any blame on Mignolet. When one-on-one with an attacker, the keeper's job is to narrow the angle by coming off his line and to stay on his feet for as long as possible, presenting a big obstacle for his opponent and Migs did all of that. Had he stayed on his line, Ba would have had copious amounts of space to aim at. Instead, he threaded it through Mignolet's legs, possibly the only way he would have slotted the ball past him. The second was a two on one and he had no chance.


Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 10:08 AM

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Chelsea came to Anfield with a game plan and executed it to perfection. Jose is one of the best in the world when it comes to negative football, frustrating his opposition into submission. Not pleasing on the eye but in the end, it's the 3 points that matter. Brendan was quoted as saying Mourinho parked 2 busses but it isn't the first time and it certainly won't be the last. English football fans have been accustomed to seeing Chelsea eke out 1-0 wins and Barca got a taste of how the Chelsea manager can choke the life out of teams by deploying suffocating tactics.

I don't take issue with his negative tactics because it was to be expected but I am never a fan of deploying strategies that toe the line of being unsportsmanlike. This is in reference to the obvious time wasting. Yes, Suarez does dive and make a meal of challenges but it's different when the manager instructs his players to do so.

I've also read comment that Rodgers was tactically naive and should have played more cautiously. Hindsight is 20-20 isn't it? We've been obliterating teams by playing football that's more than easy on the eye so why abandon that? Rafa was faulted for tinkering too much and now Rodgers is criticised for the opposite. You can't please everyone. We were at Anfield and we went for the jugular. If Stevie had not given the ball away we would be lamenting having not scored despite having over 70% possession of the ball, instead of having conceded.

Chelsea did to us what we did to Barca almost a decade ago. Ugly but effective.
Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 10:18 AM

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Gerrard's outburst of emotion after the win against City shows just how much this means to him, as if we needed any reminding. I can't begin to imagine how gutted he must have felt when Ba picked the ball off him and slotted it past Mignolet. He must have wished the ground opened up and swallowed him whole. He tried to make amends but his attempts were often straight at Schwarzer.

This is a test of character for him. He needs to bounce back and lead the team to a win at Palace. It isn't over. City still have a tricky tie against Everton.
Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 11:15 AM

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QUOTE(cherroy @ Apr 28 2014, 10:21 AM)
I don't think it was a wrong move by trying to play positive football.
If BR had played cautious football, and match finish 0-0, while fail to get 6 points from the remaining match, and Mancity win the league afterwards, many may blame BR not try to win against Chelsea afterwards as well.
It is home match, you go for win for every home match, disregard who is the opponent.

Yesterday match or whatever mistake was done and dusted, nothing can be changed anymore.

Look forward is the only option, not blaming game.
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Precisely. It was a home game and we went for the jugular as we should. There was a time when teams would park the bus and we'd struggle to muster a shot on target. Not this time though. We created chances despite them deploying 2 waves of defenders.

If we were to do it again, I'd still want us to go for it, especially when we're at home.

QUOTE(reehdus @ Apr 28 2014, 10:23 AM)
We go again! We are at GD 50 right now and City is at 58. Best case scenario for us is their GD goes to 61 after the next 3 games. That's 11 goals we have to score in 2 games. I say go for 7-0 and 8-0 to be safe. Haha!

A good writeup btw:
http://www.teamtalk.com/liverpool/9287144/...pool-s-problems
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Lest we forget. If it comes down to GD and we achieve those scores, it would mean City would have won their remaining 3 games and would therefore have a better GD than they do now smile.gif

Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 11:33 AM

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QUOTE(wadefak @ Apr 28 2014, 11:12 AM)

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Well said.

Rodgers was asked if he'd set up his team the way Chelsea set up last night? In response, the gaffer replied, "what do you think?".

"Jose's happy to work that way, to play that way and he'll probably shove his CV in front of me and say it works but it's not my way of working. You know, I like to take the initiative in games and let players express themselves".

"They defended well, we tried everything we could but our game is based on offensive, being creative as opposed to stopping them".
Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 03:28 PM

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Allen showed good technique when he hit a first time effort towards the bottom corner, only for Schwarzer to deflect it wide. He also managed a tamer effort to the Australian's right later on. In fact he was probably the only bloke whose long range efforts weren't directed right at Schwarzer. You know who I really missed last night? Jordan Henderson. Lucas lacked mobility in attack and slowed us down somewhat. He is clearly more comfortable at the back because he doesn't have the guile or power to work his way through a tight defence. Also Hendo's hard running and high pressing would have been a source of irritation for Chelsea.

Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 03:40 PM

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I think Mourinho has worked long and hard to develop his persona. I think it's intentional he can sometimes come across as a self absorbed, undiplomatic grouch that rambles to himself about "young eggs". The intention is clearly to get under the skin of his rivals and he does a darn good job of it.

After playing Atletico he was going on about how he didn't care that much about the Premiership and that the Champions League was his priority. He publicly announced that he was going to field a weakened side (that costs as much as our first team btw), giving us the impression he didn't care that much about the game. Come one, they have a squad large enough to play on both fronts. Of course he's interested! Anyway, fielding a "second team" meant that his defensive tactics were justified. We were playing at home and were on a winning streak, surely we could pick off a team of "second stringers"? Well, that's what we thought and that's exactly what Mourinho wanted.

In the end, we were almost too eager to get a goal and we were punished for it. To maintain his persona, Jose even went as far as to snub Rodgers for the customary post-match handshake. You gotta give it to this bloke. It isn't easy being him. With Fergie gone, he's top dog now when it comes to mind games.
Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 03:49 PM

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QUOTE(briantwj @ Apr 28 2014, 03:44 PM)
tbh, even a Chelsea fan sometimes also duno Mou is speaking the truth or simply playing mind games.  sweat.gif  sweat.gif

mathematically, Chelsea memang out of title race.
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Of course it's mathematically possible. If City win their game in hand, you'll only be 2 points behind us with 2 games left to play. If City and us lose 1, you're in it.
Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 03:49 PM

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Was Chelsea's win a result of a tactical masterclass? This article has the answer.

http://www.goal.com/en-gb/news/2896/premie...poolrealwinners
Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 03:56 PM

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QUOTE(normeck @ Apr 28 2014, 03:50 PM)
just wish Henderson was there last night.... and Jose was an experienced manager..he has been in England, Italy and Spain... winning all the trophy... so he know the game as well....
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He has been deploying stifling tactics especially in away matches against top opposition for some time now, so yesterday was hardly surprising. Football purists will condemn his anti-football approach but like I said much earlier, to him it's 3 points and to his fans, they aren't going to complain so long as they keep winning.
Duke Red
post Apr 28 2014, 04:06 PM

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QUOTE(kucingmainan @ Apr 28 2014, 04:00 PM)
A bit bias IMO. How is defending like what Chelsea did consider easy? Mou intention is to nullify pools attack from a get go. And of course, try to counter attack if the chance come.

Clearly, defensive play is underrated by the author.
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Defensive play is an art. It isn't easy to be disciplined and maintain focus the whole 90. Rafa's Liverpool came away triumphant from the Nou Camp deploying the same tactics but somehow he didn't receive the same accolades as Mourinho does. The point I was zeroing in on was this one :-

QUOTE
Stopping a team from performing, even one as free-scoring as Liverpool, is far easier than implementing an offensive, eye-catching playing style that is capable of dismantling most opposition. Any top-level coach will tell you that.


This is the point in contention. Which is harder? I don't think it's a biased piece since it's from a neutral source. I think it's merely an opinion and you can't dismiss an opinion that contravenes yours as being biased.

In the end, Mourinho was triumphant but I have to agree with the author to say it was hardly a "tactical masterclass". It was an expected strategy that Mourinho has used over the years and it all began from when he said he would field a "weakened team". So, well done to him.
Duke Red
post Apr 29 2014, 08:15 AM

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QUOTE(kucingmainan @ Apr 28 2014, 04:38 PM)
please enlighten me on this. what type of tactical approach can be consider as one? if defensive is art, so does offensive, so does possession football. arts are meant to be subjective.
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Precisely and like the author it is my subjective opinion that it's harder to win games by playing attractive attacking football than by trying to stop someone else from playing football.

Let me use two examples you'll be familiar with. Man Utd under Fergie vs Chelsea under Mourinho. The former managed to outplay opponents utilising what some people would deem to be average players in Fletcher, Carrick, Brown, Smalling, O'Shea, etc. I think that's harder to do than to play 11 first team internationals behind the ball. Yes it's subjective but that's my take on it.

I think your players did really well to maintain their discipline and focus and it was a tactical triumph but it was hardly a master class. Tony Pulis' teams are hard to beat. Palace are on the ascendency and Stoke were hard to beat at home. Tactical masterclass?
Duke Red
post Apr 29 2014, 11:39 AM

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QUOTE(prophetjul @ Apr 29 2014, 08:20 AM)
I think we criticise because Mou was the one who criticise these sort of tactics and called them football killers?

Whatta HYPROcrite of the highest order! 

As if we didn't know that already!  biggrin.gif
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Precisely. Here's what he was quoted as saying after his side were frustrated by West Ham.

QUOTE
"It's very difficult to play a football match where only one team wants to play. It's very difficult.


QUOTE
"A football match is about two teams playing and this match was only one team playing and another team not playing.


QUOTE
"I cannot be too critical, because if I was in his position I don't know if I would do the same. Maybe.


I think we all know the answer to that now - "Yes" he would.

QUOTE
"At the same time I told him also this is not Premier League, this is not the best league in the world, this is football from the 19th century."


Now after the game against Liverpool.

QUOTE
"A defensive display?" Mourinho asked with mock ignorance when he was accused of being negative after the game.
"I am confused with what the media thinks about defensive displays. When a team defends well, you call it a defensive display. It was a beautiful victory."


Now I have nothing against teams setting up shop to get a point but at least have the decency to admit it la. Don't condemn someone else when they do it against you and then praise yourself when you do the same. Can I say, "what a tactical masterclass by West Ham" then?

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